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Question: Closing BTC Price June 17:
$0 - 4 (3%)
<$6,500 - 7 (5.3%)
$6,500-$6,750 - 1 (0.8%)
$6,751-$7,000 - 2 (1.5%)
$7,001-$7,250 - 3 (2.3%)
$7,251-$7,500 - 6 (4.5%)
$7,501-$7,750 - 4 (3%)
$7,751-$8,000 - 12 (9.1%)
$8,001-$8,250 - 13 (9.8%)
$8,251-$8,500 - 7 (5.3%)
$8,501-$8,750 - 6 (4.5%)
$8,751-$9,000 - 11 (8.3%)
$9,001,$9,250 - 13 (9.8%)
$9,251-$9,500 - 17 (12.9%)
>$9,500 - 17 (12.9%)
$20,000 - 9 (6.8%)
Total Voters: 132

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 21229039 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (66 posts by 16 users deleted.)
realr0ach
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January 12, 2019, 11:42:31 AM

[...]Lightning Network is an exact replica of the current banking system [...]

You have to upgrade your thinking.... Roll Eyes

You people are clueless if you think all Lightning nodes that route transactions won't be run and controlled by the banking entitites that already exist.  They can simply make it that way with the stroke of a pen.  Banks are not traditionally in the semiconductor business, so that has slowed their ascent of taking control of bitcoin mining, but Lightning doesn't require mining.  It's the playground of their already existing business model, to just insert themselves in as middlemen by regulation with the following result:

Banks collect infinite interest by taking a cut of every transaction with no skin in the game and own the planet.
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1560953920
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micgoossens
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January 12, 2019, 11:43:26 AM

[...]Lightning Network is an exact replica of the current banking system [...]

You have to upgrade your thinking.... Roll Eyes

No room for upgrade

As not in NAZIthinking
As not in valueble asset thinking
As not in woman thinking
As not in *can’t disturb the WO* thinking
As not in many things

He’s fully upgraded for TROLLING

Only it seems he’s not willing to TROLL in the place special created for him Roll Eyes

What are we gonna do Grin
VB1001
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January 12, 2019, 11:45:34 AM

Shorts and Longs graphics.



https://en.tradingview.com/symbols/BTCUSDSHORTS/



https://en.tradingview.com/symbols/BTCUSDLONGS/

Cassius
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January 12, 2019, 11:48:35 AM

^^ Not bullish. Ready for a long squeeze.
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January 12, 2019, 11:53:35 AM

Of course lightning is a far weaker system than Bitcoin offering far less security and censorship resistance. It's designed that way swapping security and censorship resistance for scalability. If you need Bitcoin level security and censorship resistance pay for an on-chain Bitcoin transaction.

Additionally, if lightning ever proofs to not work good enough it can be disregarded altogether. Finally several lightning-like protocols can theoretically exist at the same time (although winner takes all seems way more likely, but perhaps there exists some niche with different requirements).
bitcoincidence
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January 12, 2019, 11:53:57 AM
Merited by vapourminer (1), JayJuanGee (1)


How do you secure your security seed? Honest question

Writing/engraving it down in multiple places of trust. No photos are allowed.
Also switching around a couple of words, would "secure" the seed in the event of an intruder finding it.
Need to remember which words of course.
You can bring some extra security in the steelplate (paperwallet) solution by dividing the phrase in three parts where you need at least two for the complete phrase. You can store them at three different locations.




Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/83ecqy/how_you_can_store_your_recovery_words_very_safely/
Quote
Here are the steps required:

So what you need first is an engraving pen that can engrave steel. Those cost less than 20 dollar and can be used to engrave anything, so may come in handy later for a gift or whatever. Those can be bought cheap on amazon for example.

Next thing you need is something to engrave to. I used cheap dog tags, a pack of 25 for ~5$ from China (banggood IIRC). But you can use whatever you want, 3 simple plates of old scrap metal work too.

Then you split the metal up in 3 groups.

Last step: You engrave your recovery words on them. If you use tags, you need 8 per group, because you can engrave front and back. So the first group gets words 1+2, 4+5...; The second group gets 2+3, 5+6...; and the third group gets 1+3, 4+6...; This only takes a few minutes, maybe half an hour if you're not used to a tool like the engraving pen.

It's done. You can now deposit each group of words in 3 different locations. You need 2 groups to recover your seed, so a thief can't do anything with it, while you still can restore the phrase easily. And your seed even is immune to water damage or whatever. Hope this helps!
Globb0
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Per securitatem consilio


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January 12, 2019, 11:55:53 AM

Bart followed by inverse Bart?



realr0ach
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January 12, 2019, 11:57:53 AM

Of course lightning is a far weaker system than Bitcoin offering far less security and censorship resistance.

You miss the point it does nothing to fix the current monetary system.  The fact bitcoin is designed around having built-in, rent seeking middlemen who you need to ask permission from to move the coins you supposedly own, and then need to pay a ransom extortion fee to, should be a red flag to any non-idiot that bitcoin at it's core does really nothing to alter the evil banking system that currently exists.  The variable of fixed money supply in bitcoin vs infinite fiat supply is pretty much a giant red herring to distract people in this regard.

The real issue at hand isn't the variable of supply, but the ability of people to insert themselves into the middleman position and siphon off wealth while doing virtually nothing, collecting infinite interest, and ownining the entire planet in the process.  The banks do this in their current business model, and both bitcoin and the lightning network are designed the same way.  So nothing really changes in the end.

Physical metals, on the other hand, DO NOT have built-in middlemen like bitcoin and the current banking system do.  If I attempt to spend a bitcoin, I am involuntarily making someone else rich in the process - the designed to centralize, built-in middlemen mining monopoly or lightning node monopoly.  If I attempt to spend a gold, silver, or copper coin, NOBODY else is profiting off my transaction and sucking up all wealth in the universe in the process.
micgoossens
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January 12, 2019, 11:59:02 AM

Bart followed by inverse Bart?





Go and defend your WIN
Based on that
Grin
Globb0
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Per securitatem consilio


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January 12, 2019, 11:59:24 AM

Where you can freely take your silver and gold bars through any airport
rebal15
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January 12, 2019, 12:01:27 PM

[...]Lightning Network is an exact replica of the current banking system [...]

You have to upgrade your thinking.... Roll Eyes

You people are clueless if you think all Lightning nodes that route transactions won't be run and controlled by the banking entitites that already exist.  They can simply make it that way with the stroke of a pen.  Banks are not traditionally in the semiconductor business, so that has slowed their ascent of taking control of bitcoin mining, but Lightning doesn't require mining.  It's the playground of their already existing business model, to just insert themselves in as middlemen by regulation with the following result:

Banks collect infinite interest by taking a cut of every transaction with no skin in the game and own the planet.

So there is no way to escape from banks.
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January 12, 2019, 12:01:32 PM

Where you can freely take your silver and gold bars through any airport

Stupid example.  It's like claiming since you can't freely move your house at the speed of light to Mars, a house has no value.  Humans, and everything of value that exists in the real world, are governed by the laws of physics. Imaginary things of no value aka digital timestamps, are not.  Doing anything in the real world requires both time and energy.  

Even bitcoin itself utilizes both time and energy, but it's to create an end product that's completely imaginary in nature.  You're expending much of the same resources of transferring gold, but accomplishing no real world result - entirely sunk cost fallacy.
VB1001
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January 12, 2019, 12:07:12 PM

MACD is hooked, or goes up or down, is weekend, more complicated, but there may be a squeeze, many hours on the side. Cool


Wekkel
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yes


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January 12, 2019, 12:07:17 PM
Last edit: January 12, 2019, 12:20:17 PM by Wekkel

Of course lightning is a far weaker system than Bitcoin offering far less security and censorship resistance.

You miss the point it does nothing to fix the current monetary system.  

Can only banks start a Lightning Network Node?
Can only banks validate LN transactions?
Can banks create Bitcoin out of thin air?

Your reasoning does not hold up under scrutiny.

Something else:


bitcoin nodes

I wonder how that relates to the spread of wealth in Europe  Roll Eyes
fluidjax
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January 12, 2019, 12:16:09 PM

How do you secure your security seed? Honest question

Cryptosteel or similar, stored in a safe
https://cryptosteel.com/

and/or

Shamirs Secret Splitting
https://iancoleman.io/shamir/

realr0ach
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January 12, 2019, 12:21:14 PM

Can only banks start a Lightning Network Node?
Can only banks validate LN transactions?

Can YOU create a fucking branch bank right now?  NO.  You need massive capital, lawyers, govt connections, and everything else.  All of the same rules will apply to Lightning nodes, just NOT DAY ONE.  Stop playing dumb.  Those regulations and red tape (AML/KYC) will lock out any wildcat nodes and the only ones will be run by people like Bank of America and Goldman Sachs.  

Anything that has an easily identifiable physical or digital surface attack vector will be enveloped by the current system.  Claiming you're going to run a wildcat Lightning node is like claiming you're going to be some type freelance illegal porn distributor and the FBI is not going to kick in your door.  If you're capable of putting 1+1 together, shilling for Lightning is like shilling directly for Goldman Sachs.
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January 12, 2019, 12:24:33 PM

Roach isnt wrong regarding LN and centralisation.

If LN gets adoption it seems very likely that mega hubs will be created to route majority of LN txes.

The reason is quite simple:

The normal user would rather open 1 channel with a mega hub (which has channels open with millions of other users) instead of directly opening millions of channels with each user (ease of use and economic viability).

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January 12, 2019, 12:24:38 PM


Shamirs Secret Splitting
https://iancoleman.io/shamir/

I would't enter my passphrase in any online form or on any computer that had internet access.
realr0ach
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January 12, 2019, 12:26:31 PM

Roach isnt wrong regarding LN and centralisation.

If LN gets adoption it seems very likely that mega hubs will be created to route majority of LN txes.

The reason is quite simple:

The normal user would rather open 1 channel with a mega hub (which has channels open with millions of other users) instead of directly opening millions of channels with each user (ease of use and economic viability).

Of course, I already said long ago this is the only real possible endgame outcome of Lightning network.  You cannot trust ANYONE shilling for Lightning network and should treat them as the enemy.  Bitcoin centralization is  bad enough, but Lightning is a blueprint of everything the bankers would love to happen.  I did not make the decision lightly that all digital currencies are garbage and we should be using only physical metals as money instead.

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January 12, 2019, 12:27:08 PM


Shamirs Secret Splitting
https://iancoleman.io/shamir/

I would't enter my passphrase in any online form or on any computer that had internet access.


You can use it offline.
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