Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[rikfredsy]

Coin
Explanation

Ohh my god , why all the time btc-e in the last price rank alwas in the back with -3 or -5 $ ; And i don't know
how could bitstamp users trust that exchange again the last time they had a huge security problem 

[1715014008]

1715014008

[1715014008]

1715014008

[1715014008]

1715014008

[gentlemand]

Ohh my god , why all the time btc-e in the last price rank alwas in the back with -3 or -5 $ ; And i don't know
how could bitstamp users trust that exchange again the last time they had a huge security problem 

It's always been harder to get money in and out of btc-e hence the lower price. You have to dick around with third party agents to transfer it.

Bitstamp is still going and covered all the losses. It's fading though.

[spooderman]

I wonder what this week will bring? The bull market is growing legs it seems.

[sAt0sHiFanClub]

Maybe if enough people are adhering to their wonderful squiggly lines it becomes something of a self fulfilling prophecy. I myself regard it all as a heap of shit. The lines do not account for things that happen in the real world.

The lines serve as a sort of pseudo religion. People have, for eons, been looking for something that will reassure them that all will be well in the future.  For most its a benevolent god promising eternal life after death in heaven. For others, its randomly drawn lines connecting other random points on a graph over random time periods that signify a future of wealth beyond measure.

Marx said religion was like Opium. This is no different. Instead of taking part in bitcoin, developing businesses with bitcoin, growing them in value over time to take advantage of an upward trend in bitcoin use and acceptance, they sit and look at charts.

Its just folk being lazy.

[thebitcoinquiz.com]

I wonder what this week will bring? The bull market is growing legs it seems.

I am assuming that the prices wont plunge down. Atleast they will maintain the current level or will rise to 300$ . Just hope that people don't start dumping at 300$.

[Afrikoin]

I'm amazed at how people take triangles on charts seriously.

It's like trying to predict the speed of a vehicle based by watching its speedometer continuously whilst ignoring the actual terrain that it's on.

edit: I feel a bit troll-y for saying that, but....seriously folks.

What do you use yourself?

Could be said "I'm amazed at how people take [insert answer here] on charts seriously."

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

[spooderman]

I use gut intuition (lol).

It's right every time! The only exceptions are when it's wrong.

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[thefunkybits]

MIT Bitcoin Day 2 live feed: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96ULlHhia_Q

[Afrikoin]

I use gut intuition (lol).

It's right every time! The only exceptions are when it's wrong.

that is one style of many tools. it is ok to have variety or even mix up different styles. There aren't any rules really.

[gentlemand]

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

Boy, I didn't realise it was that straightforward. Can we change the title of the thread to triangle observer?

[itod]

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

Boy, I didn't realise it was that straightforward. Can we change the title of the thread to triangle observer?

Be careful, you can see triangles even if they don't exist:

[Afrikoin]

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

Boy, I didn't realise it was that straightforward. Can we change the title of the thread to triangle observer?

Sign me up!

Might not work all the time, but works a lot of times. That's why there's all this

https://www.google.com/search?q=triangle+candlestick+chart+patterns+breakouts&espv=2&biw=1024&bih=513&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=5mb8VOiJIZDxaJ2HgbAG&ved=0CCcQsAQ

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[stereotype]

I'm amazed at how people take triangles on charts seriously.

It's like trying to predict the speed of a vehicle based by watching its speedometer continuously whilst ignoring the actual terrain that it's on.

edit: I feel a bit troll-y for saying that, but....seriously folks.

What do you use yourself?

Could be said "I'm amazed at how people take [insert answer here] on charts seriously."

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

What about these? .... http://fomocoin.com/others.html

[Erdogan]

I would think that, in China, money is steadily leaving the system: Chinese traders seem to be gradually selling and taking their cash out of the exchanges.  This feeling is not based on the exchange volumes, but simply becuse of the decay of the China bubble (which seems to be too fast to be due to miner dumping alone).   The rest of the world should still be a net buyer, but there is no data, really, and apparently it can barely absorb what the Chinese and the miners are selling.

There is no "money" entering nor leaving the bitcoin system. Bitcoin is money, so is USD, CNY etc. What happens is that value moves from one money system to another. When the revaluation of money system is not the same in all actors' minds, there has to be trades. If all actors at the same time and to the same degree change their valuations, there need not be many trades.

Indeed you are right, there is no USD or CNY in the "bitcoin system", so there is no sense saying that money is going into or out of it. I should have said instead that, in my opinion, more and more Chinese traders must be selling their holdings for whatever others want to pay, and dropping out. 

Detailing with examples:
If every seller suddenly revaluated their bitcoins up 50%, all trades would stop. If every buyer moments later revalued bitcoins up 50%, the value of bitcoins are up with that factor, with only the everyday small trading starting again. So this is an example where everybody acts likewise.

Another example: If every holder suddenly lost his faith and valued bitcoin to USD 20 and acted upon that, while every nonholder suddenly saw the light and wanted bitcoin for up to say 300, all the bitcoins in existence would change owner in a split second.

These examples are extreme and we will never see them, but the practical consequence is that that there is no absolute correlation between traded volume and change in value. A part of the change in price will be that all traders will revalue, this might be due to some big monetary event. Another part of the change will be that some actors revalue, others not, a typical scenario is new users discovering bitcoin and want to get in. This part of the change in price will necessaily lead to lots of trades.

[julian071]

OK, that settles it, one BTC equals 251 euro. Fine value. 250 would be even more practical, but alla.



This thread can be closed now. All trolls are fired.

[Erdogan]

I'm skeptical about comparing zero fee volume to non-zero fee volume.

To be clear: for short to mid term trading purposes, I absolutely don't doubt the relevance of CNY volume.

But for the longer term view of market volume, in my opinion, the "costly" volume of the three big USD exchanges is a good measure of how much money is "flowing into the market". (Sidenote: I really need to include Coinbase from now on)

That said, I know just discarding CNY (or permanently zero-fee USD) volume is not ideal. I have been trying to come up with ways to 'discount' the Chinese volume by some factor to make it comparable, but nothing ever really came out of it that looked satisfying to me.

Is there a relation between exchange volume and the amount of money coming into the system (or being drained from it)?  Volume is generally up when the price is changing, up or down; and that may be cause and effect at the same time.  But figuring ot the net input money flow seems to be a complicated computation at least...

I would think that, in China, money is steadily leaving the system: Chinese traders seem to be gradually selling and taking their cash out of the exchanges.  This feeling is not based on the exchange volumes, but simply becuse of the decay of the China bubble (which seems to be too fast to be due to miner dumping alone).   The rest of the world should still be a net buyer, but there is no data, really, and apparently it can barely absorb what the Chinese and the miners are selling.

 

There is no "money" entering nor leaving the bitcoin system. Bitcoin is money, so is USD, CNY etc. What happens is that value moves from one money system to another. When the revaluation of money system is not the same in all actors' minds, there has to be trades. If all actors at the same time and to the same degree change their valuations, there need not be many trades.

Well, I disagree with that assertion.

Except for the chosen few that already (completely and honestly) think of profits in this market in terms of this market's underlying asset, the most common measure of profits (or losses) is in terms of your national fiat currency of choice.

Practically, this means you might withdraw USD profits from an exchange in case you feel like "cashing out", or, if you have money to spare, and feel the price is right, you "cash in" by wiring money into an exchange. This will either remove USD from or add USD to the market.

My claim that some types of trading volume are indicative of this flow in and out of the exchanges is obviously up for debate, but questioning the above process itself I find rather silly. Price per coin is not only determined, on the demand side, by what USD holders on the exchanges are willing to pay per coin, but also by how USD balances on the exchanges are changing over time.

If you don't want to call this process "money entering or leaving", fine, but I'd say you're semantics lawyering now, not really saying anything descriptively interesting.

No the dollars on the exchange just change hands. See my other post above.

Edit: I don't like the notion of dollars going in or out (specially not "money" going in or out of bitcoin). That terminology obscures what is going on, that is why I don't like it.

[okthen]

Triangles work. Sorry you feel that way

Boy, I didn't realise it was that straightforward. Can we change the title of the thread to triangle observer?

Be careful, you can see triangles even if they don't exist:

I see... Pacman x3!

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation