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[ICantThinkOfaName]

So we're going to get all the backed up divs this Saturday, right?  Since the 14 days doesn't start until Monday?  Right?  RIGHT??? 

[grnbrg]

So we're going to get all the backed up divs this Saturday, right?  Since the 14 days doesn't start until Monday?  Right?  RIGHT???  

:facepalm:  Don't people bother to even try to look for answers before asking questions?

From 4 posts back:

(Hardware) will start rolling in next week and what it accumulates between time of arrival and 14 days after it is all received will 100% go into additional hardware.  

100%^* of the Bitcoin earned by the new hardware, between the date it arrived and was plugged in, and December 9th will go to purchase of new hardware.  The next 3 dividend payments will be taken from the original ~5TH/s that has been running since early October.  The new hardware is an additional 15-20TH/s.

^* Based on the proposition posted at LabRatMining.com, it may be 100%, less a few percent for electrical costs and rent.



grnbrg.

[countduckula]

So, no new hardware arrived yet? even with our capital of close to 1 million back then, close to 5 right now?

We're still stuck in 5 TH? What is LRM doing?

[countduckula]

Sorry to repost and add:

From the labratmining.com, considering the 55000 bonds sold and prices at $90 per bitcoin:

24.1 @50,000 bonds sold
29.5 @60,000 bonds sold

We're still at 5 and we're devoting 15-20 TH to buy new hardware.. where's the 24TH missing based on the IPO, wich with the current 600 value should be way more than 50th... I'm seriously loosing confidence on this, así of a LOT of my invested money in form of BTC.

And as i see.. the person in charge doesnt have 5 minutes to explain the current situation anywhere?.

Also, there's no proposal posted in labratmining.com to pay for cost and rent right now.

[Bargraphics]

Sorry to repost and add:

From the labratmining.com, considering the 55000 bonds sold and prices at $90 per bitcoin:

24.1 @50,000 bonds sold
29.5 @60,000 bonds sold

We're still at 5 and we're devoting 15-20 TH to buy new hardware.. where's the 24TH missing based on the IPO, wich with the current 600 value should be way more than 50th... I'm seriously loosing confidence on this, así of a LOT of my invested money in form of BTC.

And as i see.. the person in charge doesnt have 5 minutes to explain the current situation anywhere?.

Also, there's no proposal posted in labratmining.com to pay for cost and rent right now.

Relax, I'm sure news is coming soon.

[countduckula]

Hard to be cold with this lvl of information and this deviation from the original plan without any data given.

I really have trouble to see the big picture right now if we're still sitting at 5th.

[Ashitank]

I think we all can agree one thing that Lab_rat should look into other hardware vendors who are able to provide hardware ready to ship , just relying on bitfury even if we are able to make good deal doesn't count if difficulty has gone up equally as well by the time all the gear gets delivered to us.

[ipxtreme]

Hard to be cold with this lvl of information and this deviation from the original plan without any data given.

I really have trouble to see the big picture right now if we're still sitting at 5th.

+1

[Bargraphics]

The next 3 dividend payments will be taken from the original ~5TH/s that has been running since early October.  The new hardware is an additional 15-20TH/s.

We just had confirmation that the 14 days is starting and the official LRM shill just told us how much is mining roughly.

This is great news as BTC price has taken a large jump meaning that after this 14 days if prices stay the same for mining manufacturers as advertised we will be getting more than triple what we were expecting considering it was ~$200/BTC I believe when this plan was made.

For those that are impatient and don't want to wait then yes this is a bummer and you won't be able to sell your shares for a while at a decent price.
For those that bought LRM to hold for a year or so, this is very good news and only ensures us that we will likely get 100% return + still have our shares to sell in the future.

I for one am excited.

[countduckula]

Glad that you're. I'm concerned as many of others, at this rate, will take long time until we get what we put on.

[maqifrnswa]

The next 3 dividend payments will be taken from the original ~5TH/s that has been running since early October.  The new hardware is an additional 15-20TH/s.

We just had confirmation that the 14 days is starting and the official LRM shill just told us how much is mining roughly.

This is great news as BTC price has taken a large jump meaning that after this 14 days if prices stay the same for mining manufacturers as advertised we will be getting more than triple what we were expecting considering it was ~$200/BTC I believe when this plan was made.

For those that are impatient and don't want to wait then yes this is a bummer and you won't be able to sell your shares for a while at a decent price.
For those that bought LRM to hold for a year or so, this is very good news and only ensures us that we will likely get 100% return + still have our shares to sell in the future.

I for one am excited.

So what that we have 15-20 TH/s more, how much did it cost (in BTC/Gh/s)? What other hardware can we get with remaining funds?

Why does this ensure that we will likely get a 100% return? What is the investment plan that ensures this? What are the price points and difficulty projections? Will revenue exceed expenses? What is lab rat's fee and how will that affect long term profitability? He needs to get paid, is he being paid enough to keep the program running? Does he have investment/options/buy-in that is affected as well? Of the $1m we gave him, what did he do with his person $200k? What was the plan for the other $800k of hardware we bought for him? Can LR hire someone (or outsource) management of the business so he can concentrate on hardware?

These are questions investors (and lenders) ask. I don't share your enthusiasm because nothing has been presented to make us excited. I can be excited if those questions are answered.

But it doesn't matter, we're pretty much all strapped in for the ride due to the difficulty in exchanging shares and LRM doesn't have to (and won't) answer any basic questions on the fundamentals of their business.



EDIT: Another, possibly huge problem coming up in April, depending on how he set things up... He raised $1m from investors, but in exchange for no equity. On his annual IRS reporting, that just counts as income - not as raised capital since there is zero equity outlay. LR, as sole owner of his LLC, is personally responsible for taxes on that income at his personal tax rate. He will be forced to take a distribution just to cover that taxes. In the US, that's somewhere between ~15-35%, even if it is retained earnings. If he structured it as a loan, that could work - but we didn't sign a promissory note.

What's the plan for this? Have you talked to a tax accountant? Is there plans to buy lots of hardware fast to reduce tax liability?

[Bargraphics]

Currently you only pay taxes if you cash BTC in for USD, since I suppose he bought all of his gear with BTC and since you deduct all expenses (What he had to Cash BTC into USD for) Taxes would be negligible.

This is just one way of doing it.

Maybe he will claim a value for the BTC equipment. If the value is the same that he raised again this would be an expense. However he might have to amortize this.

Why does this ensure that we will likely get a 100% return?

Because LabRat is still working for shareholders to get hashrate quicker than difficulty can increase. If you noticed I said likely, as in much more likely than if he didn't.

What is the investment plan that ensures this?

This has been stated many times about the "current plan", going forward part of the 25% will be used. If you want more details than that I will kindly point to your own words here

LRM doesn't have to (and won't) answer any basic questions on the fundamentals of their business.

What are the price points and difficulty projections?

This is something for shareholders to speculate over. Lab Rat likely isn't going to try and release speculation as he has not done so in the past.

Will revenue exceed expenses?

If it doesn't then he will shut this project down as stated in his prospectus, the one you bought into.
But yes, revenue will exceed expenses for a long time considering the price jump of BTC. It was exceeding expenses prior when it was only $130/BTC

What is lab rat's fee and how will that affect long term profitability?

It's part of the 25% you agreed to.

LRM doesn't have to (and won't) answer any basic questions on the fundamentals of their business.

He needs to get paid, is he being paid enough to keep the program running?

Again, he stated that if it becomes unprofitable he will close shop, again something that was agreed when you purchased the shares. Thankfully this doesn't appear to be happening in the near or distant future with the information we've already been provided by grnbrg.

Does he have investment/options/buy-in that is affected as well?

No, or at least I highly doubt it. This is a mining bond of sorts, it pays based on hashrate not his investments and I highly doubt he used any funds outside this intended purpose.

Of the $1m we gave him, what did he do with his person $200k? What was the plan for the other $800k of hardware we bought for him? Can LR hire someone (or outsource) management of the business so he can concentrate on hardware?

Not sure if I understand this question, he's obviously running 15-20TH worth of gear currently, has stated he has quite a bit of Monarch on order. Do you think he didn't spend this money on gear?

[countduckula]

Amazing how to turn a perfectly legible msg to a mess of reply. Are we in kinder again that we need to explain each sentence?

Info, i just request information, where are we standing, what's hashrate, what hardware its coming, what's ordered, financial info, soon.

[maqifrnswa]

Currently you only pay taxes if you cash BTC in for USD, since I suppose he bought all of his gear with BTC and since you deduct all expenses (What he had to Cash BTC into USD for) Taxes would be negligible.

Clever, that would work. It's a grey area, but not one that anyone at the IRS would be aware of or want to touch.

Overall, we have different comfort levels of data required for investment. This is one of the least transparent (if not most opaque) BTC investments available. It is what it is, we invested before LR had any track record of success, so it is on us. I just am hope he receives an education through his own experience and learns where he can improve (and then implements improvements). Those questions, in my opinion, need to be explicitly answered - not just hand-waving "trust me."


My biggest problem is not simply getting hashrate quicker than difficulty increases. That short sighted goal is financial and business suicide and will drive share price to 0 (literally, 0) with dividends that do not exceed investment. You need to make sure you get hashrate at BTC/GH/s that exceeds the expected valuation (in BTC) of the hardware when accounting for difficulty increase. Those are two very different things. LR has never made any statements or comments indicating he knows the difference, nor indicated he has plans for implementing it. Even if you do implement it, one of two things can happen: 1) share price shrinks to 0 if you reinvestment rate doesn't exceed difficulty, but dividends will exceed investment or 2) share price rises if reinvestment rate exceeds difficulty, but dividends will be smaller than case 1. I think LR wants to be in case "2" What is his plan to stay in case '2'? Are we there?

But you're right, it is our fault for putting too much trust in him at the start without these answers.

[Bargraphics]

Amazing how to turn a perfectly legible msg to a mess of reply. Are we in kinder again that we need to explain each sentence?

Info, i just request information, where are we standing, what's hashrate, what hardware its coming, what's ordered, financial info, soon.

Not sure if you refuse to read or are just trolling

Where we are standing: 5TH being paid out - 15-20TH extra up and hashing currently going towards reinvestment until Dec. 9th based on how I read grnbrg's last report.

The only hardware that we know is coming would be the Monarchs at this point in time.

I apologize if this isn't the answer you want, but it is the answer to at least two of your questions.

[countduckula]

In fact, i think LRM was MUCH MORE communicative back then when he started, right now he doesnt even have time to post the dividends break down.

[countduckula]

Thanks, i can read pretty well.

I still don't know if those 15-20 were paid or plan to be paid with the 14 days produce or how or when or anything. The fact its simple, i'm not seeking your replies, i want Labrat to address this, yours and mines are just guesses, i appreciate you taking the time to answer what the person in charge should have kept clear to start with.

[Bargraphics]

Thanks, i can read pretty well.

I still don't know if those 15-20 were paid or plan to be paid with the 14 days produce or how or when or anything. The fact its simple, i'm not seeking your replies, i want Labrat to address this, yours and mines are just guesses, i appreciate you taking the time to answer what the person in charge should have kept clear to start with.

You think he got mining gear on consignment? LOL

Sorry but all the gear that is currently hashing is already paid for. Still kind of boggled that you suggested that he might be mining without paying for the gear.

[countduckula]

I suggest that i dont know what is he doing at all in any lvl, i dont know what he has, what's coming, what's he producing, what's he getting, what's being paid, what we should expect and i know what we put in and what we got out.

He offered a 360mh/bond with $90 BTC, we're at $600 btc with 80mh/bond, do your math.

[Bargraphics]

I suggest that i dont know what is he doing at all in any lvl, i dont know what he has, what's coming, what's he producing, what's he getting, what's being paid, what we should expect and i know what we put in and what we got out.

He offered a 360mh/bond with $90 BTC, we're at $600 btc with 80mh/bond, do your math.

Actually starting Dec 9. Our bonds will be worth at least 20,000,000MH/55561 (Bonds) = 359.96MH/Bond