Alpha Technology Litecoin (Scrypt) ASIC Miner Order Batch 1 Now!

[Its About Sharing]

Just got a response from Alpha-t regarding my asking for refund options.  According to the e-mail since I placed the order > 5 months ago I basically don't have any :/

Kind of curious given I made final 70% payment within the last few weeks.  Getting the feeling I won't be seeing these satoshi's again :/

It's right in the contract:

" You may cancel your order at any point within the five month period following the date on which we received payment of your deposit (provided that your product has not yet shipped)."

Hey, Its About Sharing, looks like they do plan on enforcing that pesky ole contract after all huh?  Imagine that.

Brian, if you recall, I asked you about this here: "I'm not sure about the way the contract is worded. Can you post what it is that you are talking about?" https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=314402.msg7454111#msg7454111 And now you are taking a shot at me?

You really seem to like to jab at me. I asked you a few questions on that same page (here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=314402.msg7449856#msg7449856) and you seemed to just jump over them. Since you're in a playing mood, maybe you can have a go at them now. Here, at least answer the one that mattered.

In your reply to diego2000 you state "Put another way, say YOU had a couple hundred 250Mh/s miners right now.  Would you really head down to Fed Ex tomorrow and ship them off, or would you wait a while, make some money, and THEN sell them?  All due respect, I think it is very naive to think they would leave all that money on the table." This sounds like something you would do and you are projecting it onto others. I would ship them off because I honor my word. Life is not about making as much money as I can. We reap what we sow. I'm not sure how you can judge AT when you are basically saying you would do something that you are accusing them of, because, well, it is the "natural" thing to do.

To be honest, I completely missed your post.  To answer your questions, the concerning parts are:

1.  Regarding the delivery date, they keep promising these will ship in July.  But, if you read the terms of the contract, there is NO delivery date to be found anywhere!  The *closest* stating a delivery date is as follows:
"We are currently working hard to ensure that the products will be available for delivery as soon as possible, and hope to have them available for shipping in the second or third quarter of 2014"

Now, that isn't a guarantee.  They could ship these things next year and still claim they did their best.  But let's give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they stick to the tentative dates set forth in the contract.  They could still ship these things September 30th and then claim to have shipped them right on time (Q3). 

2.  Regarding what you actually get.  They promise you 5, 50, 250Mh/s or whatever the numbers they are using now are. Notice this key phrase:
"Be advised that due to the nature of their development our products are subject to change and the final device may be different to what was advertised to you whether on our site or elsewhere."

3.  And of course the escape clause: 
"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence."

In other words, if they completely breach the contract (hard to do, since they aren't required to do much of anything but still), even if they purposefully screw you over and ship late, there is nothing you can do.  You agreed to not hold them liable even if it is their fault, and even if they do it on purpose. 

Thanks for pointing that out.

I understand they are not going to guarantee a delivery date. I don't have a problem with point 1.  Point 2 could be a bit worrying as if those chips are not up to spec due to the nature of the quicker turn around, we are stuck. Point 3 sucks.

But what truly has me a bit worried now is what I posted above, all of Apha's posts here have been deleted (minus the quotes). That is unsettling. So, my point above about waiting for final payment until something is ready to be shipped (with CE certification) is poignant now.

IAS

ps - You didn't answer my projection question. Albeit, that is an uncomfy one.

Well I don't see how you can just dismiss point one considering that is the one we have argued about the most.  And arguably is the most important.  The *only* thing these devices do is mine scrypt.  Exactly how much they mine is completely dependent on when they are delivered.  Had these devices shipped April first, they would have been worth a fortune.  If they ship September 30th, they will be near worthless.  Kind of makes a huge difference no?  Would be like sending 10K to coinbase to purchase bitcoins and not caring how many they send you.
Regarding your question:

"This sounds like something you would do and you are projecting it onto others. I would ship them off because I honor my word. Life is not about making as much money as I can. We reap what we sow. I'm not sure how you can judge AT when you are basically saying you would do something that you are accusing them of, because, well, it is the "natural" thing to do."

You completely miss the point.  They ARE honoring their word!  There is nothing dishonest about it.  They never promised (in any sort of legally binding way anyways) a delivery date.  The closest they came to one is September 30th shipping date.  I think you misunderstand my posts.  I am not judging them.  Frankly, I think they were too stupid to pull off what should have been easy money but their plan itself was brilliant (albeit, stolen from others).  The entire reason I posted what I did is because I DO trust them to do their best to fulfill the terms of the contract.  On the other hand, I think many people such as yourself didn't actually pay any attention at all to what it was they were actually promising when you sent them all that money. 

Now I DO think they were disingenuous at best regarding what they posted on the forums and stuff.  But remember these were sales people.  That's what salespeople do.  They paint their product in the best possible light.  What I was simply suggesting was to not simply take them at their "off the record" word, but look at what they were willing to put on the record.  If a person tells you over and over and over again that something will ship by a certain date they are 100 percent sure of it, BUT they won't sign that into the contract, obviously they aren't nearly as sure of it as they are saying. 
Where I disagree with you is, you seem perfectly willing to take their sales people's promises at face value.  I on the other hand ask myself, if they are so sure of the specs and delivery dates, why aren't they willing to sign to that?  This has nothing to do with my personal honesty.  Simply my experience in the business world has been over and over again, that nothing anyone says is worth a damn, the only thing worth a damn is what it says in the contract.  I guess we will have to agree to disagree.  I can promise you though I get ripped off less often then you

If I misinderstood your post, which apparently I did, then how can we agree to disagree? Ehehehe
TBH - I have been blessed for the most part. I always have chalked it up to like attracts like with some spirit guides thrown in. ;-)

Regarding point 1, I see your point now. I was looking at it quite innocently in that they didn't have control over all the supply chain and such. Speaking of which, I look forward to blockchain tech fixing things like this via some transparent supply tracking, or something related.

I can't outright accuse AT yet as it is just hard for me to believe that someone would risk so much, potentially hurting a family name (accounting firm) just for some money, and with the possibility of jail or a severe fine.

I'm wondering why there isn't an uproar over the deleted posts. I know enough to know that is a bad sign and quite alarming.

Thanks for the information/reply,
IAS

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[retro72]

I'm wondering why there isn't an uproar over the deleted posts. I know enough to know that is a bad sign and quite alarming.

Thanks for the information/reply,
IAS

I just went through the thread and Fiaz has removed every single one of his posts.

Fiaz has posted conflicting statements regarding Alpha's finances. Stating here on 22 may:

"We did try to hold it off as much as possible (despite cries on this forum for final payment) but taking it now will allow us to order crucial components earlier so we can start large scale all at once. "

Then this on the 19th June:

"I assure you we have enough funds, some may forget but when we started we had no competition for a long time, if there are any sales to be had in Scrypt mining we would be the ones with them"

I'm not sure whether he's trying to hide this and other conflicting statements he's made, or just just being childish but it seems pretty unprofessional to remove all of your spokesperson's posts.

If we are to take him at his word and assume Alpha have taken enough final payments to finish production then I suggest anyone still waiting to pay, wait until Alpha have a test unit hashing. That should be in a couple of weeks, if they are on track for a July delivery.
As you will have 2 weeks after they set up a payment processor to send the final payment you can do this without penalty and considerably minimise your risk.

[retro72]

"This sounds like something you would do and you are projecting it onto others. I would ship them off because I honor my word. Life is not about making as much money as I can. We reap what we sow. I'm not sure how you can judge AT when you are basically saying you would do something that you are accusing them of, because, well, it is the "natural" thing to do."

You completely miss the point.  They ARE honoring their word!  There is nothing dishonest about it.  They never promised (in any sort of legally binding way anyways) a delivery date.  The closest they came to one is September 30th shipping date.  I think you misunderstand my posts.  I am not judging them.  Frankly, I think they were too stupid to pull off what should have been easy money but their plan itself was brilliant (albeit, stolen from others).  The entire reason I posted what I did is because I DO trust them to do their best to fulfill the terms of the contract.  On the other hand, I think many people such as yourself didn't actually pay any attention at all to what it was they were actually promising when you sent them all that money.  

Now I DO think they were disingenuous at best regarding what they posted on the forums and stuff.  But remember these were sales people.  That's what salespeople do.  They paint their product in the best possible light.  What I was simply suggesting was to not simply take them at their "off the record" word, but look at what they were willing to put on the record.  If a person tells you over and over and over again that something will ship by a certain date they are 100 percent sure of it, BUT they won't sign that into the contract, obviously they aren't nearly as sure of it as they are saying.  
Where I disagree with you is, you seem perfectly willing to take their sales people's promises at face value.  I on the other hand ask myself, if they are so sure of the specs and delivery dates, why aren't they willing to sign to that?  This has nothing to do with my personal honesty.  Simply my experience in the business world has been over and over again, that nothing anyone says is worth a damn, the only thing worth a damn is what it says in the contract.  I guess we will have to agree to disagree.  I can promise you though I get ripped off less often then you

^^ this
Fiaz posted this on 19th March:

"...but the fact we were the first to start means we can guarantee shipping in July"

When pressed about this guaranteed July delivery, he quickly posted this retraction on the 21st March:

"Ah, a poor choice of words on my part. We are on schedule and very much expect to ship in July as has been the plan for a while now but of course there are never guarantees, my apologies."

Pretty much everything that Alpha has written in their updates or posted, is speculation. Absolutely nothing is guaranteed. Their terms and conditions absolve them from all liability if things go wrong.

I posted early in this thread that Alpha could string this out for 5 months, then force mass cancellations by sowing the seeds of FUD and walk away with all the deposit money according to their T&Cs. This is happening now. Whether by ineptitude or design,  Alpha's flimsy update, no prototype, the lack of payment processor and the constant refusal to answer fundamental questions is causing more and more people to ask for refunds, only to be told they will receive a fraction of what they paid or nothing at all.

They are rigidly enforcing the letter of their T&Cs but failing to honour the promises they have made on the forums. Most notably this:

"Additionally we have decided to be as ethical as possible regarding pre-orders and as such we only took 30% deposit. Once we have conducted the majority of our development and have a working ASIC prototype to demonstrate only then will we ask for the remaining 70%. Ensuring only when we have proven our hash rates and customers are fully satisfied with what we have achieved and the product we will be sending will they have to pay in full. We see this as a customer focused approach as opposed to taking the full amount months before completing development when it isn't really necessary."

Moral of the story. Take what they post with a grain of salt. Their T&Cs are the only thing they feel accountable to and they stacked in their favour.

[vesperwillow]

Look at that, people aside from myself are noticing he's wiping his tracks clean. Yet another area of concern. So did I read that correctly? In the fine print they're saying they can't be held responsible, even if it's due to their own negligence? That's usually not a legal term of agreement in most countries with OEM's.

[brian_23452]

Look at that, people aside from myself are noticing he's wiping his tracks clean. Yet another area of concern. So did I read that correctly? In the fine print they're saying they can't be held responsible, even if it's due to their own negligence? That's usually not a legal term of agreement in most countries with OEM's.

Correct.  This is quoted straight from their TOS:

"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence...",

and there are a few similar lines in there. 

Now I don't know how it is in the UK but in the US no matter what you put in a contract, you are still liable for outright fraud, and it wouldn't surprise me if the UK is the same (I think generally UK has better consumer protection laws than US).  But on the other hand, looking at how they are skirting the law with the refunds, one can assume they would do the same thing here, and that it would take lawsuits to actually enforce. 

My personal guess is, they will refuse refunds to everyone, and if they get sued and eventually have to give back some of the money they consider that an acceptable loss, as it won't be all of it (many people won't press the issue) and even if they do have to give back, they got interest free loans to build their cloud mining operation. 

[vesperwillow]

Look at that, people aside from myself are noticing he's wiping his tracks clean. Yet another area of concern. So did I read that correctly? In the fine print they're saying they can't be held responsible, even if it's due to their own negligence? That's usually not a legal term of agreement in most countries with OEM's.

Correct.  This is quoted straight from their TOS:

"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence...",

and there are a few similar lines in there. 

Now I don't know how it is in the UK but in the US no matter what you put in a contract, you are still liable for outright fraud, and it wouldn't surprise me if the UK is the same (I think generally UK has better consumer protection laws than US).  But on the other hand, looking at how they are skirting the law with the refunds, one can assume they would do the same thing here, and that it would take lawsuits to actually enforce. 

My personal guess is, they will refuse refunds to everyone, and if they get sued and eventually have to give back some of the money they consider that an acceptable loss, as it won't be all of it (many people won't press the issue) and even if they do have to give back, they got interest free loans to build their cloud mining operation. 

Your hunch is definitely probable. When they first started trying to earn business, their history and address were questioned, as the company had been around in various forms ( a few name changes, the same family ) for awhile, 10-20 years depending on how you viewed the data. Considering they haven't expanded much in that time, I'd imagine they do enough to pay bills, or use whatever high profits they make for their personal lives. Some folks early on even said they could share data showing a connection to some of the terror cells, but that was entirely hearsay.

For sure they're a small business, and regardless of their original intentions, it appears they're doing everything they can to cover their tails. Especially in the last 48 hours with the multitude of posts being erased from this thread. I hope for a good eventuality, but weren't they supposed to provide an update Monday (yesterday their time) ? I think that's what they said, and unless I'm mistaken, it's past Monday and I saw no emails or updates.

[nwfella]

Just got a response from Alpha-t regarding my asking for refund options.  According to the e-mail since I placed the order > 5 months ago I basically don't have any :/

Kind of curious given I made final 70% payment within the last few weeks.  Getting the feeling I won't be seeing these satoshi's again :/

It's right in the contract:

" You may cancel your order at any point within the five month period following the date on which we received payment of your deposit (provided that your product has not yet shipped)."

Hey, Its About Sharing, looks like they do plan on enforcing that pesky ole contract after all huh?  Imagine that.

A/ that contract term is not legally valid under UK law, so it means nothing. If they don't deliver the goods he's entitled to a full refund, and the CC card will most likely agree with that.

B/ he said he paid the remaining 70% within the last few weeks, I don't see anything in the contract about that not being refundable.

This too is the part that had me stumped.  I think I'm going to try giving their offices a call again in the next day or two and see if I can get something other than an answering machine.

[VJLoops]

Some folks early on even said they could share data showing a connection to some of the terror cells, but that was entirely hearsay.

Geez, who said that?  If they had proof I'm sure they would have forwarded it to the proper authorities and they would be behind bars.  What a bunch of BS imho.  Actually, I heard Fiaz was actually a trained assassin from the future sent back in time to scam people to help fund the revolt against the alien invasion.    So my contribution is actually helping mankind.  You guys will thank me later.

fyi, I am a customer, I've paid a deposit but haven't paid the remainder (still undecided).  As the saying goes don't invest what you're not willing to lose. 

[LongAndShort]

So in a nutshell, what i can gather is the company is saying in not so many words that they need you guys to pay up so they can finnish building the miners..

So to me that says if you don't pay up then be prepared to get miners really late and or not at all; losing your deposit. I would just pay up or get out either way its you that is delaying either thing happening here and not AT.

[vesperwillow]

Some folks early on even said they could share data showing a connection to some of the terror cells, but that was entirely hearsay.

Geez, who said that?  If they had proof I'm sure they would have forwarded it to the proper authorities and they would be behind bars.  What a bunch of BS imho.  Actually, I heard Fiaz was actually a trained assassin from the future sent back in time to scam people to help fund the revolt against the alien invasion.    So my contribution is actually helping mankind.  You guys will thank me later.

Yeah, myself and others told the person to stop posting such rubbish if it's unfounded and to just go to authorities if they wanted to talk that way. It was within the first few pages of the thread.

So in a nutshell, what i can gather is the company is saying in not so many words that they need you guys to pay up so they can finnish building the miners..

So to me that says if you don't pay up then be prepared to get miners really late and or not at all; losing your deposit. I would just pay up or get out either way its you that is delaying either thing happening here and not AT.

Some folks are reading it that way. Fiaz stated last week (Thursday?) an official company update, a "big" one, was coming Monday. Which has now come and gone. This is a pattern for them, most of their "we will have an update" comments never provided updates. With their removal of his commentary on web forums, and their "we can't be held liable even if we cause the issue" clause, it appears they're preparing for a fallout.

It's not to say they can't or won't ship a product, but there's so many caution and redflags coming out this situation that it's becoming white noise.

[retro72]

So in a nutshell, what i can gather is the company is saying in not so many words that they need you guys to pay up so they can finnish building the miners..

So to me that says if you don't pay up then be prepared to get miners really late and or not at all; losing your deposit. I would just pay up or get out either way its you that is delaying either thing happening here and not AT.

No. What we are saying is that they have posted conflicting statements regarding this. But in their last update they stated  they have enough money to finish production.

"We will be producing as many units as ordered without waiting for card customers to pay thus if you have not yet paid your order will still be manufactured regardless"

If we are to take them at their word, there is no reason for you to pay now. It makes more sense to wait until they have a working test unit, which should be in a couple of weeks if they are on schedule. You can then pay the balance by CC if you still wish to proceed, without taking unnecessary risks.

[nightengale]

It looks like all posts from Fiaz https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=220493 have been deleted!

That is super dodgy. Glad I didn't pay the balance on my Viper-50.

[Futune]

I got a reply form consumer advice and heres the response I got about distance selling regulations.

"We understand from your email that you have cancelled an order and the trader has only partially refunded you.



I would first like to clarify that the role of the Citizen Advice consumer service is to provide consumers in the UK with a telephone and online service offering information and advice on consumer issues.  We work in partnership with Local Authority Trading Standards Services.

 

Your rights and obligations:

 

Under the law of the United Kingdom, any terms and conditions provided by the trader are separate to your rights under the Distance Selling Regulations. However, they are legally binding for both parties. If they offer you certain rights then you can request that the trader honours these rights otherwise you will hold them in breach of contract. On this basis you can request that they either honour the agreement otherwise you will pursue them for a reasonable level of compensation.

 

Any supporting evidence you have to show that the trader has breached the contract is going to be useful and you should present this to the trader when making your complaint.

 

I will now explain your rights in relation to the Distance Selling Regulations. Please note that these regulations have since been replaced, but will still apply to your contract. Prior to 13/06/2014 when you enter into a contract with a trader by means of a distance communication (telephone, internet, mail order etc.) you will have cancellation rights under the Distance Selling Regulations. Please note that the following types of transactions are not covered by these regulations meaning that you cannot cancel once you have placed your order.

 

•Items liable to deteriorate or expire rapidly;

•CDs, DVDs or software that has had the plastic seal or cover removed;

•Items that are ordered to meet a customer’s specification, such as a made to measure item of clothing;

•Financial transactions (these are covered by the Financial Services (Distance Marketing) Regulations);

•Auctions, including TV auctions and on-line auctions;

•Business to business transactions;

•Items sold from a private individual not acting in the capacity of a business

•Purchases that have resulted from face to face contact.

•for the supply of newspapers, periodicals or magazines

•Items sold from a private individual not acting in the capacity of a business plus, contracts for the provision of accommodation, transport, catering or leisure services, where the supplier undertakes, when the contract is concluded, to provide these services on a specific date or within a specific period.

 

When this period ends depends on when the trader provides written information (in print or by email) confirming details of the order and your cancellation rights -

 

• If the trader sends the written information before they send the goods or enclosed with the goods – the cancellation period ends 7 working days from the day after the goods are received;

 

• If the trader sends the written information after the goods but within 3 months - the cancellation period ends 7 working days from the day after the written information is received;

 

• If the trader sends the written information over 3 months after the goods, or not at all – the cancellation period ends 3 months and 7 working days from the day after the goods are received.

 

If you cancel you may ask for a full refund including any delivery charges. The trader must provide this refund within 30 days.

 

If applicable, the trader may ask you to return the goods and/ or pay the return costs but can only do so if it was made clear in the written information.  If the written information does not specify that you are responsible for returning the goods, you may expect the trader to collect the goods; if it does not specify you are responsible for the cost of return then the trader must bear this cost.  Until the goods are returned to (or collected by) the trader, you have a ‘duty of care’ over the goods so it is important not to use the goods or do anything else which may damage them as this may mean the trader is not obliged to provide a full refund.

 

To cancel you must inform the trader either by letter, email or fax and it must be sent before the end of the cancellation period.  We would advise to include details (for example any order reference number) to help the trader match your cancellation request to their records.

 

Your next step:

 

If you want to pursue a civil claim and are presently based in Canada then you may want to ask a friend, relative or colleague based in the UK to pursue this on your behalf. To do this the person should write to the trader.  The letter should outline any relevant events regarding this issue and make it clear what you expect from the trader and why.  It should also give the trader a reasonable time to resolve the matter.  You should send the letter by recorded delivery which means that the trader has to sign for it. You will then have proof that it’s been received. You should also keep a copy of the letter. Template letters are available on our website. While there isn’t an appropriate template, you may use them as guidance for writing a letter of complaint.

 

You may also wish to contact your local equivalent of our service as they may be able to offer additional practical and legal advice; particularly with regards to your payment method.

 

Criminal offence:

 

I would like to confirm that attempting to restrict a person’s rights in law is a potential criminal offence.

 

What we’ll do:

 

We are going to report the matter to Trading Standards. While this may not help to resolve your dispute, it gives Trading Standards valuable information about how the trader operates. Someone from Trading Standards may contact you if they require further information.

 

If you require any further advice or information about this case, please do not hesitate to contact the Citizens Advice consumer service by return email or by calling 03454 04 05 06 quoting the case reference number.

 

Thank you for your enquiry."



So now the question is does an asic fall under any of those transactions listed?

[retro72]

Good man. I wish you luck.
Just so you know asics are not covered by those items so you are fine. Anyone else in who has requested a refund and been fobbed off by Alpha should also contact the CAB. This will force Alpha to comply with UK consumer law, refund their customers or face potential prosecution.

[vesperwillow]

Careful now, Red Star Mining could accuse you of spreading unwarranted FUD.

[wilson1973]

It looks like all posts from Fiaz https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=220493 have been deleted!

That is super dodgy. Glad I didn't pay the balance on my Viper-50.

All posts deleted... Oh dear that doesn't bode well for the future of Alpha or its Vipers.... I seem to remember them shouting from the rafters and being proud to be open and transparent. Now all that has happened is that they have been backed into a corner, retreated and gone to ground in their own forums where they are king of the hill and can ban anyone for saying anything other than what they like to hear.

Dark days are looming.

Does anyone hang around the Alpha forums, whats the word on the street ? I've been banned three times for asking the same question so can't be arsed to try another account !

[Don007]

All posts deleted? Jeez, what's that going to mean?

If they're truely legit, it's a really weird decision to delete all your posts isn't it?  Fiaz probably made some appointments which aren't going to be real or something, I can't think about other reasons why all his posts are deleted.  Or the mods did, but I don't think they've any incentive to do that. (Or a mod must feel like he's scammed or something, but that won't be professional).

Nevertheless, I don't think we'll receive an answer from Alpha-T. Atleast not here. Let's hope not all those $ are gone..

[vesperwillow]

In browsing the official AT forums (looking for perhaps good news which has been missed), instead I noticed that it's been mentioned this week that the units will no longer be standalone. Now, I might've missed that in an update, but isn't that kindof defeating the majority of the original design?

They were supposed to be rack mountable, or stackable however you want, simply provide a power cable and your mining details. Totally self sufficient, including wifi or ethernet. Now they're not only wired but there's no central comptroller. You'll have to connect them to a computer or another similar device. So they're acting like really large gridseed / blade units basically.

I half expect to hear they'll be shipping soon, but that you'll need your own reflow oven to put them together. Projected shipping date is no later than 31 July.

[allcoinminer]

In browsing the official AT forums (looking for perhaps good news which has been missed), instead I noticed that it's been mentioned this week that the units will no longer be standalone. Now, I might've missed that in an update, but isn't that kindof defeating the majority of the original design?

They were supposed to be rack mountable, or stackable however you want, simply provide a power cable and your mining details. Totally self sufficient, including wifi or ethernet. Now they're not only wired but there's no central comptroller. You'll have to connect them to a computer or another similar device. So they're acting like really large gridseed / blade units basically.

I half expect to hear they'll be shipping soon, but that you'll need your own reflow oven to put them together. Projected shipping date is no later than 31 July.

If you read their last update once more you can find that, the statement self says the shipment will only start on 31July.

[wilson1973]

In browsing the official AT forums (looking for perhaps good news which has been missed), instead I noticed that it's been mentioned this week that the units will no longer be standalone. Now, I might've missed that in an update, but isn't that kindof defeating the majority of the original design?

They were supposed to be rack mountable, or stackable however you want, simply provide a power cable and your mining details. Totally self sufficient, including wifi or ethernet. Now they're not only wired but there's no central comptroller. You'll have to connect them to a computer or another similar device. So they're acting like really large gridseed / blade units basically.

I half expect to hear they'll be shipping soon, but that you'll need your own reflow oven to put them together. Projected shipping date is no later than 31 July.

If this is true then you are paying for something which is significantly different from what was advertised.

Watch out for the next news update... build your own miners.... lol.