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Author Topic: [ANN][ZEN] Horizen: Unbounded By Design  (Read 217025 times)
Ravni Kriptograf
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May 04, 2018, 12:44:36 PM
 #2761


What's ZenCash team point of view on the new Antminer Z9 mini Equihash miner (10,000 Sol/s  @  300w for 1,999 USD )

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180503154806494uGcSyiu806FD
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urFBTcSuKlk&t=550s
Start watching this video at 36th minute, Rolf did really good clarifications...

wow, that was both sad and pathetic. What a coward...

XMR did the right thing and I just dont understand why ZEN wont do the same thing.

The thing is moving to asic resistance is possible but it would require huge amount of resources(modfiing zen,modifing securenodes,modifing pools) modifing nearly everyting related to zen. It is possible but it will push Supernodes and other zen projects behind by years.
According to NIST and ECRYPT II, the cryptographic algorithms used in Bitcoin are expected to be strong until at least 2030. (After that, it will not be too difficult to transition to different algorithms.)
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MedaR
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May 04, 2018, 01:17:36 PM
 #2762


What's ZenCash team point of view on the new Antminer Z9 mini Equihash miner (10,000 Sol/s  @  300w for 1,999 USD )

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180503154806494uGcSyiu806FD
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urFBTcSuKlk&t=550s
Start watching this video at 36th minute, Rolf did really good clarifications...

wow, that was both sad and pathetic. What a coward...

XMR did the right thing and I just dont understand why ZEN wont do the same thing.
No, he was realistic, no one is safe from ASIC, it is matter of time.. Rolf is also middle sized miner, don't forget this.
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.

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MedaR
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May 04, 2018, 01:22:06 PM
 #2763

The thing is moving to asic resistance is possible but it would require huge amount of resources(modfiing zen,modifing securenodes,modifing pools) modifing nearly everyting related to zen. It is possible but it will push Supernodes and other zen projects behind by years.
I think Rowan gave best explanations about Team's concerns..

Quote
This new miner is either an FPGA with on board RAM (quite likely) or a full blown ASIC with some kind of very fancy (and expensive) linked memory module.
If it's an FPGA we're dealing with, finding an algorithm that you couldn't just reprogram the FPGA to mine will be extremely difficult. If it's an ASIC, the task of creating some kind of incompatibility by modifying or switching algo's would obviously be considerably easier.

Problem is, we have no technical specs for the Z9 so we could potentially put a load of effort into something that would only take a few days to reconfigure the Z9 to mine...

So I think we should spend some time trying to figure out what we're actually up against before trying to formulate a plan.
Rowan Stone

https://github.com/ZencashOfficial/zen/issues/142

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fleer
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May 04, 2018, 01:24:12 PM
 #2764

are the equihash asics available for purchase anywhere?

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lusa
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May 04, 2018, 01:48:17 PM
 #2765

are the equihash asics available for purchase anywhere?

If you want to support bitmain???

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180503154806494uGcSyiu806FD
CryptoWaffle
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May 04, 2018, 02:07:32 PM
 #2766


What's ZenCash team point of view on the new Antminer Z9 mini Equihash miner (10,000 Sol/s  @  300w for 1,999 USD )

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180503154806494uGcSyiu806FD
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urFBTcSuKlk&t=550s
Start watching this video at 36th minute, Rolf did really good clarifications...

wow, that was both sad and pathetic. What a coward...

XMR did the right thing and I just dont understand why ZEN wont do the same thing.

The thing is moving to asic resistance is possible but it would require huge amount of resources(modfiing zen,modifing securenodes,modifing pools) modifing nearly everyting related to zen. It is possible but it will push Supernodes and other zen projects behind by years.

certainly not a huge amount of resources. Its been done a few times already and it was the right move. The only acceptable response to ASIC for a project like ZEN is a fork and anything else is a coward move/decision.
I dont even understand why the fork isnt already announced.
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May 04, 2018, 02:27:51 PM
 #2767

certainly not a huge amount of resources. Its been done a few times already and it was the right move. The only acceptable response to ASIC for a project like ZEN is a fork and anything else is a coward move/decision.
I dont even understand why the fork isnt already announced.
Quote
For large decisions that can have significant effects, I like to do a worst case/best case exercise. Identify the worst outcome of a decision, and balance it against the best case of the decision. It helps to actually quantify things in doing this as well.

Furthermore, part of this decision should be reviewing what the goals of the ZenCash project are and how the decisions to be made are consistent with the goals.

There are people making hardware purchasing decisions about this, and if too much of the entrenched hashrate comes from miners running ZenCash ASIC's then over time there will be a group of people wanting to maintain that hashrate. Making a decision on the direction to go is something that should be made withing a reasonable time period.

Choices under discussion so far that I have seen:

Do not change ZenCash Equihash algorithm
Modify the ZenCash Equihash algorithm to require more memory by changing parameters
Change the ZenCash algorithm to a different one already in use
Change the ZenCash algorithm to a completely new one
One of the things I have noticed as a cryptocurrency miner is that the cryptocurrency that is the first to have a new algorithm in many cases becomes the lead of that mining class. It may be because the ones that have their own algorithms also have developers that continue to create and improve the cryptocurrency, so it may be more due to the long term effect of active developers, and the same effect could be obtained by continued active development on the project.
Rolf Versluis

https://github.com/ZencashOfficial/zen/issues/142

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witch
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May 04, 2018, 02:58:59 PM
 #2768

How many coins do I have to buy to set up my own node?

And could you please let me know the hardware requirements for setting it up?
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May 04, 2018, 03:16:32 PM
 #2769

How many coins do I have to buy to set up my own node?

And could you please let me know the hardware requirements for setting it up?


https://blockoperations.com/how-to-build-and-operate-a-zencash-secure-node/

https://securenodes.na.zensystem.io/about

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TruePools
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May 04, 2018, 06:20:09 PM
 #2770

been minig on it for 5 days now & still no payment..

What is your address?
MedaR
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May 04, 2018, 07:53:00 PM
 #2771

If you are in the NYC area on May 14th, stop by and say hello. RSVP. Spots are limited!
https://www.eventbrite.com/e/zencash-first-anniversary-party-tickets-45812660902?aff=eprofsaved

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rendravolt
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May 04, 2018, 07:57:54 PM
 #2772

without doubt anonymity is a boon for all foreign exchange traders, I'm more interested in how they react to the anonymity of the countries that are fighting with blokchain precisely for this reason, in a number of countries you will not be allowed to exist

But if talking to the current circumstances, anonymity is very difficult, most of the exchange has implemented verification ID so that traders can do trading activities.

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May 04, 2018, 08:59:35 PM
 #2773

ZENCASH do many things that it already exists on other crypto. I don't see much new. As the decentralized uPort blockchain application for data and identity. Or like the decentralized Woleet blockchain application for folders, which also installs in the LEDGER to confirm the identity of folders. As cryptonote that already make encrypted messages under payment by their token.
And I see all the blockchain sites that proclaim themselves the best anonymous. We know the publicity, we need to soften the sentences. There's nothing to celebrate.
ZenCash is collection of products and services..We are not focused only on private transactions..

ZenCash have 10k Secure Nodes online and most decentralized and resilient network and this is fact. Those are not ordinary nodes. They have specific hardware and security requirements. All comunication between nodes, wallet and nodes is crypted.

Super Nodes will encircle this story :

The two major improvements Super Nodes bring are to transition tracking and payments on-chain, or within protocol, a major change from the current system where such functions are executed on external server clusters; and the introduction of sidechaining elevates the ZenCash system from a pure cryptocurrency to a platform on which an unbounded set of services can be built. The value proposition of the system then becomes more than the utility of the currency, but now includes the utility of all future services that will be layered onto our infrastructure. A small sampling of such services which are already in planning include a distributed file storage system (ZenPub), a secure messaging system (ZenChat), a computation-for-rent system akin to AWS’s Lambda Functions (ZenGrid), zero-delay payments (InstantZen), and a decentralized exchange (ZenXchange) with a fully-collateralized price-stable asset called ZenUSD (USDZ).

OK I am impressed. I have been a fan of Zen for a while now, but this upcoming transformation is really mind boggling, I have to say. Is there any infos of the time all this transformation will need?

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May 04, 2018, 09:14:06 PM
 #2774


What's ZenCash team point of view on the new Antminer Z9 mini Equihash miner (10,000 Sol/s  @  300w for 1,999 USD )

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180503154806494uGcSyiu806FD
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urFBTcSuKlk&t=550s
Start watching this video at 36th minute, Rolf did really good clarifications...

wow, that was both sad and pathetic. What a coward...

XMR did the right thing and I just dont understand why ZEN wont do the same thing.
No, he was realistic, no one is safe from ASIC, it is matter of time.. Rolf is also middle sized miner, don't forget this.
We are monitoring and evaluation next steps. We don't have an official statement at this moment.


forget about the smalltime gpu miners. They are screwed regardless of asic or not. Its about the philosophy of Zen. Diversity throughout the network is key to resilience. If Zen allows there consensus mechanism to be undermined it will threaten all other elements of the coin. If there is a bug, exploited or backdoor in a miners than it provides an attack vector. Think about a disease hitting a homogeneous population that has little resistance to that disease. That population will become extinct if the disease is lethal. But if the population has diversity then some will be affected but others will be resistant. GPU miners provided a very diverse group that support the consensus mechanism. Some use Linux other windows. Some use Nivida others AMD and there is a verity of equihash software out now.  if Zen does not see the threat then they should suffer the consequences.

Etherium is in a totally different position. The ASIC from Bitmain is not a thread as it is not better than a GPU at the moment. So adds more diversity but that will not remain the case for long. Zen is not so lucky as with Monero the Z3 is a game changer and will dominate the network in a short time.   
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May 05, 2018, 12:04:53 AM
 #2775

is zenmine.pro pool down?
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May 05, 2018, 08:38:51 AM
 #2776

is zenmine.pro pool down?
been minig on it for 5 days now & still no payment..

What is your address?

Please if this is still actual, clarify this with pool owner.

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MedaR
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May 05, 2018, 09:14:37 AM
 #2777



Attention Zen community:

Join the ZenCash team in NYC on 14 May to celebrate our first year operating!

Eat, Drink, Have Fun, and Be Zen!

Limited space, RSVP now!
https://www.eventbrite.com/e/zencash-first-anniversary-party-tickets-45812660902?aff=eprofsaved

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MedaR
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May 05, 2018, 09:56:22 AM
 #2778

OK I am impressed. I have been a fan of Zen for a while now, but this upcoming transformation is really mind boggling, I have to say. Is there any infos of the time all this transformation will need?


Quote
I thought it would help everyone understand the reasoning behind the change.  The initial estimate was end of May and now it is beginning of July so it is not too big a slip.The hard fork need to be after the  deprecation of the current version as it affects full wallets, nodes, pools and exchanges.
devman

This fork will implement block reward changes  10% 10% 10% 70% as you can see on first picture.

Full implementation of this application system with Super Nodes is expected to be launched in Q4 of 2018 with a prototype available for testing at the end of Q3.

https://zencash.com/assets/files/Zen-Application-Platform-Whitepaper.pdf

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Ravni Kriptograf
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May 05, 2018, 10:33:31 AM
 #2779

OK I am impressed. I have been a fan of Zen for a while now, but this upcoming transformation is really mind boggling, I have to say. Is there any infos of the time all this transformation will need?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Da-tkdTXkAEZl3T.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/XeZ0rta.png
Quote
I thought it would help everyone understand the reasoning behind the change.  The initial estimate was end of May and now it is beginning of July so it is not too big a slip.The hard fork need to be after the  deprecation of the current version as it affects full wallets, nodes, pools and exchanges.
devman

This fork will implement block reward changes  10% 10% 10% 70% as you can see on first picture.

Full implementation of this application system with Super Nodes is expected to be launched in Q4 of 2018 with a prototype available for testing at the end of Q3.

https://zencash.com/assets/files/Zen-Application-Platform-Whitepaper.pdf


WOW hard forking without implementation of asic resistance thats a peace of work right there.
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May 05, 2018, 11:26:50 AM
 #2780

WOW hard forking without implementation of asic resistance thats a peace of work right there.

This fork first time was introduced in our new white paper, back then this story about ASIC was not actuel. We have scheduled a fork for this purpose and we cannot delay this. As I said few posts before we don't have an official statement on this.

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