Alpha Technology Litecoin (Scrypt) ASIC Miner Order Batch 1 Now!

[Phorna]

Even not a single word that they have promised to show working unit before requesting the final payment. Every chip foundry would provide at least estimated delivery date by the time order is placed. So chips were designed but no further steps taken imho. Partnership canceled, posts deleted, terms of contract quietly changed - bending of the reality started...

[retro72]

See?  This is what I was talking about.  I know the ordinary average person pays little mind to TOS's and contracts and such, but companies meticulously plan every detail that goes into them.  This is what I was trying to say earlier, if a company put something in the contract, you can be certain they will take advantage of it if at all possible.  

The thing is, Alpha are trying to slip these changes past their customers. Hoping no one will notice.
 
It will be interesting to see if Alpha try to enforce these new changes on customers who bought under their original terms. They state Alpha customers will be given an EXACT shipping date, will be asked to pay 8-10 weeks before the shipping date, will have a 2 week window to pay, will have multiple payment options, and a partial refund if they forfeit.

These are all out of the window now, but customers who bought the product before these changes, are entitled to have the original contract honored. Assuming they have a copy of the original contract. Although I'm guessing the majority of Alpha customers never even read it, let alone made a copy of it.

[vesperwillow]

It's also interesting to note the frequency and volume of their sudden change of terms, heart and attitude, since several folks began asking pointed, logical questions, which couldn't be avoided.

[retro72]

Spotted by magic-beans-for-sale on litecointalk.

Alpha have removed the July "guarantee from their update:

https://alpha-t.net/news/viper-update-20062014/

https://forum.alpha-t.net/index.php?topic=687.0

" And we are sorry the payment processor keeps getting delayed we are doing everything we can to get it to you as fast as possible, rest assured we are committed to it so it will happen but some things are just outside of our control; as soon as it’s up we will email you".

« Last Edit: Today at 08:36:40 PM by Fiaz Malik »

Looks like Fiaz just edited it again.

[retro72]

I just read Fiaz's, quite frankly childish response on the Alpha-T forums to the posts here and on llitecintalk about the changes to the terms and conditions (he has since edited it to tone it down). It can be found in its entirety here:.

https://forum.alpha-t.net/index.php?topic=706.msg4452#new

The pertinent point is this:

"Firstly, your terms can not be retrospectively changed, the terms you accept are the terms that apply to you, any changes after you place your order are for new customers only."

An interesting statement as they have already breached their original T&Cs by not providing an EXACT shipping date when they asked for final payment, 8-10 weeks before shipping.

"30% advance payment to be paid along with booking and registration. Balance payment of 70% shall be collected 8-10 weeks before shipment date. The exact shipment date shall be notified on our website"

They have also failed to provide any videos and not much in the way of images:

"We will try to disclose as much information as possible including the development updates with images/videos/statistics."

I guess they still have time for that. Although these statements have been omitted from later T&Cs

Interestingly they removed all reference to Dexcel from their original T&Cs "Update" section sometime after 10/02/2014 but before 22/03/2014. Make of that what you will.

I would suggest Alpha customers either ask for the terms that apply to them (good luck with that) or use wayback machine or Google cache to find them.
They have quietly added some amendments to the original terms that you don't want to be on the wrong side of including but not limited to this little gem:

"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence."

Essentially, if they breach the T&Cs they cannot be held liable. So if they ship a unit sometime next year or it hashes at half the speed....too bad. This statement IS NOT in their original terms. It was added some time after 10/02/2014. I would suggest you check your payment date and read through the T&Cs you signed up to at that time.

Good luck.

[s1gs3gv]

Fiaz Malik -> "We are aware it has been some time since an update and do wish we could apprise more often. This is something that can only be done when it makes sense and we cannot do this on demand ...

<snip>

 … We are extremely busy at the moment and do apologize if you are still waiting for a response from our payments team. We will be up to date on our emails within a matter of days (there will be a few exceptions so please I know nobody likes waiting but if you're not being served it just means somebody else is)."


Huh ? "… we do wish we could apprise more often … can only be done when it makes sense .. cannot do this on demand … if you're not being served it means somebody else is"


This has got to be a living nightmare for anyone with an alpha-t pre-order.

[Searing]

Well I know I mentioned it before but the "guarantee" was obviously a lie.  They told their customers that they were trying to get a payment processor but that it was completely beyond their control, and then in the same breath said they guaranteed one by July.  Obviously one of those mutually exclusive declarations had to be a lie.  
I am going to stand by my original speculation that they never had any intention of getting a payment processor.  Taking credit cards means they have to do refunds as they would be forced by the CC company.  Not allowing credit cards allows them to play this "you're a business" game and make it as difficult as possible to get a refund, after luring in unsuspecting customers who thought they were protected with the refund guarantee.  

yes it does look likely that either they 'can't' get a cc processor or choose not to do so...if it is choose not to do so it will force some to consider (bank xfer folks) losing their 30% down completely or doing another wire xfer or whatever on the remaining 70% to recoup something

it is beginning to look like that is the process alpha may be using to cover their butt

anyway amex has listed it as a fraud purchase under my paypal dispute but again (previous posts) they do all the leg work and will tell me zip on what
they are doing

but imho if alpha has no cc processing and no paypal anymore ...kinda hard to see how amex is gonna get my $$$ back

if that falls thru next step is the posting by the consumer protection agency in united kingdom (on this thread previoulsy)

hey I got a full refund from BFL of 8.5k after 1 year and 20 days anything is possible!

(of course a lifetime of luck may have been used up in the BFL refund.....that was about as likely as getting hit by a meteorite)

so the fickle finger of fate having f***ked moves on!




p.s. read some previous posts to this reply on this thread (see above posts) ...yep looks like that is exactly what they are doing....changing the TOS is a low blow and tips their hand
reading that change in their TOS (see above posts) there is no way this week reading that I'd pay another 70% esp with 400mh Titans from KNC hitting the
network in a month....

well...thats that i guess....pretty clear we are f*c*ed on our deposits......only hope now is my amex dispute and/or the uk consumer protection link
previous in this thread if amex has no luck

I guess the rule of thumb is if BFL can get away with this stuff for years why can't we change our TOS and do the same....If their was any consumer
protection (FTC) that worked in the USA ...BFL would have been slapped down last year and this crap would likely not be tolerated anymore....

Guess we will see how this 'farce' ends in approx 3 weeks

Searing

[vesperwillow]

For what it's worth, BFL has been taken to court numerous times and BFL lost each time. It started in December, and has continued. Somewhere on the forums is a thread which has collected all of the lawsuits. BFL has, of course, played it down and ignored it when folks bring it up.

Nothing can be done like that for this situation until AT is in breach of the appropriate legislation for the UK. Now, I would say they already are as some have pointed out their terms do not fall within guidelines, but UK citizens have to bring the suit, or others will have to somehow get complaints filed in the UK.

[benjamin07]

Alpha-T reminds me of a joke about countries whose constitution is written in pencil not in pen, changed every day to suit the needs of the ruler.

I will be suing Alpha-T and this Fiaz as a personal lawsuit not as a member of a company, I will make him personally liable so he goes to jail not pays a fine.

[Phorna]

"We shall not be liable to you for any loss of profit or for indirect or consequential loss suffered by you whether as a result of any breach of these terms by us or as a result of our negligence."

Is such a disclaimer even allowed by the law? Literally it means that Alpha's customers have no rights at all - only duties divided by obligations.

[retro72]

So this is the latest nugget from Fiaz on the Alpha forum.

Forceflow

"Thanks for your answer.  I am glad the changes are not retrospective.  As far as the hashrate increases, I am well aware you didn't have to do anything other than deliver a 25Mh/s miner but that is not what is currently being promised now.  You gave everyone 2 weeks and these changes are not specifically listed as prospective.  While some may not believe in questioning -- I thought that was the point of this forum.  If you don't like to read it, don't.  Its not hard."

Fiaz

"Come on now even 1 week is MORE than enough time, how many months has it been since we took deposits. My point was EVEN IF we went back on our word of 2 weeks and promised 1 week that wouldn't be close to 'VERY SHADY'"

So Fiaz thinks going back on your word and giving customers HALF of what you promised them "wouldn't be close to very shady" Nice to see exactly what Alpha's promises are worth.

This only strengthens my belief that Alpha tried to slip these changes past their customers, hoping no one would notice. Only after they were publicly outed did they begrudging concede that these surreptitious changes would not be retrospectively enforced. Although you only have Fiaz's word and I wouldn't hold much stock in that.

[retro72]

You should also be aware that Fiaz has just deleted his account and removed every single post he has on litecointalk. Exactly what he did here a few days ago.

This is his former profile on litecointalk:
https://litecointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24384

And on bitcointalk:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=220493

So he has now attempted to remove all traces of his posts on both of the major crytpocurrency forums. Not what you would expect from an open and transparent company is it?

[maardein]

You should also be aware that Fiaz has just deleted his account and removed every single post he has on litecointalk. Exactly what he did here a few days ago.

This is his former profile on litecointalk:
https://litecointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24384

And on bitcointalk:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=220493

So he has now attempted to remove all traces of his posts on both of the major crytpocurrency forums. Not what you would expect from an open and transparent company is it?

Their company seems to become less trustworthy every minute.

[vesperwillow]

You should also be aware that Fiaz has just deleted his account and removed every single post he has on litecointalk. Exactly what he did here a few days ago.

This is his former profile on litecointalk:
https://litecointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24384

And on bitcointalk:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=220493

So he has now attempted to remove all traces of his posts on both of the major crytpocurrency forums. Not what you would expect from an open and transparent company is it?

Haha, wow.

As if folks needed any more evidence that something is amiss, this is a clear sign that something isn't going well.

[vesperwillow]

Hey guys, I just noticed they removed their photos from the website: https://alpha-t.net/about-us/team-2/

Here's the wayback snapshot from a couple months back: https://web.archive.org/web/20140210074928/https://alpha-t.net/about-us/team-2/

They were there not 2 days ago.

Image:

[Cablez]

I hope you guys are collecting all the before and after screenshots.  I have a sneaking suspicion that they may be needed in the near future.

[bumface]

i orderd the large thing for 9371 usd and this thread is scaring the shit out of me

Please show us a working prototype

[brian_23452]

i orderd the large thing for 9371 usd and this thread is scaring the shit out of me

Please show us a working prototype

Lol really?  After all this you seriously think there is a working anything?

[bumface]

i can not loose 10k, if they cant deliver my asic then refund the total in current btc value.i sacrificed starting a company for this and my money is frozen in this asic for half a year...

[kebabman]

i can not loose 10k, if they cant deliver my asic then refund the total in current btc value.i sacrificed starting a company for this and my money is frozen in this asic for half a year...

Oh man, I'm sorry, I think it's going to be really hard to get your BTC back.