Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[ChartBuddy]

Coin



Explanation

[dani]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

[Fatman3001]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

They are full precisely because almost all near-zero fee transactions are currently included.

Are all zero fee transactions included in Litecoin, Dash, monero, etherium?  Bitcoin is losing market share because competitors are underpricing us. 

Just open a block explorer and you'll see LTC and DASH has like 4-5-6 tx/block, monero is at 0-1.

BTC does like 2000 txs/block.

You are either gaining market share or you are losing it. It doesn't matter how far of a lead you have. if your competitor is picking up speed and you are slowing down, in a long enough race, you will lose.

no coin has had the heat thrown at it that bitcoin has ... if any of them get big enough to warrant more than a 'meh' then the blow torch comes on them.

I want to see the BS of V. Buterin explode into a full-blown internet rage war, PoS ethereum is going to encourage some truly sick politicking, you thought PoW chinese miners was an 'issue'?

No coin...yet. We seem to be talking past each other. Look, there can be only one "most marketable commodity" by definition. Another word for that term is "money".  In order for something to be marketable, you have to be able to bring it to market. To exchange it.  NO cryptocoin is money yet, but no cryptocoin will ever become money if it can't be exchangeable in the frequencies money needs to be exchanged.

If Etherium has more utility due to smart contracts, turing completeness or whatever, it will gain market share faster. PoS has serious problems and I've always said that, but it turns our PoW also has a serious problem: Chinese electricity and labor cost advantages means ANY PoW plan may result in the same loss of censorship resistance Bitcoin is experiencing with mining overdevelopment and concentration in one political jurisdiction.

 

Caspar? POS? Vitalik's a cowboy. Will any of that even blend?

If Ethereum manages to prove that PoS is safe on a large scale, Bitcoin might have to move to PoS as well.

[harrymmmm]

Adam told you it wasn't. Close to a month ago, but don't mention that,
'Course (iirc) he also offered a fix for the issue, but don't mention that.

Yep, better to see if the angry mob can be used to fuck with the price a bit more. /s

[marcus_of_augustus]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

the set-up is insanely bullish .... which is why we are getting this incessant barrage of negative FUD (currently now focusing on HF, segwit, chicom-miners, doomer bullshit) that needs to get corrected but inevitably derails the thread

[valta4065]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

CB's maths are wrong.

I had to wait the whole night for my tx to go through. First time I need to wait so long :-/

[harrymmmm]

Bitcoin Core 0.12 is officially released. I'm glad I can now ban the few 'classic' nodes that try to promote bitcoin altcoin fork.

Core is so concerned about node dropoff that they now want to ban any node not running their code. Makes sense.

Was that an example of being constrained by ethics. Haha.

That ban option is there to disable misbehaving nodes afaics.

Gotta admit tho, it IS handy for banning classic nodes. I just did a couple...

[AlexGR]

i just send 1$ to 1LBHYYEbd8eqrfi9PiSEkj35e9vM3iZEFm with a 1cent fee

lets see what happens...

sending it now...

https://blockchain.info/address/1LBHYYEbd8eqrfi9PiSEkj35e9vM3iZEFm

if this dont work ill send it with a 5cent fee.

current block height 399867

Took a while but:

Included In Blocks   399923

Even with near-zero fees at 0.01$ you got in, with lower priority, despite "blocks are full".

Because the time to worry about the rising costs are after they become a problem or before? The time to worry about lifeboat capacity is after the iceberg has been hit?  

We've seen what the network looks like in even more congested situations due to the stress tests.

Fees remained low still.

The reason is that legit txs are way below 1mb and what is left of the 1mb is "topped off" with very cheap/spam/dust/dice etc txs. So the legit txs can always get confirmed fast with 3-4-5cents, while the spammers try to get included (and do get included) by trying fees like 0 and 1 cent.

If the network can process both legit use, spam, stress test that artificially bloats txs, and do all that while fees are consistently at near-zero cost, then fuck me man... what more do you want? And this SHOULDN'T BE LIKE THAT. It's not healthy. It's not what it's supposed to be based on Bitcoin's design to replace diminishing subsidy with rising fees - and we have already distributed ~75% of the monetary base.

[AlexGR]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

CB's maths are wrong.

I had to wait the whole night for my tx to go through. First time I need to wait so long :-/

Anything from 0.02$+ confirms fast, as proved, and even 0.01$ confirms in a few hours.

Again: This is ridiculously low fees. The fact that transactions are even included at these rates is a market failure of shorts.

[JayJuanGee]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

Yes, wishful thinking stopping the various FUD, quasi-off topic and trolling.

I personally have little clue about the price direction on the short term.. with the various ongoing price manipulations that seem to be occurring and even the seemingly relatively speaking low volume.

It would be nice to get some high volume upward price action to bring us past $467, but I am having my doubts about how long it is going to take for such an event to occur because when we have fairly low trade volume with upward and downward girations, we have the sense that there is not a whole hell-a-va lot of passion out there regarding bitcoin pumping (to get us to move upwards), and when low volume is sustained, then the price is being controlled by a fairly small amount of capital, which means that BTC prices can be driven down with a few thousand coins dumped over a few hours. 

Surely, the whales need more than a few thousand coins and capital to control bitcoin prices, but relatively speaking, it is not a lot when the volume is so low on an ongoing basis. 

Accordingly, if there is high trade volume with upward price movement (for example, averaging more than 15k coins per day on Bitstamp for more than a week), then that level of trade volume signifies that we have a pretty decent BTC price battle going on (and some passion in the fight between the bears and the bulls)... otherwise if there is not a passionate battle, then little by little bears can control and manipulate and surprise with dumps...

To me, I kind of assess that we have not experienced such a sustained BTC price battle for more than 8 weeks... so can become a bit nerve racking.. to witness the bears kind of controlling and the FUD receiving too much attention... and the passion for upward movement is not quite high enough to cause upward umph. 

Prior to 8 weeks ago, we had about 20 weeks of a decent and sustained trade volume which really was a price battle that brought us to our current approximate floating price (largely floating between the $360s and the $460s during this kind of waiting and see period.. maybe even a kind of consolidation range.. at least for the moment, until passion increases... which will come, sooner or later.. hopefully sooner...  ).

[AlexGR]

3) Amount sent    $1.00 (.00236  BTC)      I Manually added Fee  .00001 BTC ($.004) (.00001 BTC per kilobyte)  (fee % = 0.4%)
- Was never viewable on receiving end until after completely received / available for use (3 confirmations) after 9 hours / 21 minutes.

0.004$.

Not even a cent.

4 tenths of 1 cent.

Confirmed.

Under "full blocks".

I mean wtf.

[Fatman3001]

This might help clear out some of the cobwebs of your confusion adam...    

idk the guy, he's chinese i assumed he was a big blocker.

peter todd shouldn't be allowed to have friends.

Samson Mow is the best comedian working in the Bitcoin space.  And FYI he's Canadian.

Can we get him to write a sitcom about Peter Todd and Luke Jr as an odd couple that somehow gets locked in a room together in every episode?

I'm picturing a sort of Peep Show meets Big Bang Theory angsty geekfest of feisty mutual loathing with occasional rapport and reconciliation.  

Richard Ayoade as The Todd.  David Mitchell as Luke?  Benedict Wong can play Samson when they break the fourth wall.  

That show would last five minutes, ending with Luke-JR hammering a cross through Peters heart while reciting scripture in latin with an appalachian accent.

I'd watch it.

[dani]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

Yes, wishful thinking stopping the various FUD, quasi-off topic and trolling.

I personally have little clue about the price direction on the short term.. with the various ongoing price manipulations that seem to be occurring and even the seemingly relatively speaking low volume.

It would be nice to get some high volume upward price action to bring us past $467, but I am having my doubts about how long it is going to take for such an event to occur because when we have fairly low trade volume with upward and downward girations, we have the sense that there is not a whole hell-a-va lot of passion out there regarding bitcoin pumping (to get us to move upwards), and when low volume is sustained, then the price is being controlled by a fairly small amount of capital, which means that BTC prices can be driven down with a few thousand coins dumped over a few hours. 

Surely, the whales need more than a few thousand coins and capital to control bitcoin prices, but relatively speaking, it is not a lot when the volume is so low on an ongoing basis. 

Accordingly, if there is high trade volume with upward price movement (for example, averaging more than 15k coins per day on Bitstamp for more than a week), then that level of trade volume signifies that we have a pretty decent BTC price battle going on (and some passion in the fight between the bears and the bulls)... otherwise if there is not a passionate battle, then little by little bears can control and manipulate and surprise with dumps...

To me, I kind of assess that we have not experienced such a sustained BTC price battle for more than 8 weeks... so can become a bit nerve racking.. to witness the bears kind of controlling and the FUD receiving too much attention... and the passion for upward movement is not quite high enough to cause upward umph. 

Prior to 8 weeks ago, we had about 20 weeks of a decent and sustained trade volume which really was a price battle that brought us to our current approximate floating price (largely floating between the $360s and the $460s during this kind of waiting and see period.. maybe even a kind of consolidation range.. at least for the moment, until passion increases... which will come, sooner or later.. hopefully sooner...  ).

Thank you! I think that sums up the past few weeks. Like you said, the volume is quite low. I'll see if the price will drop a little further

I think we'll see 410 again, this week. You guys think it could slip to 370-380 for a day and recover quickly? Too much support? I'd love that idea of buying them cheap

[Lutzow]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

Yes, wishful thinking stopping the various FUD, quasi-off topic and trolling.

I personally have little clue about the price direction on the short term.. with the various ongoing price manipulations that seem to be occurring and even the seemingly relatively speaking low volume.

It would be nice to get some high volume upward price action to bring us past $467, but I am having my doubts about how long it is going to take for such an event to occur because when we have fairly low trade volume with upward and downward girations, we have the sense that there is not a whole hell-a-va lot of passion out there regarding bitcoin pumping (to get us to move upwards), and when low volume is sustained, then the price is being controlled by a fairly small amount of capital, which means that BTC prices can be driven down with a few thousand coins dumped over a few hours. 

Surely, the whales need more than a few thousand coins and capital to control bitcoin prices, but relatively speaking, it is not a lot when the volume is so low on an ongoing basis. 

Accordingly, if there is high trade volume with upward price movement (for example, averaging more than 15k coins per day on Bitstamp for more than a week), then that level of trade volume signifies that we have a pretty decent BTC price battle going on (and some passion in the fight between the bears and the bulls)... otherwise if there is not a passionate battle, then little by little bears can control and manipulate and surprise with dumps...

To me, I kind of assess that we have not experienced such a sustained BTC price battle for more than 8 weeks... so can become a bit nerve racking.. to witness the bears kind of controlling and the FUD receiving too much attention... and the passion for upward movement is not quite high enough to cause upward umph. 

Prior to 8 weeks ago, we had about 20 weeks of a decent and sustained trade volume which really was a price battle that brought us to our current approximate floating price (largely floating between the $360s and the $460s during this kind of waiting and see period.. maybe even a kind of consolidation range.. at least for the moment, until passion increases... which will come, sooner or later.. hopefully sooner...  ).

Thank you! I think that sums up the past few weeks. Like you said, the volume is quite low. I'll see if the price will drop a little further

I think we'll see 410 again, this week. You guys think it could slip to 370-380 for a day and recover quickly? Too much support? I'd love that idea of buying them cheap

Probably it will recover right away just like it did a while ago when the price hits around the $380 area. This is due to the fact that many bitcoiners will buy it as everyone usually do when the price dips thinking of a possible uptick in price which equally translates to profit.

[JayJuanGee]

3) Amount sent    $1.00 (.00236  BTC)      I Manually added Fee  .00001 BTC ($.004) (.00001 BTC per kilobyte)  (fee % = 0.4%)
- Was never viewable on receiving end until after completely received / available for use (3 confirmations) after 9 hours / 21 minutes.

0.004$.

Not even a cent.

4 tenths of 1 cent.

Confirmed.

Under "full blocks".

I mean wtf.

Actually, in this experiment, I probably should have attempted one transaction without any fees at all, but the blockchain app made me put in some fee, so I chose .00001 BTC per kilobyte.

[valta4065]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

CB's maths are wrong.

I had to wait the whole night for my tx to go through. First time I need to wait so long :-/

Anything from 0.02$+ confirms fast, as proved, and even 0.01$ confirms in a few hours.

Again: This is ridiculously low fees. The fact that transactions are even included at these rates is a market failure of shorts.

Question of point of view. 1 cent for a 1$ tx is 1%. Not a ridiculous amount.

[AlexGR]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

CB's maths are wrong.

I had to wait the whole night for my tx to go through. First time I need to wait so long :-/

Anything from 0.02$+ confirms fast, as proved, and even 0.01$ confirms in a few hours.

Again: This is ridiculously low fees. The fact that transactions are even included at these rates is a market failure of shorts.

Question of point of view. 1 cent for a 1$ tx is 1%. Not a ridiculous amount.

You can have 250.000 txs per day moving around 1 dollar on avg (daily volume = 250k$), or you could be moving 1000$ (daily volume = 250mn $).

It's a choice.

And scaling can't go 1000x - I mean Gavin can't come up with 1GB blocks to produce 250mn transactions per day of avg 1 dollar.

[JayJuanGee]

Guys, can we stick to the thread? I want charts, Doomsday and moon postings. No more HF, segwit and bullshit posts.

What do you think about the price movement? I for once thought the uprise stopped and would slowly decrease. But since we bounced back @415 yesterday I'm not quite sure about that

Yes, wishful thinking stopping the various FUD, quasi-off topic and trolling.

I personally have little clue about the price direction on the short term.. with the various ongoing price manipulations that seem to be occurring and even the seemingly relatively speaking low volume.

It would be nice to get some high volume upward price action to bring us past $467, but I am having my doubts about how long it is going to take for such an event to occur because when we have fairly low trade volume with upward and downward girations, we have the sense that there is not a whole hell-a-va lot of passion out there regarding bitcoin pumping (to get us to move upwards), and when low volume is sustained, then the price is being controlled by a fairly small amount of capital, which means that BTC prices can be driven down with a few thousand coins dumped over a few hours.  

Surely, the whales need more than a few thousand coins and capital to control bitcoin prices, but relatively speaking, it is not a lot when the volume is so low on an ongoing basis.  

Accordingly, if there is high trade volume with upward price movement (for example, averaging more than 15k coins per day on Bitstamp for more than a week), then that level of trade volume signifies that we have a pretty decent BTC price battle going on (and some passion in the fight between the bears and the bulls)... otherwise if there is not a passionate battle, then little by little bears can control and manipulate and surprise with dumps...

To me, I kind of assess that we have not experienced such a sustained BTC price battle for more than 8 weeks... so can become a bit nerve racking.. to witness the bears kind of controlling and the FUD receiving too much attention... and the passion for upward movement is not quite high enough to cause upward umph.  

Prior to 8 weeks ago, we had about 20 weeks of a decent and sustained trade volume which really was a price battle that brought us to our current approximate floating price (largely floating between the $360s and the $460s during this kind of waiting and see period.. maybe even a kind of consolidation range.. at least for the moment, until passion increases... which will come, sooner or later.. hopefully sooner...   ).

Thank you! I think that sums up the past few weeks. Like you said, the volume is quite low. I'll see if the price will drop a little further

I think we'll see 410 again, this week. You guys think it could slip to 370-380 for a day and recover quickly? Too much support? I'd love that idea of buying them cheap

I am becoming a bit bearish on the short term (maybe 52.5% down and 47.5% up - I mean like a 5%-10% correction), but really, I don't know.. I just have an inclination.  

My inclinations can be quite wrong, sometimes.  In mid-November, I recall around $300 waiting for BTC prices to go below $300 and waiting for the push below $300, and sometimes the price just won't go lower.  We cannot always really know for sure when the bears have run out of ammo or willpower or whatever it is that then causes the price to resume its upward trajectory.

Personally, I think that you should have enough ammo that you can continue to buy on the way down, if prices go there, but also, you should be prepared for prices to go upwards too (so never sell all or even a large majority of your stash.. better to buy and sell in increments, possibly of less than 10% of your stash - unless you really are convinced and have some solid insight for some reason).

I have enough ammo if prices go below $360, but really that is not the preferable direction because most of my ammo is prepared for upwards, and we cannot really know, which way it is going to go..  

Once we are in BTC, for our own sanity, if we want to stay in BTC for the long-term, we can only prepare for both price directions because that seems to be likely to continue for quite some time into the future.

[valta4065]

blocks are completely full
every single one
my 1cent fee tx has yet to be mined

CB's maths are wrong.

I had to wait the whole night for my tx to go through. First time I need to wait so long :-/

Anything from 0.02$+ confirms fast, as proved, and even 0.01$ confirms in a few hours.

Again: This is ridiculously low fees. The fact that transactions are even included at these rates is a market failure of shorts.

Question of point of view. 1 cent for a 1$ tx is 1%. Not a ridiculous amount.

You can have 250.000 txs per day moving around 1 dollar on avg (daily volume = 250k$), or you could be moving 1000$ (daily volume = 250mn $).

It's a choice.

And scaling can't go 1000x - I mean Gavin can't come up with 1GB blocks to produce 250mn transactions per day of avg 1 dollar.

I see your point. But BTC is not used for massive tx. In fact its reputation is rather the contrary: being able to send small amounts to people. This comes from all the faucets and ponzi shits.

[harrymmmm]

Coin



Explanation

Damn! Blocks are fucking full! I've got and important tx waiting for its third confirmation for ages ><

Not sure if newbie or troll, but i'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
Third conf has absolutely nothing to do with full blocks.