Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[jbreher]

To scale to visa/mastercard transactions per second, the blocks can never be big enough (if I remember correctly we need about 6Gig per block),

Never? Have you forgotten the mechanics of compound interest?

Internet bandwidth is growing by 24% CAGR. (http://www.cisco.com/c/en/us/solutions/collateral/service-provider/visual-networking-index-vni/vni-hyperconnectivity-wp.html)

There is a ratio of 6000 between 1MB and 6GB. This is less than 12 doublings.

If 1MB was small enough for 2010, then 6GB will be small enough in the year 2045 or so. Dominant payment mechanism in 30 years? I like the sound of that. You really think adoption will move that fast?

https://lightning.network/

Scalability. Capable of millions to billions of transactions per second across the network. Capacity blows away legacy payment rails by many orders of magnitude.

And the point of blowing way past any conceivable takeup is ... ... ... what, exactly?

The security tradeoffs are not worth it to me. And as mentioned before, there's that entire lack of a working routing mechanism thing.

Oh - and you didn't answer my question, did you?

Lightning Network...this ones goes to a billion.

Much like Nigel's relabeling of '10' as '11', SegWit accomplishes its block size magic by mere dishonest accounting trickery. XD

Incidentally, the Fender Bassman model 5F6-A, upon which the first Marshall amps were based - went to '12'.

[fluidjax]

Much like Nigel's relabeling of '10' as '11', SegWit accomplishes its block size magic by mere dishonest accounting trickery.

The only serious research I have seen into block size is Bitfury's
http://bitfury.com/content/5-white-papers-research/block-size-1.1.1.pdf


Look at the requirements for 32M blocks, 400GB daily, 128Gb ram.
At 32M, this excludes 95% of the current bitcoin nodes creating almost total miner centralisation.
Imagine what 6Gb blocks require.



I take these figures with due scepticism, but there is nothing else to compare it against.

[Elwar]

we are going to have a second layer and we will allow bigger blocks.

stop worrying about irrelevant stats like node count, 10000 raspberry pies with poor connectivity isn't going to make your network more resilient than 1000 20K dollar machines.

bitcoin's security model is based on hash power. dont like that? make an Proof Of Nodes altcoin.

Bigger blocks on a second later will be pretty sweet.

[Dakustaking76]

Price is going lower again
What happend?
Small dropp i know But just asking Why aint we going forward

[r0ach]

Price is going lower again
What happend?

Because the sheklers at Goldman Sachs told people to buy bitcoin with both hands, which means it's probably going to 12 cents:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-24/goldman-nervous-bitcoin-traders-be-patient-next-surge-will-take-it-above-3600

[micalith]

Price is going lower again
What happend?

Because the sheklers at Goldman Sachs told people to buy bitcoin with both hands, which means it's probably going to 12 cents:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-24/goldman-nervous-bitcoin-traders-be-patient-next-surge-will-take-it-above-3600

yup, lots of good news, so final chance of selling manipulation for buying 'cheap coin'

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/ledgerx-gets-us-approval-for-derivatives-on-digital-currencies-20170724-01338

[Olivious]

Price is going lower again
What happend?

Because the sheklers at Goldman Sachs told people to buy bitcoin with both hands, which means it's probably going to 12 cents:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-07-24/goldman-nervous-bitcoin-traders-be-patient-next-surge-will-take-it-above-3600

yup, lots of good news, so final chance of selling manipulation for buying 'cheap coin'

http://www.nasdaq.com/article/ledgerx-gets-us-approval-for-derivatives-on-digital-currencies-20170724-01338

I like how it falls $100 then people panics again and again and again. They should research why is it rising or falling.

[JayJuanGee]

the recent activation of segwit, and the signaling for segwit2x were two completely independent things.

I think that you are lacking factual and logical integrity to make such claims of non-connectedness.  

maybe so, but i'm still right.
the activation lock-in of segwit was done via version bits, while signaling for NYA was done coinbase string ( less formal ).
there was no version bits that meant segwit2x support
there was bit4 for bip91 and bit1 for bip141

miners could have simply set bit4 on and not signal NYA in there coinbase, wouldn't REALLY of made a dif. so the fact that almost all miner bothered to signal NYA in there coinbase ( needlessly ) was a sign of good faith to make good on the NYA nothing more nothing less.

Your above statement is internally contradictory.  I am not really disagreeing with you regarding the technical aspects of the signaling being a separate thing in each.. the signaling of Segwit2x being different from the signaling of BIP91 - however, you are suggesting that the Segwit2x did not mean anything in terms of contributing to the locking in of BIP91.. but yet at the same time, the signaling of segwit2x means that those folks signaling are serious about the 2x part. 

maybe it is like beating a dead horse if we were to continue to go over this, because I am saying that you cannot infer the level of 2x support from the segwit2x signaling and you are saying that segwit2x is a decent indicator of 2x support... we seem to be at a dead end (logger heads)

Probably you are going to continue to see this "signaling of intention" to continue to drop, and if it remains on the websites (such as coin.dance), then it will likely shrink a lot more after segwit is actually active in the end of August - I don't see what purpose it serves because there is no triggering mechanism through that "intention" signaling..   Maybe in the future there will be a need to remove the segwit portion from such intention signaling and then see what level of support remains if there were only the 2mb hardfork in the signaling of intention?

i would assume miners will continue to signal NYA so long as they intent to fallow threw with the agreement (in full)

Yeah, but if signaling NYA does not commit them to anything, then it should have very little value... We will have to see what happens here, because our predictions are quite opposite.

I don't think it is necessary to respond to the remainder of your points because it seems that we are just coming to opposite conclusions based on our speculation regarding whether when the rubber hits the road is the bigblocker support going to be there... I say no, and you say yes.  So, we disagree, even though I would not assert my position as an absolute because some matters could change, but as of now, based on what I see in terms of both facts and logic, I really doubt that the material and relevant miner support for 2x HF is as great as you are asserting that support to be.

[JayJuanGee]

if you cannot will not spend a little bit of money to help this network,  you have no business in its faith, so PISS OFF!

Craig?   Craig?   Is that you?

[hv_]

we are going to have a second layer and we will allow bigger blocks.

stop worrying about irrelevant stats like node count, 10000 raspberry pies with poor connectivity isn't going to make your network more resilient than 1000 20K dollar machines.

bitcoin's security model is based on hash power. dont like that? make an Proof Of Nodes altcoin.

Bigger blocks on a second later will be pretty sweet.

Sweets are killing your life more than weapons these days...


Bigger blocks at first is the healthy medicine a Bitcoin maximalist needs most.

[El duderino_]

Bet CLOSED! Let the game begins...
Thank you all for supporting this game and I wish you all good luck. Let's make contact when ATH touched.
Final list:
20/07 Siggy 
21/07 Mr Frog
22/07 Protokol
23/07 Bitcoinaire
24/07 Lost_in_base
25/07 rjclarke2000
26/07 Globbo
27/07 Poolminor
28/07 TeeBone
29/07 Ted E. Bear
30/07 bathy
31/07 Infofront
01/08 Vin
02/08 Steelboy
03/08 D_eddie
04/08 Bitserve
05/08 Bikerleszno
06/08 Last of the v8s
07/08 Pajulapoiss
08/08 Imbatman
09/08 Mikenz
10/08 Machasm
11/08 Aesma
12/08 doc12
13/08 Fluidjax
14/08 ShroomsKit_Disgrace
15/08 Fragout
16/08 Orpington
17/08 sirazimuth
18/08 Ivomm
19/08 Elwar
20/08 Oblox
21/08 Haciendo
22/08 Boba
23/08 ErisDiscordia
24/08 Ludwig Von
25/08 Hazukison
26/08 SportbetMaster
27/08 Nanobtc
28/08 Vamos1
29/08 Paashaas
30/08 RayX12
31/08 BinaryReign
02/09 Patrisorvieto
05/09 Entons
06/09 Oinas
09/09 Edgar
11/09 Buwaytress
15/09 MinermanNC
17/09 Spaceman_spiff
21/09 undeadbitcoiner
01/10 K.Ehleyr
02/10 Petemoss2
04/10 Herman Hesse
13/10 Cryptoqueen
05/11 Chainsaw
21/11 Icygreen
12/12 Kurious
23/12 Fractaluniverse
14/01/2018 In the silence
05/02/2018 savetherainforest

[fluidjax]

if you cannot will not spend a little bit of money to help this network,  you have no business in its faith, so PISS OFF!

its not about distributing the blockchain to everyone.
its about allowing everyone to participate in it.

no offence intended, i worded that rather harshly :S

Craig Steven Wright is that you?
(edit: lol I now see JJG says the same)

I'm happy to spend money on my nodes, but it's about ensuring the network is de-centralised.  That is the only thing that truly distinguishes it from the corporate payment systems.
Mass participation, store of value... who cares about any of this if its not decentralised.

I will resist anything that erodes that.

[Slow death]

Price is going lower again
What happend?
Small dropp i know But just asking Why aint we going forward

As long as we do not pass on August 1 there will still be many uncertainties





Speaking on August 1, viabtc already removed its txaccelerator


https://www.viabtc.com/tools/txaccelerator/

[fluidjax]

Price is going lower again
What happend?
Small dropp i know But just asking Why aint we going forward

TA made the price drop, the pennant nearly closed without an real sign of rising, it's easy to dump first and then pick up your coins on the followers.

[petemoss2]

Speaking on August 1, viabtc already removed its txaccelerator


https://www.viabtc.com/tools/txaccelerator/

It's still there. You just need to click "txaccelerator" twice.

edit: the link above will bring you to a "404 error...." page. Click on the "accelerator" option.

[JayJuanGee]

Price is going lower again
What happend?
Small dropp i know But just asking Why aint we going forward

This is be called bitcoin.


Why you want to get excited by a little bit of price movement?

Generally, we are in striking distance of ATH and really within a kind of range of $2600 to $2950.... ...

Now, maybe it is starting appear that we are going to break down.. but at the moment, as I type, we are still in the range.. currently $2650...

If we break down below $2600 (or maybe $2550), then the next area of support would likely be in the $2200 to $2400 territory...

Anyhow, we are not there yet, and decent ongoing buying pressure seems to continue in bitcoinlandia..

[Mrpumperitis]

https://medium.com/@jimmysong/bitcoin-cash-what-you-need-to-know-c25df28995cf

[luckygenough56]

golman sachs advice :

Sell eth ---> sell bitcoin ---> fiat

[spiderbrain]

I legitimately get myself upset everytime i come here and debate this. its not healthy. i have to stay away....

Keep it up! I'm surprised anyone has the energy any more

[mymenace]

Huge, game changer


....' The “corporate capital of the world” has just made it legal for corporations to use blockchain technology for stock trading and record-keeping. At the same time, a digital currency trading platform has been authorized to provide clearing services.

The new blockchain rules will go into effect by August 1, 2017.

“LedgerX will be authorized to provide clearing services for fully-collateralized digital currency swaps,” the announcement said, adding that LedgerX “initially plans to clear bitcoin options.” '....


https://www.rt.com/usa/397397-blockchain-delaware-bill-passes/