[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[minerpart]

Hey Vince. I know it's risky and you can get shot down for it  but would you like to share some of your 'maths' (i.e. mathematics) - or to be more correct, arithmetic - on this particular part of our day to day running costs?

[stenkross]

My god.

Could some admin just lock this whole thread down for a week or so.
It would be a huge favour for all (except crumbs and a few other trolls).

[hak8or]

Why is this thread a constant cesspool? It always, ALWAYS, devolves into the major players going at each other, while the rest of us are sitting here just waiting for news or new information. We would love some actual discussion, but instead we get such crap with people coming in and spouting their attacks on each other. Why can't they be done via PM? Or on twitter if you demand an audience? Hell, why are they even still allowed to post here!?

And it seems that for some reason this only happens in Active Mining threads, and much more rarely in Asic Mining threads.

[zumzero]

+1

I vote we discuss this....

1.9GH/s and 2.5W, estimated end of profitable hashing:
0.20 $/kWh - July
0.15 $/kWh - August
0.10 $/kWh - September
One month extra if BTC at $2k. From selling point, it can make wide customer base for future 28nm but needs high volume, no preorders, sell at costs, deliver on time.

How about 0.017 $/kWh 

A simple interpolation of his figures would suggest mid-July.

But that assumes his maths above is correct.

I'd like to see the figures on this - what difficulty increased have you presumed kactech? Please show us your calculation.

0.017 not 0.17

I would be very interested to hear Vince's thoughts further to his recent post about ActM being able to compete indefinitely.

[minerpart]

hak8or-

Why do you think?

Just by chance?

Maybe ACtM competitors are trying to disrupt the company? It can only be that really if you think about it.

[kleeck]

Why is this thread a constant cesspool? It always, ALWAYS, devolves into the major players going at each other, while the rest of us are sitting here just waiting for news or new information. We would love some actual discussion, but instead we get such crap with people coming in and spouting their attacks on each other. Why can't they be done via PM? Or on twitter if you demand an audience? Hell, why are they even still allowed to post here!?

And it seems that for some reason this only happens in Active Mining threads, and much more rarely in Asic Mining threads.

LOL.

[deizel]

Back on track...

Can I just point out that with a 28nm full custom ASIC - and 0.017c/kwh leccy, ActM can now compete indefinitely, which is awesome news.

[minerpart]

The actual quote from Ken is:

'How about 0.017 $/kWh'

Which is 1.7 cents per KWh which according to this table is very very very good for industrial use:

http://www.eia.gov/electricity/monthly/epm_table_grapher.cfm?t=epmt_5_6_a

So Vince, the figure is 1.7 c/KWh on the leccy bill.

[minerpart]

Well it's not my number is it? It's Ken's. I thought that was really really clear - as I quoted him.

And the prices in the table are clearly marked as Average Retail Price - in really BIG writing up the top - so they are not fixed price points.

Thirdly, customers can get special deals with suppliers. You may have heard about that?



Eduardo your naivete and lack of attention to the obvious details in a simple table and simple post explains a lot about your company's current situation. Maybe you aren't very good at seeing straight?

[finlof]

Minerpart and StuartUK's projections of $40 million dollars (though I personally believe that's a fantasy)

Incorrect. It's not my figure.


'Financial Management

The date of these projection is December 5, 2013.

Estimated AMC 12 Months Projections:

AMC through VMC expects to sale 1 Million of its 28nm Bitcoin Mining Chips in 2014.  After AMC recoups its
NRE of ~1 Million dollars, then AMC expects to receive ~40 Million dollars in profits from its VMC subsidary payment in 2014'

the reason i put you and StuarkUK in with Ken is because you champion those figures he gives like it's already happened.  you somehow keep believing EVERY projection/date/deadline Ken puts out there, and then when it's missed, you act like he never said it or come up with some excuse like "oh that was before we were working on full custom 28nm."  it's quite amazing really...

Oh and as to the number of shares i own, it's 416 - on cryptostocks.  i sold out all of my shares in the bitfunder disaster and withdrew all my coins the day Ukyo announced he was closing to americans.  I'm sorry Ken and others decided to wait it out while the boat was sinking and then wonder why they cant recover their money.  It's because it's at the bottom of the ocean people... (down under in Australia probably).  i do have 1.2 btc on crypto-trade to speculate with on ActiveMining, should there ever be shares to buy/sell on there.  like some others I keep up with this thread mostly for entertainment (I cant believe it's still going on...), but partially to see if Ken can actually deliver.  He might turn out like BFL and Avalon who after months of stalling/promising/ignoring finally delivered.  or maybe Hashfast.  or maybe Labcoin.  or maybe something we've never seen before.  we'll just have to wait.  and wait... and wait... and wait...

[VinceSamios]

Sorry I made a newb mistake (AT&T made the same mistake on MB usage on phone contracts if I remember correctly, although that doesn't excuse my brain fart.)

1.7 cents per KWH - this is the number I wanted. I also feel its accurate because LabRatMining is also getting the same leccy rate (yes leccy is the sparky zappy stuff) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=251423.msg4699831#msg4699831

So with a full custom 28nm chip they are going to be one of the most, if not _the_ most, efficient chip on the market. And with such cheap leccy..... even if a number of competitors all:

1. manufacture their own full custom 28nm chips
2. sell their own chips as per 1
3. mine with their own chips as per 1
4. can also secure 1.7c/kwh leccy

ActM will still be equally profitable and therefore, unless people start mining at a loss (um no), will be profitable indefinitely.

It will take a number of manufacturer/retailer/miners with a chip much smaller than 28nm (20nm isn't a big enough difference) and leccy at-least half the price (not gonna happen) in order to make ActM unprofitable... this is a LONG LONG LONG way off, and would give ActM plenty of time to produce a more competitive chip and find cheaper leccy (although I doubt that's really going to happen)

Vince out.

[zumzero]

Nice post Vince.  Thanks for adding perspective.

[kslaughter]

Why is this thread a constant cesspool? It always, ALWAYS, devolves into the major players going at each other, while the rest of us are sitting here just waiting for news or new information. We would love some actual discussion, but instead we get such crap with people coming in and spouting their attacks on each other. Why can't they be done via PM? Or on twitter if you demand an audience? Hell, why are they even still allowed to post here!?

And it seems that for some reason this only happens in Active Mining threads, and much more rarely in Asic Mining threads.

The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

[mainline]

...
The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

Your investors, OTOH, are scared of what Active Mining has already achieved.
Excelsior!!1

[CanadianGuy]

Why is this thread a constant cesspool? It always, ALWAYS, devolves into the major players going at each other, while the rest of us are sitting here just waiting for news or new information. We would love some actual discussion, but instead we get such crap with people coming in and spouting their attacks on each other. Why can't they be done via PM? Or on twitter if you demand an audience? Hell, why are they even still allowed to post here!?

And it seems that for some reason this only happens in Active Mining threads, and much more rarely in Asic Mining threads.

The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

And that's why there is no support wall at .0005 on crypto-trade... because the trolls are scared of buying into such a successful company

[zumzero]

...
The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

Your investors, OTOH, are scared of what Active Mining has already achieved.
Excelsior!!1

Racking them up today! Crumbs ignored again.

3 down, 8 to go!

[Alphi]

Why is this thread a constant cesspool? It always, ALWAYS, devolves into the major players going at each other, while the rest of us are sitting here just waiting for news or new information. We would love some actual discussion, but instead we get such crap with people coming in and spouting their attacks on each other. Why can't they be done via PM? Or on twitter if you demand an audience? Hell, why are they even still allowed to post here!?

And it seems that for some reason this only happens in Active Mining threads, and much more rarely in Asic Mining threads.

The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

ken your words may come back to haunt you..
you are contractually bound to deliver on all of your promises made to your shareholders and customers..
if you do not then you may end up facing breach of contract or even fraud charges.

a man who's bravado does not measure up to his abilities walks a very thin line indeed.

there are already a number of formal investigations ongoing in relating to bitcoin mining scandals. I would advise ALL investors to do their own due diligence and invest cautiously.
if you cannot afford to lose the money (whether its BTC or FIAT) then please for your own sake do not invest it.

[R_Lem]

...
The trolls are scared of what Active Mining will be able to achieve.

Your investors, OTOH, are scared of what Active Mining has already achieved.
Excelsior!!1

Racking them up today! Crumbs ignored again.

3 down, 8 to go!

My ignore list is at 27 from this thread alone.

VolanicEruptor
crumbs
Mabsark
pankkake
Entropy-uc
CanadianGuy
gecko_x2
MassiveInvestor
Edser
testh
dolor
DoloresHazed
AccountManagement
NickDanger
Cropcircle
DoloresMaze
webgypsy
Bambifan101
Thumper650
Troxy
mainline
fannybaws
bitditzy
Bitdust
iPass
breadcrumbs
EduardoDeCastro

EDIT: and v2rocket

[V2Rocket]

My ignore list is at 27 from this thread alone.

VolanicEruptor
crumbs
Mabsark
pankkake
Entropy-uc
CanadianGuy
gecko_x2
MassiveInvestor
Edser
testh
dolor
DoloresHazed
AccountManagement
NickDanger
Cropcircle
DoloresMaze
webgypsy
Bambifan101
Thumper650
Troxy
mainline
fannybaws
bitditzy
Bitdust
iPass
breadcrumbs
EduardoDeCastro

Excelent list.  Added to mine.  I also can't stand idiots who post their ignore lists.  So ur added 2

[gogxmagog]

"ignore" is kind of pointless when so many users love to quote the trolls and I have to see their blather anyways. If anything, this thread has strengthened my critical analysis skills. I read, think, then disregard about 90% of everything in here. Just like watching the news on tv, you learn to read between the lines and spot outright manipulation and lies.