Liquid Synergy Designs Inc. -ASIC mining hardware

[je1p7u7]

I don't mean disrespect by this, but how do we know that we can truly trust Steamboat? I could be totally wrong and Steamboat may be totally trustworthy, but I can imagine that those sending lots of money via Bitcoin to him can have legitimate doubts and some fears at the back of their minds. To Steamboat, in light of this, would you be willing to give your identity and address information to the escrow JohnK? This is for peace of mind for the others here who may not know you so well and I don't mean any offence by this request.

No disrespect taken. I am glad you are taking the time to research who I am and who you are investing with. My identity has not been released due to delays in other portions of this project which will undoubtedly be discovered once the community begins it's background check. I am, and always have, planned on becoming publicly known. I do not have an issue with giving this information to John K. in the interim to ease your concerns.

Please note however, that this does in no way guarantee the safety of an investment.
 [...]

I agree with Steamboat that providing his identity to JohnK will not change much. I would guess that scammers have falsified identity documents anyway and furthermore law authorities would not understand the Bitcoin aspect (you paid with what? do you have a bank receipt or CC statement?) nor would it be easy to investigate this internationally.

I too had a lot of concerns about joining this (or any) group buy. I was amazed that so many people sent BTC, but I was the first person to ask if Steamboat could verify that he had really purchased the initial batch of chips (he was reselling half of it) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2055009#msg2055009

Steamboat has shown great organizational skills and a lot of interest in the Klondike project. I believe he will gain a lot more profit by delivering the advertised services/products than doing otherwise. He bought the first batch of chips before offering this group sell so the way I see it he is skillfully joining his private mining interests with additional business goals.

While everything seems legit I still always use the word "allegedly" when I talk about anything bitcoin. So I allegedly bought some ASIC chips that will allegedly be fabricated by Avalon allegedly a couple of weeks from now. The only thing that is real up to this point is that I gave someone $ to give me some data bits called BTC.

[je1p7u7]

Is there an option to buy a "Fully unassembled unit"? Something for the hardcore DIY-stencil-cutting-oven-reflow types that don't want to bother organizing PCB fabrication themselves.

[TomKeddie]

I too had a lot of concerns about joining this (or any) group buy. I was amazed that so many people sent BTC, but I was the first person to ask if Steamboat could verify that he had really purchased the initial batch of chips (he was reselling half of it) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2055009#msg2055009

I saw your verification and decided that was enough for me (you you could have been working together, I only bought 32 chips in batch 1, I can still feed my family if they go missing).

Since then I've been totally convinced steamboat is legit, I think he is thinking way too much about the tiny details to not go through with this.  I also agree that he has a lot more to gain by going through with this than scamming.

This is just the start, BFL seem to be releasing chips.  These Avalon chips are fairly primitive ASICs, there will be Avalon II perhaps in something 25nm, perhaps offering 200MH/s on a AA battery, who knows.  I think this is the start of an industry, these boards will be obsolete in a year but the experience and reputations gained producing them will be very valuable.

[bassclef]

Is there an option to buy a "Fully unassembled unit"? Something for the hardcore DIY-stencil-cutting-oven-reflow types that don't want to bother organizing PCB fabrication themselves.

This is what I'm interested in. Bkkcoins has already stated he would be selling DIY kits with all the parts/empty boards ready to go (minus chips of course). Heat sinks are a question mark for me--I'm not sure who is selling them besides steamboat, but I'm going to need a bunch.

[hchc]

I bought chips from zefir group buy but I'm in US. Can I have him send you the chips for assembly?

[Reckman]

I too had a lot of concerns about joining this (or any) group buy. I was amazed that so many people sent BTC, but I was the first person to ask if Steamboat could verify that he had really purchased the initial batch of chips (he was reselling half of it) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2055009#msg2055009

I saw your verification and decided that was enough for me (you you could have been working together, I only bought 32 chips in batch 1, I can still feed my family if they go missing).

Since then I've been totally convinced steamboat is legit, I think he is thinking way too much about the tiny details to not go through with this.  I also agree that he has a lot more to gain by going through with this than scamming.

This is just the start, BFL seem to be releasing chips.  These Avalon chips are fairly primitive ASICs, there will be Avalon II perhaps in something 25nm, perhaps offering 200MH/s on a AA battery, who knows.  I think this is the start of an industry, these boards will be obsolete in a year but the experience and reputations gained producing them will be very valuable.

at current prices in order for avalons to be obsolete, IE cost more to operate than they would produce, network hashrate would need to be 200x of todays value(24,000 thash), 100x after the next reward halfing (12,000 thash)

rather unlikely in the near future

[bigbeninlondon]

I too had a lot of concerns about joining this (or any) group buy. I was amazed that so many people sent BTC, but I was the first person to ask if Steamboat could verify that he had really purchased the initial batch of chips (he was reselling half of it) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2055009#msg2055009

I saw your verification and decided that was enough for me (you you could have been working together, I only bought 32 chips in batch 1, I can still feed my family if they go missing).

Since then I've been totally convinced steamboat is legit, I think he is thinking way too much about the tiny details to not go through with this.  I also agree that he has a lot more to gain by going through with this than scamming.

This is just the start, BFL seem to be releasing chips.  These Avalon chips are fairly primitive ASICs, there will be Avalon II perhaps in something 25nm, perhaps offering 200MH/s on a AA battery, who knows.  I think this is the start of an industry, these boards will be obsolete in a year but the experience and reputations gained producing them will be very valuable.

at current prices in order for avalons to be obsolete, IE cost more to operate than they would produce, network hashrate would need to be 200x of todays value(24,000 thash), 100x after the next reward halfing (12,000 thash)

rather unlikely in the near future

You can only look at operating costs vs production if the unit is free.  Add in costs for the unit itself and it changes the equation.  You have to make enough profit not only to cover operating costs, but also initial capital.

[Reckman]

getting off topic but cant help myself =p reasonable ROI is only 5-10% a year so on one steamboat K16 board, you would need to net what 26$ a year.

[kimosan]

Order placed in batch 5.

Email received.

Thank you for setting up these group buys!

[morris14ccm]

Order placed for Batch 5.

16 Chips * .086 BTC = 1.376 BTC

TX ID: 2b48bf78879a44b14bbfb9f0a57955f9c114a5d114d83374fa5e679343677cca

Email sent.

Thanks for heading this group buy.

[fasmax]

Ordered 32 chips from batch 5 and email has already been sent.

Transaction ID: 130d007a3557d2b471220d6d38d1f0ba2cfdb72dec7a60b309ff5912df9c022d
Thanks!

[SebastianJu]

Regarding assembly... will you pay a licence fee to bkkcoins? If so how much will it be per board?

[paulthetafy]

I've read every page of this thread and I'm still confused about a few things... 
Firstly am I correct that the fully assembled kit does NOT include a case or fan?  In which case I would need to work out a mounting/cooling option myself?
Secondly, with regards to powering them, if I only want to power 1 or 2, would I be correct that this can be done from a PSU currently powering my desktop, i.e. pull one of the PCI-e power cables out the back and extend it as necessary to reach?  Has anyone thought about any standalone powering options other than an ATX PSU (which is overkill for 1 or 2 boards)?
Lastly, on the hosting option, is the 8% cost a percentage if the initial purchase price, or 8% of mining income?  Do you have any more details on hosting as I am quite interested in this!
TIA!

[cp1]

The module should be powered off of 12V, so you can use anything as long as it puts out enough power (~ 32W per board).

[ionstorm]

ok, I think we should get together and figure out what is the best powersupply to power a bunch of these devices at once, also does the fully assembled miner come with case fans?  

I got a couple of these killer fans in my pc:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185054
Scythe 3000rpm 133CFM Ultra Kaze fans
It could be overkill for our machines but there is no doubt these fans will keep us cool, also for PSU, whats the best bang for the buck 80+ Gold that can power 4-8 of our boards?

[ik2013]

ok, I think we should get together and figure out what is the best powersupply to power a bunch of these devices at once, also does the fully assembled miner come with case fans?  

I got a couple of these killer fans in my pc:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185054
Scythe 3000rpm 133CFM Ultra Kaze fans
It could be overkill for our machines but there is no doubt these fans will keep us cool, also for PSU, whats the best bang for the buck 80+ Gold that can power 4-8 of our boards?

Well it isn't 80+ Gold but if you need to only power 4-8 this should work quite nicely:
Corsair CX430M
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139049&Tpk=corsair%20430M&IsVirtualParent=1

80+ Bronze

$29.99 after mail in rebate

I've been using Corsair PSUs in all my builds for a couple of years now and the first one I bought is still going strong.

[steamboat]

Basically it makes me wonder what the firmware is that the Testing option will pre-install? Is there some firmware involved in these boards other than the programming of the PIC? Do we need some kind of firmware-programming kit or something to put firmware into something ourselves if you don't pre-install it? I just don't understand exactly what is involved, not even whether I would be able to make use of boards that do not have "firmware pre-installation" done on them by someone else (maybe someone who has special cables and such used to program bitstreams or something)?
-MarkM-

The firmware that will be installed is the firmware that bkkcoins the developer of these open source boards is creating.
More information can be found here http://github.com/bkkcoins/klondike .

So is that something my computer can/will send to the board(s) across the USB?
Or something I would need special cabling/kit in order to install it myself?
-MarkM-

Depending on what type of kit you buy it will come flashed onto the board. You just need to plug the USB and boot up cgminer etc.

Yes that is why I was asking: the only "kit" that says it actually includes the firmware is the "testing" option, which isn't really a "kit" at all its a fully assembled, firmware loaded, tested unit. If loading the firmware is not something normal people can do with normal computer and USB or whatever, then really there doesnt' seem to be much option, failing there being some local firmware-loading shop or something I could take it in to that hasd the special gear for loading firmware I'd pretty much have to go with the tersted unit option.

On the other hand, I recall in the past having some ancient wireless networking card that Linux needed something they referred to as "firmware" to make it work, and all I had to do was download the so called firmware and run some firmware-installer command and presto it worked.

So it makes a lot of difference to me whether this so called firmware is akin to what I did to the wireless card or more along the lines of those FPGA re-programming tasks I see people being told to go get Jsomething cables and special kits and such to accomplish.

-MarkM-

Any firmware loading that requires a special interface will be done prior to shipping. There are several options for this which include installation from the chip supplier, from the assembler, and prior to final device shipment. Depending on the timeline, having the PICs programmed from the manufacturer would be ideal, though there are backup plans in the event this is not possible. At a bare minimum, each unit will come with a USB bootloader preinstalled which will allow the device firmware to be updated by the end consumer. The testing option ensures the latest firmware is installed and functioning with the host software at the time of shipment.

To emphasize: None of the offerings which include assembly will require specialized hardware to program the unit.

Is the KW/h cost for hosting known already?

They are, but have not been released. The rates are well below the US average, and are being aggressively negotiated to bring them down further.

So it is 2.45BTC for one Klondike 16 chip with everything needed not including shipping?

The price for one Fully assembled Klondike 16 with everything minus the power supply included is $133.50, to be paid in BTC. This does not include shipping.

Ok thanks, I added the price of chips. This looks a lot more affordable now. Is it possible to get a table with estimated shipping prices for completed boards? Thanks.

To clarify: Avalon ASIC chips are BTC.086 each. 16 of these chips are required for one K16 board, which are not included in the price of any of the assembly options. None of the assembly options contain the power supply required to power the device, but do contain everything else (minus the assembly only option). I understand this is confusing. This thread is not the ideal format for a shopping cart. The website is being built and should help to clarify these details.

Shipping rates cannot be calculated until final dimensions and weight are known. Once this information has been made available, a shipping chart will be posted.

is this us only, or international?

Worldwide. Please see the shipping section for rates for chip purchases.

Please note however, that this does in no way guarantee the safety of an investment.
 [...]

I agree with Steamboat that providing his identity to JohnK will not change much. I would guess that scammers have falsified identity documents anyway and furthermore law authorities would not understand the Bitcoin aspect (you paid with what? do you have a bank receipt or CC statement?) nor would it be easy to investigate this internationally.

I too had a lot of concerns about joining this (or any) group buy. I was amazed that so many people sent BTC, but I was the first person to ask if Steamboat could verify that he had really purchased the initial batch of chips (he was reselling half of it) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=192916.msg2055009#msg2055009

Steamboat has shown great organizational skills and a lot of interest in the Klondike project. I believe he will gain a lot more profit by delivering the advertised services/products than doing otherwise. He bought the first batch of chips before offering this group sell so the way I see it he is skillfully joining his private mining interests with additional business goals.

While everything seems legit I still always use the word "allegedly" when I talk about anything bitcoin. So I allegedly bought some ASIC chips that will allegedly be fabricated by Avalon allegedly a couple of weeks from now. The only thing that is real up to this point is that I gave someone $ to give me some data bits called BTC.
[/quote]

I would like everyone who reads this thread to read this post. Some scams are very transparent, some are not. Please research carefully any vendor you choose to do business with.

Is there an option to buy a "Fully unassembled unit"? Something for the hardcore DIY-stencil-cutting-oven-reflow types that don't want to bother organizing PCB fabrication themselves.

There have been many requests for this. At this time it is a tentative yes, though in no way certain. There are several scenarios that would make this difficult to do, the logistics of which are being addressed.

I bought chips from zefir group buy but I'm in US. Can I have him send you the chips for assembly?

Yes. Any of the services mentioned in the OP may be combined with any other Avalon ASIC chip service, from this or a third party offering.

Regarding assembly... will you pay a licence fee to bkkcoins? If so how much will it be per board?

Aside from the support already being provided to BkkCoins, he will receive a percentage of each unit produced.

I've read every page of this thread and I'm still confused about a few things... 
Firstly am I correct that the fully assembled kit does NOT include a case or fan?  In which case I would need to work out a mounting/cooling option myself?
Secondly, with regards to powering them, if I only want to power 1 or 2, would I be correct that this can be done from a PSU currently powering my desktop, i.e. pull one of the PCI-e power cables out the back and extend it as necessary to reach?  Has anyone thought about any standalone powering options other than an ATX PSU (which is overkill for 1 or 2 boards)?
Lastly, on the hosting option, is the 8% cost a percentage if the initial purchase price, or 8% of mining income?  Do you have any more details on hosting as I am quite interested in this!
TIA!

Full kit: Includes the assembly service and a DIY kit which includes: heat sink, standoffs, fan, screws, thermal paste, and USB cable.
Fully assembled unit: Includes assembly of one Klondike K16 ASIC board and all DIY kit parts fully assembled.

* Assembly, Assembly and DIY Kit, and Fully Assembled Unit prices do not include the price of Avalon ASIC chips, and are not due at the time of chip purchase.

The DIY kit contains everything needed, minus the power supply, to build a fully functioning unit. Full assembly contains all parts of the DIY kit fully installed.

The single unit design will be open air, with the fan positioned directly above the heatsink, with standoffs to support the fan, and to act as feet for the unit.

Assuming your power supply can support the unit, yes.

The hosting option cost is 8% of the revenue generated by the unit. More details will be available soon.


All purchases received, recorded, replied.
To customers with a Batch 1 order: Please respond to the email sent as soon as possible.

As a side note: If anyone has experience in precision 3d modeling and would like to help please send me a PM. Designs for the heatsink, single unit, and multiple unit need to be rendered.

[mr.n00blar]

There's a lot of good stuff here but its not easily deciphered... If you buy a DIY kit assembled, if you assemble it correctly, would you be able to just begin mining? How much does one DIY kit cost (est)? Will it come with everything needed to run it?

[Beastlymac]

There's a lot of good stuff here but its not easily deciphered... If you buy a DIY kit assembled, if you assemble it correctly, would you be able to just begin mining? How much does one DIY kit cost (est)? Will it come with everything needed to run it?

Chips available: 576

Summary of services offered:

• Chips: Avalon 110nm ASIC chips.
  
  
• Assembly: Includes assembly of ASICs, PCB based on the Klondike K16 design, and necessary PCB components.
  
  
• Full kit: Includes the assembly service and a DIY kit which includes: heat sink, standoffs, fan, screws, thermal paste, and USB cable.
  
  
• Fully assembled unit: Includes assembly of one Klondike K16 ASIC board and all DIY kit parts fully assembled.
  
  
• Testing: Includes one fully assembled Klondike K16, firmware pre-installation, and stability testing.
  
  
• Hosting: Rent space in a secure, monitored, climate controlled environment while retaining full ownership of unit.

*All services may be used separately or in conjunction with other offers, including chips or assembly purchased from an outside source


Pricing

• Chips:
  Avalon ASIC chips may be ordered for BTC0.086. This fee is due immediately upon order placement.
  
• Assembly:
  The total price for assembly is $95. This includes $35 for the PCB and board related components, and $60 for assembly, to be paid in BTC.
  
• Assembly and DIY Kit:
  The DIY kit and fully assembled PCB are $123.5, to be paid in BTC.
  
• Fully Assembled Unit:
  The fully assembled unit, including all necessary hardware, is $133.5, to be paid in BTC.
  
• Hosting:
  Hosting fees are tentatively set at 8% plus the cost of electricity. A setup fee may be unavoidable, due to the sizable infrastructure costs associated.
  
• Testing:
  Testing fees to be released.
  

* Assembly, Assembly and DIY Kit, and Fully Assembled Unit prices do not include the price of Avalon ASIC chips, and are not due at the time of chip purchase.

*Prices do not include shipping.

*Power supply not included.

*The prices above, not including the ASIC chips, are tentative and subject to change pending finalization of all parts required. This includes Testing and Hosting.  Each item whose price has not been finalized includes an increased margin reflecting this uncertainty, and may be reduced.

* Any USD fees incurred from receipt of ASIC chips from Avalon will be calculated upon arrival and distributed evenly based on the amount of chips purchased per person, payable in BTC prior to shipping to final destination. These include but are not limited to import tax, customs duties, and merchandise processing fees associated with receipt of shipment from Avalon. Depending on the HS code Avalon uses in shipping, the estimated total is $404.82.

* All purchases are processed in a First in, First out queue.

You get everything that you need to run the kloindike except a power supply

[BitCsByBit]

Can I add to my order?
Assuming chips are still available, you may add up to 100% of your initial purchase without losing your place in the shipping cue.

Can someone please clarify if this applies only per batch, while chips are available for that batch, or more chips can be added to the current batch and get them delivered together with your chips from the previous batch?

If possible, I'd like to add a few chips to my batch 4 pre-order.

Cheers.