Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[hmmmstrange]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

You mean August 2012 right, August 2013 would be very stupid.

[JorgeStolfi]

edit: they were definitely solvent w/projected $925,000 in trading fees & $200,000 in net income from 4/2013 to 3/2014

One must subtract the client accounts, a 400,000,000 dollar liability by prevailing rumors.

[Peter R]

It was not sizable enough to warrant a flight to Japan. However, it is sizable enough to ruin my weekend.

Glad to hear it isn't too bad % wise.  I had a few GoxBTC too

[macsga]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

It's called the "Stockholm syndrome" I guess. A known "malleability"  

[F-bernanke]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

There was still great liquidity for whales. However we now discover it was all BTC IOU's that were traded...

[hmmmstrange]

http://two-bit-idiot.tumblr.com/post/77988833128/the-final-goxing

Mt. Gox has allegedly never conducted a single audit of its customer deposits, and it is believed that Karpeles may have been the only one within the company to have knowledge of how to actually tap the exchange’s cold storage. It remains unclear exactly how this type of storage leak could have happened over a multi-year period without any knowledge on the part of the executives at Mt. Gox.

[CoinDox]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

I hear you, oddly enough, after waiting 2 months for my CAD withdrawl, I moved back into BTC and got out in late September of last year.

I think though why it is a big deal again is because it is just such an astounding foible that it is hard to wrap ones mind around it. Also, depending on how things play out, this gives good insight into how one of the first exchanges functioned behind the scenes.

[kkaspar]

Why are mtgox developments still this big subject here? I thought we were just going to let mtgox die already and recover without it.

I also see that some people have trouble burying their head in sand. It's weird, because usually everyone are doing it so well.
I think that someone should post a detailed guide how to do it, so we could all just deny that mtgox ever existed and continue to chant choo choo without interruptions.

I'm not saying we need to pretend like gox doesn't exist, but rather we need to acknowledge that we've moved on from gox. When I saw the price make a strong rebound from 400 during the gox crash and start recovering on its own, I was incredibly bullish. I thought "here we are, the worst has happened, and the whales are still buying. this the bottom, even with all the bad news about gox priced in and with gox completely gone. now we can move on into a new era of recovery and a new rally. bitstamp is now leading, using entirely strength from bitstamp". The price was doing perfectly fine on it's own. A slow, steady, and strong recovery would have been perfect. We don't need to add accessories like "gox might recover" and pump the price to ridiculous levels right away. All this does is add more drama and uncertaintly, and now the neverending story continues. It is a de-evolution. Now I am back in the same situation I was in for the previous 4 weeks when I was bearish instead of bullish.

In all seriousness, the situation with gox is far from over. Questions like "why did mtgox shut it's door?" and "what will happen with their customers funds?" are still unanswered. And these are the important questions. Gox just stopping trading and taking down their website meant very little. People weren't patient enough to wait for clarity about this entire situation and jumped the gun here, so in my view this rise is fragile at best. True recovery will only come if the entire bitcoin market system integrity is no longer under threat.
If it will be concluded as a fact, that mtgox customers lost their money, then there will be a shitstorm that BTC has never seen before.
To me, it's rather amusing how people try to downplay the entire situation.

[fluidjax]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

Because someone had to have their funds on Gox, otherwise the truth would have been known earlier.

[JCviggen]

"what will happen with their customers funds?"

That's the big one isn't it? By all accounts what Mt.Gox is holding in cash and coins is not equal to zero. No doubt even as they were shutting down some people had money transfers en route.

[exponential]

http://two-bit-idiot.tumblr.com/post/77988833128/the-final-goxing

Mt. Gox has allegedly never conducted a single audit of its customer deposits, and it is believed that Karpeles may have been the only one within the company to have knowledge of how to actually tap the exchange’s cold storage. It remains unclear exactly how this type of storage leak could have happened over a multi-year period without any knowledge on the part of the executives at Mt. Gox.

wow

[jl2012]

I don't understand why ANY of you here would still have funds on mtgox. Mtgox has had blatant liquidity and management problems and been the running joke of this community for almost an entire  YEAR. I removed my funds in AUGUST. We had passed mtgox off as no longer relevant and a facade months and months ago and now suddenly it's a big deal again?

Because someone had to have their funds on Gox, otherwise the truth would have been known earlier.

You are just begging the question....

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[billyjoeallen]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/209535200/Business-Plan-MtGox-2014-2017

$2 million in profit in the current fiscal year? And all the hassle, risk and aggravation? Remind me never to go into the Bitcoin business.

That document is evidence of attempted fraud. Their profit was much higher than 2 million but Mark lost much much more. The majority of new capital was to cover for Karpeles' blunders.  Mark is not just out of business now. He's going to jail.

[Peter R]

If it will be concluded as a fact, that mtgox customers lost their money, then there will be a shitstorm that BTC has never seen before.
To me, it's rather amusing how people try to downplay the entire situation.

There will be a shitstorm indeed.  However, if investors who thought they held 750,000 BTC* in aggregate realize they now hold 0, this revealed scarcity may blow the price in the upwards direction as easily as negative sentiment may push the price down.  


*Assuming this is true, of course.

[JCviggen]

Bitcoinbuilder is tanking at the latest "revelations" 0.05 now.

[CoinDox]

Why are mtgox developments still this big subject here? I thought we were just going to let mtgox die already and recover without it.

I also see that some people have trouble burying their head in sand. It's weird, because usually everyone are doing it so well.
I think that someone should post a detailed guide how to do it, so we could all just deny that mtgox ever existed and continue to chant choo choo without interruptions.

I'm not saying we need to pretend like gox doesn't exist, but rather we need to acknowledge that we've moved on from gox. When I saw the price make a strong rebound from 400 during the gox crash and start recovering on its own, I was incredibly bullish. I thought "here we are, the worst has happened, and the whales are still buying. this the bottom, even with all the bad news about gox priced in and with gox completely gone. now we can move on into a new era of recovery and a new rally. bitstamp is now leading, using entirely strength from bitstamp". The price was doing perfectly fine on it's own. A slow, steady, and strong recovery would have been perfect. We don't need to add accessories like "gox might recover" and pump the price to ridiculous levels right away. All this does is add more drama and uncertaintly, and now the neverending story continues. It is a de-evolution. Now I am back in the same situation I was in for the previous 4 weeks when I was bearish instead of bullish.

In all seriousness, the situation with gox is far from over. Questions like "why did mtgox shut it's door?" and "what will happen with their customers funds?" are still unanswered. And these are the important questions. Gox just stopping trading and taking down their website meant very little. People weren't patient enough to wait for clarity about this entire situation and jumped the gun here, so in my view this rise is fragile at best. True recovery will only come if the entire bitcoin market system integrity is no longer under threat.
If it will be concluded as a fact, that mtgox customers lost their money, then there will be a shitstorm that BTC has never seen before.
To me, it's rather amusing how people try to downplay the entire situation.

+100

[fonzie]

Just a quick reminder for what´s about to come in the media in the next days.

Bitcoin is a trademark held by MtGox!

If MtGox get´s broke - Bitcoin get´s
If MtGox did get hacked - Bitcoin did
......

[MickeyT2008]

Surely if we take the story at face value about the theft of the coins then it becomes fraud the moment the loss of the coins is discovered if trading is allowed to continue.  That would mean from that this point in time that people were knowingly being allowed to buy coins that don't exist.  This of course would raise the question of whether trading stopped on discovery of this or later on.  Up until that point it would be incompetence, if trading continues once it's realised that there's no coins then doesn't it become a crime?

[CoinDox]

Just a quick reminder for what´s about to come in the media in the next days.

Bitcoin is a trademark held by MtGox!

If MtGox get´s broke - Bitcoin get´s
If MtGox did get hacked - Bitcoin did
......

What?