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Question: Closing BTC Price June 17:
$0 - 2 (1.7%)
<$6,500 - 7 (6%)
$6,500-$6,750 - 1 (0.9%)
$6,751-$7,000 - 2 (1.7%)
$7,001-$7,250 - 3 (2.6%)
$7,251-$7,500 - 6 (5.2%)
$7,501-$7,750 - 4 (3.4%)
$7,751-$8,000 - 12 (10.3%)
$8,001-$8,250 - 13 (11.2%)
$8,251-$8,500 - 6 (5.2%)
$8,501-$8,750 - 6 (5.2%)
$8,751-$9,000 - 11 (9.5%)
$9,001,$9,250 - 10 (8.6%)
$9,251-$9,500 - 9 (7.8%)
>$9,500 - 16 (13.8%)
$20,000 - 8 (6.9%)
Total Voters: 116

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 21223947 times)
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BTCMILLIONAIRE
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January 23, 2019, 07:09:27 AM

On an unrelated side note. It's quite interesting how the subsets of shared opinion holders on this thread seem to go through all possible permutations.
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January 23, 2019, 07:09:35 AM
Merited by 600watt (1)

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them? 
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January 23, 2019, 07:10:56 AM
Merited by jbreher (1)

So you are stating that the child soldier in your example would be better off complaining than trying to figure out how to stay alive or find a way out of his current life?

I have been speaking in generalities but yes if that was his only outlet other than getting killed. I refer now you back to my original post, this is why speaking in absolutes is always wrong.
Absolutely. Always.
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January 23, 2019, 07:12:40 AM


But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

Ok lets consider slavery.  Yes there are slaves right now.  To wit:

Quote
Modern slavery is defined as slavery, servitude, forced or compulsory labour and human trafficking1. The 2016 Global Slavery Index estimates that 45.8m people in 167 countries are living in modern
slavery today2. The majority are victims of exploitation in private sector activities, such as manufacturing, construction and agriculture. Forced labour and slavery is big business — the International Labour
Organisation estimates that illicit profits from these crimes amount to US$150b per year. Businesses are facing increasing pressure to tackle the crisis of modern slavery head-on as awareness grows and
consumers demand more responsibility from their preferred brands. Modern slavery also represents a significant reputational risk to businesses as non-governmental organisations and the media ‘name
and shame’ companies who violate human rights.   [...]  In 2016, there were an estimated 11,700 victims of slavery in Britain alone
 Source:  https://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015/$FILE/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015.pdf



Can we safely assume that Jbear and BTCMillionaire think that any of the current 45 million slaves in the world that has time to complain about about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them

Is this how you guys think?
General reminder to everyone that slavery has been abolished in our part of the world for hundreds of years.
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January 23, 2019, 07:14:49 AM

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them? 
We should not try to help them. We should keep them out of our country. We have enough problems to deal with. Some of them arguably more severe than theirs.
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January 23, 2019, 07:15:03 AM

General reminder to everyone that slavery has been abolished in our part of the world for hundreds of years.

Is that why there are 11,000 slaves in the UK in 2016?  

FYI illegal drugs have been abolished too.  Doesn't seem to have worked out.
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January 23, 2019, 07:15:57 AM

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them?  
We should not try to help them. We should keep them out of our country. We have enough problems to deal with. Some of them arguably more severe than theirs.

Yup.  Conservative in a nutshell.  I won't lift a finger for anyone that isn't me - fuck them.  Good one.
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January 23, 2019, 07:16:27 AM

General reminder to everyone that slavery has been abolished in our part of the world for hundreds of years.

Is that  why there are 11,000 slaves in the UK in 2016?  

FYI drugs have been abolished too.
The brits have fallen. So has Sweden and France. None of them will recover without some kind of war or mass purge, if at all.
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January 23, 2019, 07:17:28 AM

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them? 
We should not try to help them. We should keep them out of our country. We have enough problems to deal with. Some of them arguably more severe than theirs.

Yup.  Conservative in a nutshell.  Fuck everyone who isn't me.  Good one.
That's your side who thinks like that. You want what you want because you want it. You have no arguments, just feelings. Feelings ain't gonna get anyone out of slavery.
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January 23, 2019, 07:33:52 AM

I say that both of you (jbreher and BTCMILLIONAIRE) are on the wrong side on this subject. Many times it is just random events, and not the effort.

Which is, of course, why the lazy and the stupid are universally wallowing in riches, and the soup kitchens cater to those that identify opportunities and work ceaselessly to attain the next rung up.

Right.

 Roll Eyes
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January 23, 2019, 07:39:33 AM
Last edit: January 23, 2019, 07:53:32 AM by Biodom

I say that both of you (jbreher and BTCMILLIONAIRE) are on the wrong side on this subject. Many times it is just random events, and not the effort.

Which is, of course, why the lazy and the stupid are universally wallowing in riches, and the soup kitchens cater to those that identify opportunities and work ceaselessly to attain the next rung up.

Right.

 Roll Eyes

I have no idea what whining and the lack of effort both of you keep talking about. It is probably something personal since you are so adamant about it.
Watch "Trading places". A bit of exaggeration, but an interesting idea. Not sure if it was tried IRL, though.
There is an interesting source, though:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-hedge-fund-geniuses-got-beaten-by-monkeys-again-2015-06-25
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January 23, 2019, 07:46:28 AM

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them?  
You keep pulling shit out of your ass and trying to shove it down my throat.

You act as if I had stated that considering helping them or actively (trying to) do so shouldn't be allowed, which is false. None of that crap has anything to do with the argument though.


Name me one example in which you will see strictly better results by complaining than by thinking up different potential solutions. You can't. Because complaining is a destructive force with a net effect that is either zero or negative.
Nobody is stopping you from helping others, and props to you if you're not just a hypocrite running your mouth and actually doing what you preach to others (which I doubt). But none of that has anything to do with the fact that energy invested in complaining is wasted energy.

Best case you will make people aware of a given problem, but if that was your goal there are vastly more efficient ways that won't cause other gullible people to just complain as well.
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January 23, 2019, 07:50:42 AM

I say that both of you (jbreher and BTCMILLIONAIRE) are on the wrong side on this subject. Many times it is just random events, and not the effort.

Which is, of course, why the lazy and the stupid are universally wallowing in riches, and the soup kitchens cater to those that identify opportunities and work ceaselessly to attain the next rung up.

Right.

 Roll Eyes

I have no fucking idea what whining and the lack of effort both of you keep talking about. It is probably something personal since you are so adamant about it.
Watch "Trading places". A bit of exaggeration, but an interesting idea. Not sure if it was tried IRL, though.
There is an interesting source, though:
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/how-hedge-fund-geniuses-got-beaten-by-monkeys-again-2015-06-25
This all started with someone whining over wealth inequality and the widening wealth gap. Which should be completely irrelevant to literally everyone except data fetishists.
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January 23, 2019, 07:51:17 AM
Merited by 600watt (1)

Name me one example in which you will see strictly better results by complaining than by thinking up different potential solutions. You can't. Because complaining is a destructive force with a net effect that is either zero or negative.

What you call "complaining" I call advocacy.  And advocacy works.  We wouldn't have the UK modern slavery laws without advocacy.  

Making it illegal for Western companies to profit from slavery is highly effective, because the directors go directly to jail.  And guess what, company directors sit up in their chairs and pay attention when you say "if you don't do X, you will go to jail".   Then the directors tell their C-suite, "don't fuck up on X, or I will fire you without hesitation".  Those are real results, in real time.  

That is one you will see strictly better results by "complaining" rather than blaming the victim.  

Because what you are doing is blaming the slave for being a slave.  And that achieves nothing.  People like you avoid having to take responsibility for anything by always blaming the victim.  "If he wasn't such a dissident, he wouldn't have gone to Chinese prison camp". 
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January 23, 2019, 07:59:01 AM

Name me one example in which you will see strictly better results by complaining than by thinking up different potential solutions. You can't. Because complaining is a destructive force with a net effect that is either zero or negative.

What you call "complaining" I call advocacy.  And advocacy works.  We wouldn't have the UK modern slavery laws without advocacy.  

Making it illegal for Western companies to profit from slavery is highly effective, because the directors go directly to jail.  And guess what, company directors sit up in their chairs and pay attention when you say "if you don't do X, you will go to jail".   Then the directors tell their C-suite, "don't fuck up on X, or I will fire you without hesitation".  Those are real results, in real time.  

That is one you will see strictly better results by "complaining" rather than blaming the victim.  

Because what you are doing is blaming the slave for being a slave.  And that achieves nothing.  People like you avoid having to take responsibility for anything by always blaming the victim.  "If he wasn't such a dissident, he wouldn't have gone to Chinese prison camp". 
You keep ignoring one crucial thing. How does trying to get rid of slavery in shithole countries benefit us?
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January 23, 2019, 08:02:55 AM

Name me one example in which you will see strictly better results by complaining than by thinking up different potential solutions. You can't. Because complaining is a destructive force with a net effect that is either zero or negative.

What you call "complaining" I call advocacy.  And advocacy works.  We wouldn't have the UK modern slavery laws without advocacy.  

Making it illegal for Western companies to profit from slavery is highly effective, because the directors go directly to jail.  And guess what, company directors sit up in their chairs and pay attention when you say "if you don't do X, you will go to jail".   Then the directors tell their C-suite, "don't fuck up on X, or I will fire you without hesitation".  Those are real results, in real time.  

That is one you will see strictly better results by "complaining" rather than blaming the victim.  

Because what you are doing is blaming the slave for being a slave.  And that achieves nothing.  
This just shows that your reading comprehension skills are non-existent. You're filling gaps that never even existed.

The quote of mine stated that:

An individual which chooses to invest their individual time into complaining about their individual situation instead of trying to improve their own individual situation doesn't deserve an improved situation. (Spoilers: Always the same individual.)


You now take an outsider, e.g. yourself, complaining on behalf of a victim (which you made up) to disprove my assertion.

None of what you've tried to state here has anything to do with what I've stated.

In my statement, the slave girl or child soldier or whatever the fuck you want to use as an appeal-to-emotion example (any individual can be used here, really) is better off investing their time into figuring out any way to improve their situation over complaining over their situation.
Complaining will do nothing to improve their situation, especially in the outlandish situations you've named here.

Yet you try to use those to disprove a completely different claim that you have made up (and constantly keep changing with new examples). All while trying to portray me as some kind of inhumane devil. That's some serious mental acrobatics that I would only expect out of a lawyer.
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January 23, 2019, 08:04:22 AM

You keep ignoring one crucial thing. How does trying to get rid of slavery in shithole countries benefit us?

In broad terms, everyone in the world benefits when living conditions are raised for the world's poorest.

Henry Ford had the right idea:

Quote
In January 1914, Henry Ford started paying his auto workers a remarkable $5 a day. Doubling the average wage helped ensure a stable workforce and likely boosted sales since the workers could now afford to buy the cars they were making. It laid the foundation for an economy driven by consumer demand.
 https://www.npr.org/2014/01/27/267145552/the-middle-class-took-off-100-years-ago-thanks-to-henry-ford

If you are poor, when you are given money you will immediately spend it.  That is consumer demand.  Giving money to the very poorest, increases consumer demand which feeds the economy as a whole.  If we enable the poorest 50% of the world to buy basic necessities of life, you would see the biggest bull market the world has ever seen.  Lifting the living standards of the very poorest, even slightly, makes us all richer. 
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January 23, 2019, 08:07:03 AM

Name me one example in which you will see strictly better results by complaining than by thinking up different potential solutions. You can't. Because complaining is a destructive force with a net effect that is either zero or negative.

What you call "complaining" I call advocacy.  And advocacy works.  We wouldn't have the UK modern slavery laws without advocacy.  

Making it illegal for Western companies to profit from slavery is highly effective, because the directors go directly to jail.  And guess what, company directors sit up in their chairs and pay attention when you say "if you don't do X, you will go to jail".   Then the directors tell their C-suite, "don't fuck up on X, or I will fire you without hesitation".  Those are real results, in real time.  

That is one you will see strictly better results by "complaining" rather than blaming the victim.  

Because what you are doing is blaming the slave for being a slave.  And that achieves nothing.  People like you avoid having to take responsibility for anything by always blaming the victim.  "If he wasn't such a dissident, he wouldn't have gone to Chinese prison camp".  

If the only advocacy you are doing is typing on a bitcoin speculation thread, then its probably about as an inefficient of an advocacy campaign as you could possible choose to do with your time. Thats why it comes across (and seems more likely to be) much more of depression-like complaining, pontificating and lamenting.

We can't have too much compassion and empathy for others in this world. But why seek it out here of all places? Doesn't make much sense, does it?

That's is why I met your "Advocacy" with a call out for self accountability. Let's cut through the noise and BS. If you really want to make a difference, get out of here and go make one!

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January 23, 2019, 08:07:39 AM

You keep ignoring one crucial thing. How does trying to get rid of slavery in shithole countries benefit us?

In broad terms, everyone in the world benefits when living conditions are raised for the world's poorest.

Henry Ford had the right idea:

Quote
In January 1914, Henry Ford started paying his auto workers a remarkable $5 a day. Doubling the average wage helped ensure a stable workforce and likely boosted sales since the workers could now afford to buy the cars they were making. It laid the foundation for an economy driven by consumer demand.
 https://www.npr.org/2014/01/27/267145552/the-middle-class-took-off-100-years-ago-thanks-to-henry-ford

If you are poor, when you are given money you will immediately spend it.  That is consumer demand.  Giving money to the very poorest, increases consumer demand which feeds the economy as a whole.  If we enable the poorest 50% of the world to buy basic necessities of life, you would see the biggest bull market the world has ever seen.  Lifting the living standards of the very poorest, even slightly, makes us all richer. 
Quantify it in numbers and actions. What's your plan? What will it cost? What will the tangible benefits to us, not them, be?
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January 23, 2019, 08:08:13 AM
Merited by kurious (1)

Yet you try to use those to disprove a completely different claim that you have made up (and constantly keep changing with new examples). All while trying to portray me as some kind of inhumane devil.

The point I am making, which you seem to be incapable of understanding, is that it is often outside of the power of the victim to change their circumstances.  Because they are a fucking slave.  

And there are relatively easy ways for us as Westerners to improve their situation.  But the ethos I see constantly repeated on this board (Ibian being a classic example) is that we shouldn't try, even if it is in our own interest to do so.  And I find that disgusting.  
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