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Author Topic: BiblePay | 10% to Orphan-Charity | RANDOMX MINING | Sanctuaries (Masternodes)  (Read 236705 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (345 posts by 33 users deleted.)
616westwarmoth
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March 14, 2018, 11:23:11 PM
 #5181

Why am I such a big fan of Stake per RAC?  Because of our emission schedule:

http://wiki.biblepay.org/Emission_Schedule

Month-Year   Block Emission   Monthly Emission   Total Emission
12/25/2017   12,313           74,613,750            274,613,750
12/20/2018   10,270           62,237,714            1,087,306,771
12/15/2019   8,567           51,914,467            1,765,200,000
12/9/2020      7,146           43,303,517            2,330,652,413
12/4/2021      5,961           36,120,847            2,802,314,348  <-Half of BBP emitted by mid 2021!!!
...............
12/23/2046   59                    359,591                    5,150,636,889

Basically, half of our total emissions are in the first 4 years.  The next half of emissions takes 25 years!  
That is telling you that it is time to accumulate and be patient.  But to help traders and investors out through this high emission rate, staking per RAC would REALLY help.  As price appreciates and emission tapers we can scale back the amount needed per RAC.  

Vote here:

http://forum.biblepay.org/index.php?topic=127.0

EDIT:  Legacy ie., 50,001 per user to get 100 UTXO would be better than staking per MAG because that would also grow the aggregate stake amount with the user base while making everyone stake the same amount.  If they are fractional MAG they will always be fractional MAG and their stake amount will never go down like the bigger miners.

Do you wonder why there are no traders posting on Reddit, like "when moon?"  It's because traders and investors look at the emissions and feel like they are getting dumped on by miners.  It's why I worry that BTC will shoot up while we are still in our high emission phase.  And if you are looking for something to trade, what do you look for?  You can look for something that is getting positive money flow on a down day.  That is how I found BBP.  Or you can do what lots of other traders do, and look for something that gains in RELATIVE STRENGTH.  Relative Strength is how a particular coin performs relative to its peers.  As for biblepay, since I have been in it, our relative strength has done worse.  We were ranked in the top 500s of market cap, now we are in the 700s.  The fact that we are not outperforming other coins is a message that something needs to be done.  Jumping other coins in rank will draw in traders.  Traders like stuff that goes up especially since it's not easy to short cryptos.  

However, I believe BTC drops by 90% during the next US/global recession.  I think the US going into recession, when it happens, will take Asia along with it and likely Europe too.  Most of the holders of bitcoin are small investors and they will be looking to sell.  If bitcoin drops by 50-70% during a good economic time, how is it not going to drop by 90% during a recession?  It's another reason why I like growing the stake amount.  To get some good price appreciation before the next recession.

Here is why I think RAC based is a poor substitute for Mag based stake.

Consider where we are at right now, under the corrected coin emission schedule, the Superblock for PoDC should be roughly 1.4M BBP/day. Right now, to make 10% of that would require (in round terms) 200K RAC for a 100 Mag (based on a "current" Team RAC of about 2M).   So 50K/ Mag (which along with 10K are leading the Mag voting) would mean 5M BBP to make 140K BBP per day, and 20 BBP/RAC (the clear cut RAC leader) would mean 4M BBP for the same reward.  Now, flash forward to next year this time where we'll have (conservatively) 10M Team RAC.  The daily reward will have dropped to about 1.1M BBP/day (with a properly working 7 minute timing block).  So the same 200K user, will then have a Mag of 20 and need 100K to stake or the same amount (5M BBP) to stake under RAC to get 22K/day.

This means under RAC we're either overly generous to our current users or predatory to new ones in a year.  Especially if the price can grow...

Mag will always remain the same cost overall, which is poor because it locks up fewer coins, but the alternative is to me, unacceptable, which is current users like myself get into the PoDC system for a very small percentage of the overall reward.  The best system would be the most complex, and that would require staking equal to some multiple of the reward, like 100x or 150x. 

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tmike
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March 15, 2018, 12:08:10 AM
 #5182

I dont think your config has actually been set properly.

The wallet does set the target (above in that 50001 part of the message)using the "utxoamount=XXXX". 

my config:

addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network

gen=1
genproclimit=3
poolport=80
pool=http://pool2.biblepay.org
workerid=*
utxoamount=1

gonna repeat...  I put * to block the workerid obviously.

Is there something wrong with this config?  podc still gives me the "Unable to create PODC UTXO::Balance (3259.00) less than target UTXO (50001.00)." error

Someone else in this thread was having the same issue, please advise.



Can you try gen=0 and see if it still mines? Maybe you have a file permission issue.

znffal
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March 15, 2018, 12:09:59 AM
 #5183

I dont think your config has actually been set properly.

The wallet does set the target (above in that 50001 part of the message)using the "utxoamount=XXXX". 

my config:

addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network

gen=1
genproclimit=3
poolport=80
pool=http://pool2.biblepay.org
workerid=*
utxoamount=1

gonna repeat...  I put * to block the workerid obviously.

Is there something wrong with this config?  podc still gives me the "Unable to create PODC UTXO::Balance (3259.00) less than target UTXO (50001.00)." error

Someone else in this thread was having the same issue, please advise.



Code:
utxoamount=1

Possible this. It looks like it is trying to use 50001 as UTXO amount which is the default.

Try

Code:
utxoamount=3000
thesnat21
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March 15, 2018, 12:17:02 AM
 #5184

Code:
utxoamount=1

Possible this. It looks like it is trying to use 50001 as UTXO amount which is the default.

Try

Code:
utxoamount=3000
Had it at 3000 earlier.. tried again, same result.

im on 1.1.1.0,  it should be registering the command...

is there a way to force it via debug console?

Appreciate any ideas at this point..  lol thanks for the help guys
znffal
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March 15, 2018, 12:23:38 AM
 #5185

Code:
utxoamount=1

Possible this. It looks like it is trying to use 50001 as UTXO amount which is the default.

Try

Code:
utxoamount=3000
Had it at 3000 earlier.. tried again, same result.

im on 1.1.1.0,  it should be registering the command...

is there a way to force it via debug console?

Appreciate any ideas at this point..  lol thanks for the help guys


Try in debug:

exec podcupdate true

EDIT: Then check your transactions and see if there is one there. Then wait 6 blocks.
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March 15, 2018, 12:25:55 AM
 #5186

Try in debug:

exec podcupdate true

EDIT: Then check your transactions and see if there is one there. Then wait 6 blocks.

nada...

19:24:45

exec podcupdate true


19:24:50

{
  "Command": "podcupdate",
  "PODCUpdate": "Unable to create PODC UTXO::Balance (3259.00) less than target UTXO (50001.00)."
}

no transactions...  lol it dont like me!
znffal
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March 15, 2018, 12:31:31 AM
 #5187

Try in debug:

exec podcupdate true

EDIT: Then check your transactions and see if there is one there. Then wait 6 blocks.

nada...

19:24:45

exec podcupdate true


19:24:50

{
  "Command": "podcupdate",
  "PODCUpdate": "Unable to create PODC UTXO::Balance (3259.00) less than target UTXO (50001.00)."
}

no transactions...  lol it dont like me!

Very strange. Ok try changing your config to


Code:
addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network
gen=1
genproclimit=1
utxoamount=3000


then close wallet reopen, and do in debug
exec podcupdate true

Let's check it isn't just the pool mining settings.
thesnat21
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March 15, 2018, 12:36:08 AM
 #5188

Very strange. Ok try changing your config to


Code:
addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network
gen=1
genproclimit=1
utxoamount=3000


then close wallet reopen, and do in debug
exec podcupdate true

Let's check it isn't just the pool mining settings.
same..
znffal
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March 15, 2018, 12:43:41 AM
 #5189

Very strange. Ok try changing your config to


Code:
addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network
gen=1
genproclimit=1
utxoamount=3000


then close wallet reopen, and do in debug
exec podcupdate true

Let's check it isn't just the pool mining settings.
same..


Hmm ok.

I assume you are on the latest version of the wallet?
You have set the unlock for PoDC updates password when you started the wallet?

What does

exec stakeamount

(it may be exec stakebalance, I can't remember)
give you?
thesnat21
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March 15, 2018, 12:54:10 AM
 #5190

im on the lastest download 1.1.1.0, i saw comments on alpha for 1.1.1.1 but not sure where the download is

yes unlocked..

19:48:28

exec stakebalance


19:48:28

{
  "Command": "stakebalance",
  "StakeBalance": 3259
}
znffal
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March 15, 2018, 12:56:29 AM
 #5191

im on the lastest download 1.1.1.0, i saw comments on alpha for 1.1.1.1 but not sure where the download is

yes unlocked..

19:48:28

exec stakebalance


19:48:28

{
  "Command": "stakebalance",
  "StakeBalance": 3259
}


Ok dude, I'm lost.
Please try

Code:
exec getboincinfo

Post the results please. We may have to get Rob to take a look at this one.
znffal
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March 15, 2018, 01:08:59 AM
 #5192

Ok dude, I'm lost.
Please try

Code:
exec getboincinfo

Post the results please. We may have to get Rob to take a look at this one.

glad im not nuts ... lol somethings up... Appreciate you trying!

anyone got an extra 47k? ... lol that would solve it too.... ugh

19:58:10

{
  "Command": "getboincinfo",
  "CPID": "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a",
  "Address": "BJAv7c2Ys9KfzDtyTec5pxpmh97M9KTKBX",
  "CPIDS": "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a;",
  "CPID-Age (hours)": 422520,
  "NextSuperblockHeight": 34645,
  "NextSuperblockBudget": 2660579,
  "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a_ADDRESS": "BJAv7c2Ys9KfzDtyTec5pxpmh97M9KTKBX",
  "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a_RAC": 630.39,
  "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a_TEAM": 15044,
  "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a_TaskWeight": 0,
  "3c4dbf398e2a1062bd695366dad41f8a_UTXOWeight": 0,
  "Total_RAC": 630.39,
  "Total Payments (One Day)": 0,
  "Total Payments (One Week)": 0,
  "Total Budget (One Day)": 0,
  "Total Budget (One Week)": 13302895,
  "Superblock Count (One Week)": 5,
  "Superblock Hit Count (One Week)": 5,
  "Superblock List": "34440,34235,34030,33825,33620",
  "Last Superblock Height": 34440,
  "Last Superblock Budget": 2660579,
  "Last Superblock Payment": 0,
  "Magnitude (One-Day)": 0,
  "Magnitude (One-Week)": 0
}


Ok, long shot random suggestion,

Send 3100 BBP to your address FROM YOUR WALLET
BJAv7c2Ys9KfzDtyTec5pxpmh97M9KTKBX

i.e. send them to yourself, no new coins, same PoDC wallet.

Wait 6 blocks

then

exec podcupdate true

As I said, long shot...
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March 15, 2018, 01:11:23 AM
 #5193

Why am I such a big fan of Stake per RAC?  Because of our emission schedule:

http://wiki.biblepay.org/Emission_Schedule

Month-Year   Block Emission   Monthly Emission   Total Emission
12/25/2017   12,313           74,613,750            274,613,750
12/20/2018   10,270           62,237,714            1,087,306,771
12/15/2019   8,567           51,914,467            1,765,200,000
12/9/2020      7,146           43,303,517            2,330,652,413
12/4/2021      5,961           36,120,847            2,802,314,348  <-Half of BBP emitted by mid 2021!!!
...............
12/23/2046   59                    359,591                    5,150,636,889

Basically, half of our total emissions are in the first 4 years.  The next half of emissions takes 25 years!  
That is telling you that it is time to accumulate and be patient.  But to help traders and investors out through this high emission rate, staking per RAC would REALLY help.  As price appreciates and emission tapers we can scale back the amount needed per RAC.  

Vote here:

http://forum.biblepay.org/index.php?topic=127.0

EDIT:  Legacy ie., 50,001 per user to get 100 UTXO would be better than staking per MAG because that would also grow the aggregate stake amount with the user base while making everyone stake the same amount.  If they are fractional MAG they will always be fractional MAG and their stake amount will never go down like the bigger miners.

Do you wonder why there are no traders posting on Reddit, like "when moon?"  It's because traders and investors look at the emissions and feel like they are getting dumped on by miners.  It's why I worry that BTC will shoot up while we are still in our high emission phase.  And if you are looking for something to trade, what do you look for?  You can look for something that is getting positive money flow on a down day.  That is how I found BBP.  Or you can do what lots of other traders do, and look for something that gains in RELATIVE STRENGTH.  Relative Strength is how a particular coin performs relative to its peers.  As for biblepay, since I have been in it, our relative strength has done worse.  We were ranked in the top 500s of market cap, now we are in the 700s.  The fact that we are not outperforming other coins is a message that something needs to be done.  Jumping other coins in rank will draw in traders.  Traders like stuff that goes up especially since it's not easy to short cryptos.  

However, I believe BTC drops by 90% during the next US/global recession.  I think the US going into recession, when it happens, will take Asia along with it and likely Europe too.  Most of the holders of bitcoin are small investors and they will be looking to sell.  If bitcoin drops by 50-70% during a good economic time, how is it not going to drop by 90% during a recession?  It's another reason why I like growing the stake amount.  To get some good price appreciation before the next recession.

Here is why I think RAC based is a poor substitute for Mag based stake.

Consider where we are at right now, under the corrected coin emission schedule, the Superblock for PoDC should be roughly 1.4M BBP/day. Right now, to make 10% of that would require (in round terms) 200K RAC for a 100 Mag (based on a "current" Team RAC of about 2M).   So 50K/ Mag (which along with 10K are leading the Mag voting) would mean 5M BBP to make 140K BBP per day, and 20 BBP/RAC (the clear cut RAC leader) would mean 4M BBP for the same reward.  Now, flash forward to next year this time where we'll have (conservatively) 10M Team RAC.  The daily reward will have dropped to about 1.1M BBP/day (with a properly working 7 minute timing block).  So the same 200K user, will then have a Mag of 20 and need 100K to stake or the same amount (5M BBP) to stake under RAC to get 22K/day.

This means under RAC we're either overly generous to our current users or predatory to new ones in a year.  Especially if the price can grow...

Mag will always remain the same cost overall, which is poor because it locks up fewer coins, but the alternative is to me, unacceptable, which is current users like myself get into the PoDC system for a very small percentage of the overall reward.  The best system would be the most complex, and that would require staking equal to some multiple of the reward, like 100x or 150x. 

616Westwarmoth, I read and consider your arguments carefully.  You are heard by me.  If we flash forward

Quote
we'll have (conservatively) 10M Team RAC.  The daily reward will have dropped to about 1.1M BBP/day (with a properly working 7 minute timing block).  So the same 200K user, will then have a Mag of 20 and need 100K to stake or the same amount (5M BBP) to stake under RAC to get 22K/day.

This means under RAC we're either overly generous to our current users or predatory to new ones in a year.  Especially if the price can grow...


As we go on, a few things should go into consideration for the potential stakeholder:  Does it make more sense for me to mine/crunch, does it make more sense for me to obtain a masternode and acquire biblepay that way, or does it make more sense for me to buy and hold biblepay for appreciation?  In my opinion, your argument assumes the potential stakeholder is captive to mining/crunching.  I believe Stake per RAC opens up the most suitable reasoning for pursuing alternative ways to acquire biblepay.  (That is to say, it draws in traders and investors and not just miners.)  I think either method, Stake per RAC or Stake per MAG rewards the earlier entrants.  Stake per MAG lowers the staking requirement for legacy miners and crunchers.  We can always lower the Stake requirement for staking per RAC which I expect us to do with higher prices and lower rewards.  Again, having to lower stake requirements for staking per RAC because of higher prices and lower rewards is a good problem to have.  And I believe staking per RAC is the most direct way for us to get higher prices, not staking per MAG.  

It is my belief that if we went with stake per MAG, the future fractional users would actually not stake the entire amount to get a 100 utxo.  For a fractional MAG they would stake none or a smaller amount and wait to save up the amount for a 100 utxo.  

Rob is a visionary and we are ahead of the curve in considering incorporating staking with crunching/mining.  Other POW coins are starting to attract large GPU mining farms.  All pure POW coins are a "race to the bottom"  with mining participants scaling up until they reach their breakevens:

https://www.reddit.com/r/groestlcoin/comments/838c8y/so_someones_siphoning_3550_of_all_grs_blocks/?st=jersv3bj&sh=2eaad96d

Quote
So someone's siphoning 35-50% of all GRS blocks... self.groestlcoin

Submitted 5 days ago * by crypto_franiac

While doing some research on what pool might be the best to mine GRS, I came accross these extraction stats:

https://chainz.cryptoid.info/grs/#!extraction
According to it, Suprnova and MPH each find less than 5% of the blocks on a 1000-blocks average. And the other pools are waaaay behind.

So who is this mysterious Fdi7YYeN7nmnjJPqQDGy8vudgQ26FVjNrk address suckering 1/3 and sometimes even 1/2 of all the GRS blocks?

A pool not listed here? A solo-miner with a big, a very big mining farm? NiceHash hashing power?

Edit1: Right now there's a top 3 extraction addresses that don't seem to be pool ones, accounting for 51.9% of the last 1000 blocks, and 71% for the last 100. Logically it means that these guyz (?) have roughly 70 GH/s hash power together.

Quote
Jackie is aware. It is in fact a private pool (GPU farm). They asked Jackie personally whether it was OK to use his pool to mine GRS (not that he needs permission!). Since all other hash rate is so low he is getting alot of the blocks.

Now that person only earning 2.75 GRS per block is strange, maybe /u/jackielove4u can explain?


[–]jackielove4uDevelopment Team 3 points 4 days ago

The pool listed on chainz are the ones that were tagged by me from 2014 till 2016. I stopped tagging them since 2017. The pool is not listed there, it is a huge mining farm. (thousands of gpu's).

The thing that cures the race to the bottom in instances like this is requiring every hardware addition to the farm or network to also require an addition to staking an amount of cryptocurrency.  Stake per RAC does this. Cryptocurrency becomes worth something.  It is what you need to hold or obtain in order to obtain more for rewards for your hashing/crunching.    The way to manage stake per RAC is to decrease the stake requirement as rewards decrease, and as price increase by a substantial amount.  I think it is reasonable to assume around a 15-20 sat increase for every 200M and keeping at or over 50-60% of available supply locked up.  Hopefully we quickly get to 90% of total supply locked up.  The best example we can see of a 55% lockup working is with masternodes.  We have 169 masternodes which locks up 261,950,169 bbp out of a supply of 467,454,405 bbp which is roughly 55% of supply locked up.  Our price has been higher with more masternodes.  I think if we get to 90% locked up the price is higher by a good bit and we can therefore support more orphans.  We'll move up in marketcap ranking and get the attention of traders and investors.  I think it is a big win for everyone.  
  
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March 15, 2018, 01:41:17 AM
 #5194

Ok I have downloaded the newest BBP wallet yesterday and it still has green bar at bottom of wallet saying syncing with network for past 24 hours, should have loaded by now. I have also tried closing and restarting the wallet but still same issue as above. Anyone know how to fix the issue?
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March 15, 2018, 01:44:03 AM
 #5195

Ok I have downloaded the newest BBP wallet yesterday and it still has green bar at bottom of wallet saying syncing with network for past 24 hours, should have loaded by now. I have also tried closing and restarting the wallet but still same issue as above. Anyone know how to fix the issue?
edit the config change the master nodes

addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network

if that still doesnt work delete the chain data
tmike
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March 15, 2018, 02:07:30 AM
 #5196

Ok I have downloaded the newest BBP wallet yesterday and it still has green bar at bottom of wallet saying syncing with network for past 24 hours, should have loaded by now. I have also tried closing and restarting the wallet but still same issue as above. Anyone know how to fix the issue?
edit the config change the master nodes

addnode=node.biblepay.org
addnode=biblepay.inspect.network

if that still doesnt work delete the chain data


Did you try gen=0 yet to see if it will actually stop mining?

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March 15, 2018, 02:08:29 AM
 #5197

Ok I have downloaded the newest BBP wallet yesterday and it still has green bar at bottom of wallet saying syncing with network for past 24 hours, should have loaded by now. I have also tried closing and restarting the wallet but still same issue as above. Anyone know how to fix the issue?

Is the computer clock time correct? It has to be pretty exact for it to sync. If that doesn't work repair or delete the chain and try again.

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March 15, 2018, 02:10:20 AM
 #5198

yeah but, everybody who was reading c-cex thred knows, that there is strong xvg holders group against c-cex. and they plan to do steps agains c-cex. so if i were aware of going maintenance early, i could  withdraw everything... when we turned to maintenance mode i still had 2 options, sell all bbp for low price and withdraw something else or wait... i was waiting because i just have enough for masternode... so now i must hope that ccex will goes up just to withdraw coins or so... but as we are still in maintenance i realy dont know ...
nevermind, going to mine harder than before Cheesy

I just read the rest of that train wreck thread on XVG-

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=418700.3720

Or at least pages 160-187 (where I left off last) and I must say its painful to read it.

Im sorry we have BBP caught up in the middle of this.  Lets pray our users can get it all out and they come back out of maintenance.

I hate to say it, but Im also having thoughts that we really need to jump on a couple new high quality exchanges as we need more reliability and integrity.



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March 15, 2018, 02:12:37 AM
 #5199

yeah but, everybody who was reading c-cex thred knows, that there is strong xvg holders group against c-cex. and they plan to do steps agains c-cex. so if i were aware of going maintenance early, i could  withdraw everything... when we turned to maintenance mode i still had 2 options, sell all bbp for low price and withdraw something else or wait... i was waiting because i just have enough for masternode... so now i must hope that ccex will goes up just to withdraw coins or so... but as we are still in maintenance i realy dont know ...
nevermind, going to mine harder than before Cheesy
If it makes you feel any better I have 1 Sancs worth sitting in there with yours.

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March 15, 2018, 02:22:51 AM
 #5200


Did that bout 8 hrs ago ...

I have 2 recv addresses, and all the coins were in the "other' address from the pool.




Hi Thesnat, I believe you had the problem earlier where exec podcupdate said 50000 less than stake target yet your utxoamount=3000 in the config.

I think the problem is your biblepaycore wallet is not reading the config file from :
%appdata%\biblepaycore
(I assume this is windows).
Best advice I have is to open explorer, go to that dir, delete debug.log, restart the wallet, and verify If its actually writing to *that* debug log.
If its not you probably have a permission issue.
If you will download the 1.1.1.1 again, save it to the drive, right click on it, Unblock it, Run it as administrator, re-install it, then re-run the wallet and ensure the debug.log is written to the proper place. (Windows is probably writing it virtually to a hidden dir).

Then add 'genproclimit=5' to your config file, run the wallet, type getmininginfo, and see if it says genproclimit=5?  If it does then set the utxoamount=3000 and try again.

In a nutshell: Your wallet is not reading the biblepay.conf file
 (I believe).


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