[IPVO] [Multiple Exchanges] Neo & Bee - LMB Holdings

[spinoff]

Please answer with a simple yes or no.

I'll answer you: read the prospectus. More carefully if you have allready. You could even read the first 10 or so pages of the thread and save us all reading over and over the same questions that cryptocyprus has allready answered

[1714608567]

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[1714608567]

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[ffssixtynine]

All kinds of bitcoin companies and investments would be in trouble if someone decided to waste 100s of millions trying to send the price right down. In practice that would be very difficult to do for long. Critique by all means, but be sensible about it. Yes it may happen but that is an extreme case. If one believes it too likely, one would not invest in bitcoin at all.

Asking about a basic hedging strategy is fine but there has already been a reasonable amount of discussion. The reality is that NEOBEE does rely primarily on a stable or rising exchange rate in the short and medium term. If bitcoin falls much in the medium term then NEOBEE will fail, but then it also likely means bitcoin has failed. It's also like asking what happens if lots of people decide to empty their bank accounts - a bank run will take any bank out. NEOBEE are no different. If the price falls too much for too long before they have got sufficient resources put away and then they can't fulfill the obligations, they will have a problem.

Your other question is a pure practical one which one can answer by properly reading the materials and posts.

This is beginning to read like an exercise in trolling. In the securities section. Again. For a change.

[ex-trader]

Please answer with a simple yes or no.

I'll answer you: read the prospectus. More carefully if you have allready. You could even read the first 10 or so pages of the thread and save us all reading over and over the same questions that cryptocyprus has allready answered

I've read the prospectus, I know the answer, I just want an official real answer to a simple question, so I can make my point clear.

Either they can prove me wrong or right, I just want the truth and to get that I want them to answer the question. If they will not engage in a simple debate to attempt to prove me wrong with simple facts, then that alone speaks volumes to me.

[N_S]

If they will not engage in a simple debate to attempt to prove me wrong with simple facts, then that alone speaks volumes to me.

So let's assume they don't respond to your question. Are you going to keep asking them to answer it?

[jbest8283]

You seem like children who shouldn't even have money.

Holy fuck...I quit here.
If you don't believe in it I assume you don't have shares. If you don't have shares, get out. If you don't believe in it but have shares, refer to my first comment.

Cryptocyprus, please just find a new update medium with more intelligent creatures.

[klee]

Since Neo still refuse to answer my simple questions with simple answers let me ask it again in a very simple way.

One Bitcoin is currently worth 150euros. If I could open an account tommorow with my 150 euros, will I own one Bitcoin and be given the address/code for that Bitcoin that will allow me to transfer it to a place of my choice if required.

Please answer with a simple yes or no.

If the rate drops to $1 (Highly unlikely), we will buy every single Bitcoin available and use it all in Cyprus for our customers.

You are a good trader but you can't read? LOL

[well.attenuated]

Please answer with a simple yes or no.

I'll answer you: read the prospectus. More carefully if you have allready. You could even read the first 10 or so pages of the thread and save us all reading over and over the same questions that cryptocyprus has allready answered

I've read the prospectus, I know the answer, I just want an official real answer to a simple question, so I can make my point clear.

Either they can prove me wrong or right, I just want the truth and to get that I want them to answer the question. If they will not engage in a simple debate to attempt to prove me wrong with simple facts, then that alone speaks volumes to me.

Of course you cannot take possession of the bitcoin you numskull, at least not while your account is valued at your EUR deposit amount. otherwise you as the depositor would have access to 100% of the short term upside potential (withdraw the bitcoin) with none of the short term downside risk (leave the deposit in).  
If you want to abandon your EUR pegged position than buy a bitcoin and be done with it.

[jedunnigan]

You guys are so quick to jump down ex-trader's throat. Slow down.

Yes this question has been posed many, many times, but the point still remains: the business model cryptocyprus is trying to pull off is HARD, and trading your way through heavy dips in price will be a site to see.

Even if they have what they think is a successful trading model (which they won't share because it's their secret sauce), there is still the possibility they will not be able to handle what they thought they could. Point being, pegged accounts are not a sure bet, no matter how good of a trader you are. This is a scary proposition, so no amount of spreadsheets with possible scenarios should quell the prudent investor.

[spinoff]

I've read the prospectus, I know the answer, I just want an official real answer to a simple question

yeah, you know the answer because they said it in the prospectus, ain't that official enough?

You seem like children who shouldn't even have money.

Holy fuck...I quit here.
If you don't believe in it I assume you don't have shares. If you don't have shares, get out. If you don't believe in it but have shares, refer to my first comment.

Cryptocyprus, please just find a new update medium with more intelligent creatures.

I concurr, cryptocyprus don't waste your time answering what you've been real clear about allready. As a shareholder I'm happier if you ignore the trolls

[Herp]

You guys are so quick to jump down ex-trader's throat. Slow down.

Yes this question has been posed many, many times, but the point still remains: the business model cryptocyprus is trying to pull off is HARD, and trading your way through heavy dips in price will be a site to see.

Even if they have what they think is a successful trading model (which they won't share because it's their secret sauce), there is still the possibility they will not be able to handle what they thought they could. Point being, pegged accounts are not a sure bet, no matter how good of a trader you are. This is a scary proposition, so no amount of spreadsheets with possible scenarios should quell the prudent investor.

People have to understand this business is a bet on 2 things:

A - Bitcoin's growth

and

B - A bet on the future of banking

You get exposure to both these 2, shooting two birds with one stone.

Ofc if A fails B will fail also, unless Neo uses some ace day traders that could make money in both bull and bear market playing the charts and using huge chunks of money to get the upper hand.

[kingcrimson]

Where in the prospectus does it say NEOBEE will withhold the information about the business model?  The customer has a choice in having a BTC or EUR denominated account.  The customer is going to be offered a fixed interest rate on EUR denominated account so they will benefit from a BTC/EUR increase.

Go back and read the prospectus(hint:this is where the shareholders are informed of the business model).

Show me exactly in the prospectus where it says that retail customers will be told explicitly that their money will be invested in BTC, but that the majority of the upside is kept by Neo, but in the event of BTC falling that Neo will be unable to pay them back.

Customers are not stupid and they'll work this out over time as Neo keep 'adjusting' how many Bitcoins they own via a nonsensical 'peg'......

That isnt the industry standard. Do you think banks sit down and tell customers they gamble their funds on bad mortgages? I think your standards are unrealistic. No bank in the world operates how you expect neobee to.

[N_S]

I think your standards are unrealistic.

Bingo. This is the right answer.

[minerpart]

All kinds of bitcoin companies and investments would be in trouble if someone decided to waste 100s of millions trying to send the price right down. In practice that would be very difficult to do for long. Critique by all means, but be sensible about it. Yes it may happen but that is an extreme case. If one believes it too likely, one would not invest in bitcoin at all.

Asking about a basic hedging strategy is fine but there has already been a reasonable amount of discussion. The reality is that NEOBEE does rely primarily on a stable or rising exchange rate in the short and medium term. If bitcoin falls much in the medium term then NEOBEE will fail, but then it also likely means bitcoin has failed. It's also like asking what happens if lots of people decide to empty their bank accounts - a bank run will take any bank out. NEOBEE are no different. If the price falls too much for too long before they have got sufficient resources put away and then they can't fulfill the obligations, they will have a problem.

Your other question is a pure practical one awhich one can answer by properly reading the materials and posts.

This is beginning to read like an exercise in trolling. In the securities section. Again. For a change.

Good response but you are not seeing the big picture which is that neobee is not any other btc stock, and, global finance is a players game. If neo took a significant portion of peoples savings in Cyprus then it will be a globally significant event. Neo would be destroyed over a period of months through market manipulation of the price of btc while the banking system created its own neobee type infrastructure and made plans to adopt btc into the mainstream.

It might well cost a few hundreds of millions but have you seen how much a global bank turns over never mind the funds available to the Fed. All that money could be made back with a pump on btc.

There may be room for new btc based banks to evolve into the fixed, monopolized market that is global finance but only if they are immune or safeguarded from attack from the old guard. Neobee is not safe because a temporary dive in btc can kill it. It has no firewall.  For the big boys a temporary dip would be child's play. So if neo is a success it will be crushed into dust. They are playing in the big boys sandpit. And these boys are amongst the dirtiest, most ruthless and immoral operators on the planet.

[ThickAsThieves]

https://www.havelockinvestments.com/20131101-announcement.php

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE

November 1, 2013 - Havelock Investments (HavelockInvestments.com), a leading Bitcoin Denominated Investment Fund, announced today that it has executed a definitive agreement to be acquired by The Panama Fund, S.A, a fully licensed and registered Panamanian Investment Company.

The acquisitions creates the world's first, fully licensed, Bitcoin Denominated Fund Exchange, where companies from around the world will be able to raise capital directly, through the exclusive use of Bitcoins.

With this acquisition HavelockInvestments.com will be able to maintain its current Funds, as well as expand its operations, while attracting new opportunities in the rapidly expanding Bitcoin Marketplace.

The original HavelockInvestments.com team will remain in place and will play a key role in the future growth of the company.

[ffssixtynine]

Minerpart, that doesn't actually make business sense.

In this case it'd be cheaper and more sensible to just buy the company or compete. I fully expect both to happen if bitcoin becomes a disruptive influence. Pure business decision. NEOBEE will know this full well as do the professional investors in it. NEOBEE aren't doing anything that others can't do but if they make it work they will profit, one way or another.

If NEOBEE fails it won't be because of some banking conspiracy of that kind. Much more likely, if this is how you think, that they would make it politically difficult to expand internationally or pressure merchants not to accept bee (which would have major ramifications at the EU Commission but could happen). In both cases it would be a delaying tactic for 1-2 years whilst they sort their shit out. That is possible but it depends upon a lot of other factors.

Neobee's model has significant risks but quantifying investment risks is something that amateur bitcoin investors seem to be rather poor at. Banks ganging up to fuck over the bitcoin exchange rate is possible but very unlikely, and is a problem for bitcoin rather than NEOBEE (ie forget about bitcoin if you think they will do this).

NEOBEE's risks are considerable, not least getting sufficient customers, merchants, technical implementation, and being able to operate as planned (due to regulation). Banks or institutions tanking bitcoin? Barely makes the list.

[minerpart]

All valid points but tanking price is what these people do every day, many of them are career market manipulators with billions in funds behind them. If they wanted to buy neo they would turn it to dust first, then buy it out for 5% its previous value.

For share holders it may then succeed but odds wise I would put this in the hundred to one stakes overall. Yes largely because of the mass adoption issue which is their first and biggest struggle. If it gets there the next hurdle is financial attack from every corner of the western world. You'd need Steven Seagal for even half a chance and I don't think even he would fancy the risk.

[jedunnigan]

You guys are so quick to jump down ex-trader's throat. Slow down.

Yes this question has been posed many, many times, but the point still remains: the business model cryptocyprus is trying to pull off is HARD, and trading your way through heavy dips in price will be a site to see.

Even if they have what they think is a successful trading model (which they won't share because it's their secret sauce), there is still the possibility they will not be able to handle what they thought they could. Point being, pegged accounts are not a sure bet, no matter how good of a trader you are. This is a scary proposition, so no amount of spreadsheets with possible scenarios should quell the prudent investor.

People have to understand this business is a bet on 2 things:

A - Bitcoin's growth

and

B - A bet on the future of banking

You get exposure to both these 2, shooting two birds with one stone.

Ofc if A fails B will fail also, unless Neo uses some ace day traders that could make money in both bull and bear market playing the charts and using huge chunks of money to get the upper hand.

Right but Bitcoin can still survive extreme lows. Whether or not NEO can is another question entirely....

[N_S]

If it gets there the next hurdle is financial attack from every corner of the western world.

How does this theory explain why Germany, economic powerhouse of Europe, has taken such a benign stance on bitcoin?

[cryptocyprus]

Neo & Bee Update November 1st 2013

Investor Relations Website

We are currently developing our investor relations website, this will become a portal for all news releases, it will also offer a wide range of content surrounding Neo, Bee and all future subsidiaries. Monthly company performance data will also be released through this website. We will offer direct share management through this website allowing investors to hold shares directly with ourselves.

Direct Share Purchase

We will also implement a direct share purchase option allowing investors to buy and hold shares with ourselves, shares will only be available at the IPVO price of 0.003 BTC/Share. We will allow the transfer of these shares into any trading platform that supports Neo & Bee.

We will provide more information regarding transfers immediately before we launch the website (1 – 2 Weeks).

Appointment Of CFO – George Ioannou

George is joining the team as the CFO. George is a member of the following;

Fellow Member of the Association of Chartered Certified Accountants (UK)
Member of the Institute of Public Accountants in Cyprus (CYP)
Member of the International Institute of Internal Auditors (USA)
Member of the Institute of Internal Auditors in Cyprus.
Member of the Public Risk Management Association (PRIMA) – European Body

With a strong background in a CFO Role at both Fiduciana Trust Cyprus and Otenet Telecom Ltd, previous experience includes roles for Alpha Bank in the Credit Risk and Internal Audit Divisions. George brings a vast amount of experience to the team and will be working closely with every aspect of the business.

Direct Bitcoin Purchases (EU)

We are launching a website that will utilize a cash payment network around Europe to allow members of the public to purchase Bitcoin almost instantly using cash directly from ourselves, this will mainly be targeted at the under served UK Bitcoin Economy. This website shall be launched and fully functional prior to January 31st 2014, I will provide more updates as developments are made including the name of the cash payment network operator once we are in a position to do so.

Kenyan Entity

We have been forced to register a subsidiary in Kenya (Under Application) for the corporate account to be opened with MPesa. We have also established a direct link with the founder of MPesa that can be utilized should the need arise.

Updated Prospectus

An updated prospectus is still being prepared, a high workload on the ground here is delaying this progress, the work being done on the ground is being given priority over the updates to the document. It won't be long before it is released and I will update on the timeframe when it is clearer to myself when it is possible to get it released.

Neo & Bee Presents The Cyprus Investors Show 2014 (December 2013)

We are the main sponsors of the event, we will gain a large amount of publicity through being the main sponsors of the event, the target demographic for the event are High Net Worth Individuals, Private Investors, Investment and Asset Management Firms , Private Banks and other financial institutions, Financial Services organizations , Investment Advisors, Investment Bankers, Wealth / Asset management firms and professionals, Financial Planners, Portfolio Managers, Pension Funds, Insurance Companies , Lawyers - Legal advisors, Accounting professionals, Tax planners, Family offices .
   The event has been operating for a number of years and is one of the largest conferences held on the island, once the final branded invitations are completed, I shall provide them for everyone to see.

Cover of In Business Magazine (February 2014)

I have been approached to be on the cover of In Business magazine for their February issue (I agreed), there is already a buzz around the business world here in Cyprus about the company that is bringing Bitcoin to Cyprus for everyone. The magazine is the largest business publication in Cyprus, the feature will include a multiple page spread on Neo & Bee.

[pedrog]

If it gets there the next hurdle is financial attack from every corner of the western world.

How does this theory explain why Germany, economic powerhouse of Europe, has taken such a benign stance on bitcoin?

And the ECB report on crypto currencies was quite positive...