[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[RickJamesBTC]

Usually a ponzi scheme will pay out people with other peoples incoming funds. This one is just taking money from everyone and never paying a thing. Brilliant!

So then that means this isn't a ponzi scheme.

True, it's just fraud.

[breadcrumbs]

Nothing I have written is meant to be a personal attack.

I have been in contact with some people who have known and met the CEO of Active Mining before he became involved in Bitcoin and they all say he is a great guy, a smart guy.

The issue is that there is no mining happening, there are no dividends being paid out, and there are no shares being traded.

The issue is that some of you seem to enjoy defending the failures and delays of Active Mining in the face of the lack of any results.

If Active Mining does finally produce its own miners and trading is happening no one will be more happy than me.

But, until such time, the CEO of Active Mining should be pressured to answer the essential questions.

And, until that time, some of the cheerleaders should step back and be more honest and realistic and less delusional.
Hope is lovely, delusion is disgusting.

[JoTheKhan]

@breadcrumbs I think people just have you on ignore. Your username is very similar to a very infamous "crumbs" whose account was banned back in December, (or was it January?) and he has been making alt accounts weekly ever since. No one thinks you are making any personal attacks, atleast I haven't. If you check my post history you will see that I am all for pressuring Ken for answer as his lack of communication has been infamous (too) in the past. Though he has recently opened up a little more than usual (which is definitely good).

[drawingthesun]

Nothing I have written is meant to be a personal attack.

I have been in contact with some people who have known and met the CEO of Active Mining before he became involved in Bitcoin and they all say he is a great guy, a smart guy.

The issue is that there is no mining happening, there are no dividends being paid out, and there are no shares being traded.

The issue is that some of you seem to enjoy defending the failures and delays of Active Mining in the face of the lack of any results.

If Active Mining does finally produce its own miners and trading is happening no one will be more happy than me.

But, until such time, the CEO of Active Mining should be pressured to answer the essential questions.

And, until that time, some of the cheerleaders should step back and be more honest and realistic and less delusional.
Hope is lovely, delusion is disgusting.

This is a quality post and many people here are mistaking you for the troll 'Crumbs'.

I have heard good things about Ken, the only bad things are from VE or the trolls. I have had a lot of private correspondence with Ken and he comes across as smart and he is on the ball with the company. I only have one major issue with Ken and that is transparency, I hate being in the dark.

However recently he has been very forthcoming and I appreciate it.

Also I really hope Ken allows us to trade on CryptoTrade and convert those shares to ColouredCoins at a later date.

[mainline]

...
I have heard good things about Ken, the only bad things are from VE or the trolls. I have had a lot of private correspondence with Ken and he comes across as smart and he is on the ball with the company. I only have one major issue with Ken and that is transparency, I hate being in the dark.
...

Whelp, drawingthesun's vote rounds this out.  The entire Active Mining Mensa chapter is now in agreement - Ken's smart and business savvy.
Drawing, could you remind me who "invested" his entire retirement fund in a elderly alcy from Missouri?

*But i'm happy to hear my post helped - I'm here to console and comfort those once blinded by greed and now stricken with grief.

[Vigil]

Crypto-Trade daily volume -> 1.57 BTC.

[zumzero]

Crypto-Trade daily volume -> 1.57 BTC.

Just enough for you to sell all your shares at once then. 

[mainline]

Crypto-Trade daily volume -> 1.57 BTC.

Just enough for you to sell all your shares at once then.  

Just enough for all of you to sell all your shares at once.  

[VolanicEruptor]

I bet all the activemining shares in existence aren't even worth $10,000 total.
are any of you waking up yet to the smell if this heaping pile of shit?

[gjpminingco]

V.E GTFO no ones want to Hear you trolling anymore


P.S Your now on Ignore, and have been SLAPPED with the troll STFU stick to as the Nike slogan says " JUST DO IT " The STFU part that is


( thought i would clarify what part for ya since i know it would baffle ya a little. )

[VinceSamios]

Sorry I made a newb mistake (AT&T made the same mistake on MB usage on phone contracts if I remember correctly, although that doesn't excuse my brain fart.)

1.7 cents per KWH - this is the number I wanted. I also feel its accurate because LabRatMining is also getting the same leccy rate (yes leccy is the sparky zappy stuff) - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=251423.msg4699831#msg4699831

So with a full custom 28nm chip they are going to be one of the most, if not _the_ most, efficient chip on the market. And with such cheap leccy..... even if a number of competitors all:

1. manufacture their own full custom 28nm chips
2. sell their own chips as per 1
3. mine with their own chips as per 1
4. can also secure 1.7c/kwh leccy

ActM will still be equally profitable and therefore, unless people start mining at a loss (um no), will be profitable indefinitely.

It will take a number of manufacturer/retailer/miners with a chip much smaller than 28nm (20nm isn't a big enough difference) and leccy at-least half the price (not gonna happen) in order to make ActM unprofitable... this is a LONG LONG LONG way off, and would give ActM plenty of time to produce a more competitive chip and find cheaper leccy (although I doubt that's really going to happen)

Vince out.

Turns out the video got upvoted on reddit - hilarious http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zN9LZ3ojnxY

[zumzero]

Brilliant.  Those two need to understand that the customer is always right!  

Here's something to warm the cockles.   It's from a Coindesk article on the Miami Conference...


Roger Ver on the Bitcoin Price and Mining

Day One of the conference was capped off by angel investor and bitcoin advocate Roger Ver and he did not disappoint. When asked about the future value of bitcoin, Ver was understandably bullish about price.

“It’s very, very clear that it is going to be higher than it is today,” he said.

Perhaps the most intriguing though that Ver conveyed was his opinion on mining. “It’s a market that has huge potential,” he said. Ver pegged bitcoin mining as a $1 billion industry given the roughly one million coins that will be rewarded over the next year.

“I don’t think anyone understands how big this industry will be,” he said.

[minerpart]

And KnC has taken 28 million dollars in pre orders for a 20nm technology that is yet unproven and in fact they may never ship a miner with anywhere near the the specs they are claiming.

This market is awash with money. It is also awash with people who don't do any research before parting with their cash.

If we can get a good 55nm miner with good ROI it will definitely sell.

A 28nm top end machine for Q2 will have huge demand. KnC sold out 8 mill in a day - for a concept machine that may not even be achieveable.

[kleeck]

And KnC has taken 28 million dollars in pre orders for a 20nm technology that is yet unproven and in fact they may never ship a miner with anywhere near the the specs they are claiming.

This market is awash with money. It is also awash with people who don't do any research before parting with their cash.

If we can get a good 55nm miner with good ROI it will definitely sell.

A 28nm top end machine for Q2 will have huge demand. KnC sold out 8 mill in a day - for a concept machine that may not even be achieveable.

Of all the mining companies who have failed to hit deadlines or worse you throw stones at KnC - the ONE company that has delivered on time and with relatively little issue. How do you think they raised $28M? They run a tight ship and get things done. KnC is THE competition in this space. If any mining company can put an engineering team together that can achieve a highly competitive 20nm device it's KnC.

I would not be playing them down or lead anyone else invested in the mining industry to do so. They are the top dog and are aiming to stay there. Let's be reasonable with our competitive analysis here.

That said, I agree that this year will still see a high demand for miners, even if KnC enters the first 20nm miner successfully.

[zumzero]

There are a lot of potential customers who, when browsing for a miner will consider; price, hashing rate and expected delivery time.  Weather it's a 20nm, 28nm or a 55nm product, this will go unnoticed by many shoppers, but obviously not all.  A lot of them will be as blissfully unaware of the power draw of their units as much as the price per wattage their energy suppliers are charging them whether that's in cents or dollars.

This is why targeting the budget sector with ActM's 55nm units has great potential imo.

minerpart, I'm sure you're already responding to kleeck's post, but I would be interested to hear what you have to say about the difficulties presumably ANY company will have in developing 20nm miners?

[Vigil]

There are a lot of potential customers who, when browsing for a miner will consider; price, hashing rate and expected delivery time.  Weather it's a 20nm, 28nm or a 55nm product, this will go unnoticed by many shoppers, but obviously not all.  A lot of them will be as blissfully unaware of the power draw of their units as much as the price per wattage their energy suppliers are charging them whether that's in cents or dollars.

This is why targeting the budget sector with ActM's 55nm units has great potential imo.

minerpart, I'm sure you're already responding to kleeck's post, but I would be interested to hear what you have to say about the difficulties presumably ANY company will have in developing 20nm miners?

As long as they can be produced cheap enough to sell them at a budget price.

[wasubii]

There are a lot of potential customers who, when browsing for a miner will consider; price, hashing rate and expected delivery time.  Weather it's a 20nm, 28nm or a 55nm product, this will go unnoticed by many shoppers, but obviously not all.  A lot of them will be as blissfully unaware of the power draw of their units as much as the price per wattage their energy suppliers are charging them whether that's in cents or dollars.

This is why targeting the budget sector with ActM's 55nm units has great potential imo.

minerpart, I'm sure you're already responding to kleeck's post, but I would be interested to hear what you have to say about the difficulties presumably ANY company will have in developing 20nm miners?

As long as they can be produced cheap enough to sell them at a budget price.

With Avalon, bitfury and bitmain (plus others?) all with paid for 55nm masks, they will keep selling as long as they can make a profit. By the time ActM has 55nm chips to sell in 6 months time, the wholesale value of them will be so low that the only thing to do with them is to mine.

I hope the costs of mounting them on boards and getting them mining will not be so high as to make them useless for mining too....

[Vigil]

There are a lot of potential customers who, when browsing for a miner will consider; price, hashing rate and expected delivery time.  Weather it's a 20nm, 28nm or a 55nm product, this will go unnoticed by many shoppers, but obviously not all.  A lot of them will be as blissfully unaware of the power draw of their units as much as the price per wattage their energy suppliers are charging them whether that's in cents or dollars.

This is why targeting the budget sector with ActM's 55nm units has great potential imo.

minerpart, I'm sure you're already responding to kleeck's post, but I would be interested to hear what you have to say about the difficulties presumably ANY company will have in developing 20nm miners?

As long as they can be produced cheap enough to sell them at a budget price.

With Avalon, bitfury and bitmain (plus others?) all with paid for 55nm masks, they will keep selling as long as they can make a profit. By the time ActM has 55nm chips to sell in 6 months time, the wholesale value of them will be so low that the only thing to do with them is to mine.

I hope the costs of mounting them on boards and getting them mining will not be so high as to make them useless for mining too....

Probably, Ken didn't do the calculations before buying this IP.

[knybe]

And KnC has taken 28 million dollars in pre orders for a 20nm technology that is yet unproven and in fact they may never ship a miner with anywhere near the the specs they are claiming.

This market is awash with money. It is also awash with people who don't do any research before parting with their cash.

If we can get a good 55nm miner with good ROI it will definitely sell.

A 28nm top end machine for Q2 will have huge demand. KnC sold out 8 mill in a day - for a concept machine that may not even be achieveable.

Of all the mining companies who have failed to hit deadlines or worse you throw stones at KnC - the ONE company that has delivered on time and with relatively little issue. How do you think they raised $28M? They run a tight ship and get things done. KnC is THE competition in this space. If any mining company can put an engineering team together that can achieve a highly competitive 20nm device it's KnC.

I would not be playing them down or lead anyone else invested in the mining industry to do so. They are the top dog and are aiming to stay there. Let's be reasonable with our competitive analysis here.

That said, I agree that this year will still see a high demand for miners, even if KnC enters the first 20nm miner successfully.

That is why my equipment money has gone to KnC and not VMC.

[minerpart]

I'm looking at KnC exactly because they are doing so well. They are our competition. If we can't analyse the competition we are a lost company.

Business is always relative - so we need to think about our place in the market.

kleeck think on this : NASA got men to the moon in 1969 - but they could not do that again today. They haven't been able replicate that journey with any of their tech for 40years.

You might say they haven't tried and it might not be a great analogy but its a loose idea. The point I'm trying to make us just because a company delivered on X promises does NOT mean they can deliver on Y.

20 nm ASIC tech is another return to the moon but this time meeting all the health and safety requirements of the 21st Century. In other words its a similar journey but far far more problematic.

Zum see my post and link from yesterday. Performance enhanced 20nm overall is an unproven concept. The benefits over  top spec 28nn may not be able to be realised with the non-scalable  components that need to be integrated into the reduced die.