Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[MinermanNC]

People that want a bigger block are just socialists that want their free transactions.

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

Do not ascribe to me characteristics which I do not possess. You seem to be so blinded by your ideology that you cannot even allow for your opposition to possess humanity within.

Fees is what pays for the security of the network. The block subsidy is temporary. The total value of the fees correlates directly into a level of security.

We don't need to rehash this truism. We all know this.

Fees will be lower overall with a larger block size (more supply) so security will be lower.

Another bald unsupported assertion. Show the analysis please.

An alternate hypothesis (one I deem more rational) is that per-transaction fees do not need to rise to untenable levels, should more transactions be allowed within each block. Well, that's not a hypothesis, that is a provable fact by appeal to simple arithmetic. The hypothesis is that total fees will be larger in this case than they will be in a smallblock world.

Here is another hypothesis, one many deem plausible: that faced with a Bitcoin with little utility because it does not support enough tps to allow a person to use it directly, and the option of XCoin (I hope there is not real coin named XCoin - this is just a variable) with all the characteristics of Bitcoin save its blocksize limitation, enough will adopt XCoin because it provides them real utility, such that XCoin will overtake Bitcoin in transaction volume, monetary volume, and mining concentration.

Would be an uphill battle for another coin to muscle out BTC. All that makes good sense, but x-coin would probably have to be a new or very different algorithm, because many existing sha coins cannot duplicate and are mostly a clone of BTC to begin with. So for another coin it would have to have, new mining gear/softwares and all that development involved with Asics etc. to mine x-coin ... huge hurtles starting right there. So I'd say bitcoin just has to make the necessary changes for improving block size transactions. I think BTC isn't going away anytime soon?    

[Richy_T]

Massive new data centres using new generations of highly efficient mining chips. This is mining now:

That is ridiculous

[Richy_T]

i quit mining because it is pointless to mine in the usa. you buy hardware to mine with and write that off along with ur electricity and whatever else. then you have to mine for months just to break even. then mine several more months to make profit. then you pay the irs income tax on everything you mined. then u have to wait a year to sell to get lower tax rate on the profit you sold your coins at. i mined mostly because i am a hardware geek who tinkered with mining hardware. you are better off just straight buying coins and HODL them. you do not get taxed (at least not yet <roll eyes>) for buying and holding bitcoins. HODL for at least one year and you wont pay as high of taxes (if you consider the 15% TAX RATE THAT OBAMA RAISED TO 20% AS NOT ABUSIVE HIGH TAXES). all my cold storage coins will be one year or older at new years. no point in me selling them though.

i believe the usa govy taxes are to high in an extreme way. we are talking abusively high taxes.

There's no better way to get clean coins though.

[MinermanNC]

Massive new data centres using new generations of highly efficient mining chips. This is mining now:

That is ridiculous

That looks more like a data center for cloud storage than a BTC farm?  

Edit: But hard to see in that pic

[ChartBuddy]

Coin



Explanation

[2015Bubble]

So it has begun 

[ImI]

chart looks strong as fuck

[Cconvert2G36]

We in for another exciting friday night?

[peonminer]

chart looks strong as fuck

[lottery248]

omg why.
no ponzi factor to rise bitcoins pls.
if that is, then we are out.
let's seek for 500.

[jbreher]

Would be an uphill battle for another coin to muscle out BTC.

I agree. It would take a pretty significant advantage for some other coin to capture Bitcoin's market share. I believe the fact that such an XCoin competitor would be usable by people directly due to tps capability, rather than requiring all users to line up behind centralized aggregated access providers required by a 4 tps Bitcoin, may be such an advantage.

Further, once everyone is using these centralized aggregated access providers anyhow, what is the motivation of these centralized actors to continue to use the relatively expensive Bitcoin, rather than the more capable, cheaper XCoin?

[koryu]

That's a sweet dragonfly doji on the 3d. Pressure is up.

Lot of margin will be squeezed either way.

[Fatman3001]

Fatman, you mine. I wouldn't consider you a threat to decentralization. What size blocks do you figure would keep fees low and keep you running smoothly? If prices are higher, is there more competition for txn's? Or will small mines have a harder time solving blocks?

*sorry for all the n00b questions. I've just been informed I'm on the verge of hero status. I still know nothing.

Block size isn't a huge problem for regular miners. As CConvert2G36 points out, I only send my hashes and receive work from the pool. We're talking about tiny amounts of data. The pools can afford to pay for decent internet and/or a hosting service.

The "real" problem is the non-mining nodes who don't get paid to transmit transactions. But I think you and I pretty much agree here. There's enough decent internet in the world to keep the network running with far bigger block sizes. Storage is getting cheaper and cheaper. HW in general is getting cheaper and cheaper. If you live in an area with shitty internet you might want to avoid running a node. But those areas are getting fewer and farther between.

Some "anecdotal evidence" might suggest that people are running their nodes over wifi, which I would strongly recommend against if you want to use you internet for anything else.

In any event, when Bitcoin becomes more mainstream we will see regular computer nerds start firing up nodes. We're talking about a sizable group of individuals who'll spend as much as BJA spent on his "swampnode" on a keyboard.... with fancy buttons with programmable led's (Fingers crossed. Bring it to me Santa!!!).

[adamstgBit]

Are we still talking about blocksize? they increased the limit already... its set in the code to change in 3 months once 90% is working with this version, of course miners will keep their soft 1MB limit ( whiles still expecting block <2MB ) until they feel its right to bump their soft limit to 1,256KB  

[brg444]

In any event, when Bitcoin becomes more mainstream we will see regular computer nerds start firing up nodes. We're talking about a sizable group of individuals who'll spend as much as BJA spent on his "swampnode" on a keyboard.... with fancy buttons with programmable led's (Fingers crossed. Bring it to me Santa!!!).

I'd love if that were true but we've reached a considerable percentage of the nerd market in the last few years and yet for the amount of nodes count as never been lower.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

I love listening to you guys talk.

[adamstgBit]

what we need to be talking about now isn't block limit but TX manubillity and opening up bitcoin's scripting capabilities  


>32000 <2 years!

[Fatman3001]

In any event, when Bitcoin becomes more mainstream we will see regular computer nerds start firing up nodes. We're talking about a sizable group of individuals who'll spend as much as BJA spent on his "swampnode" on a keyboard.... with fancy buttons with programmable led's (Fingers crossed. Bring it to me Santa!!!).

I'd love if that were true but we've reached a considerable percentage of the nerd market in the last few years and yet for the amount of nodes count as never been lower.

It is true. When you push a button the led's ripple through the keyboard. Or you can highlight buttons you frequently need to use... or need to avoid. I doubt it's as useful as I imagine it to be, but let's not let reality get in the way of a good nerdgasm.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

what we need to be talking about now isn't block limit but TX manubillity and opening up bitcoin's scripting capabilities  

[MinermanNC]

Would be an uphill battle for another coin to muscle out BTC.

I agree. It would take a pretty significant advantage for some other coin to capture Bitcoin's market share. I believe the fact that such an XCoin competitor would be usable by people directly due to tps capability, rather than requiring all users to line up behind centralized aggregated access providers required by a 4 tps Bitcoin, may be such an advantage.

Further, once everyone is using these centralized aggregated access providers anyhow, what is the motivation of these centralized actors to continue to use the relatively expensive Bitcoin, rather than the more capable, cheaper XCoin?

That's a good point, we know the banks are looking hard at their own centralized crypto as well as other major developers, but all will have to overcome the image of being centralized as well as provide blockchain integrity of some sort though hashing? I don't know of any other way to support a blockchain. So even with a new coin(s) I still think somehow BTC will be the gold standard of sorts... were as their new more efficient and probably targeted use coins, will convert to BTC... IDK, I'm sure many fall asleep at night wondering about all of this