NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[dzarmush]

I have a large account balance, and the other day I noticed a few separate transactions in my history where unknown users to me had sent 1 NXT amounts to my account. I hadn't noticed them before, as the only difference between a forged NXT and a sent NXT is the small icon next to the transaction number.

I suspect someone was experimenting with trying to identify the location of accounts with large balances on the network. I don't have much experience with these things, but I suspect there could be ways of analysing transaction logs and other data sources to try and determine the IP address, or identity/location of an open account.

My account number is one of the accounts on the block explorer page of top accounts, so I think someone was searching for the location & account status of big accounts.

Dont worry. It was me, who added your account to one of NXT faucet, as you seems too poor to fund activity of NXT supporters or too busy watching your balance growing.

Joke. Or not?

Dont take it personally. This is my message to all high volume shareholders.

Why don't you read what I said? I'm suggesting all large holders of NXT, like myself, pool a big wad of NXT together and donate ALL the forged NXT to community activities that further all out interests FOR MANY YEARS.

This is my message to the NXT community - read & think before you comment and act.

Rather than set myself up as a 'leader' of NXT on the basis that I got lucky and sent BcNext 1 bitcoin, I'm advocating trying to be smart about things. I can see there are much better people than me to co-ordinate the distribution of any contribution I can make. I can also see that donating to random people who ask is not the best way to go. Some of them might have big voices but small minds, and lack talent and good ideas. Some might be scam merchants.

I revealed myself as having a big stake  - maybe that was unwise.

I'm suggesting that  decisions on how to spend any donated NXT be made by the best and brightest in the NXT community - to avoid donating NXT to people who post negative comments without reading and thinking first.

I'm looking for a structure to support NXT for years, not a few random acts to the loudest voices.

I want to support smart people. Does your comment to my post about setting up a forging trust account suggest you are smart? I just offered to support the NXT community for many years, and you replied "as you seems too poor to fund activity of NXT supporters or too busy watching your balance growing" Then you make a joking reference about hacking my account to donate it to a NXT faucet, presumably because I'm not donating enough.

I'm not taking it personally (you don't know me), but I'm suggesting you need to consider your approach if you want my support . I expect that you would read and think before posting a reply.

I think it's a great idea. At least for a start. If major stakeholders just sell all their coins there will be no power to prevent bad things that might happen in future. There should be some kind of fund or something that developers could use for whatever the system might need: new nodes, marketing etc.

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[utopianfuture]

Why push aldrin to do anything? He can do whatever he wants with his stake. You can rest assured he's going to use it well, no need to blabla in my eyes. Supporting contributions to the project sounds fine.

The system won't work if all the big stakes just hoards a big stake. If he finally does as he said, basically his nxt become dead because it is only sitting there for forging without entering the economy.

If this would be the case, then the initial distribution of NXT to stakeholder is in fact the problem. It was decided to do it the way it was done. There is no way to change the rules now. IMHO, aldrin has every right to do what he want with his NXT - technically and morally.

Apart from that, I think that the system DOES work even when all the big stakes just hoard a big stake. There is still a certain percentage of NXT moving around.
Big stakes will probably not hoard forever. It depends on the price made by the moving NXT, the potential NXT still has (over time) and the temptation of cashing out.

Marcus (small-stake)

It is just like adding a feature to nxt network to counterreact hoarding. If you want all kind of cool stufs for nxt why don't you want a feature that will make nxt a sustainable system? I am big stake definitely in top100. I am also economist. I am taking a position for the best of nxt network and the idea of decentralization.

[landomata]

I have an idea which would help distribute some of your Nxt and also help Nxt develop for the long term.


We will start a contest where the 10 best ideas for a client feature or application which would help Nxt grow over the next 5 years.

We would be open to entries from all Nxters and the community will vote for the best 10 ideas which would get funding.

The development fund would be managed by those currently in charge of the bounty program.

10 idea's each get 200,000 NXT to implement their feature or application to the Nxt ecosystem.


Total Development Fund Needed: Nxt 2,000,000


I can immediately start the thread where idea's can be deposited....Final voting can begin in a weeks time.


What do you guys think?


 

[dzarmush]

Now I see your point, but I think that instead of forging with the big accounts, let others, with smaller Nxt stakes forge, and better donate couple of hunders k for bounties that will really help Nxt to succeed. Like bybitcoin is doing it.

Don't tell people what to do and you won't hear where should you go.

I´m sorry, but that´s bullshit.

I think everything I´ve done so far was in the best interest of Nxt.

Probably so, I didn't follow. Anyway if the guy goes out from the shadow and suggests to pledge some really good money it's not the right thing to ask for more and more and more.

[utopianfuture]

there has to be a tax against money not put into circulation. Cfb , is it possible to design such a scheme?

Isn't that what freicoin or any fiat currency is doing? I'd sell my NXTs and go back to bitcoin if any such thing was implemented.

I would definitely sell all my next if there is no mechanism to counterreact hoarding because it is not going to work any other ways.

[smartwart]

Now I see your point, but I think that instead of forging with the big accounts, let others, with smaller Nxt stakes forge, and better donate couple of hunders k for bounties that will really help Nxt to succeed. Like bybitcoin is doing it.

But who should I donate my couple of hundred k too? I know that sometimes the smartest guy in the room says the least, and the loudest guy is actually full of shit. Why don't we try and setup a group consensus first to co-ordinate things a little. I want a decentralised NXT, but in this critical phase why not try and have a loose structure to maximise the bang for our NXT buck. I know I'm not the guy to decide who should get some community funding, so I want to donate through a consensus of people who have shown they are smart and capable. I saw the list of people posting in this thread. I vote for quality, not quantity. Who are the really smart people with good ideas? They decide where my NXT goes.

here are some thoughts about a concept call "mining hubs" to accumulate accounts for forging without the need to transfer the stake to one account.
its not a complete worked out concept and just a idea need to prove with some developers if its possible to implement.
there were already a few words:

Would it ever be possible to make pools of some kind with Nxt?

Why not? Same basis: transactions.

just a comment to this interesting topic:

as we know, members of these fond need to trust one person who manage the forging-account.
charming would be to have "forging-hub's" where stake holders can connect their accounts.
the earned fees would distributed proportional to the account balance.
the hub manager keep a fee - for sure ;-)

I could imagine that concept would join more people as the single account-concept.
an nice side effect would be that the periodic distribution of all fees would generate new fees...
this sustains the whole system.

[BloodyRookie]

@cfb: What is the field "referencedTransaction" in the transaction class for? Could you explain a bit?

[swartzfeger]

re: contributing/helping the cause

sometimes I feel like a real turd reading this thread.

I (mostly) live paycheck to paycheck (sorry, no pity party intended). Instead of QQing about unfair distribution, etc etc, I calculated the max I was comfortable investing, and I now proudly hold 6500 NXT (about 1/10th of the minimum I'd like to hold, but what the hey, you gotta start somewhere).

Once reality/math collided, and I realized that even 100k balances weren't really forging squat, I then started to think in terms of contributing.

I know enough Objective-C to get myself in trouble... i.e., someone could deliver an iOS app 5x faster with 5x the features. Still, it's a skill. I've been wanting to do a NXT MacOS ticker but I've been coming up empty handed for APIs. I emailed DGEX almost a week ago but haven't heard back.

In a former life, pre-divorce (ca. 2006) I handled cmyk separations/traps, etc for RR Donnelly. I know Photoshop inside and out. taught Photoshop courses.

RasPi -- buying a Pi or Odroid-U3 wouldn't break the bank... I'd prefer to spend the $ on NXT, but if it helps the cause, why not? But just how important is something like the Pi in the grand scheme of things?

Recommendations? I'd really like to do something other than reading this thread for 2+ hrs every night (it's a great way to unwind tho!)

[laowai80]

there has to be a tax against money not put into circulation. Cfb , is it possible to design such a scheme?

Isn't that what freicoin or any fiat currency is doing? I'd sell my NXTs and go back to bitcoin if any such thing was implemented.

I would definitely sell all my next if there is no mechanism to counterreact hoarding because it is not going to work.

If you want the money system to tax savers with inflation or any other means, just use the USD or whatever fiat currency is used in your country, there is no difference then. I think it's against NXT's principles to infringe upon people's freedom to do whatever they want with their NXTs. The only penalty with the purpose to help keep network strong is if they don't forge - temporarily lose forging chances. Any other penalties would be dictatorship.

[klee]

From my IT guy:

DDoS Deflate is a  bash shell script which purpose is blocking a denial of service attack.

the following installation guide is about cent os .

How to install

1. Login to Cent OS as root
2. run terminal
3. run the following commands
a. "wget http://www.inetbase.com/scripts/ddos/install.sh"
b. "chmod 0700 install.sh"
c. "./install.sh"


Configure

After installing the script the following directories and files
will be created

program directory =/usr/local/ddos
program =/usr/local/ddos/ddos.sh
ignore_ip_list=/usr/local/ddos/ignore.ip.list
cron (scheduller) =/etc/cron.d/ddos.cron
apf ( advanced policy firewall) =/etc/apf/apf
ipt (iptables) =/sbin/iptables

edit configuration file

run the following command on terminal
cd /usr/local/ddos
vi ddos.conf
( to edit the file with vi editor just type "i" , when finished  press escape then ":" "w" "q" and enter )

Configuration file settings

Freq= ( how often the script is executed in minutes )
Ddos - cron ( cron sceduller update )
No_of_connections ( number of connections received before an IP is blocked )
Apf_ban ( 1 means that it will use apf , 0 it will use iptables )
Ban_period ( time in seconds to block an IP )
Email_to ( address to send an email when an IP is blocked )
Kill ( when value is 0 no IP is banned )


In case you get blank IP edit the main script ddos.sh and replace

"netstat -ntu | awk ‘{print $5}’ | cut -d: -f1 | sort | uniq -c | sort -nr > $BAD_IP_LIST"

with this one

"netstat -ntu | grep ‘:’ | awk ‘{print $5}’ | sed ‘s/::ffff://’ | cut -f1 -d ‘:’ | sort | uniq -c | sort -nr > $BAD_IP_LIST"
( be sure to keep the command in a single line )


Uninstall  DDos Deflate

1. Login to Cent OS as root
2. run terminal
3. run the following commands
a. "wget http://www.inetbase.com/scripts/ddos/uninstall.sh"
b. "chmod 0700 uninstall.sh"
c. "./uninstall.sh"

[aldrin]

Why push aldrin to do anything? He can do whatever he wants with his stake. You can rest assured he's going to use it well, no need to blabla in my eyes. Supporting contributions to the project sounds fine.

The system won't work if all the big stakes just hoards a big stake. If he finally does as he said, basically his nxt become dead because it is only sitting there for forging without entering the economy.

I think for the whole system to work, there has to be a tax against money not put into circulation. Cfb , is it possible to design such a scheme?

My suggestion is for big stake holders to pool their holding together (separate accounts but all donating to the same fund).

I'll summarise my position very specifically - i've got about 4% now - I sell down down at a steady rate to about 1%, and I add the bulk of remaining 1% to a the 'community forging fund' for communal funding efforts. Obviously if other big stake holders don't join in the forging would be slightly under 1% - but that's of all transactions on the network. If others joined me, it could be 5-10% - OF ALL TRANSACTION FEES GOING BACK INTO DEVELOPMENT - that would fund a lot of good things. We could have a budget and actually plan things (a little, I know decentralisation is king)

So my personal plan is this

1- steady dispersal of 3% of my 4% of NXT supply to other people in a calm and measured way (and I make money and feel good)
2- 1% is forging 24/7 for community funding - more if others join me (everyone feels good)


Criticise what I'm suggesting, but first understand my position. Ask questions. Don't assume.

[marcus03]

Why push aldrin to do anything? He can do whatever he wants with his stake. You can rest assured he's going to use it well, no need to blabla in my eyes. Supporting contributions to the project sounds fine.

The system won't work if all the big stakes just hoards a big stake. If he finally does as he said, basically his nxt become dead because it is only sitting there for forging without entering the economy.

If this would be the case, then the initial distribution of NXT to stakeholder is in fact the problem. It was decided to do it the way it was done. There is no way to change the rules now. IMHO, aldrin has every right to do what he want with his NXT - technically and morally.

Apart from that, I think that the system DOES work even when all the big stakes just hoard a big stake. There is still a certain percentage of NXT moving around.
Big stakes will probably not hoard forever. It depends on the price made by the moving NXT, the potential NXT still has (over time) and the temptation of cashing out.

Marcus (small-stake)

It is just like adding a feature to nxt network to counterreact hoarding. If you want all kind of cool stufs for nxt why don't you want a feature that will make nxt a sustainable system? I am big stake definitely in top100. I am also economist. I am taking a position for the best of nxt network and the idea of decentralization.

I share your intentions and I think it's cool that you have them being a high-stake.

However, I assume that the average high-stake has other priorities. IMHO, the feature that you are proposing would kill NXT within a few days. Hoarders would cash out and I would, too (hopefully before them...).

[laowai80]

A spectre is haunting NXT, the spectre of communism.

[neer.g]

@ Aldrin,
We will start a contest where the 10 best ideas for a client feature or application which would help Nxt grow over the next 5 years.
Total Development Fund Needed: Nxt 2,000,000
I can immediately start the thread where idea's can be deposited....Final voting can begin in a weeks time.
What do you guys think?

I agree with Aldrin that we need to let it grow naturally and see proven results before we spend funds.
Having a contest for 10 best ideas is good, but who will guarantee the implemetation. I would love to doante when I know someone like nexern/jean luc/cfb for example is standing behind it. This apply to software development, marketing and all other areas.
I don't have the time to do it myself, but I'll be happy to continue donating.

[utopianfuture]

there has to be a tax against money not put into circulation. Cfb , is it possible to design such a scheme?

Isn't that what freicoin or any fiat currency is doing? I'd sell my NXTs and go back to bitcoin if any such thing was implemented.

I would definitely sell all my next if there is no mechanism to counterreact hoarding because it is not going to work.

If you want the money system to tax savers with inflation or any other means, just use the USD or whatever fiat currency is used in your country, there is no difference then. I think it's against NXT's principles to infringe upon people's freedom to do whatever they want with their NXTs. The only penalty with the purpose to help keep network strong is if they don't forge - temporarily lose forging chances. Any other penalties would be dictatorship.

It is very different thing. There will be a predefined rule of how thing is going to work not an arbitrary central bank who decide how much money to spend and which bank to bail out.
I am all for freedom and decentralization. But if a system want to survive it has to stay on an equilibrium, the system is flawed if there is a tendency toward a disequilibrium where all economic activities come to a halt as all nxt become dead money sitting there does nothing.
That is a feature of the system which needs to be thought about.

[mcjavar]

Now I see your point, but I think that instead of forging with the big accounts, let others, with smaller Nxt stakes forge, and better donate couple of hunders k for bounties that will really help Nxt to succeed. Like bybitcoin is doing it.

Don't tell people what to do and you won't hear where should you go.

I´m sorry, but that´s bullshit.

I think everything I´ve done so far was in the best interest of Nxt.

Probably so, I didn't follow. Anyway if the guy goes out from the shadow and suggests to pledge some really good money it's not the right think to ask for more and more and more.

You are right, but giving him advice HOW and WHERE to pledge the money is important, I think.

[landomata]

@ Aldrin,
We will start a contest where the 10 best ideas for a client feature or application which would help Nxt grow over the next 5 years.
Total Development Fund Needed: Nxt 2,000,000
I can immediately start the thread where idea's can be deposited....Final voting can begin in a weeks time.
What do you guys think?

I agree with Aldrin that we need to let it grow naturally and see proven results before we spend funds.
Having a contest for 10 best ideas is good, but who will guarantee the implemetation. I would love to doante when I know someone like nexern/jean luc/cfb for example is standing behind it. This apply to software development, marketing and all other areas.
I don't have the time to do it myself, but I'll be happy to continue donating.

it would be managed just like the bounty system....once they deliver the feature/application then they get the bounty....so they can be sure if they invest time and energy into their idea they will get the bounty at the end.

200,000 Nxt is not a small amount.

[laowai80]

If you want the money system to tax savers with inflation or any other means, just use the USD or whatever fiat currency is used in your country, there is no difference then. I think it's against NXT's principles to infringe upon people's freedom to do whatever they want with their NXTs. The only penalty with the purpose to help keep network strong is if they don't forge - temporarily lose forging chances. Any other penalties would be dictatorship.

It is very different thing. There will be a predefined rule of how thing is going to work not an arbitrary central bank who decide how much money to spend and which bank to bail out.
I am all for freedom and decentralization. But if a system want to survive it has to stay on an equilibrium, the system is flawed if there is a tendency toward a disequilibrium where all economic activities come to a halt as all nxt become dead money sitting there does nothing.
That is a feature of the system which needs to be thought about.

No it's not so different.

Why do you think the money would be sitting there, doing nothing?
As soon as the price goes up, the big stakeholders will be tempted to sell, the more price goes up, the more they are tempted to sell or invest in some enterprise, and so the money is put into circulation naturally.

If you force people to do something with their property, that's dictatorship. This was NOT defined in the NXT's original economic rules, and if you start changing economic rules arbitrarily, people first become confused and then they flock to a more stable system with economic rules set in stone from Day 1.

The only rules that should be allowed to be changed is the rules that define functioning of the network, which is the backbone of NXT, those can be tweaked to counteract different new attacks of the software, etc. But not the economic foundations.

[swartzfeger]

It is very different thing. There will be a predefined rule of how thing is going to work not an arbitrary central bank who decide how much money to spend and which bank to bail out.
I am all for freedom and decentralization. But if a system want to survive it has to stay on an equilibrium, the system is flawed if there is a tendency toward a disequilibrium where all economic activities come to a halt as all nxt become dead money sitting there does nothing.
That is a feature of the system which needs to be thought about.

What Would Milton Do?

Who says the system isn't in equilibrium?

Once we stick our fingers in the pie, it's game over. Who gets to play Bernanke, Lagarde, et al?

[joris]

Why push aldrin to do anything? He can do whatever he wants with his stake. You can rest assured he's going to use it well, no need to blabla in my eyes. Supporting contributions to the project sounds fine.

The system won't work if all the big stakes just hoards a big stake. If he finally does as he said, basically his nxt become dead because it is only sitting there for forging without entering the economy.

If this would be the case, then the initial distribution of NXT to stakeholder is in fact the problem. It was decided to do it the way it was done. There is no way to change the rules now. IMHO, aldrin has every right to do what he want with his NXT - technically and morally.

Apart from that, I think that the system DOES work even when all the big stakes just hoard a big stake. There is still a certain percentage of NXT moving around.
Big stakes will probably not hoard forever. It depends on the price made by the moving NXT, the potential NXT still has (over time) and the temptation of cashing out.

Marcus (small-stake)

It is just like adding a feature to nxt network to counterreact hoarding. If you want all kind of cool stufs for nxt why don't you want a feature that will make nxt a sustainable system? I am big stake definitely in top100. I am also economist. I am taking a position for the best of nxt network and the idea of decentralization.

You can't live in a NXT, nor eat them and they won't satisfy any real world demand without transferring them to someone else. So there are always natural incentives to spend them. The flow or availability of a certain amount of currency isn't a useful target or goal (except for gaming systems like Central Banks do, blowing bubbles and supplying only those directly around them with free money), but the consequence of exchanging goods and services. Currency is a mean to facilitate the trade of non-fungible goods and services.

Demand and supply will find the circumstantial sweet exchange spot for NXT. Hoarding won't hurt any other holder of NXT, on the contrary.

When they get definitely lost, they won't drain any more NXT from the market by forging, but also less NXT remain in circulation anyways. 1 billion units is a rather low number, so they will get further divisible to keep a practical unit of exchange.