Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s

[terrapinflyer]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months   Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st   

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

[gmaxwell]

FUN FACT: Literally EVERYONE who preordered an asic from ANY manufacturer that delivered made a profit in USD if they mined for a week or two then resold the hardware.

The only people who think they are getting scammed are the nerds who think that btc mining must result in a positive ROI in btc and think that the hardware manufacturer can be held accountable for that.

This is going a bit off-topic... but it really shouldn't be left unchallenged.

I think you're taking an exceptionally stupid position here.  You have a stack of USD, you could do at least three things:
(0) Sit on your USD and do nothing.
(1) Buy Bitcoin.
(2) But a Bitcoin miner.

If (2) yields less bitcoin than you would have gotten with (1) you are worse off in every way. The miner takes up space, consumes power, has shipping and delivery risks, and is just as worthless as the Bitcoin if Bitcoin loses value, but is far less liquid. You take all the risks of owning Bitcoin, multiplied by illiquidity, plus some hardware specific risks.

There is no scenario in which (2) is better than (1) if (2) yields less Bitcoin, not if bitcoin goes up in value, not if it goes down, not if bitcoin becomes worthless, not on a boat, not with a goat.

Unless you want to consider incompetent people with no self control who can't manage to buy and hold things on their own— in which case I'll gladly offer second signer service for multisig at far less of a loss than ripoff prices from asic hardware vendors and a lot fewer risks.

[jimmothy]

I think you'll find that there are plenty of people who are disappointed with the conduct of BA, that's what this thread has been discussing for the last ten pages or more, so read back if you're unclear what different people have stated, I'm not going to generalise their reactions like you did in an attempt to prove my point. Suffice to say there's more than a handful of voices expressing discontent.

You asked, "Why are you so mad?" which is really quite ironic as you jumped on my earlier comment where I stated that 'there was no trolling, only a necessary holding to account' and then told me to fuck off. So am I mad? No, not really, so I just told you to fuck off back. Fair's fair, isn't it?

You're right there was some disappointment but only from maybe 5 people who actually purchased a preorder. If you cant look at PGs 5 pages worth of posts in this thread and don't see trolling I don't know if you can be helped. He did the same shit in the hashfast thread and they are now shipping hardware with decent specs.

We have been told by bobsag3 (very reputable seller) that they are going to be talking with BA to clarify about the delays and refunds even though they are not obligated to give refunds according to their agreement terms so no need to panic.

[jimmothy]

FUN FACT: Literally EVERYONE who preordered an asic from ANY manufacturer that delivered made a profit in USD if they mined for a week or two then resold the hardware.

The only people who think they are getting scammed are the nerds who think that btc mining must result in a positive ROI in btc and think that the hardware manufacturer can be held accountable for that.

This is going a bit off-topic... but it really shouldn't be left unchallenged.

I think you're taking an exceptionally stupid position here.  You have a stack of USD, you could do at least three things:
(0) Sit on your USD and do nothing.
(1) Buy Bitcoin.
(2) But a Bitcoin miner.

If (2) yields less bitcoin than you would have gotten with (1) you are worse off in every way. The miner takes up space, consumes power, has shipping and delivery risks, and is just as worthless as the Bitcoin if Bitcoin loses value, but is far less liquid. You take all the risks of owning Bitcoin, multiplied by illiquidity, plus some hardware specific risks.

There is no scenario in which (2) is better than (1) if (2) yields less Bitcoin, not if bitcoin goes up in value, not if it goes down, not if bitcoin becomes worthless, not on a boat, not with a goat.

Unless you want to consider incompetent people with no self control who can't manage to buy and hold things on their own— in which case I'll gladly offer second signer service for multisig at far less of a loss than ripoff prices from asic hardware vendors and a lot fewer risks.

I can actually think of a few cases where 2 is better than 1 or 0.

If you receive your miner and btc rate stays constant there would be little incentive for people to pour money in to new hardware or at least as quickly as expected. This could mean difficulty is much less than predicted and everyone reaches roi.

alternatively the price of btc could go up and you might only reach 50% roi but if you resell your miner after using it for a month you could probably reach a positive roi or come very close in btc terms (usd would reach positive roi in this case)

[Unacceptable]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months   Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st   

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

I stand corrected,starting from march 10th,april 10th-may 10th is 2 months extra waiting..............

My orders are 1st batch,so yes I expected feb 24th to march 10th as my ship dates

Yes ASICminer-no delays,KNC-1-2 weeks,MBP-1 month I think,I'll be corrected,I'm sure 

[Flying Hellfish]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months   Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st   

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

I stand corrected,starting from march 10th,april 10th-may 10th is 2 months extra waiting..............

My orders are 1st batch,so yes I expected feb 24th to march 10th as my ship dates

Yes ASICminer-no delays,KNC-1-2 weeks,MBP-1 month I think,I'll be corrected,I'm sure 

Everybody always leaves out Bitmain.  Selling and shipping only what they have in stock, those lads deserve some credit.

[Unacceptable]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months   Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st   

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

I stand corrected,starting from march 10th,april 10th-may 10th is 2 months extra waiting..............

My orders are 1st batch,so yes I expected feb 24th to march 10th as my ship dates

Yes ASICminer-no delays,KNC-1-2 weeks,MBP-1 month I think,I'll be corrected,I'm sure 

Everybody always leaves out Bitmain.  Selling and shipping only what they have in stock, those lads deserve some credit.

I told ya I'd be corrected!!!!!!!! 

Absolutely they do    In fact I'm ordering 1 in a few hours & another in a week or 2 

[alfabitcoin]

I think jimmothy is an example of customers what every asic preorder company desire   no offense

[Lloydie]

Hi ! Well.. PG is just trolling this forum in an unacceptable way.

Correction, there is no trolling.  The information being provided and the holding of supposed responsible parties to account is more than acceptable, it is completely necessary and is one of the few reasons why any disclosure at all is taking place by a company who received funds in good faith from customers but whose good faith is far from being repaid.

You are delusional. Quit trolling and do something productive.

You come to this thread knowing that literally every asic manufacturer has experienced delays and act like you predicted the future when it was the same with BA.

Try not to pat yourself on the back too hard.

Notice how the only ones crying for a refund are the ones without orders from BA?

Seriously fuck off. We all knew that when preordering nonexistent hardware there would be a huge chance of delays and we accepted that fact when ordering.

We will get our (still best priced) hardware eventually and you will continue hopping from thread to thread letting everyone who preordered an asic know exactly how stupid they are.

Get a life

No mate, you can fuck off yourself asshole. When members of the community provide information that informs the community at large of nefarious dealings, inconsistent statements, broken promises and attempts to defraud, it sure as hell isn't trolling, it's holding people to account.

If you don't like it that's too fucking bad.

I do hope you get your hardware but in the meantime, direct any anger you have to those who've deliberately lied to you about realistic delivery dates, those who've suckered you in to take the investment risk normally taken by venture capitalists who also become part owners in the business and who have dangled you out on the customer thread with very limited upside, that is, assuming you get a product at all.

You may not like it, but your attempts to shout down meaningful criticism do you no service at all.

No ole, you Fuck Off. You are NOT providing meaningful criticism. Asshole.

[GodfatherBond]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months   Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st   

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

Actually yes, KNC shipped on time.

[Lloydie]

Read on, Lloydie, you're not even at the end of the conversation. You missed the post where the mod neatly negates the person you're ostensibly supporting then your champion flounders by trying to cherry-pick parts of my comments.

Did I forget to mention you're an asshat?

Run along now, let's hear something that resembles a paragraph of original thought when you next post. I have to say that my post about you and the dead philosophers still makes me smile, especially as it only seems to have now dawned on you that you are the about-to-be-scammed, the scammed and the scammee.

You didn't know you were more than just an asshat, did you?

 

I know there is a good chance I've been scammed. The sick part are wankers like you and PG doing the I told you so's, asking for 10 Btc for info, producing "satire", and you "philosophy". Thanks but seriously get a fucking life. Be witty with your meaningless bullshit somewhere else. We do not thank you. We say Fuck Off to you with a middle finger. Make that one arm over the other with a raised fist.

[dropt]

So,feb-march-april-maybe in may is 2 months  Looks like 3 months at least if they do deliver by may 1st  

The original ship date was the end of Feb not the beginning. No one ever expected to see shipping before the end of Feb, if you did you where completely oblivious. So you math is a bit off, April-May(be) is 2 months.
Has anyone ever shipped on time?
Seriously, has anyone ever shipped on time?

Actually yes, KNC shipped on time.

Acutally, no they didn't.  They may have only missed it by days/weeks, but they missed it.

[smooth]

Read on, Lloydie, you're not even at the end of the conversation. You missed the post where the mod neatly negates the person you're ostensibly supporting then your champion flounders by trying to cherry-pick parts of my comments.

Did I forget to mention you're an asshat?

Run along now, let's hear something that resembles a paragraph of original thought when you next post. I have to say that my post about you and the dead philosophers still makes me smile, especially as it only seems to have now dawned on you that you are the about-to-be-scammed, the scammed and the scammee.

You didn't know you were more than just an asshat, did you?

 

I know there is a good chance I've been scammed. The sick part are wankers like you and PG doing the I told you so's, asking for 10 Btc for info, producing "satire", and you "philosophy". Thanks but seriously get a fucking life. Be witty with your meaningless bullshit somewhere else. We do not thank you. We say Fuck Off to you with a middle finger. Make that one arm over the other with a raised fist.

I find you both incredibly entertaining. Don't change a thing.

[dropt]

Everybody always leaves out Bitmain.  Selling and shipping only what they have in stock, those lads deserve some credit.

IMO They deserve a lot of credit.  I don't know why they're so heavily overlooked.  Maybe it is likely because they didn't rah-rah a bunch of idiots into pre-orders only to leave them hanging.  I'm buying as many S1's as my plans allow, and I'd hazard a guess that almost every single person who is buying into Bitmain units is far, far better off than anyone involved in any of the pre-order screw-ups.  

[dropt]

Read on, Lloydie, you're not even at the end of the conversation. You missed the post where the mod neatly negates the person you're ostensibly supporting then your champion flounders by trying to cherry-pick parts of my comments.

Did I forget to mention you're an asshat?

Run along now, let's hear something that resembles a paragraph of original thought when you next post. I have to say that my post about you and the dead philosophers still makes me smile, especially as it only seems to have now dawned on you that you are the about-to-be-scammed, the scammed and the scammee.

You didn't know you were more than just an asshat, did you?

 

I know there is a good chance I've been scammed. The sick part are wankers like you and PG doing the I told you so's, asking for 10 Btc for info, producing "satire", and you "philosophy". Thanks but seriously get a fucking life. Be witty with your meaningless bullshit somewhere else. We do not thank you. We say Fuck Off to you with a middle finger. Make that one arm over the other with a raised fist.

I find you both incredibly entertaining. Don't change a thing.

  I agree.

[Lloydie]

Read on, Lloydie, you're not even at the end of the conversation. You missed the post where the mod neatly negates the person you're ostensibly supporting then your champion flounders by trying to cherry-pick parts of my comments.

Did I forget to mention you're an asshat?

Run along now, let's hear something that resembles a paragraph of original thought when you next post. I have to say that my post about you and the dead philosophers still makes me smile, especially as it only seems to have now dawned on you that you are the about-to-be-scammed, the scammed and the scammee.

You didn't know you were more than just an asshat, did you?

 

I know there is a good chance I've been scammed. The sick part are wankers like you and PG doing the I told you so's, asking for 10 Btc for info, producing "satire", and you "philosophy". Thanks but seriously get a fucking life. Be witty with your meaningless bullshit somewhere else. We do not thank you. We say Fuck Off to you with a middle finger. Make that one arm over the other with a raised fist.

I find you both incredibly entertaining. Don't change a thing.

  I agree.

If it provided a brief bit of levity in this shit space we are in, happy to oblige. 

[xstr8guy]

Hi ! Well.. PG is just trolling this forum in an unacceptable way.

Correction, there is no trolling.  The information being provided and the holding of supposed responsible parties to account is more than acceptable, it is completely necessary and is one of the few reasons why any disclosure at all is taking place by a company who received funds in good faith from customers but whose good faith is far from being repaid.

You are delusional. Quit trolling and do something productive.

You come to this thread knowing that literally every asic manufacturer has experienced delays and act like you predicted the future when it was the same with BA.

Try not to pat yourself on the back too hard.

Notice how the only ones crying for a refund are the ones without orders from BA?

Seriously fuck off. We all knew that when preordering nonexistent hardware there would be a huge chance of delays and we accepted that fact when ordering.

We will get our (still best priced) hardware eventually and you will continue hopping from thread to thread letting everyone who preordered an asic know exactly how stupid they are.

Get a life

Why do people keep saying this like it's the truth?!  Bitfury and KNC were very nearly right on target with their shipping dates... a few days here a couple weeks there... certainly nothing major.  And there's BitMain with their wonderful Antminers that just magically appeared without any preorder whatsoever.

[Lloydie]

Read on, Lloydie, you're not even at the end of the conversation. You missed the post where the mod neatly negates the person you're ostensibly supporting then your champion flounders by trying to cherry-pick parts of my comments.

Did I forget to mention you're an asshat?

Run along now, let's hear something that resembles a paragraph of original thought when you next post. I have to say that my post about you and the dead philosophers still makes me smile, especially as it only seems to have now dawned on you that you are the about-to-be-scammed, the scammed and the scammee.

You didn't know you were more than just an asshat, did you?

 

I know there is a good chance I've been scammed. The sick part are wankers like you and PG doing the I told you so's, asking for 10 Btc for info, producing "satire", and you "philosophy". Thanks but seriously get a fucking life. Be witty with your meaningless bullshit somewhere else. We do not thank you. We say Fuck Off to you with a middle finger. Make that one arm over the other with a raised fist.

As I said above, I won't be going anywhere, I explained my reasons why the broader community needs to know about the underhanded business practices of hardware manufacturers and I sure as hell am not the first person to say that on this forum. I don't repeat myself to asshats so I won't tell you why your gullibility and stupidity allows others to get rich from your money while screwing you into the ground.

You're a fool and the worst sort of fool is the fool who doesn't know he's a fool.

Your accolades are growing by the hour, about-to-be-scammed, scammed, scammee, asshat and fool.

How about you actually address what people are saying rather than venting your frustration with meaningless teen-angst-ridden insults?

If you're wounded and people commenting on the lack of business ethics by BA and others pours salt in your wounds and makes you mad, I understand, you're not liking the pain and you're not able to lash out at BA as... wait for it... they haven't even made an official comment on their own official thread. You, their loyal customer and patsy, are being ripped so you'd prefer that people were quiet than quite rightly inform other members of the community that BA are struggling to meet any customer commitments at all.

Wounded and hurt, maybe we add those to your list? Or are you all cool again and fine with being ripped?

Lemme see. Are you telling us something we don't already know? No. Are you offering comfort or encouragement? Also no. Are you being a smartass after the fact wanker? Why yes. And for that, I reiterate: GTFO.

For the record, I'm not cool with being ripped. I expect bobsag3 to sort this shit out. Also, I believe BA's backed team has failed. I do want my money back or hash power if they work something out with AM. If these things don't happen, I will be very unhappy with Mr Carson.

Meanwhile, my fist is still raised against you, ole.

[ernie-]

Why do people keep saying thus like it's the truth?!  Bitfury and KNC were very nearly right on target with their shipping dates... a few days here a couple weeks there... certainly nothing major.  And there's BitMain with their wonderful Antminers that just magically appeared without any preorder whatsoever.

BitMain seem to have their act together, I see many people here selling their units with delivery no more than a week or so. I am interested in the Black Arrow too, but I can't quite work out when someone will have them in stock like the Antminers.

[jimmothy]

I think jimmothy is an example of customers what every asic preorder company desire   no offense

I bought from BFL and made a profit in USD regardless of the ridiculous delays. I don't want people to be mislead and they should know that EVERY asic manufacturer that accepts preorders will miss the deadline. It is not a secret.

Unless you buy from bitmain or asicminer you will not get your asic on time.

What you fudsters forget is that a 2 month delay does not equal a guaranteed loss. It does mean that you will not profit AS much as you would have if you had it earlier but assuming you are already at a loss is simply wrong according to history.

This all ignores the fact that BA may even decide to give out refunds even though they are not obligated in their TOS and they might come up with a better compensation plan for the delays.