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Author Topic: [ANN][XCP] Counterparty - Pioneering Peer-to-Peer Finance - Official Thread  (Read 1276302 times)
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Chang Hum
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April 18, 2014, 05:36:38 AM
Last edit: April 18, 2014, 05:54:43 AM by Chang Hum
 #7181

I wonder if the guy who's effectively won the lottery through this IPO, will try and manipulate the price.... wouldn't cost a lot relatively to make Mastercoin worth double!

Yeah he could sell like 10 - 15% of his holdings in offline transactions... and then use the cash to buy bitcoin or if he sold for bitcoin, just go in and sweep through the sell order book...

You're missing the point slightly Halfcab, this asset maidsafe coin can only be purchased with mastercoin. The IPO is aiming for $10million paid in(6-8 of which apparently has already been secured by large private investors) Bitcoin or mastercoin. 100% of all bitcoin purchases will go through this lucky person/groups hands making them overnight millionaires + plus they get the added bonus of being able to dump as many of their worthless mastercoins in exchange for shares in arguably the most interesting internet project since bitcoin.

I think JR will almost certainly become an overnight multi millionaire from this... not bad from under a years work part time in his shed!  Grin

Meanwhile it's fairly obvious the Mastercoin price is going to tank heavily after this company owns 1000's of coins they can't sell.

I think the whole things an unbelievably scandle, and can't really get my head around the true motives behind this. Why the hell would this company accept mastercoin as part of their I.P.O when there's absolutely no market volume to it and they don't need to?

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April 18, 2014, 05:41:33 AM
 #7182

I wonder if the guy who's effectively won the lottery through this IPO, will try and manipulate the price.... wouldn't cost a lot relatively to make Mastercoin worth double!

Yeah he could sell like 10 - 15% of his holdings in offline transactions... and then use the cash to buy bitcoin or if he sold for bitcoin, just go in and sweep through the sell order book...

You're missing the point slightly Halfcab, this asset maidsafe coin can only be purchased with mastercoin. The IPO is aiming for $10million paid in(6-8 of which apparently has already been secured by large private investors) Bitcoin or mastercoin. 100% of all bitcoin purchases will go through this lucky person/groups hands making them overnight millionaires + plus they get the added bonus of being able to dump as many of their worthless mastercoins in exchange for shares in arguably the most interesting internet project since bitcoin.

I think JR will almost certainly become an overnight multi millionaire from this... not bad from under a years work part time in his shed!  Grin

Meanwhile it's fairly obvious the Mastercoin price is going to tank heavily after this company owns 1000's of coins they can't sell.

I think the whole things an unbelievably scandle, and can't really get my head around the true motives behind this. Why the hell would this company accept mastercoin as part of their I.P.O when there's absolutely no market volume to it and they don't need to?

Typically company stock buy-back programs are a show of good faith in their own potential, so accepting Mastercoin seems to be similar in that regard.

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April 18, 2014, 06:00:19 AM
 #7183

I wonder if the guy who's effectively won the lottery through this IPO, will try and manipulate the price.... wouldn't cost a lot relatively to make Mastercoin worth double!

Yeah he could sell like 10 - 15% of his holdings in offline transactions... and then use the cash to buy bitcoin or if he sold for bitcoin, just go in and sweep through the sell order book...

You're missing the point slightly Halfcab, this asset maidsafe coin can only be purchased with mastercoin. The IPO is aiming for $10million paid in(6-8 of which apparently has already been secured by large private investors) Bitcoin or mastercoin. 100% of all bitcoin purchases will go through this lucky person/groups hands making them overnight millionaires + plus they get the added bonus of being able to dump as many of their worthless mastercoins in exchange for shares in arguably the most interesting internet project since bitcoin.

I think JR will almost certainly become an overnight multi millionaire from this... not bad from under a years work part time in his shed!  Grin

Meanwhile it's fairly obvious the Mastercoin price is going to tank heavily after this company owns 1000's of coins they can't sell.

I think the whole things an unbelievably scandle, and can't really get my head around the true motives behind this. Why the hell would this company accept mastercoin as part of their I.P.O when there's absolutely no market volume to it and they don't need to?

Typically company stock buy-back programs are a show of good faith in their own potential, so accepting Mastercoin seems to be similar in that regard.

I personally think it's disgusting valuing Mastercoins un-liquidate-able "stocks" worth anywhere near Bitcoins at this buy in level. And why would a fundraising startup want to take such a gamble!?

If you placed a market order to liquidate around $35k worth of Mastercoin on https://www.masterxchange.com/market.php?currency=msc# the only exchange that seems to be available, you'd drop the market to a price of 0.0001 1/800th of the current price, selling at an average of 0.005 (1/16th of current market price). And this is despite the Hype around this IPO!!!
 
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April 18, 2014, 06:02:11 AM
 #7184

I wonder if the guy who's effectively won the lottery through this IPO, will try and manipulate the price.... wouldn't cost a lot relatively to make Mastercoin worth double!

Yeah he could sell like 10 - 15% of his holdings in offline transactions... and then use the cash to buy bitcoin or if he sold for bitcoin, just go in and sweep through the sell order book...

You're missing the point slightly Halfcab, this asset maidsafe coin can only be purchased with mastercoin. The IPO is aiming for $10million paid in(6-8 of which apparently has already been secured by large private investors) Bitcoin or mastercoin. 100% of all bitcoin purchases will go through this lucky person/groups hands making them overnight millionaires + plus they get the added bonus of being able to dump as many of their worthless mastercoins in exchange for shares in arguably the most interesting internet project since bitcoin.

I think JR will almost certainly become an overnight multi millionaire from this... not bad from under a years work part time in his shed!  Grin

Meanwhile it's fairly obvious the Mastercoin price is going to tank heavily after this company owns 1000's of coins they can't sell.

I think the whole things an unbelievably scandle, and can't really get my head around the true motives behind this. Why the hell would this company accept mastercoin as part of their I.P.O when there's absolutely no market volume to it and they don't need to?

Typically company stock buy-back programs are a show of good faith in their own potential, so accepting Mastercoin seems to be similar in that regard.

I personally think it's disgusting valuing Mastercoins un-liquidate-able "stocks" worth anywhere near Bitcoins at this buy in level. And why would a fundraising startup want to take such a gamble!?

If you placed a market order to liquidate around $35k worth of Mastercoin on https://www.masterxchange.com/market.php?currency=msc# the only exchange that seems to be available, you'd drop the market to a price of 0.0001 1/800th of the current price, selling at an average of 0.005 (1/16th of current market price). And this is despite the Hype around this IPO!!!
 

Yes the low-volume, something I mentioned earlier, makes no sense for a project with so much notoriety. People must think its too expensive.

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April 18, 2014, 06:43:11 AM
 #7185

Notoriety on Bitcoin talk where he posted a whitepaper sketched out to a school boy standard making little sense 9 months ago. The only business document I've ever seen that shows photos of people showering in dollars with speech bubbles clarifying the authors greed.  

Following I think a 5000 odd Bitcoin investment by Sept last year he then deviated from the original crazy escrow plan, and subsequently enjoyed a 1000% Major Bitcoin rally that was enough to turn a joker into a serious contender (Given that the exodus funds is now at 1000 from 5000, I wonder what would have happened to this project without the major bitcoin upturn).

Anyway what this guy started 8 months ago as a part time work from home project around his full time job, he can now sell half of for $10m and buy back that half nex month for $1m.

Has the world gone mad?? or is it just me thinks this whole things nuts?
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April 18, 2014, 07:19:30 AM
 #7186


Wow. I'm really impressed. How much did you pay Sergio to get him to audit this?
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April 18, 2014, 07:35:49 AM
 #7187

Notoriety on Bitcoin talk where he posted a whitepaper sketched out to a school boy standard making little sense 9 months ago. The only business document I've ever seen that shows photos of people showering in dollars with speech bubbles clarifying the authors greed.  

Following I think a 5000 odd Bitcoin investment by Sept last year he then deviated from the original crazy escrow plan, and subsequently enjoyed a 1000% Major Bitcoin rally that was enough to turn a joker into a serious contender (Given that the exodus funds is now at 1000 from 5000, I wonder what would have happened to this project without the major bitcoin upturn).

Anyway what this guy started 8 months ago as a part time work from home project around his full time job, he can now sell half of for $10m and buy back that half nex month for $1m.

Has the world gone mad?? or is it just me thinks this whole things nuts?

I think the world is full of situations exactly like this in emerging markets. imagine how many people invested in nonsense initiatives during the gold rush, or the late 90's internet pump. The fact is, in emerging markets, the ratio of high dollar investors to investment experts is near zero, so millionaires are throwing *s__* to the wall to see what sticks, and in the past, these investors tend to benefit the most from emerging markets, however, the vast marority are losers. This is just the name of the game, someone saw his vision, someone had a lot of money, put 2 and 2 together, and there you have it.

I don't know enough about planned initiatives of the Mastercoin project to say whether or not they have accomplished as much as they said they would by this time. I have not done due diligence, however I have heard the contrary, that they indeed have come forth with very little. The sentiment in the Counterparty Community seems to believe strongly that indeed Counterparty did much more with much less in much less time than the Mastercoin Project has done. If that is true, it is pretty interesting.

I think that PhantomPhreak, Xnova, and Matt Y, beginning to travel and go to talks, preferably which are filmed and placed on youtube or other media, will be a huge jumpstart.

In my phone conversation with LED_LCD, he brought up the point that Counterparty reflects the ethics of the original Bitcoin project and I agreed. What I'm not in agreement with however, is that in this competitive climate, something with no funding can survive. I do not believe that technology can necesarily speak for itself. Is it possible ? Sure, but why take that chance. We have seen that the core developers of Counterparty are interested in one thing: The success of the protocol in decentralizing asset issuance and trade, with an extremely high level of security. The initial distribution method along with the progress that has been made, along with the attitude of the developers, especially PhantomPhreak, has been incredible and fair. Phantom's attitude mirrors Satoshi's, in that he is very much concerned with protocol happenings, and completely disinterested the drama that crops up around it.

If you ask me, you have an ethical center which has emerged, with virtually zero ego involved, along with incredible developer talent. You can tell both by words and actions, that the developers feel they have to prove nothing verbally. They let it all in the open because they believe 100+% in the project.

We need to take this ethical group of developers and give them the funding and recognition they need to help the project survive.

My central point is that, the competitive climate is not comparable to 2009 when Satoshi got started. Of course open-source communities got involved at the outset, the ethics-based, "donation-only" sentiment started this space, mostly because at the time, including even now arguably, no one could imagine that a share of a network, could be that secure and distributed, let alone valuable!? The point is, greed has been introduced, the get-rich quickers are out on the prowl, and thus we have seen the capitalistic nature as an offshoot dominate, starting with the altcoin market. What are the altcoins but in large part arguably a way for some developers to get together and scheme people out of their bitcoins ? I apologize if I have offended any developers, but it at least appears that way when you look at the IPO initiatives versus the value history and of course the post-IPO initiatives that seem to deride the initial promises; it appears conspicuous that the goal is quick gains for everyone involved, that invariably means tons and tons of losers and only a few winners.

I'm not going to just talk up Counterparty, because I invested during the burn process. I'm not just protecting my investment with my words, although of course I and you all have a vested interest in doing so. No. I'm going to tell it like it is. How often have you been berated by the developers of Counterparty for donations ? Never. What was arguably the fairest launch of a new decentralized token ? I would say Counterparty, without hesitation, I'm sure there's some alts which try to accomplish similarly, but I believe Counterparty was the first protocol/token with a burn period issuance. How often do you see our developers here ignorantly gloating about how much better the protocol is than others ? If they do compare, it is based on facts, and they leave out the unnecessary adjectives. This is a mature group, with a quickly maturing project, and being that it requires XCP to purchase asset issuing space on the protocol, XCP is largely undervalued.

I think it is without a shadow of a doubt, clear, that we as a community and the developers need to take the marketing initiative to a competitive level, but I think the marketing should always be pointing to initiatives, progress, etc., and it should be clean and simple like Apple, or Google.

I believe that we need some great leaders and visionaries to step forward and put action and money toward the marketing initiative.

Counterparty has a shot at a multi-billion dollar emerging market. With just over two and a half million shares of something in that space, how long do you think that abominably low XCP price will last ? Well I can tell you that if we do not allocate resources, time, and passion into marketing, talks, activities, events, in much the same way that the developers have poured their hearts and souls into the protocol itself and surrounding infrastructure, the price will fall into the noise of the alts, just like it is currently doing. We've already seen the core devs taking initiative to this I believe largely shared revelation, with Xnova announcing an identity reveal, along with the developers possibly starting to travel to functions, this is the very beginning of that idea coming to fruition. Bitcoin had virtually no competition. It was first to market by an indomitably large margin; this is no longer the case.

Look at how awesome Linux and all it's various distros are. Linux has virtually no marketing, virtually no funds, while some distro groups do, they have 1% market share in the computing industry dominated by Microsoft and Apple. We don't want a 1% market share in this emergent space, we want much more than that, for the very reason that this project is not built on greed, nor is it built on anything else but the spirit of development innovation.

We have to compete, this won't speak for itself, but you can speak for it.


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April 18, 2014, 08:29:47 AM
 #7188


I think the whole things an unbelievably scandle,



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April 18, 2014, 08:48:32 AM
 #7189

imo, maid safe coin looks like a scam.  this will deal a big blow to master coin

I understand they're taking millions of dollars of mastercoin funding privately from a single individual at the current market price! Possibly turning JR?? into an overnight multimillionaire from this crowd-source-coin-sell!

Added by edit: Also all funds raised by bitcoin externally go into mastercoin (again by private seller or market forces would force them to pay by bitcoin because of the fixed rate 0.08)

Something stinks how can a start-up of this size and ambition be so oblivious to the fact the price isn't real as there's no volume to sell. Either entire startup corps have completely lost the plot here or it's a scam to get market rate for mastercoins!!

Has anyone technical looked into what they've produced, it's beyond me to build it. No one talking publicly from their organisation seems to have a clue about crypto in general though.


I must say, it does seem kind've nuts, meh, i'm glad i own MSC
instead of moaning, i suggest you get some MSC too

Have bought and sold for a cheeky 15% since it was first announced no real point holding it now as looks like the safecoin team are setting the mastercoin price at 0.08
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April 18, 2014, 09:19:07 AM
 #7190

imo, maid safe coin looks like a scam.  this will deal a big blow to master coin

Are you sure? This looks like a pretty legitimate project.
http://bitcoinmagazine.com/12397/maidsafe-is-making-data-safe/

Maidsafe is a great project and doesn't get the recognition it deserves. I haven't read the technical details but Safecoin is supposed to work with a Proof of Resource function for their storage network - the Mastercoin ipo is just for "vouchers" that will be exchangeable for Safecoin's upon release. It gives them a little added publicity and the ability for MSC users to purchase Safecoin (As far as I am aware the Mastercoin DEX does not support Asset <-> Bitcoin transactions).
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April 18, 2014, 10:24:20 AM
 #7191

imo, maid safe coin looks like a scam.  this will deal a big blow to master coin

Are you sure? This looks like a pretty legitimate project.
http://bitcoinmagazine.com/12397/maidsafe-is-making-data-safe/

Maidsafe is a great project and doesn't get the recognition it deserves. I haven't read the technical details but Safecoin is supposed to work with a Proof of Resource function for their storage network - the Mastercoin ipo is just for "vouchers" that will be exchangeable for Safecoin's upon release. It gives them a little added publicity and the ability for MSC users to purchase Safecoin (As far as I am aware the Mastercoin DEX does not support Asset <-> Bitcoin transactions).

I'm generally skeptical about distributed and/or decentralized data storage mechanisms. People who have had experience with P2P networks like Freenet would be skeptical too.

Engineers have a joke along these lines:

Cheap, fast, reliable (pick any two)

If I put storage specific functional requirements: persistence, assesibility and responsiveness along with the above, it's a huge technical achievement if they were to (basically) create a Skype for data storage.

The graph (https://raw.github.com/maidsafe/Whitepapers/master/resources/resources_graph.png) displaying lines comparing the estimated value of a safecoin vs the cost of resources seems counter-intuitive to me. When the underlying resource becomes cheaper or more abundant, then the token to access said resource becomes more valuable?
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April 18, 2014, 10:33:43 AM
 #7192

can somebody help me to setup boottlexcp? where can I find the instructions?
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April 18, 2014, 10:59:36 AM
Last edit: April 18, 2014, 11:35:04 AM by romerun
 #7193

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/maidsafe-development/j8QBYnXOYUI

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=558012.msg6279566#msg6279566

sounds like they don't really need cash but want to pump msc liquidity by converting btc to msc on behalf of investors, sounds great for msc price outlook but not sure who wants to invest in this safecoin thing
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April 18, 2014, 11:39:50 AM
 #7194

can somebody help me to setup boottlexcp? where can I find the instructions?

Looks like BottleXCP has yet kept up with the current counterpartyd as there are some api changes recently. Better use counterpartyd directly for now, or counterwallet.
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April 18, 2014, 12:07:12 PM
 #7195

can somebody help me to setup boottlexcp? where can I find the instructions?

Looks like BottleXCP has yet kept up with the current counterpartyd as there are some api changes recently. Better use counterpartyd directly for now, or counterwallet.

Yeah why not use counterwallet ? http://counterwallet.co

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April 18, 2014, 02:29:04 PM
 #7196

Cross-post link from forums.counterparty.co --> https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,261.msg1957.html#msg1957

We've had 3 donations so far in just 24 hours!  Cool

LED_LCD    0.1 BTC
FLAYAWAY 50 XCP
Unknown    0.01


All donors will be listed as Assistant Producers
The largest donor will be listed as Assistant Executive Producer Smiley


At current market values that leaves 0.86 BTC or about 215 XCP left to be raised! Anything helps!

Here's the saved wishlist on TigerDirect -- > http://goo.gl/8YtriV

DONATION ADDRESS: 13CVPDZRvAHiKtNJm3x36jREPDdtocXf4p

DayTrade with less exposure to risk, by setting buy and sell spreads with CabTrader v2, buy now @ crypto-folio.com
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April 18, 2014, 02:33:09 PM
 #7197

Cross-post link from forums.counterparty.co --> https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,261.msg1957.html#msg1957

We've had 3 donations so far in just 24 hours! Smiley

LED_LCD    0.1 BTC
FLAYAWAY 50 XCP
Unknown    0.01


All donors will be listed as Assistant Producers
The largest donor will be listed as Assistant Executive Producer Smiley


At current market values that leaves 0.86 BTC or about 215 XCP left to be raised! Anything helps!

Here's the saved wishlist on TigerDirect -- > http://[Suspicious link removed]/8YtriV

DONATION ADDRESS: 13CVPDZRvAHiKtNJm3x36jREPDdtocXf4p

Come on that's not a big amount. You must be having a lot of XCPs. 1.17 BTC is nothing.
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April 18, 2014, 02:37:21 PM
 #7198

Cross-post link from forums.counterparty.co --> https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,261.msg1957.html#msg1957

We've had 3 donations so far in just 24 hours! Smiley

LED_LCD    0.1 BTC
FLAYAWAY 50 XCP
Unknown    0.01


All donors will be listed as Assistant Producers
The largest donor will be listed as Assistant Executive Producer Smiley


At current market values that leaves 0.86 BTC or about 215 XCP left to be raised! Anything helps!

Here's the saved wishlist on TigerDirect -- > http://[Suspicious link removed]/8YtriV

DONATION ADDRESS: 13CVPDZRvAHiKtNJm3x36jREPDdtocXf4p

Come on that's not a big amount. You must be having a lot of XCPs. 1.17 BTC is nothing.

The XCP I have is for a fund of investors, a very small amount of which is mine, and in addition to that, I've already invested 2 Bitcoin of my own money in buying a DSLR to film this. I hope this answers your concern.

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April 18, 2014, 03:23:36 PM
 #7199

Cross-post link from forums.counterparty.co --> https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,261.msg1957.html#msg1957

We've had 3 donations so far in just 24 hours!  Cool

LED_LCD    0.1 BTC
FLAYAWAY 50 XCP
Unknown    0.01


All donors will be listed as Assistant Producers
The largest donor will be listed as Assistant Executive Producer Smiley


At current market values that leaves 0.86 BTC or about 215 XCP left to be raised! Anything helps!

Here's the saved wishlist on TigerDirect -- > http://goo.gl/8YtriV

DONATION ADDRESS: 13CVPDZRvAHiKtNJm3x36jREPDdtocXf4p

I just got another donation for 0.1 BTC, please let me know who you are, and all future donors, please contact me with your Bitcointalk handle, if you'd like to be featured in the credits of the video. Thanks again for all your support.

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April 18, 2014, 03:26:43 PM
 #7200

Cross-post link from forums.counterparty.co --> https://forums.counterparty.co/index.php/topic,261.msg1957.html#msg1957

We've had 3 donations so far in just 24 hours!  Cool

LED_LCD    0.1 BTC
FLAYAWAY 50 XCP
Unknown    0.01


All donors will be listed as Assistant Producers
The largest donor will be listed as Assistant Executive Producer Smiley


At current market values that leaves 0.86 BTC or about 215 XCP left to be raised! Anything helps!

Here's the saved wishlist on TigerDirect -- > http://goo.gl/8YtriV

DONATION ADDRESS: 13CVPDZRvAHiKtNJm3x36jREPDdtocXf4p

just sent you 0.1btc
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