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Question: Highest price we'll see in 2022:
50,000 - 0 (0%)
60,000 - 0 (0%)
70,000 - 0 (0%)
80,000 - 0 (0%)
90,000 - 0 (0%)
100,000 - 0 (0%)
125,000 - 0 (0%)
150,000 - 0 (0%)
175,000 - 0 (0%)
200,000 - 0 (0%)
225,000 - 0 (0%)
250,000 - 0 (0%)
275,000 - 0 (0%)
300,000 - 0 (0%)
>300,000 - 0 (0%)
Total Voters: 0

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 25527794 times)
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realr0ach
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January 23, 2019, 05:41:06 AM

Anyone saying that success is linked to hardwork deserves to be let alone in any third world country to see how their hardwork will be rewarded. Or in any poor family in any Western country.

Absolute twaddle.

The circumstances of one's birth are relevant, indeed. However, anyone who works hard will experience more success than one who does not. Period.

You're using something like the chess elo analogy.  Claiming that if you play enough games, luck will be canceled out and your true skill will average out to wherever it should be.  It's not a valid analogy with real life because humans practice specialization of labor and everyone isn't competing on the same metric.  It's easily possible to choose a bad, overpopulated, or dying career field for instance, be the hardest worker and best at it in the world, and be totally useless, accomplish nothing, and die in poverty.

That's the nature of capitalism - non-state run enterprise.  It's easy to divert resources into an activity where there's nobody guaranteed to be on the other side of the trade in the order book.  Nobody knows everything and you're required to step into the unknown in capitalism.  You can do the best due diligence on the planet and still come up with a flop.  Pretending all hard working people succeed is just naive.  Capitalism is designed to create lots of hard working losers.
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January 23, 2019, 05:55:46 AM

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You, sir, have some serious cojones. Prepare for an endless flood of words.


Bitcoin does not have a 'hub and spoke' structure. Maybe Lightning, but too early to tell.
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January 23, 2019, 05:59:38 AM

Anyone saying that success is linked to hardwork deserves to be let alone in any third world country to see how their hardwork will be rewarded. Or in any poor family in any Western country.

Absolute twaddle.

The circumstances of one's birth are relevant, indeed. However, anyone who works hard will experience more success than one who does not. Period.

You're using something like the chess elo analogy.  Claiming that if you play enough games, luck will be canceled out and your true skill will average out to wherever it should be.  It's not a valid analogy with real life because humans practice specialization of labor and everyone isn't competing on the same metric.  It's easily possible to choose a bad, overpopulated, or dying career field for instance, be the hardest worker and best at it in the world, and be totally useless, accomplish nothing, and die in poverty.

That's the nature of capitalism - non-state run enterprise.  It's easy to divert resources into an activity where there's nobody guaranteed to be on the other side of the trade in the order book.  Nobody knows everything and you're required to step into the unknown in capitalism.  You can do the best due diligence on the planet and still come up with a flop.  Pretending all hard working people succeed is just naive.  Capitalism is designed to create lots of hard working losers.


Anyone in the first world who got a STEM degree in the last 100 years, and is otherwise employable, has had no problem finding a high paying job. I'd wager the same will be true for the next 50 years, anyway.

If you didn't go to college, or received a bachelor's degree in something useless, like psychology or art history, then you're obviously in for a rougher ride. And that's all on you.
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January 23, 2019, 06:07:24 AM

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

As a person who had his first full time job being slightly less than 17 (took a year after the high school before enrolling in uni as I wanted to make sure that I was truly interested in this field), I say that both of you (jbreher and BTCMILLIONAIRE) are on the wrong side on this subject. Many times it is just random events, and not the effort. I had a few situations where a very sustained and qualified effort was there, but results were lacking and, in the opposite, when I almost did not try, yet the rewards were magnificent (as far as getting what i wanted accomplished fast). The connection between the effort and the results is tenuous at best.

Many of us have heard the expression that luck happens where preparation meets opportunity, and of course, I agree with you that there are a variety of variables in between, but sometimes individuals will not be ready or able to take advantage of various opportunities when they are not adequately prepared, and sometimes opportunities will not come in the same time line or based on the same amount of preparation.  In other words, everybody is correct, here, and everyone wins for providing the correct set of answers.

 

hahahahaha  Cheesy Cheesy
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January 23, 2019, 06:13:13 AM

Allow me to pull it from the quote above:

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

You're welcome.

If you truly believe that is globally true then you are either blind or a fool. first world views for first world problems.
You cannot think beyond Nintendo fat slobs that leach off society.
The world goes beyond your front yard.

What opportunities can these kids take advantage of?

https://www.child-soldiers.org/where-are-there-child-soldiers

I have no idea. I'm not on the ground where '56 non-state organizations' in '14 warring countries' are employing kids in this manner. All opportunity is specific to the individual. You're going to need to be more precise in your inquiry.

But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

And I will refer you back to my original reply to your snip of his post for your full circle.



Update:

There is an official response from Binance CEO



He's correct the level of journalism in this space is on par with straight bloggers.
There are no fact checkers left and there is no accounting.
The revenue stream has changed from people buying news to people being tricked by click bait sites.
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January 23, 2019, 06:27:43 AM

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

As a person who had his first full time job being slightly less than 17 (took a year after the high school before enrolling in uni as I wanted to make sure that I was truly interested in this field), I say that both of you (jbreher and BTCMILLIONAIRE) are on the wrong side on this subject. Many times it is just random events, and not the effort. I had a few situations where a very sustained and qualified effort was there, but results were lacking and, in the opposite, when I almost did not try, yet the rewards were magnificent (as far as getting what i wanted accomplished fast). The connection between the effort and the results is tenuous at best.

On a side note:
Yeah, I get the tough love, but let see how you will react when your job is taken away by a super-smart AI in the near future.
There is a reason why all chess championships are not commercially viable anymore (ask Gary Kasparov) since nobody cares about how earthlings play when AlphaZero shows a true genius in the game and plays at the level humans can barely comprehend. Almost all of us might end up in a human "zoo" even sooner than I expect. Hopefully, bitcoin will make our days there more pleasant, but there cannot be any guarantees.
You're making false correlations. Just because it's possible to sometimes see greater results with less effort doesn't mean that it's generally desirable to put in no effort (or waste whatever effort you can bring up on whining). In any realistic scenario any individual that tries will perform better than the very same individual in the very same situation would without trying. There's just no sensible argument about this as far as I can see, although I'd be eager to hear one.

Implying that your efforts don't necessarily mean anything just because other people got more "money" or whatever without trying just doesn't make sense. Obviously some efforts will go to waste. But fact is, if you look at one individual person at any point in time that same person will be better off if they invest their time productively as opposed to wasting it on whining or doing nothing at all.




Also, the day an AI takes away humans jobs should be a global holiday. Personally, I can't fucking wait. As far as human zoo goes, I'm hard pressed to imagine a future in which we don't increase our own capabilities by making transfer of information from and to our computers more efficient.
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January 23, 2019, 06:29:03 AM

Jack's coming around it look's like...interesting.



https://twitter.com/jack/status/1087914900628766720

Here is the interview with Taleb and Naval in case you missed it. He is a much better writer than speaker imo, but it's still pretty good and worth checking out. It is somewhat hard to follow so bring a open mind and some patience. ymmv

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=5&v=Da0aXfshlxM
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January 23, 2019, 06:31:37 AM

Allow me to pull it from the quote above:

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

You're welcome.

If you truly believe that is globally true then you are either blind or a fool. first world views for first world problems.
You cannot think beyond Nintendo fat slobs that leach off society.
The world goes beyond your front yard.

What opportunities can these kids take advantage of?

https://www.child-soldiers.org/where-are-there-child-soldiers

I have no idea. I'm not on the ground where '56 non-state organizations' in '14 warring countries' are employing kids in this manner. All opportunity is specific to the individual. You're going to need to be more precise in your inquiry.

But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

And I will refer you back to my original reply to your snip of his post for your full circle.

So you are stating that the child soldier in your example would be better off complaining than trying to figure out how to stay alive or find a way out of his current life?
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January 23, 2019, 06:32:03 AM

He's correct the level of journalism in this space is on par with straight bloggers.

It only appears that way because this happens to be a niche that you are particularly educated on. It's the same for every other subject too. Remember this when you are listening to "journalism" on some subject you aren't that knowledgeable on. If you were more knowledgeable on that subject it would sound just as bad as it does for the thing you are knowledgeable on.
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January 23, 2019, 06:51:55 AM

So you are stating that the child soldier in your example would be better off complaining than trying to figure out how to stay alive or find a way out of his current life?

I have been speaking in generalities but yes if that was his only outlet other than getting killed. I refer now you back to my original post, this is why speaking in absolutes is always wrong.
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January 23, 2019, 06:53:39 AM

He's correct the level of journalism in this space is on par with straight bloggers.

It only appears that way because this happens to be a niche that you are particularly educated on. It's the same for every other subject too. Remember this when you are listening to "journalism" on some subject you aren't that knowledgeable on. If you were more knowledgeable on that subject it would sound just as bad as it does for the thing you are knowledgeable on.

I hear ya, and I blame it on the money trail to the click baiters.
Nite all.
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January 23, 2019, 06:58:22 AM


But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

Ok lets consider slavery.  Yes there are slaves right now.  To wit:

Quote
Modern slavery is defined as slavery, servitude, forced or compulsory labour and human trafficking1. The 2016 Global Slavery Index estimates that 45.8m people in 167 countries are living in modern
slavery today2. The majority are victims of exploitation in private sector activities, such as manufacturing, construction and agriculture. Forced labour and slavery is big business — the International Labour
Organisation estimates that illicit profits from these crimes amount to US$150b per year. Businesses are facing increasing pressure to tackle the crisis of modern slavery head-on as awareness grows and
consumers demand more responsibility from their preferred brands. Modern slavery also represents a significant reputational risk to businesses as non-governmental organisations and the media ‘name
and shame’ companies who violate human rights.   [...]  In 2016, there were an estimated 11,700 victims of slavery in Britain alone
 Source:  https://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015/$FILE/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015.pdf



Can we safely assume that Jbear and BTCMillionaire think that any of the current 45 million slaves in the world that has time to complain about about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them

Is this how you guys think?
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January 23, 2019, 06:59:52 AM

So you are stating that the child soldier in your example would be better off complaining than trying to figure out how to stay alive or find a way out of his current life?

I have been speaking in generalities but yes if that was his only outlet other than getting killed. I refer now you back to my original post, this is why speaking in absolutes is always wrong.
So you'd rather have people complain and die than having them trying to figure out steps to improve their life in whatever ways accessible to them. How is that supposed to ever accomplish anything?
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January 23, 2019, 07:05:27 AM


But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

Ok let's take slavery.  Yes there are slaves right now.  To wit:

Quote
Modern slavery is defined as slavery, servitude, forced or compulsory labour and human trafficking1. The 2016 Global Slavery Index estimates that 45.8m people in 167 countries are living in modern
slavery today2. The majority are victims of exploitation in private sector activities, such as manufacturing, construction and agriculture. Forced labour and slavery is big business — the International Labour
Organisation estimates that illicit profits from these crimes amount to US$150b per year. Businesses are facing increasing pressure to tackle the crisis of modern slavery head-on as awareness grows and
consumers demand more responsibility from their preferred brands. Modern slavery also represents a significant reputational risk to businesses as non-governmental organisations and the media ‘name
and shame’ companies who violate human rights.
 Source:  https://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015/$FILE/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015.pdf  



Can we safely assume that Jbear and BTCMillionaire think that any of the current 45 million slaves in the world that has time to complain about about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.
If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.
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January 23, 2019, 07:07:49 AM

He's correct the level of journalism in this space is on par with straight bloggers.

It only appears that way because this happens to be a niche that you are particularly educated on. It's the same for every other subject too. Remember this when you are listening to "journalism" on some subject you aren't that knowledgeable on. If you were more knowledgeable on that subject it would sound just as bad as it does for the thing you are knowledgeable on.

Right, right...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gell-Mann_amnesia_effect
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January 23, 2019, 07:09:27 AM

On an unrelated side note. It's quite interesting how the subsets of shared opinion holders on this thread seem to go through all possible permutations.
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January 23, 2019, 07:09:35 AM
Merited by 600watt (1)

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them? 
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January 23, 2019, 07:10:56 AM
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So you are stating that the child soldier in your example would be better off complaining than trying to figure out how to stay alive or find a way out of his current life?

I have been speaking in generalities but yes if that was his only outlet other than getting killed. I refer now you back to my original post, this is why speaking in absolutes is always wrong.
Absolutely. Always.
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January 23, 2019, 07:12:40 AM


But to come full circle, what does that have to do with BITMILLIONAIRE's original statement? I shall repeat it once again, should you have already forgotten.

Anyone who has time to complain about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them.

Ok lets consider slavery.  Yes there are slaves right now.  To wit:

Quote
Modern slavery is defined as slavery, servitude, forced or compulsory labour and human trafficking1. The 2016 Global Slavery Index estimates that 45.8m people in 167 countries are living in modern
slavery today2. The majority are victims of exploitation in private sector activities, such as manufacturing, construction and agriculture. Forced labour and slavery is big business — the International Labour
Organisation estimates that illicit profits from these crimes amount to US$150b per year. Businesses are facing increasing pressure to tackle the crisis of modern slavery head-on as awareness grows and
consumers demand more responsibility from their preferred brands. Modern slavery also represents a significant reputational risk to businesses as non-governmental organisations and the media ‘name
and shame’ companies who violate human rights.   [...]  In 2016, there were an estimated 11,700 victims of slavery in Britain alone
 Source:  https://www.ey.com/Publication/vwLUAssets/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015/$FILE/ey-the-uk-modern-slavery-act-2015.pdf



Can we safely assume that Jbear and BTCMillionaire think that any of the current 45 million slaves in the world that has time to complain about about wealth inequality doesn't really deserve moving upwards in the food chain, as they could've invested the same time on figuring out sensible goals for their life as well as some steps towards them

Is this how you guys think?
General reminder to everyone that slavery has been abolished in our part of the world for hundreds of years.
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January 23, 2019, 07:14:49 AM

If said slave chooses to spend time that he could've used e.g. on devising an escape plan on complaining.

That's a joke right?  

We are talking about young girls who are chained to beds to work as prostitutes.  We are talking about kids on fishing trawlers in the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  We are talking about people who have been in North Korean concentration camps for two generations, whose entire family will be executed if they escape.  

Your opinion is they should not complain about their circumstances, and we as wealthy Westerners should not try to help them? 
We should not try to help them. We should keep them out of our country. We have enough problems to deal with. Some of them arguably more severe than theirs.
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