WARNING DeepOnion is a SCAM, proof inside!

[saucenak]

Deeponions is not a scam, it's the future of the TOR browser


Do not forget that TOR helped the development of BTC, it was one of the main causes of purchase of BTC before (around 2010) to buy on blackmarket

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[taoist23]

This topic looks like attempt to decrease price of Onion to find out good point of enter on Exchange.%)

No, this topic reveals interesting technical aspects which I never knew.
Without doubt lauda has a lot of experience and revealed many scams so far and I like to hear all opinions.
I learned much from this thread, thanks to all.

[validenp]

Notice all the supporters of the scam coin deep onion are members with the signature requirements to get the coin, they are a paid Schill. If it looks like a scam, smells like a scam it must be a scam. I wont waste my time with a shit coin that is not giving away what it says it will give away. I bet you will get like 2 coins for your efforts.

[QlooQl]

Most bounties are just ways to pay people less than minimum wage (or nothing at all) to do some very valuable work for you. Almost every ICO is currently doing bounties in some form. I mean people are literally getting in flame wars over who gets to translate to Portuguese for 1000 of the latest bigscamcoin.

[QlooQl]

DeepOnion might be a scam. I personally only invest in coins that seem to have fair leadership (I really like Decred, for example).

But this kind of thing happens all the time in silicon valley. Too much investor cash right now. The stupid money means more scams. I would listen when someone is willing to spend their time and effort. Does that mean DO will be worth $0? I don't think so, but we won't know til someone actually finds a use for the product. I'll just wait for a better risk/reward.

[taoist23]

DeepOnion might be a scam. I personally only invest in coins that seem to have fair leadership (I really like Decred, for example).

But this kind of thing happens all the time in silicon valley. Too much investor cash right now. The stupid money means more scams. I would listen when someone is willing to spend their time and effort. Does that mean DO will be worth $0? I don't think so, but we won't know til someone actually finds a use for the product. I'll just wait for a better risk/reward.

There is no risk/reward if you don't buy onions at exchange.
You can get them in signature campaign for posting 10 posts/week, so this would better be called  work/reward.

[suppersz]

Yeah there might be some people who think its scam wanting to cash out a nice pump but I think for the most part its far more likely they just want some % of the coins they helped to create, to me it seems strange to want to show support for a project such as this and then turn around and say "I dont even want any of these coins."

Personally not sure, the whole thing seems great but there are some concerns so I'll get my free coins and over the next few weeks of the airdrops I'll see how things work out and how the dev handled themself before investing more off the exchanges. It's too early to know for sure.

[Lauda]

Well, Lauda, if you say ETH is a scam, you lose all credibility for whatever else you say... Anything with a premine is not necessarily a scam, and people must understand that developing something awesome is not free...

Plenty of people are convinced that ETH is a scam. A lot of experts in this field don't even want to get near it due to its centralization. If you want to keep your head in the ground, then so be it.

Pedantically speaking, no communication can be made 100% anonymous, but Tor (when used correctly) can greatly increase your anonymity.

In other words: DeepOnion is falsely marketing itself, and I am right. Someone understands it.

The OpenSSL bugs you mentioned are irrelevant in my opinion, when bugs are found they are hopefully patched out asap.

They were abused long before they were discovered, and post discovery.

The attack vectors to worry about typically involve traffic analysis to de-anonymise.

Which are present.

Notice all the supporters of the scam coin deep onion are members with the signature requirements to get the coin, they are a paid Schill.

Exactly. When you out this shitcoin, they come swarming like an army.

[QlooQl]

Having a cult-following IS value. Even if the cult is full of raving lunatics who got paid like $0.25 worth of Chuck E Cheese Tokens (honestly more useful than most the ICOs today).

That's why I say {scamcoin} can still have a future. It's still a scam, but so is Herbalife, Mary Kay, Pampered Chef, and other "multi-level" marketing companies. They are as close to pyramid schemes as you can get without legally being a pyramid scheme. So are most ICOs today.

[cleavey]

Pedantically speaking, no communication can be made 100% anonymous, but Tor (when used correctly) can greatly increase your anonymity.

In other words: DeepOnion is falsely marketing itself, and I am right. Someone understands it.

Technically yes. I am a pedant when it comes to how I speak, partly because I've been around long enough to know that no matter how you say something, someone will misinterpret you, so being clear is important. Not everyone agrees, especially on the internet. I'm willing to ignore a certain amount of imprecise wording from people online, you can't correct everyone and they seldom thank you for it. It could also be argued that "100% anonymous" is an example of marketing speak, another way to say unclear jibberish (see here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_jargon ). When was the last time your eyes didn't glaze over when a product description says something like "quantum dot technology" or "4x performance". It doesn't make it right, it's just the norm of advertising, so unless it's rife or particularly egregious, it's probably not worth fixating on.

The OpenSSL bugs you mentioned are irrelevant in my opinion, when bugs are found they are hopefully patched out asap.

They were abused long before they were discovered, and post discovery.

Yes, but every piece of software has bugs, using that as an argument is not very strong unless the bugs are found but never patched. If the software is open source, and the community is active enough that there is a reasonable expectation that due diligence has been performed, that's the best we can hope for (that heartbleed bug though ).

The attack vectors to worry about typically involve traffic analysis to de-anonymise.

Which are present.

Yes, I was giving a more compelling argument than "bugs in software". A lot of the traffic analysis that can be done comes from controlling exit nodes, which is why I went on to outline the best way I think a crypto could try to use Tor for maximal anonymity. Yes there have been (probably still are) traffic analysis attacks on hidden services, but it's still the most secure way to use Tor in all likelihood. I think for most people, a properly implemented Tor crypto is enough to consider yourself more secure than someone can be bothered with, but if you're a real multi-million dollar drug money launderer, probably taking some extra precautions would be wise

[EverumCasino]

If writing posts on a forum where you're gonna be writing posts anyway is too much work, then you can also opt out and not participate. Best part about it all is that it's optional

Bad PR = good PR = any PR.

[mrkhajit]

now this coin is scam or not?

[Lauda]

It could also be argued that "100% anonymous" is an example of marketing speak, another way to say unclear jibberish (see here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_jargon ).

Let's not compare shady developers and their shitcoins with big companies and their marketing departments.

Yes, but every piece of software has bugs, using that as an argument is not very strong unless the bugs are found but never patched. If the software is open source, and the community is active enough that there is a reasonable expectation that due diligence has been performed, that's the best we can hope for (that heartbleed bug though ).

You're stating the obvious though.

Yes, I was giving a more compelling argument than "bugs in software". A lot of the traffic analysis that can be done comes from controlling exit nodes, which is why I went on to outline the best way I think a crypto could try to use Tor for maximal anonymity. Yes there have been (probably still are) traffic analysis attacks on hidden services, but it's still the most secure way to use Tor in all likelihood. I think for most people, a properly implemented Tor crypto is enough to consider yourself more secure than someone can be bothered with, but if you're a real multi-million dollar drug money launderer, probably taking some extra precautions would be wise

There is absolutely no reason to do this when there are existing solutions such as Monero.

now this coin is scam or not?

Yes.

[cleavey]

It could also be argued that "100% anonymous" is an example of marketing speak, another way to say unclear jibberish (see here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_jargon ).

Let's not compare shady developers and their shitcoins with big companies and their marketing departments.

Marketing is marketing, it is all language that does not usually treat clarity, reality or consumers with the utmost respect. If you'd prefer, I could say something like "everyone exaggerates on their CV". I don't agree with it.

Yes, but every piece of software has bugs, using that as an argument is not very strong unless the bugs are found but never patched. If the software is open source, and the community is active enough that there is a reasonable expectation that due diligence has been performed, that's the best we can hope for (that heartbleed bug though ).

You're stating the obvious though.

If I can use an obvious statement against your point, what does it say about your point?

Yes, I was giving a more compelling argument than "bugs in software". A lot of the traffic analysis that can be done comes from controlling exit nodes, which is why I went on to outline the best way I think a crypto could try to use Tor for maximal anonymity. Yes there have been (probably still are) traffic analysis attacks on hidden services, but it's still the most secure way to use Tor in all likelihood. I think for most people, a properly implemented Tor crypto is enough to consider yourself more secure than someone can be bothered with, but if you're a real multi-million dollar drug money launderer, probably taking some extra precautions would be wise

There is absolutely no reason to do this when there are existing solutions such as Monero.

There definitely is. Monero anonymises transactions on the blockchain, but it doesn't hide the fact that your ip is interacting with it. There is the option of using Monero over Tor, which I'd recommend if you're that into using Monero for privacy (https://github.com/monero-project/monero#using-tor ).

[Lauda]

Marketing is marketing, it is all language that does not usually treat clarity, reality or consumers with the utmost respect. If you'd prefer, I could say something like "everyone exaggerates on their CV". I don't agree with it.

It is not the same thing, comparing the misleading marketing of a strong and established brand vs. the misleading marketing of an unknown and shady developer.

If I can use an obvious statement against your point, what does it say about your point?

Your statement does not, in any way, affect my point.

There definitely is. Monero anonymises transactions on the blockchain, but it doesn't hide the fact that your ip is interacting with it. There is the option of using Monero over Tor, which I'd recommend if you're that into using Monero for privacy (https://github.com/monero-project/monero#using-tor ).

Again in other words: There is no reason for DeepOnion to exist (regardless whether it does what it claims to do or not (minus the fake advertising)).

[cleavey]

Marketing is marketing, it is all language that does not usually treat clarity, reality or consumers with the utmost respect. If you'd prefer, I could say something like "everyone exaggerates on their CV". I don't agree with it.

It is not the same thing, comparing the misleading marketing of a strong and established brand vs. the misleading marketing of an unknown and shady developer.

It is the same thing. I'm not comparing the entities, I'm comparing the way they speak. Pretend I didn't say "quantum dot", it was just an example of bullshit marketing speak.

If I can use an obvious statement against your point, what does it say about your point?

Your statement does not, in any way, affect my point.

I took your point to be that Tor isn't secure because it has had bugs exploited in the past. Unless you plan on not using software, the threat of bugs being exploited is ubiquitous. The imprecise wording of "100%" I dealt with elsewhere.

There definitely is. Monero anonymises transactions on the blockchain, but it doesn't hide the fact that your ip is interacting with it. There is the option of using Monero over Tor, which I'd recommend if you're that into using Monero for privacy (https://github.com/monero-project/monero#using-tor ).

Again in other words: There is no reason for DeepOnion to exist (regardless whether it does what it claims to do or not (minus the fake advertising)).

I haven't argued for or against DeepOnion as yet (I've just been answering select points I disagreed with, like you mentioning bugs in OpenSSL or the shills using similarly flawed logic). I don't give a toss about the politics beyond grabbing some popcorn and letting it play out, so disregarding that I'll just say this:

I see nothing wrong with competition in the "anon-crypto" market, which already has a lot of competition. I doubt DeepOnion can make a big impact to that market, but far be it from me to stop them from trying. For the market in general, Monero is top dog and I don't see that changing (unless some major design flaws in Monero exhibit themselves, unlikely), but that is just my opinion.

[skyline247]

1) They made a scrypt to check signatures and posts. They use automatic payout with the bot. They designed smart rules.

That's quite easy to do; almost trivial.

-snip-
There are lots of shady things about the project, but it's free. There's tons of bad ICO that actually collect money from investors and walk away

Classic relative privation fallacy (aka, "not as bad as" fallacy), which is not an actual argument that goes in favor of the project.

Lauda as much as I disagree with your banning of me from the Bitmixer campaign (R.I.P), you have a point about this being shady.

However, keep something in mind. While I am not suggesting you are wrong, don't forget even a company like BTC-e which is the most shady of all is working hard to pay back everyone who had funds on their exchange despite the fact we do not know their identities. They could take our BTC and run, but they are legit. From this perspective, DeepONION could also be legit, and their owners simply hiding their identities. IT doesn't prove they aren't legit. Hope this makes sense...

[jk_14]

The its not an ICO defense means squat.
Premining all the coins doesn't change.
And I sure as hell am not taking lip from NOOBS here with five posts telling me stupid shit about coins while the post away with their onion sig campaign.

Even if tor WAS properly integrated as stated then we have the coin rigged badly to make the devs rich with a classic scheme....... The air drop.
Which yes is very much scammy.
Always has been and always will be.

The reality is here is we have old members saying this is seriously sketchy bullshit.
And noob accounts with sig campaigns for the coin in question lining up to defend it.
In other words case fucking closed pajeets  

There's nothing scammy about wanting to make money off of your own project. If the dev delivers something that is accepted and promoted by the community, he deserves a large chunk of the pie for literally creating it.

If that wasn't the case there would be literally nothing available and humans would still live in bloody caves. Are you seriously arguing against trying to make a profit off of your own work?

By the end of the last round we will see if the dev spread out the coins as previously claimed. If he does there is nothing scammy or deplorable about the project in any way.

In either case, he's not extorting morons out of their money in the form of a poorly planned ICO with a dreadful whitepaper that doesn't even make any points so this is definitely one of the least suspicious projects that are currently available, seeing as how just about everything else these days is an ICO with zero completed development.


Do I know if this is a "scam" or not? No, nobody does at this point and flagging projects based on such a laughable suspicion would literally kill crypto-currencies as a whole if it was the norm.

[Lauda]

It is the same thing.

It isn't even close to being the same thing, no.

I took your point to be that Tor isn't secure because it has had bugs exploited in the past. Unless you plan on not using software, the threat of bugs being exploited is ubiquitous. The imprecise wording of "100%" I dealt with elsewhere.

Whoever believes that TOR is 100% anonymous as claimed by the signature from DeepOnion is an outright idiot. Bugs were present, and likely are present among various attack surfaces. End of.

I see nothing wrong with competition in the "anon-crypto" market, which already has a lot of competition. I doubt DeepOnion can make a big impact to that market, but far be it from me to stop them from trying.

DeepOnion isn't a competitor to anything, don't make bad jokes.

Lauda as much as I disagree with your banning of me from the Bitmixer campaign (R.I.P), you have a point about this being shady.

RIP.

[chiller]

In a perfect world market (crypto or not) would decide if it's scam or not scam... At the moment with a market cap around of ~750k USD and daily volumes of 7k USD the market looks healthy.
I myself had some concerns about this coin but I'm on the train now. I think more liquidity and even more coins like this help overall crypto economy by providing new user base (that's trivial but essential to any market) by providing low barrier entry (literally 0$ if you don't count your time skipping through bitcointalk and replaying here and there )...
Of Course raising red flags and helping community to understand the problems helps too.