Official Thread: AMT

[clenell]

yes, i can prove my purchase (order #610) but there really is no point - the goal post would subsequently be moved and you'd find another hoop for me to jump through. im through convincing the naysayers on this thread. i will post plenty of pics though when i get my miner.

[Puppet]

http://bitmine.ch/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/CoinCraft-A1.pdf

1.2THs = 1200GHs

The spec-sheet says...
(20GHs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/20GHs = 60 Chips
60 * 7W = 420W

Respectively... On the top-end...
(40Ghs @ 1.0W/GH = 40W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/40GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 40W = 1200W

So... By the specs, they are not wrong by saying the chips can run as low as 420W, and SPEEDS up to 1.2THs. (Seeing as the number of chips is not stated, and power/speed/cooling may be the final determining factor of the shipped unit.)

Ok, those numbers are new. I got the answer I got when I asked. I guess Bitmine made an estimate since then.

However, first of all , those are number for the chips, not the miner. AMT sells miners, so their power consumption is going to be higher since VRMs, PSU's etc cant be 100% efficient. So there is no way in hell these machines could possibly be expected to consume 0.35 * 1200 = 420W. If you factor in real world inefficiencies, 500W at the wall would be a minor (miner?) miracle.  For AMT to state power consumption as 300W-.. is a lie. They might as well have put 3W or 0.3W there.

Secondly, assuming bitmine hit their specs, to get anywhere close to the stated efficiency would mean AMT is under clocking the chips to their minimum speed and have 60 A1 chips in there per miner. Which also implies at nominal speeds,  their rig should have no problems hashing at 1500 GH and in turbo mode it should achieve 2.4 TH. What are the odds they are selling machines that are perfectly capable (with adequate PSU) of hashing at 2.4TH, but only advertising 1.2 ? Considering they were marketing 40GH bitfury boards as 64GH, I rate those chances slim to non existent.

AMT, feel free to clarify how many A1's will be in that miner.

 

[swiftshoot]

Well so far,
I sent multiple emails for my tracking number.
None has been sent to me.
No confirmation of unit being sent.
Can't log in into AMT user site, says my password is incorrect.
Tried to reset password, page goes into an endless referral loop. (Tried IE, Chrome, Firefox)
I still have faith that they will do what is necessary to get back in touch with me in the coming days.... If I don't hear from them by 27th, but see them posting here will mean only one thing....

Those who have placed your orders with AMT, please verify your account to see if they are working and report back here... cause it is illogical why my account should not be working... I use a password safe and never changed it.

[clenell]

i logged in just fine.

[ISAWHIM]

1.2THs = 1200GHs

The spec-sheet says...
(20GHs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/20GHs = 60 Chips
60 * 7W = 420W

Respectively... On the top-end...
(40Ghs @ 1.0W/GH = 40W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/40GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 40W = 1200W

For AMT to state power consumption as 300W-.. is a lie.

With the above two stated setups... The lower one would operate at less than 300W, but not 300W while at 1.2THs speeds.

(20Ghs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
600GHs/20GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 7W = 210W

This same 30 chips can do 1.2THs, but not at 600W. (40 chips possibly, between the two numbers.)

300W/7W = ~44 chips (low)
which would be 44*20Ghs=880GHs on the low 300W

600W/13.6W = ~44 chips (below nominal)
which would be 44*28GHs=1232GHs (1.2THs) on below nominal About 600W
Again, I assume this LIMIT is due to the PSU ability, and heat-dissipation ability. Not a limit of the chip itself. (If 44 is what is used.)

11 boards of 4 chips = 44
8 boards of 6 chips = 48
6 boards of 8 chips = 48
Or mixed, one with 4  or 6 chips, to even it out. For the 48-chip odd arrangements.

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does... They state perfect-world estimated ranges. 40MPG Hwy - 32MPG City, but it never gets that, ever... Thus 300-600W, and the "max speed" may only be 1.2THs. They never said what the low speed is.

They didn't even confirm that the A1 chip is what is being used. (That is what we assume.)

It isn't a LIE, if no-one has it yet. "Specs subject to change". Even then, it isn't a LIE, it is an error. If that is what they were told, then that is what they repeated, as specs. My video cards say 250W, but I have them running at 135W, and have pushed them over 290W. Yet the specs still say "consumes 250W". Which is not "at the wall".

But I agree that the specs seem under-estimated, possibly. (The other components are all low-power, except the PSU and fans. They run off USB-power, so they have to be low wattage.) Another thing they forget to think about, is European power is 240v, which is half the amps, and more efficient than American power at 120v. That will add 15-25% inefficiency to the PSU alone, even a platinum PSU, which is only rated at 90% efficient at 240V, with an 85% load. (Which, by the way, is a LIE, because PSU's never get that efficient. )

One more month, or two... and we will see the results, in full technicolor detail.

[amer]

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does... They state perfect-world estimated ranges. 40MPG Hwy - 32MPG City, but it never gets that, ever... Thus 300-600W, and the "max speed" may only be 1.2THs. They never said what the low speed is.

MPG numbers aren't "perfect world estimates". They are actual tests done on those vehicles by the EPA and manufacturers are forced to publish the EPA numbers regardless of their own estimates or real world performance. So, unless these numbers are coming from a national [supposedly] unbiased testing facility, your analogy is not accurate.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/fe_test_schedules.shtml

[swiftshoot]

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does... They state perfect-world estimated ranges. 40MPG Hwy - 32MPG City, but it never gets that, ever...

This could be true for American Car companies... but German Car Companies use real world testing... When Volkswagen said their TDIs get 55MPG, I can get that and even more... so never say never.

[swiftshoot]

Well so far,
I sent multiple emails for my tracking number.
None has been sent to me.
No confirmation of unit being sent.
Can't log in into AMT user site, says my password is incorrect.
Tried to reset password, page goes into an endless referral loop. (Tried IE, Chrome, Firefox)
I still have faith that they will do what is necessary to get back in touch with me in the coming days.... If I don't hear from them by 27th, but see them posting here will mean only one thing....

Those who have placed your orders with AMT, please verify your account to see if they are working and report back here... cause it is illogical why my account should not be working... I use a password safe and never changed it.

Well some good news... "Hey, we're working on it, and should have it shipped out tomorrow hopefully.  All the best"

I will be happy to see it at my house... soon. Once I get it, I will post pics of the unit and how it functions.  Having that sliver, albeit brief communique, helps reassure the customers... 

Thank you for the update AMT.

[Khanduras]

Well so far,
I sent multiple emails for my tracking number.
None has been sent to me.
No confirmation of unit being sent.
Can't log in into AMT user site, says my password is incorrect.
Tried to reset password, page goes into an endless referral loop. (Tried IE, Chrome, Firefox)
I still have faith that they will do what is necessary to get back in touch with me in the coming days.... If I don't hear from them by 27th, but see them posting here will mean only one thing....

Those who have placed your orders with AMT, please verify your account to see if they are working and report back here... cause it is illogical why my account should not be working... I use a password safe and never changed it.

Well some good news... "Hey, we're working on it, and should have it shipped out tomorrow hopefully.  All the best"

I will be happy to see it at my house... soon. Once I get it, I will post pics of the unit and how it functions.  Having that sliver, albeit brief communique, helps reassure the customers... 

Thank you for the update AMT.

Out of curiosity, what was your order number? And what miner did you order? Someone should really keep track of this like they did for BFL and the other companies.

[Puppet]

With the above two stated setups... The lower one would operate at less than 300W, but not 300W while at 1.2THs speeds.
This same 30 chips can do 1.2THs, but not at 600W. (40 chips possibly, between the two numbers.)

IOW, its a lie. More so since the spec sheet states "1,200 GH/s nominal performance "
AT nominal speeds, there is no way they can hit the stated power consumption range. It will use >800W. That it can use less at unspecified speeds is about as relevant as what it consumes when its not hashing or turned off.  Power consumption scales fairly linearly with clockspeed (at any given voltage) so you can put any arbitrary low power estimate there as long as you dont specify the speed. They might as well have called it a 20W miner.

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does...

What other vendor sells miners stating only a low power consumption mode without the corresponding speed, while advertising the speed without the corresponding power consumption?

They didn't even confirm that the A1 chip is what is being used. (That is what we assume.)

Which does not reflect well on them either. Keeping up the appearance its their own chip.

Even then, it isn't a LIE, it is an error. If that is what they were told, then that is what they repeated, as specs. My video cards say 250W, but I have them running at 135W, and have pushed them over 290W. Yet the specs still say "consumes 250W". Which is not "at the wall".

Its a lie if its deliberate. As for your GPU, you dont connect a GPU to an outlet at the wall. It doesnt have a PSU, so there is no way for the vendor to state those numbers. But at default settings, particularly when running typical workloads, it will use ~250W or less from the PSU, not 500+W. Otherwise that manufacturer is lying.

One more month, or two... and we will see the results, in full technicolor detail.

or two? Clenell was promised delivery first week of January. You wouldnt be implying they might be lying about delivery dates too ? .

[Mblackout]

how long time for delivery 1.2 miner? i live in connecticut

4 to 6 Weeks. Our chips come in next week, or at least are due to. Our setup is almost done and we're at final assembly stages of the 1.2th. Please feel free to place your order via the site and contact Sales@advancedminers.com for any questions, this really isnt the place for it.

Did you get confirmation chips shipped?  Are they showing up this week.  Hopefully    so!!'!

[ISAWHIM]

One more month, or two... and we will see the results, in full technicolor detail.

I was referring to my specific orders... not his. Does he have full technicolor ability?

P.S. The cake is a lie!

So, as stated before, and the others have proven... Estimated values, are just estimates, even by a "regulatory board". (Regulatory boards use closed-loops, which are "perfect world" constants.) Saying it gets 34MPG and then it actually gets 42MPG would also be a "lie", so that german car defense is moot, and untrue BS. (I am sure a few cars are under-estimated, but not all german cars even have that information.)

The chips "nominal", and the "miners nominal" are/may not be the same. By your same analogy, you are not running the chip directly off the wall. It is part of a system, and the "system", is what determines the value it wants as nominal/normal. If you buy an overclocked unit, then the chip is not run at nominal speeds, though the oc-unit is running at a nominal level, for the unit. My GPU chips nominal use, by the MFG is 200W, the company that used the chip, runs it nominal {normal-stock} at about 225W. (It is an over-clockers card, pre-clocked.) Other versions of the card, cheap ones with poor regulators, nominally run about 180W to be "safe".

But anyways, you are complaining about a few watts, on specs that were an estimate, for a machine that didn't exist at the time, and is just being "made" now. Is that how you buy cars... You bitch about not getting 45MPG, because you only got 38MPG. And you have refused a good deal on a car, because you KNOW it will never get that MPG, at the speeds you want to drive it at.

Any-ways, now there is not much left for people to do, but nit-pick on the details. "Omg, it's blue in the picture and you sent me a red one!" By the way, nothing BFL said was even close to specs, and KNC is still ball-park, as were the Avalons, and every other created ASIC. Though, once delivered, they corrected the values a little. Avalons still crash at the rated speeds. Needing constant resetting.

I don't know why you can't fathom that ~600W is the estimated power for 1.2THs operation, and that ~300W is obviously the MINIMUM the unit runs at, at ???GHs. (That low is not stated. Why you would ever think that they are saying 300W @ 1.2THs is beyond my comprehension. That is not what it says.)

I just showed you that 1.2THs can be done at 420W, with plenty of room to spare, with those specific chips. "At the wall". My whole computer runs off 38W "at the wall", that is a 4GHz, quad-core, 8GB ram, 4 fans, and every component on the mother-board. (That is minus my 7x180W GPU's.) I am sure the rest of their system will consume less than that, which is still under 600W total.

My computer miners run from 800W - 1800W and get 4.4MHs (At the 1800W level they get the 4.4MHs, not at 800W, they only get about 3.0Mhs.) * This is a scrypt speeds, not sha-356 speeds. I make more money than a 120GHs sha-256 ASIC.
http://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency/?sha256HashRate=120000.00&sha256Power=300.00&sha256PowerCost=0.1500&scryptHashRate=4400.00&scryptPower=1800.00&scryptPowerCost=0.1500&sha256Check=true&scryptCheck=true

Thus, why the 2x 1.2THs miner is the only viable option for the future. For me. (Time to retire my four scrypt miners, that cost me about $780 a month to operate, to replace them with something that only costs me about $128 a month to operate. I honestly don't care if it ends-up costing double that, in the end, in power.)
http://www.coinwarz.com/cryptocurrency/?sha256HashRate=2400000.00&sha256Power=1200.00&sha256PowerCost=0.1500&scryptHashRate=17600.00&scryptPower=7200.00&scryptPowerCost=0.1500&sha256Check=true&scryptCheck=true

[swiftshoot]

So, as stated before, and the others have proven... Estimated values, are just estimates, even by a "regulatory board". (Regulatory boards use closed-loops, which are "perfect world" constants.) Saying it gets 34MPG and then it actually gets 42MPG would also be a "lie", so that german car defense is moot, and untrue BS. (I am sure a few cars are under-estimated, but not all german cars even have that information.)

But anyways, you are complaining about a few watts, on specs that were an estimate, for a machine that didn't exist at the time, and is just being "made" now. Is that how you buy cars... You bitch about not getting 45MPG, because you only got 38MPG. And you have refused a good deal on a car, because you KNOW it will never get that MPG, at the speeds you want to drive it at.

Ignoramus at its best...

German car companies get their values by driving the cars.  American car companies get their values via a hooked up computer to simulate a driver....
I have never seen a driver said "LOOK I am doing 42 MPG but should be getting 34 MPG. This company is a liar."
and therefore, I never have seen a miner complain about getting better hashing numbers than what the company reports.  You always hear about people getting speeds under the values reported.

If you have to make a song and dance over stupidity, please consider working @ Walmart.  Stupidity at its best there.

[spooderman]

We need a thread on "How Asic manufacturers Troll bitcoiners."

[s1lverbox]

We need a thread on "How Asic manufacturers Troll bitcoiners."

^^+1^^
any Jr.member or newbie  with 1.2Th miner will attack that?

[sh1k1g4m1]

We need a thread on "How Asic manufacturers Troll bitcoiners."

I second this motion.

[clenell]

1.2THs = 1200GHs

The spec-sheet says...
(20GHs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/20GHs = 60 Chips
60 * 7W = 420W

Respectively... On the top-end...
(40Ghs @ 1.0W/GH = 40W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/40GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 40W = 1200W

For AMT to state power consumption as 300W-.. is a lie.

With the above two stated setups... The lower one would operate at less than 300W, but not 300W while at 1.2THs speeds.

(20Ghs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
600GHs/20GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 7W = 210W

This same 30 chips can do 1.2THs, but not at 600W. (40 chips possibly, between the two numbers.)

300W/7W = ~44 chips (low)
which would be 44*20Ghs=880GHs on the low 300W

600W/13.6W = ~44 chips (below nominal)
which would be 44*28GHs=1232GHs (1.2THs) on below nominal About 600W
Again, I assume this LIMIT is due to the PSU ability, and heat-dissipation ability. Not a limit of the chip itself. (If 44 is what is used.)

11 boards of 4 chips = 44
8 boards of 6 chips = 48
6 boards of 8 chips = 48
Or mixed, one with 4  or 6 chips, to even it out. For the 48-chip odd arrangements.

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does... They state perfect-world estimated ranges. 40MPG Hwy - 32MPG City, but it never gets that, ever... Thus 300-600W, and the "max speed" may only be 1.2THs. They never said what the low speed is.

They didn't even confirm that the A1 chip is what is being used. (That is what we assume.)

It isn't a LIE, if no-one has it yet. "Specs subject to change". Even then, it isn't a LIE, it is an error. If that is what they were told, then that is what they repeated, as specs. My video cards say 250W, but I have them running at 135W, and have pushed them over 290W. Yet the specs still say "consumes 250W". Which is not "at the wall".

But I agree that the specs seem under-estimated, possibly. (The other components are all low-power, except the PSU and fans. They run off USB-power, so they have to be low wattage.) Another thing they forget to think about, is European power is 240v, which is half the amps, and more efficient than American power at 120v. That will add 15-25% inefficiency to the PSU alone, even a platinum PSU, which is only rated at 90% efficient at 240V, with an 85% load. (Which, by the way, is a LIE, because PSU's never get that efficient. )

One more month, or two... and we will see the results, in full technicolor detail.

thanks for the explanation isawhim... nonetheless you will not convince that which does not want to be convinced. how does that adage go? you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. puppett and many others on this website are not thirsty. they are trolls plain and simple. they bring nothing useful to the table. they pimp there bias and speculation because they are attention whores, nothing more.

[s1lverbox]

1.2THs = 1200GHs

The spec-sheet says...
(20GHs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/20GHs = 60 Chips
60 * 7W = 420W

Respectively... On the top-end...
(40Ghs @ 1.0W/GH = 40W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/40GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 40W = 1200W

For AMT to state power consumption as 300W-.. is a lie.

With the above two stated setups... The lower one would operate at less than 300W, but not 300W while at 1.2THs speeds.

(20Ghs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
600GHs/20GHs = 30 Chips
30 * 7W = 210W

This same 30 chips can do 1.2THs, but not at 600W. (40 chips possibly, between the two numbers.)

300W/7W = ~44 chips (low)
which would be 44*20Ghs=880GHs on the low 300W

600W/13.6W = ~44 chips (below nominal)
which would be 44*28GHs=1232GHs (1.2THs) on below nominal About 600W
Again, I assume this LIMIT is due to the PSU ability, and heat-dissipation ability. Not a limit of the chip itself. (If 44 is what is used.)

11 boards of 4 chips = 44
8 boards of 6 chips = 48
6 boards of 8 chips = 48
Or mixed, one with 4  or 6 chips, to even it out. For the 48-chip odd arrangements.

Thus, like I said... like every MFG does... They state perfect-world estimated ranges. 40MPG Hwy - 32MPG City, but it never gets that, ever... Thus 300-600W, and the "max speed" may only be 1.2THs. They never said what the low speed is.

They didn't even confirm that the A1 chip is what is being used. (That is what we assume.)

It isn't a LIE, if no-one has it yet. "Specs subject to change". Even then, it isn't a LIE, it is an error. If that is what they were told, then that is what they repeated, as specs. My video cards say 250W, but I have them running at 135W, and have pushed them over 290W. Yet the specs still say "consumes 250W". Which is not "at the wall".

But I agree that the specs seem under-estimated, possibly. (The other components are all low-power, except the PSU and fans. They run off USB-power, so they have to be low wattage.) Another thing they forget to think about, is European power is 240v, which is half the amps, and more efficient than American power at 120v. That will add 15-25% inefficiency to the PSU alone, even a platinum PSU, which is only rated at 90% efficient at 240V, with an 85% load. (Which, by the way, is a LIE, because PSU's never get that efficient. )

One more month, or two... and we will see the results, in full technicolor detail.

thanks for the explanation isawhim... nonetheless you will not convince that which does not want to be convinced. how does that adage go? you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. puppett and many others on this website are not thirsty. they are trolls plain and simple. they bring nothing useful to the table. they pimp there bias and speculation because they are attention whores, nothing more.

are you working for another 5% off from atm?

[Puppet]

But anyways, you are complaining about a few watts, on specs that were an estimate, for a machine that didn't exist at the time, and is just being "made" now.

You are missing the point. Bitmine could miss their targets, and I wouldnt necessarily call them liars if they do. But if Im going to resell bitmine chips or build gear around their chips, and I put numbers on it that are impossible with bitmine's specs, then Im lying. If you like car analogies so much, its like BMW advertising their new electric car will have a range of x miles, and a dealership taking preorders claiming it will do twice that (and claim to take delivery of the cars before even BMW says it will manufacture them).

And no, even 600W is not possible at the wall at nominal speeds if bitmine hit their specs. PSU's, VRM's and the rest do consume power, thats a fact, not an estimate.

[ISAWHIM]

And no, even 600W is not possible at the wall at nominal speeds if bitmine hit their specs. PSU's, VRM's and the rest do consume power, thats a fact, not an estimate.

1.2THs = 1200GHs

The spec-sheet says...
(20GHs @ 0.35W/GH = 7W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/20GHs = 60 Chips
60 * 7W = 420W

If 20GHs is the "MINERS nominal speed", then that does hit the target, with room to spare, for any electronics.

(25GHs @ 0.6W/GH = 15W) = 1 Chip
1200GHs/25GHs = 48 Chips
48 * 15W = 720W

Nominal is "Near that range", for the chip. It is not ONLY that SPECIFIC value. You are as dense as they come when it comes to electronics and cars. Sorry, but you really need to stop investing in BTC if that is your greatest level of understanding. Actually, invest more, I could use some more easy money.

The chips don't have only 3 absolute levels of operation, they are showing you the RANGE, just as they do with cars. Driving on the road, or in a lab is irrelevant to the actual car you purchase. It is only expected to get NEAR that range, compared to the range of a SIMILAR vehicle with that same values, and get more than the other cars with lower values.

You are missing the whole point that the chips nominal value, and what the miners nominal operation, are NOT THE SAME. You don't drive your car at 120MPH, for hours, in a closed loop, or on the streets. Just as you don't only drive it 25MPH in that same situation. Your CARS NOMINAL value is not the MOTORS NOMINAL values. Depends on the transmission, how fat you are, if you live in the mountains, whether you got the turbo-intake, whether you got aluminum rims... I guarantee that a 4-cylinder and a 12-cylinder version of the same CAR will both do 120MPH... One just dies faster and takes longer and consumes more fuel, but its the same CAR. But that same engine in another CAR, will not have the same NOMINAL output, for the CAR. Though the engines NOMINAL output is exactly the same.

Anyways, it is clear that I am wasting my voice on the deaf. Consider me trolled by a troll. I am tired of teaching children how the world works for today.

I could care less about 5% off anything. I make more in a day then 5% off this unit would ever save me. Because I "know how the world works". lol. My mistake for thinking you wanted to know too. Since you keep asking, getting the answers, and then ask again. Something in your brain isn't functioning properly. Get your money back on that software, or pay for the upgrades, you need them.