Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[HarmonLi]

https://blockchain.info/charts/bitcoin-days-destroyed

guess not.

that chart doesn't seem to be working since the 4th of august.



from another site:

I am expecting to see a large spike in BDD if support will be broken, price drops to the 420$ - 450$ next support level,
and large holders will send coins to exchanges to sell on the rather strong rebound that will follow. That should result in some weird volatility.

So we're now already talking about a big giant crash that'll send us back into the $400s? I'm tempted to see this as the sign to go all in Many people will call this capitulation, I guess...

[Moria843]

I don't believe in charts or past trends. I just have a "gut feel" that price will go up in long term. Holding until it goes below $400 or above $700. Will buy more below $400; sell some when above $700.

[mmitech]

Nothing to do with school, I am just surprised we are back here again.


ok ... so do you have a wife or children?  I usually do this with hand drawn pictures as the example but today I think fingers suit better...

So say you have a wife and children ? How valuable to you (and them) are their fingers?  to me they are WORTH nothing...  and the PRICE I give you for them
on the open market is $0

Lets switch this around- do your wife and childrens fingers have any VALUE to you? if so how much are they WORTH to you? and what PRICE will you pay to keep them all in one place with fingers attached to loved ones? more than my PRICE of $0? I bet and why is that? it is because they have more VALUE to you then they do to me, for me the PRICE  for your loved ones fingers is $0 for you I imagine and hope a very large figure lets say $100,000 or more


something something <snip>

look above, I did read to the end of that line and there you lost me.... a value of thing is not determined by my self only, it is determined by a whole community, if we think that the value (call it price if you want) of 1 Liter of milk is worth 1$ but then one farmer based on the miracle of grass and water going into the cow and turning out as milk (and shit and pee) think that that liter of milk is worth at least $1000, that farmer is going to have some bad time selling his shit. but if 20% of farmers think so then there is 20% of greedy motherfuckers, because 80% disagree.

we can go on and on trying to define this (I am wrong with the possibility of being right), but I personally am not buying that theory, wherever I go I pay €€ as a value of a thing. the value translate to that €€ and I didn't see yet in my life a community agrees on something having more value but lower price!!! in fact that just doesn't make any sense to me.


Edit: did read to the end and I just realized where your confusion is, you are defining the filthy capitalism.

  

[NotLambchop]

... Perhaps the best way to add clarity in ordinary language is with modifiers, as e.g. "exchange value", "relative value", "functional value", and "monetary value".

..."sentimental value."

This is a speculation forum, used by traders.  From a trader's perspective, Bitcoin's value approximates its exchange value/price.  No need for qualifiers because context.

[HarmonLi]

I don't believe in charts or past trends. I just have a "gut feel" that price will go up in long term. Holding until it goes below $400 or above $700. Will buy more below $400; sell some when above $700.

Are you not worried by the crash at all? I mean I'm quite impressed if you're not, but I think it's at least somewhat worrying in these difficult times, after all. No one knows which way it'll go eventually...

[inca]

I don't believe in charts or past trends. I just have a "gut feel" that price will go up in long term. Holding until it goes below $400 or above $700. Will buy more below $400; sell some when above $700.

Are you not worried by the crash at all? I mean I'm quite impressed if you're not, but I think it's at least somewhat worrying in these difficult times, after all. No one knows which way it'll go eventually...

What crash?

[kireinaha]

Even the most ardent long term investors are growing tired of the slow bleed down and want to drop this under performing investment. So that's what we're seeing now... it's not manipulation.

You can't blame them; asking people to hold a stake in relatively new technology that has been in a bear market for 9 months is a pretty tall order, and at this stage in the technology life cycle, is a pretty good indicator that interest has simply dried up and moved elsewhere. We all know the "honey badger" and all that, but continuing to hold in this kind of market is basically a leap of faith.

[Sandia]

Are you not worried by the crash at all? I mean I'm quite impressed if you're not, but I think it's at least somewhat worrying in these difficult times, after all. No one knows which way it'll go eventually...

What crash?

I think he is talking about the big 30-50% one day dives in November or December, or that 80% drop in March on Bitfinex.  I am sure he is not talking about the measly 2% drop yesterday.  No sane person would call 2% a crash...I hope.

[hmmkay]

Anyone noticed that the value of Bitcoin has risen quite a lot the last half year, regardless the price of bitcoin?

Whoa what do you mean by that? The price is the measure of how valuable a Bitcoin is, isn't it? I don't seem to be getting what you're trying to say here. Please enlighten us, man

The utility of bitcoin is the sum of the benefits derived from its applications by its users.

The value of bitcoin is the size of its transactional economy over a given period.

The price of bitcoin is wherever the market happens to clear.

Only in the case of perfectly rational actors under perfectly efficient condtions will these three coincide.

I don't agree, this is just delusional stuff you are talking, a value of a bitcoin is exactly what it can be exchanged for (in terms of goods and services) compared to what can a dollar (or gold, Euro, Yen...) be exchanged for.

Edit: with this logic: gold has no value and a visa card have more value than a Bitcoin.... see this is just horseshit.

Gold didn't have value until enough people started to 'like' it. Same holds true for bitcoin.

[JorgeStolfi]

"Price" = what one paid or must pay to acquire something.  An objective concept (everyone who knows how much was paid or is being charged for some item will agree about its price), but is typically different for each transaction, even for successive transactions with the same item.  "Market price" = price of the last transaction of the item in some open market, or largest bid or lowest ask in said market.

"Value" = how much one would pay to acquire that item, or charge to sell it.  A subjective concept (typically the same item will have different values for different people, even at the same time and place), may not be clearly known by the person himself, and may change quickly and radically as the person's mood, ideas, and circumstances change.

In a free and conscious commercial transaction, typically the item has higher value to the buyer than to the seller, and the price is some amount between the two values.

There's  an old quip, "an Economist knows the price of everything, but the value of nothing." 

[Moria843]

I don't believe in charts or past trends. I just have a "gut feel" that price will go up in long term. Holding until it goes below $400 or above $700. Will buy more below $400; sell some when above $700.

Are you not worried by the crash at all? I mean I'm quite impressed if you're not, but I think it's at least somewhat worrying in these difficult times, after all. No one knows which way it'll go eventually...

No I'm not worried. I've done with bitcoin mining and bitcoin investment purchases the same as I've done with stocks. That is to put yourself in the position that no matter what happens, you have something to be happy about. That equilibrium point is different for everyone. But even if it crashes I can be happy I didn't buy too much; if it does great I can be happy I bought enough. It's finding your equilibrium point for different investments. My bitcoin equilibrium point is between 100 to 200 BTC and I'm at 112 right now. Average cost per BTC so far about $375.

[adamstgBit]

"Price" = what one paid or must pay to acquire something.  An objective concept (everyone who knows how much was paid or is being charged for some item will agree about its price), but is typically different for each transaction, even for successive transactions with the same item.  "Market price" = price of the last transaction of the item in some open market, or largest bid or lowest ask in said market.

"Value" = how much one would pay to acquire that item, or charge to sell it.  A subjective concept (typically the same item will have different values for different people, even at the same time and place), may not be clearly known by the person himself, and may change quickly and radically as the person's mood, ideas, and circumstances change.

In a free and conscious commercial transaction, typically the item has higher value to the buyer than to the seller, and the price is some amount between the two values.

There's  an old quip, "an Economist knows the price of everything, but the value of nothing." 

 

bitcoins Price / Value has stabilized, but it stabilized at like 1 : 10

given all the things you can do with a bitcoin, bitcoin enables real business all over the world, its no joke,  it will have a significant impact in the coming years, it really should be priced in the 5-10K range

pretty sure the market will eventually catch up and price these precious bits closer to "value"   ...maybe go overvalued for a few weeks  

[hd060053]

weakest bid side on huobi ever... this doesn't look good. Only bitstamp is blocking the total capitulation now with 6k to 540.

[Schickeria]

I don't believe in charts or past trends. I just have a "gut feel" that price will go up in long term. Holding until it goes below $400 or above $700. Will buy more below $400; sell some when above $700.

Are you not worried by the crash at all? I mean I'm quite impressed if you're not, but I think it's at least somewhat worrying in these difficult times, after all. No one knows which way it'll go eventually...

Worrying about price dumps on high risk investments is like trying to learn to swim in sharks territory.

[Richy_T]

Sigmund Freud may have said it, but it was originally spoken by Mr. Carl Sagan.

Sigmund Freud
Born: May 6, 1856, Příbor, Czech Republic
Died: September 23, 1939, London, United Kingdom

Carl Sagan
Born: November 9, 1934, Brooklyn, NY
Died: December 20, 1996, Seattle, WA

So unlikely to be the case. Likely it's apocryphal but I always heard it attributed to Einstein.

[Bittings]

Sigmund Freud may have said it, but it was originally spoken by Mr. Carl Sagan.

Sigmund Freud
Born: May 6, 1856, Příbor, Czech Republic
Died: September 23, 1939, London, United Kingdom

Carl Sagan
Born: November 9, 1934, Brooklyn, NY
Died: December 20, 1996, Seattle, WA

So unlikely to be the case. Likely it's apocryphal but I always heard it attributed to Einstein.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[kireinaha]

Sigmund Freud may have said it, but it was originally spoken by Mr. Carl Sagan.

Sigmund Freud
Born: May 6, 1856, Příbor, Czech Republic
Died: September 23, 1939, London, United Kingdom

Carl Sagan
Born: November 9, 1934, Brooklyn, NY
Died: December 20, 1996, Seattle, WA

So unlikely to be the case. Likely it's apocryphal but I always heard it attributed to Einstein.

Yes, an earlier poster attributed it an Alcoholic Anonymous handbook from 1979, which may or may not have been penned by Carl Sagan

[Richy_T]

Sigmund Freud may have said it, but it was originally spoken by Mr. Carl Sagan.

Sigmund Freud
Born: May 6, 1856, Příbor, Czech Republic
Died: September 23, 1939, London, United Kingdom

Carl Sagan
Born: November 9, 1934, Brooklyn, NY
Died: December 20, 1996, Seattle, WA

So unlikely to be the case. Likely it's apocryphal but I always heard it attributed to Einstein.

Yes, an earlier poster attributed it an Alcoholic Anonymous handbook from 1979, which may or may not have been penned by Carl Sagan

I'm running a little behind...

[romneymoney]

Sigmund Freud may have said it, but it was originally spoken by Mr. Carl Sagan.

Sigmund Freud
Born: May 6, 1856, Příbor, Czech Republic
Died: September 23, 1939, London, United Kingdom

Carl Sagan
Born: November 9, 1934, Brooklyn, NY
Died: December 20, 1996, Seattle, WA

So unlikely to be the case. Likely it's apocryphal but I always heard it attributed to Einstein.

Yes, an earlier poster attributed it an Alcoholic Anonymous handbook from 1979, which may or may not have been penned by Carl Sagan

I'm pretty sure they said Narcotics Anonymous but not going back to confirm that