Alpha Technology Litecoin (Scrypt) ASIC Miner Order Batch 1 Now!

[Ilan1]

I have been there and trust them, you need to relax, you are getting all wound up with no proper cause, they have said repetedly they will ship earliest 15th July and latest end of July, calling up CAB and Trading Standards and making a lot of premature and unnecessary noise is only going to create issues, and that if anything is going to be the root cause of any hold up, so it will be YOU that will be responsible, if units do not ship on time, stop being so dramatic, and selfish and think about all of the 1000's of other customers that have paid and are happy to wait until end of July before getting nervous.

Take it easy and go and find something else to pass the time whilst Alpha are hard at it to ensure our miners get delivered on time. Stop spreading FUD and stop making waves and causing problems, this is why you have been banned from the forum, no other reason, THE END

Well the issue is, they can't physically make the deadline at this point. Legally. Unless they change their design, again. Examine the CE certification process. It's required because they're including PSU's. If they don't include PSU's in the design, then that's one less thing to worry about, but now the end user will have to worry about it.

If they include PSU's in shipment, they need CE certification. Which takes 2-12 weeks (at best, with bribes), and they have to supply machines off of the assembly line. This means that they'd need to have already built the machines and had them in CE process weeks ago.

Unless they issue a fake CE sticker, or ship without CE certification -- both will cause the items to be held in customs.

And this is just one of 3 major issues which is cause for concern on their deadline. When asked about it, they have banned / ignored customers. While your experience with them may have been genuine, the fact remains they physically can't meet their deadline.

You make an interesting and rational point, is it not possible to pre-certify a PSU for shipping before it gets "put in the box" ?

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[vesperwillow]

You make an interesting and rational point, is it not possible to pre-certify a PSU for shipping before it gets "put in the box" ?

No, CE certification requires that the system be tested as the consumer is designed to use it. Which means even if you just toss a power brick in the box.. this is how the CE labs have to test it.

Which is why they physically can't make deadline without removing the PSU from the equation.

[Ilan1]

You make an interesting and rational point, is it not possible to pre-certify a PSU for shipping before it gets "put in the box" ?

No, CE certification requires that the system be tested as the consumer is designed to use it. Which means even if you just toss a power brick in the box.. this is how the CE labs have to test it.

Which is why they physically can't make deadline without removing the PSU from the equation.

Well this does concern me, at least someone is talking with some sense in this thread! (Minus the attitude)

[Ilan1]

Exactly and they have finished designing or if you wish to call it "developing" so there job is done it is now over to the foundry - it is you who is the one embarrassing yourself

Definition of:foundry

A semiconductor manufacturer that makes chips for third parties. It may be a large chip maker that sells its excess manufacturing capacity or one that makes chips exclusively for other companies.

Oh dear!

I'm sorry but wtf are you talking about?? 

You think you can edit your post after I've written mine in some juvenile attempt to trip me up. I quoted it before you edited it son, so now you look like an even bigger arse

Seriously. Go back and read my posts. I've forgotten more about this stuff than you clearly know. 

By all means continue your pathetic attempts to justify your gamble with Alpha. But don't, for the love of God try to pretend you have even the slightest understanding of the Asic development process You just look like a fool..

Has it not occurred to you (whilst you are ranting and being abusive) that we are infact saying the same thing! However what you label as "Development" I consider to be Design and Creation, read my first post!!

[retro72]

Well this does concern me, at least someone is talking with some sence in this thread! (Minus the attitude)

Sense...... You can't even spell the word.

If you had even bothered to read the thread you'll see this was covered pages back and a lot of perfectly rational arguments were put forward to explain why we believe Alpha has little chance of meeting their July deadline.

Before running off at the lip. Maybe you should take the time to read at least some of the posts. It will save you some embarrassment

[retro72]

Has it not occurred to you (whilst you are ranting and being abusive) that we are infact saying the same thing! However what you label as "Development" I consider to be Design and Creation, read my first post!!

Good. I'm glad we agree. Night night.

[Ilan1]

Well this does concern me, at least someone is talking with some sence in this thread! (Minus the attitude)

Sense...... You can't even spell the word.

If you had even bothered to read the thread you'll see this was covered pages back and a lot of perfectly rational arguments were put forward to explain why we believe Alpha has little chance of meeting their July deadline.

Before running off at the lip. Maybe you should take the time to read at least some of the posts. It will save you some embarrassment

The only one who should be embarrassed is you with your nasty attitude, it is you my friend that is making a fool of himself, what's your problem anyway, are you unable to have a civil discussion without being such an Nasty arse, and you wonder why you got banned from the Alpha forum. Oh Dear!

[retro72]

The only one who should be embarrassed is you with your nasty attitude, it is you my friend that is making a fool of himself, what's your problem anyway, are you unable to have a civil discussion without being such an Nasty arse, and you wonder why you got banned from the Alpha forum. Oh Dear!

Ok.  I'm not going to continue this discussion. Its going nowhere. I'll say this, go back a few pages read what has been posted by me and others and you'll see why we are dubious, to say the least.

If you do you'll see:
Alpha are using "risk lot" chips. Basically foundry samples that haven't gone through proper testing. Just to save time. This brings reliability massively into question

They will have to fit 13 PCBs, containing 208 chips in total, along with heatsinks, fans 3 PSUs, controller boards etc into a 4u case (for the 250mh/s) This is IMPOSSIBLE. Please go back a couple of pages and find my post showing pictures of other asics. At most they have 5 PCBs. If they do manage to cram this much gear in, it will not last a week and will probably burn your house down. The case will have to be MUCH, MUCH larger. Something they have yet to disclose to their customers. Yet they're asking for final payment.

The units still have to be CE certified

If you look at Alpha's own timeline. Systems assembly and testing takes 20 days and should start early next week for them to be on time. They haven't even got the wafers yet., let alone chips. So they are a way off. To make up the time, they have said they will be cutting testing short to deliver in July. Even Cointerra didn't do this when they were a month behind, and look what happened there. Again another blow to reliability.

They have lied to their customers regarding the Distance selling regulations in order to withhold their legally entitled refunds.

As a Start up with no accounts and a high risk product, it will be very difficult for them to get a bank as a credit card Processor. Something they have been promising customers for weeks.

I could go on but I'm sure you get the picture. With all of the above going against them you can see why I get hot under the collar when people drop by without reading previous posts, taking my posts out of context, accuse me of spreading FUD and tell me to chill.

After reading your posts on Hashfast:(https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=262052.msg4555678#msg4555678 )
I'm frankly staggered that you would come here and try to defend Alpha at all. You thought Hashfast were legit and bought from them after dodging BFL. So you can see why the "I think they're nice guys" argument doesn't cut it for me.

I hope you see where I'm coming from. I wish you luck

[brian_23452]

you are likely correct...I am looking at it more from the point if they pull a BFL intentional or otherwise and CAN'T SHIP IN JULY....if it ships end of July and I won't get it till August actual..I will likely get Amex to dump for not getting item according to timeline

that much will likely work

Actually their T&Cs and FAQs state their timeline as Q2/Q3.

"We are currently working hard to ensure that the products will be available for delivery as soon as possible, and hope to have them available for shipping in the second or third quarter of 2014"

Saying they HOPE to ship in July doesn't change anything. They are only bound by the timeline stated in the T&Cs.

So Amex, or any other CC company won't get a penny out of their bank unless they ship in October.

This is yet another reason why Ive said from the get go this is a scam.  Even if by some miracle of all miracles they manage to get this thing ready in July, they still aren't contractually obligated to actually ship the things.  They can, entirely within the terms of the agreement, sit there and mine with them for a few months until they are no longer profitable and then ship them out.

I have been there and trust them, you need to relax, you are getting all wound up with no proper cause, they have said repetedly they will ship earliest 15th July and latest end of July, calling up CAB and Trading Standards and making a lot of premature and unnecessary noise is only going to create issues, and that if anything is going to be the root cause of any hold up, so it will be YOU that will be responsible, if units do not ship on time, stop being so dramatic, and selfish and think about all of the 1000's of other customers that have paid and are happy to wait until end of July before getting nervous.

Take it easy and go and find something else to pass the time whilst Alpha are hard at it to ensure our miners get delivered on time. Stop spreading FUD and stop making waves and causing problems, this is why you have been banned from the forum, no other reason, THE END

Oh, well since you visited them all is well I guess.  I guess the illegal attempt to circumvent consumer protection laws with the laughable excuse that you aren't a consumer should just be forgiven?
Anyways, as to what I said about delivery.  This is from the contract that you agreed to when you purchased your imaginary product:
"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence."

I didn't just make my claim up.  It says it right there in the contract you signed!  If they lied to you, it doesn't matter because you signed away their liability.  If they finish the units on time, and decide not to ship them on time so they can mine with them instead, too bad, you signed your rights away.  

Even then, there is no contractual promise of July.  There is no contractual delivery date at all, but to the extent that there is it is as follows"
"We are currently working hard to ensure that the products will be available for delivery as soon as possible, and hope to have them available for shipping in the second or third quarter of 2014"
July is not in the third quarter.

Not sure what your business or legal background is, but as a general rule, companies do not put terms into contracts if they do not plan to enforce the terms when beneficial.  There is 0 chance you or anyone else that preordered has one of these things by July, and I will wager any amount of bitcoins with a reputable escrow of your choice on this.

[Searing]

note: long post on cc options with alpha and what my amex customer service people have been telling
me voice..

if you are not interested I warned you ..feel free to skip (or put me on /ignore I won't mind I don't know you anyway!)

onward (see below)

I did NOT post this on www.alpha-t.net forums..figured it would just get deleted (see announcements they just put up
on use of forums) but feel free to link this message over there...that MAY work?



In a previous post I mentioned that if Alpha (in good faith I give them that) allows credit card payment
thru their bank this coming week as they state) and at least with an Amex card (I assume the same would apply with other
cards) If I pay the remaining 70% via credit card (for my protection if they BFL and I DON'T GET my item by Aug 1st (not
when they ship when I get my Item) I've been told by (2) Amex folks that the 70% cc remaining payment..if I chose to
pay..WOULD BE protected by my Amex card and fully refunded all of it (and I again assume other credit cards same) ..

It is up to the merchant to prove they ship'd it in a timely manner..not just say they are gonna and arrival is also considered (like ship on July 21st from wherever in the world I get it in "in hand" Aug/Sept...don't fly)

OK..so odds are good if "I choose" to pay that last 70% via cc option on my Vyper 50mh unit (if alpha does offer such cc next week) and all is "golden'  Alpha is on the up and up ships in July etc etc....they did their part I did my part..successful business arrangement done!

Just got off the phone with the 2nd amex person I talked to about this..(see above) .and we went further in the conversation
then just the 'can I get my 70% back if I decide to pay such next week to alpha ...that I asked the 1st amex rep a week or so ago)

I said 'well assuming that they did not ship in time and I could get my 70% back remaining that I paid may pay
this coming week what about the 30% down via paypal (which is past 45 days) what...I paid last jan 5th it was paypal....

I was interrupted at that point ..he offered this I did not ask (was going to) *they rarely interrupt..*

If that is the case he said and you did not get the item in the timeline they mentioned..we would dispute and pay
you back the remaining 70% you paid a month previous and also refund you the 30% down you paid in Jan 2014
IN FULL..if they did not deliver and it is good enough for the 70% remainder disputed to pay back..it holds true for all the money you
sent them ..and you would get the full 100% back in the dispute..if they miss the July shipping deadline..

I then asked what about..this business to business UK stuff where we are not 'consumers' that alpha claims in its
terms (which i should get a copy of by the way heh) ..the amex guy laughed
and said that does not make any difference the Amex protection exists for our consumer users and business users..
was not sure how if you lived in the UK this would work ..did not apply to me (usa)

Again the burden of proof is to ship the item on time....if they 'say' they are gonna ship July 18th and you can show
us it will not get to you by august 1st and/or they have NOT shipped (the old BFL 2 more weeks game) you can also
get refunded...all 1005

well ...imho that means that IF alpha is 'legitimately" trying to get the product out for its customers IT WILL get the
credit card option up next week to pay as they state..and that will go a long way to show they are at least trying
to get stuff out...even if cc option does not favor them if they can't deliver...(former bfl refugee intent goes a long
way with me)

If the credit card option goes away (as their phone not working due to tech difficulties in latest announcement! )
and they want wire xfer or LTC or BTC only...well...I'm taking my jan 30% refund back and running away!

In other words I then contact Amex and say I can't pay the remainder with credit card as they have stated...I'd like my 30% down payment from Jan 2014 back

and again the Amex guy said that is how it would play out

heh (like the fact paypal 45 day does not apply to amex card payment using paypal)

so contact your Amex card rep or other credit card company before you pay the remaining (or not) 70% down payment
due by credit card next week and/or ask about jan 30% down options

if 'suddenly' Alpha does not have a credit card option for Amex...I guess that will tell us all something and after informing
amex of such ....blam my 30% down payment will get refunded...Amex said they fully understand my want/need to pay by
credit card the last 70% if for some reason I can't I would get my 30% down payment back...that would not look very
'legit' in amex's view....

again I assume Alpha is 'legit' in that they are 'trying' to get us equip..i will hold out for such equip as long as possible
in July as my part of the agreement....

but hey...thats why i used my amex card via paypal last jan 2014 on the 30% down and will pay amex the last 70% this next week (if it is offered)  they mess up I'm not gonna hold the bag.. (the hashfast/BFL game show)

feel free to use this message and link it on the www.alpha-t.net customer forums...if
they delete it I guess that tells us something as well

again do your own conversations with your cc companies you paid your 30% down with and I encourage all if they
plan to pay the last 70% to use a cc for their protection after talking to your cc reps to determine options

(actually quite impressed with Amex they seem downright gleeful on going after anyone you have a beef with..must break
up the day or something? )

anyway hope this helps ...now we wait to see if cc option is offered next week (6/15 to 6/21) as they have stated
that imho would be a very good sign that they are at least 'trying' to fulfill their obligations as they state...

again good luck

Searing

[miri94]

thank you Searing

[Searing]

thank you Searing

again....this probably? means I'm 90% covered...the prev amex post...but w/o actually canceling my Vyper 50mh if so with amex
can't be 100%..encouraging however if i should want to pay the last 70% to www.alpha-t.net....that I have some protection.

just don't want to get BFL'd again for not shipping! (that took 1 year and 20 days to get my $8.5k back!)

but check with your own cc company etc etc...but what I was told w/o 'actually' going thru with refunding my order

Searing

[retro72]

again....this probably? means I'm 90% covered...the prev amex post...but w/o actually canceling my Vyper 50mh if so with amex
can't be 100%..encouraging however if i should want to pay the last 70% to www.alpha-t.net....that I have some protection.

just don't want to get BFL'd again for not shipping! (that took 1 year and 20 days to get my $8.5k back!)

but check with your own cc company etc etc...but what I was told w/o 'actually' going thru with refunding my order

Searing

Hey Searing. Thanks for looking into this. Great work. But there are a couple of key questions that still haven't been answered as far as I can see.

1) Is Amex jointly liable? Joint liability means you get paid directly from Amex. They don't have to chase Alpha's bank. If they are not jointly liable, Amex don't pay you themselves, they ask Alpha's bank for a refund.
This is critical as they bank will only provide refunds if there is money to do so. This means if 100 people pay on their CC. Alpha spends 70% of those funds on Foundry costs, PCB fab, Salaries, enclosure manufacturing etc. Only 30% will be available for refunds. So only 30 people will get paid.

2) What timeline do Amex consider to be binding? The hoped for July delivery Alpha have stated in forum posts and newsletters, or the Q2/Q3 delivery they have laid out in their terms. Alpha have been very careful not to promise a July delivery. Fiaz actually stated a few pages back that July delivery was guaranteed. When I pressed him on this he quickly backpedaled.

This is pretty fundamental, as Alpha will argue only the timeline stated in their T&Cs is binding, so they will not be obliged to consider a refund until October. Don't forget their terms state "available for shipping" Q2/Q3 not "delivered to you" so they have even more wiggle room. (not to mention that little gem brian_23452 found lurking at the bottom of their T&Cs)

Also, as they are trying to use a UK bank (Lloyds Cardnet) if Amex are not jointly liable, you can bet Lloyds will not refund potentially hundreds of thousands of pounds based on internet postings. They will look very closely at the terms and conditions to ascertain whether they have to pay.

All in all, a card is better than a bank transfer but to what extent depends on answers to the above questions. Also don't forget, as Alpha are bound by UK consumer law you can send the unit back within 7 working days it for a FULL 100% refund, if you are not a business. As long as they have the funds to pay that is.

[Searing]

again....this probably? means I'm 90% covered...the prev amex post...but w/o actually canceling my Vyper 50mh if so with amex
can't be 100%..encouraging however if i should want to pay the last 70% to www.alpha-t.net....that I have some protection.

just don't want to get BFL'd again for not shipping! (that took 1 year and 20 days to get my $8.5k back!)

but check with your own cc company etc etc...but what I was told w/o 'actually' going thru with refunding my order

Searing

Hey Searing. Thanks for looking into this. Great work. But there are a couple of key questions that still haven't been answered as far as I can see.

1) Is Amex jointly liable? Joint liability means you get paid directly from Amex. They don't have to chase Alpha's bank. If they are not jointly liable, Amex don't pay you themselves, they ask Alpha's bank for a refund.
This is critical as they bank will only provide refunds if there is money to do so. This means if 100 people pay on their CC. Alpha spends 70% of those funds on Foundry costs, PCB fab, Salaries, enclosure manufacturing etc. Only 30% will be available for refunds. So only 30 people will get paid.

2) What timeline do Amex consider to be binding? The hoped for July delivery Alpha have stated in forum posts and newsletters, or the Q2/Q3 delivery they have laid out in their terms. Alpha have been very careful not to promise a July delivery. Fiaz actually stated a few pages back that July delivery was guaranteed. When I pressed him on this he quickly backpedaled.

This is pretty fundamental, as Alpha will argue only the timeline stated in their T&Cs is binding, so they will not be obliged to consider a refund until October. Don't forget their terms state "available for shipping" Q2/Q3 not "delivered to you" so they have even more wiggle room. (not to mention that little gem brian_23452 found lurking at the bottom of their T&Cs)

Also, as they are trying to use a UK bank (Lloyds Cardnet) if Amex are not jointly liable, you can bet Lloyds will not refund potentially hundreds of thousands of pounds based on internet postings. They will look very closely at the terms and conditions to ascertain whether they have to pay.

All in all, a card is better than a bank transfer but to what extent depends on answers to the above questions. Also don't forget, as Alpha are bound by UK consumer law you can send the unit back within 7 working days it for a FULL 100% refund, if you are not a business. As long as they have the funds to pay that is.

yeah I was gonna ask him on your points but I doubt the rep would know ..he was imho coming from the point of view of a 'legit' business....I was asking in a way of not accusing Alpha of not trying to deliver but what I could do if they did NOT deliver

thus..we did not get into games they could play above by limiting funds or playing games with the TOS etc

if it gets to that point ...well ..my money is probably lost because they would likely imho only do this IF they were going bankrupt or some such or in some really deep hurt
which I guess is possible

only so far I could push the hypothetical w/o calling them outright 'scam' at that point we would have moved on to the Amex guy urging I refund my 30% (which I don't know may be the correct thing to do) with the silence by alpha the chip maker's pulling them from their site as a purchaser of their chips...the 'you are business games'

well duh...I should probably just punt

my view is that if they really really are in trouble the bank under no circumstances will give them a way to pay by credit card .it would be too shaky...I may still take the risk
if they did take cc as an option..but man even that is bit shaky now with out further info

but likely I'll have to get MORE INFO then just 'here is our cc option" before that point in time

ie for example

say the cc option comes out next week June 15th to the 21st ...it was stated Alpha will take cc orders for 2 weeks after they start their cc option...
that takes us up to July 1st ...and if they say they hope to have a miner out to us in July...well duh...

well...if they have NO PROTOTYPE at that point and or NO info on chip status..and same old 'trust us' it will look pretty weak at that point and me an amex
have another nice conversation on how i can 'run away' and get my 30% back (maybe)

er ...I'm pretty sure just with that info to amex (no prototype and they ship that month July....only 1 month....no info on chip status if it left the foundry...the you can't refund but on
our terms because we treat customers as a business (the amex guy really thought that was dumb) and lets face it the continued plain ass silence by them on progress) the Amex
guy would let me punt easy at that point (heck could have prob punted my jan 2014 stuff last nite talking to him for that matter)

anyway all that...I'd have the best shot at that point just asking for my 30% refund back via the amex way...again alpha at that point has setup many  limited options to amex dispute (if they have the money for amex to get or not well that is a diff issue) and or close accounts so amex has no recoures... or I go by their refund policy...with their refund policy i get like 217usd back lose 450....if I can't get my 30% refund back at all ...makes no sense just ask amex to push the whole amount if it gets to that point
whoop de do...I'm out 217....and that is if the don't deliver ..my amex attempt fails....or I refund from them in good faith under their plan

If amex at that point can't get my money I doubt there will be any refund money to be got..even under their weird rebate senario

it is like what do they expect us to do..just roll over and give them NON cc on the 70% and or not use our previous cc rights with our card companies on the previous
30% we put $$$ down on? or the next 70% final payment?

but yeah it could all be a big stall...my 667 usd may already be gone and they are just playing ochestra music to keep us calm with all this cc provider bank stuff
so that we don't notice the Titanic is sinking till they are well away in the life boats

but anyway hypothetically I pushed it about as far as I could get away with but to be fair to the Amex guy.....if they are a legit company and don't ship we should
always get our $$$ back on a pre-order refund (got the one guy at amex not warned about BFL dang it) anything beyond that and I'm telling amex they are a scam
was not ready to go that far at this point in time....if I think they are a scam/or just plain unable to deliver then amex can get informed of such

anyhow if it gets weird I will go thru amex for my 30% down payment back ...may not work but imho I'd have a better shot with them then waiting last in line
getting only my 217 usd back via alpha if it all goes to sh*t

again ask your own credit card folks...this is just my *maybe unique* conversation on a 'what if' with (2) Amex reps withing the last 3 weeks ..the 2nd convo
was last nite

well at least I can say if it don't work ..they not only 'tricked me' but amex and paypal also (better then bfl then it was all me wire xfer sigh)

Searing

[retro72]

@Searing. Whatever you decide. Good luck mate. I'd hate to see you lose money.

I've been thinking. I assume Alpha never confirmed you or anyone else was a business at the time of purchase. So you are still covered by the UK Distance Selling Regulations unless they can prove otherwise. This means you are entitled to a 100% refund of your deposit if you decide to cancel (not sure if Amex would do this) but you are also entitled to send the unit back for a full refund within 7 working days of receiving it, whether that's in July or any other time..

Something to think about. Anyway mate good luck. I'm off to watch the world cup!! C'MON ENGLAND!!

[anderl]

@Searing. Whatever you decide. Good luck mate. I'd hate to see you lose money.

I've been thinking. I assume Alpha never confirmed you or anyone else was a business at the time of purchase. So you are still covered by the UK Distance Selling Regulations unless they can prove otherwise. This means you are entitled to a 100% refund of your deposit if you decide to cancel (not sure if Amex would do this) but you are also entitled to send the unit back for a full refund within 7 working days of receiving it, whether that's in July or any other time..

Something to think about. Anyway mate good luck. I'm off to watch the world cup!! C'MON ENGLAND!!

And this is another reason that Alpha cannot fall back on the statement that all their customers are business clients.  To define a purchaser as a business client you need to have "on record" the tax identification numbers of the client you are dealing with.  Alpha doesn't even need to verify that the client they are working with is a business as defined by the government of the country that the business is in.  

I run a business and have vendor contracts and I can assure you that they verify and keep on record my tax id number.  So if Alpha did not require (not  an optional field) a business identification number as provided by the client then they will have a hard time convincing a judge or magistrate that their clients are actually businesses.  Alpha is screwed there.

[nightengale]

When is the deadline? It's been changed so many times I don't even know. Leaning against paying the balance at this point. If more people refuse to pay the balance, they will have to either come up with bigger lies or bigger truths (as well as amnesty for delayed payments). Either is preferable to where we're at, with minimal information.

[Searing]

you are likely correct...I am looking at it more from the point if they pull a BFL intentional or otherwise and CAN'T SHIP IN JULY....if it ships end of July and I won't get it till August actual..I will likely get Amex to dump for not getting item according to timeline

that much will likely work

Actually their T&Cs and FAQs state their timeline as Q2/Q3.

"We are currently working hard to ensure that the products will be available for delivery as soon as possible, and hope to have them available for shipping in the second or third quarter of 2014"

Saying they HOPE to ship in July doesn't change anything. They are only bound by the timeline stated in the T&Cs.

So Amex, or any other CC company won't get a penny out of their bank unless they ship in October.

not entirely sure on that the Amex rep said I could refund my $$$ the 30% from Jan in that it has been a bit of time...the logic is (if he is correct)
that I put money down to hold a pre-order...thus it has not shipped thus I could get my $$$ back

that is my assumption w/o actually going thru with it

In other words the 30% down was to "hold a product till it came to pass" and I changed my mind...the company I sent my $$$ to can't hold me to
a product that is a pre-order and just get it out at their leisure...from amex point of view you would get orders for products that would ship way past
their expire date and other games

anyway...it is the only game in town I have ...if I decide to get my refund back will go the amex route first

but from what I can tell you call amex up and you say "I want to refund my 30% down on a product that does not exist yet stated to ship latest 3rd Quarter
of this year on their TOS but I can show that they were shooting for a timeline in July...well ..I have cold feet now on if they can pull such off...and can't
won't wait as their TOS says to 3rd quarter of 2014...can I get that refunded

as far as Amex is concerned..you don't have the product yet you can get a refund ..ie it an't shipped you don't have to pay

now someone with amex or another cc company on here needs to follow through on this and let us know myself still fence sitting I am

(although this may be just to see if they actually offer a cc option as they state or get rejected...the above refund option would be a sure
thing imho if I went to Amex and said I put down on my pre-order 30% down via paypal ..and now they don't take paypal and want the
other 70% via wire xfer only...Amex I very sure would not think that was such  a good idea on a product not shipped yet)

anyway we will know when someone pulls the plug on their cc order of 30% and posts it on here..again the stuff I did with amex
was just asking w/o accusing alpha as a scam...simple how do i proceed on this eguip order if i keep or if i try to refund

felt I had to post it on here

but it is up to others to pursue and make their own calls and conclusions with their cc companies

just my experiences on 2 amex customer rep calls

Searing

[Seldombill]

Hi to all

Where the hell will connect the 13 chip pcb ?   if this board is for others spec previous to the increment on MH per unit.

https://alpha-t.net/news/development-update-29032014/

the board on the image need to be re-maked, i think we are on scam wagon.

Where are the pics for the chips PCB ? this need to be ready and waiting chips. easy to take a picture.

Where we enclosure 13 PCB and heatsink ?

And the CE issue ?

who is manufacturing the chips ? and where ?  - Globalfoundy not have any news related to alpha chip fabrication!!

If want to put these vital questions in the alpha-t´s forum automatic ban and deletion of the post.

Retro72 i´m with you.

alpha.t are delete the post the don´t want to show to users and not be alarmed. bad behavior to be transparent.

retro72 count with me when all not satisfied customers have to bring legal action against alpha.

The timeline of event´s are well designed, we are paid 30% and they changed the rules ( customer to business ) no full refund. the first customers are out of luck more the 5 moth...
 
I´m 250M/h CE vapor customer i think.

[pastet89]

Difficulty will go to 100K...