NobleCoin[NOBL] - 8% PoS | 1Yr+ | MARKETPLACE | PAY | GIFT | CHARITIES/MERCHANTS

[baloy]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

[murkster]

Edit: I wouldn't consider any of it shameful. This is a fun game but money is involved and we all know the risks. I trade & take them myself just not with NOBL. We're not saints around here, just a little different and perhaps cuckoo for trying to do what we do. Wink

Amen.. Still sat on my Noble.. but making a nice amount from the other chaff..

JUst a quick point, keep the announcments to a minimum, as they get ripped off VERY quickly...

[Odsejen]

i like this coin what are the actual and future plans for this coin in specific (beside the great community activity)?

[murkster]

i like this coin what are the actual and future plans for this coin in specific (beside the great community activity)?

Read initial opening post mate...

Don't take this the wrong way but I believe that all announcements should be left until its too late for others to clone the ideas (noble has been shit on enough), hence asking you to read opening post.....

[james6546]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Hi Baloy,

If you leave the PoS coin inside your wallet and your wallet unlocked and running it will make you a decent amount of interest. It will also help to secure the blockchain the same way that PoW mining does.

I think your point is that leaving your coins in the wallet will not help the spread of coins. That is one of the problems with PoS coins, you end up getting a lot of people hoarding them. I think that is where Noble will shine, because as well as there being incentive for you to stake the coins in your wallet, there are also a good amount of places where you can spend the coins, such as the marketplace and an ever growing number of merchants.

My plan is to hopefully exchange a certain amount of my stake rewards for bullion if and when it becomes available.

[baloy]

thanks a lot james6546... now, i understand a bit... just a bit on how crypto currency works... i'm reading, processing so as to better understand every discussion posted here. and yes, there will be always a positive and negative side... but, for our coin (NOBL), personally, what i see is, it would be more on the positive side...

again, thanks a lot for enlightening me on PoS... this is "a knowledge on a day" for me...

 

[NorrisK]

thanks a lot james6546... now, i understand a bit... just a bit on how crypto currency works... i'm reading, processing so as to better understand every discussion posted here. and yes, there will be always a positive and negative side... but, for our coin (NOBL), personally, what i see is, it would be more on the positive side...

again, thanks a lot for enlightening me on PoS... this is "a knowledge on a day" for me...

 

did you read the pdf by Rofo? it is very informative!

[baloy]

did you read the pdf by Rofo? it is very informative!

i had read it but not yet completed... and yes, it is very informative... had shared it to my friends too... had also invited them on Noble but it seems, they didn't care for our coin   

thanks...

[The One]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Creating money out of thin air will reduce the value of money...debasement. - fiat money like nowadays.

Creating coins out of thin air will have the same effect as the created coins has nothing backing it, i.e POS - no mining. POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

[presstab]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Creating money out of thin air will reduce the value of money...debasement. - fiat money like nowadays.

Creating coins out of thin air will have the same effect as the created coins has nothing backing it, i.e POS - no mining. POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

I disagree with you on this one for sure because your analysis completely ignores the changes that occur with the supply and demand of the coin.  Also there is no difference in what is "backing" the coin. In either scenario you have an amount of capital, whether physical or digital, that is being utilized to hash on the chain.

[Coinler]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

[NorrisK]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

I don't agree. Litecoin is already being dumped hard and still sustains a good price (although declining). Adding that thing won't make much differnce in amount of coins dumped. (ok, maybe until diff readjustment)

[Coinler]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

I don't agree. Litecoin is already being dumped hard and still sustains a good price (although declining). Adding that thing won't make much differnce in amount of coins dumped. (ok, maybe until diff readjustment)

well unless they already have working prototypes that they are currently mining with and 'testing' extensively. it's just the thing i would do as an asic developer. build asic. use it to extract btc value and gain more capital investment to fund my asic business. crypto needs to get more investors because what we have is supply outweighing demand. i so miss the days of .1btc permh per 24hrs mining. we're down to 1/100th that now. 100mh asics?? who knows. but the POS coins are doing well. the anon coins with pos even better. the scrypt mining coins are all being thrashed. just look at crypto. there is not one single rising scryptcoin. even dogecoin hit sub 50 satoshi levels.

[NorrisK]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

I don't agree. Litecoin is already being dumped hard and still sustains a good price (although declining). Adding that thing won't make much differnce in amount of coins dumped. (ok, maybe until diff readjustment)

well unless they already have working prototypes that they are currently mining with and 'testing' extensively. it's just the thing i would do as an asic developer. build asic. use it to extract btc value and gain more capital investment to fund my asic business. crypto needs to get more investors because what we have is supply outweighing demand. i so miss the days of .1btc permh per 24hrs mining. we're down to 1/100th that now. 100mh asics?? who knows. but the POS coins are doing well. the anon coins with pos even better. the scrypt mining coins are all being thrashed. just look at crypto. there is not one single rising scryptcoin. even dogecoin hit sub 50 satoshi levels.

What I mean is that even without asics its being dumped hard already. And for fast adjusting coins, this means even with asics, amount of dumped coins does not significantly increase.

[hellscabane]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

I'll be honest, I doubt they have a substantive tape-out for something that is in that form factor. I'd bank GAW won't have any batches shipped until 2015 at the earliest; KNC just had their tape-out a month ago, so I would expect them to ship out at least a quarter before GAW. Whichever coin has the majority of sCrypt hash power after KNC ships their Titans (most likely Litecoin) won't be affected by these Vaultbreakers. On the other hand, all of the smaller coins will easily be in a world of hurt.

On the bright side, a few of these rigs could easily kill any newly cloned sCrypt coins that come out later this year.

[Coinler]

feast your eyes on the latest threat to alt-crypto. 500 mh scrypt miner. litecoin is dead.. and so are all other scrypt algo coins by the time this comes out.

http://minerdesk.com/vaultbreaker-the-worlds-first-500mhs-scrypt-miner/

I'll be honest, I doubt they have a substantive tape-out for something that is in that form factor. I'd bank GAW won't have any batches shipped until 2015 at the earliest; KNC just had their tape-out a month ago, so I would expect them to ship out at least a quarter before GAW. Whichever coin has the majority of sCrypt hash power after KNC ships their Titans (most likely Litecoin) won't be affected by these Vaultbreakers. On the other hand, all of the smaller coins will easily be in a world of hurt.

On the bright side, a few of these rigs could easily kill any newly cloned sCrypt coins that come out later this year.

well i was just talking about this earlier in the thread and another user said it would be years before 1gh scrypt asics are released.. from the looks of this im thinking we will hear news of them before the end of the year. so alt-crypto will have to get alot more investment strength or risk getting raped 10x to 10 cents mining profitability per day. u can say i foresaw it and thought i would help noble, which i thought to be a coin with a team with good intentions by suggesting we start making switches to antiasic algorithm to slow daily supply as well as POS to acquire more investment interest. hopefully noblecoin will be able to move with the times and come up with a decent structure to strengthen the value of the currency and get the real ball rolling. as it is Rofo has sadly admitted that the value of noblecoin is suppressed to hide from multipools and their profitability switching. but i think with my suggestions noble will not have to worry about such a thing.

as much as an asic owner will love the idea of getting alot of coins and the greed associated with that. he should consider that any moves, even away from asics will increase the value of his currency. but i guess it's too bad. scrypt crypto is dying a slow death.. the heat output and electricity usage is no longer acceptable. hence users are moving to more efficient and cooler running algorithms. some of which have been compromised. so choose well which algo ur going to employ.

just wanted to help. only have like 100k noble atm and that's because im not currently investing in any scrypt coins. and i think soon others will follow. dumped all my ltc, doge.. i just dont see them coming back up.

[The One]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Creating money out of thin air will reduce the value of money...debasement. - fiat money like nowadays.

Creating coins out of thin air will have the same effect as the created coins has nothing backing it, i.e POS - no mining. POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

I disagree with you on this one for sure because your analysis completely ignores the changes that occur with the supply and demand of the coin.  Also there is no difference in what is "backing" the coin. In either scenario you have an amount of capital, whether physical or digital, that is being utilized to hash on the chain.

You have a right to disagree but i'm afraid you are totally wrong. Supply and demand is a market force phenomena to establish a price of a particular good and/or services. The creation of money supply has nothing to do with supply and demand. You need to understand classical economics, especially the work of Ludwig Mises. When a money supply is expanded, it creates inflation. Fiat money creates high inflation as it cost nearly nothing to produce. Money backed by gold has very low inflation because it cost money to get gold out of the ground. The difference between the cost and the selling price of gold is the expansion of money supply.

[Coinler]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Creating money out of thin air will reduce the value of money...debasement. - fiat money like nowadays.

Creating coins out of thin air will have the same effect as the created coins has nothing backing it, i.e POS - no mining. POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

I disagree with you on this one for sure because your analysis completely ignores the changes that occur with the supply and demand of the coin.  Also there is no difference in what is "backing" the coin. In either scenario you have an amount of capital, whether physical or digital, that is being utilized to hash on the chain.

You have a right to disagree but i'm afraid you are totally wrong. Supply and demand is a market force phenomena to establish a price of a particular good and/or services. The creation of money supply has nothing to do with supply and demand. You need to understand classical economics, especially the work of Ludwig Mises. When a money supply is expanded, it creates inflation. Fiat money creates high inflation as it cost nearly nothing to produce. Money backed by gold has very low inflation because it cost money to get gold out of the ground. The difference between the cost and the selling price of gold is the expansion of money supply.

it's not just that. i sorely hold to any one economic idealogy. especially of those minds from the past. this is the 21st century, we have a more evolved society, and growing minds and cultures and behaviours have changed since those guys time. as much as some old fashioned idealogies may find some areas where they are still accurate today. i dont think that they can be and/or should be looked at as a universal way of seeing things for the rest of humanity's existence. situations change, behaviours change and what was once can no longer survive.

if only it was still so clear cut black and white. plus, as much as we may want to compare mining in the mines to virtual mining. it is my view simply that the value of a currency now, especially in crypto is determined by how many competing sellers there are and how low they are willing to go to extract a different currency for theirs(btc for nobl). basic supply and demand will not drive the value of the currency simply because investors will run out of investment capital and then what do you have to attract new investors??. as i can buy 2.5billion coins out of 3billion but the remaining 0.5billion still may contain undersellers who will push the price back down to the starting point because they didnt get to sell in the first place.. meaning i will continually have to buy to lift the price until i own all 3 billion coins. psychology plays a major role now as many people understand economics and capitalism to a greater extent than the average person did say 100 years ago.

but if noone sells in a market with 10billion coins and all u can find on the market are  .01 fractions to buy at say $3000/coin, then that really does not help the standard supply and demand model. the value of each coin would effectively be $3000, but because noone is selling down the price the demand was allowed to grow. but that doesnt mean there wasnt a large supply. so at the end of the day.. u have to give people something that they are willing to hold on to. very very few people will just buy and allow their investment value to shrink to 1/10 their buy in value without dumping the stock to rebuy lower or invest elsewhere like i have with ltc and doge.

i invested in ltc hoping for it to rise.. but instead it lost 50% value. i dumped it, invested in a coin and received 3 times my ltc value in btc much quicker than waiting for investors to accumulate and build ltc price. it was just the smart thing to do. now if i see fit, i can reacquire my ltc at no loss. but im seeing nothing from them to provide me that interest. so vericoin will now get ltc's investment.

in crypto supply and demand plays a little differently. what is being sent to exchanges is the supply. and what is being held in personal wallets is not. thus simply holding will create scarcity and force buyers to pay higher prices to utilize the services. it requires patience on the part of all investors. individuals who want noblecoin itself will mine it because that is what they want.. but multipools and asics may not have the same view. if users do not want to hold the coin and will continue to sell at sub 20 satoshi even after this coin has shown that investors are willing to pay upward of 200 satoshi then it is an indication that the coin is losing the race to daytraders and others who really dont care about it as earlier investors are pretty much filled up with all they need/want and there is nothing successfully attracting new investors to set the floor at 200satoshi.

[Rofo]

While I appreciate your understanding of traditional economics, I mean no offence when I say this is crypto. we're talking about. Little is rational and the rules are different. RZR yesterday released a .PDF explaining their coin and outlined a goal to build a Road/Marketplace to secure themselves current hype and a near $1,000,000 market cap. Sound familiar? Inflation/maintenance/selling pressure for RZR PoW is 90-100BTC per day, we're now currently 1.2BTC/day.

POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

We can't apply this to PoW whatsoever. PoW has costs (mining/tax), the coins are immediately sold and the value diminishes. We're the prime example of that. We've been in situations where the coin costs 1.5-2x the current price to mine, and our value continues to drop. With 51% attacks and PoW abuse, this value drops more. NOBL as PoW at this point is obviously not holding its value.

PoS provides more incentives to hold and build/increase investment. It doesn't have a tax/cost applied to it to create compared to PoW, and it removes the current external factors negatively affecting our price. The rich don't just get richer, everyone who holds gets richer. The stake % is universal, and we're free from the fears of mining/ASICs and miners dumping that has been a prime topic of this board for a long time. The potential for stake to be used positively by supporters (charity, giveaways, promotions, paying for development) which was gained without high electricity/mining gear costs is something to consider.

We truly just want NOBL in the hands of people who will hold, build & promote with us positively, politely and aggressively to the cryptocurrency scene and their friends/world at large. I feel like we've slipped into external debates over mining and technicals (though yes the debates are relatively polite & many people find them rewarding to follow), rather than focusing on uses, innovation, broader acceptance, projects, community building & promotion. I personally believe PoS is the best choice in the current cryptocurrency environment to resolve this so we can move forward.

[presstab]

got a question...

what will happen if for a long time, a PoS coin inside the wallet will not be used? i mean, the owner intends to keep the coin as long as possible... does this benefits the owner, the community and the coin?

personally, on my understanding on the laws of economics, in order for a currency to gain value, it must be actively used... now, on my example above, the coin was just hibernating inside the wallet. it was not used as intended...

please share your thoughts... thanks...

Creating money out of thin air will reduce the value of money...debasement. - fiat money like nowadays.

Creating coins out of thin air will have the same effect as the created coins has nothing backing it, i.e POS - no mining. POW has mining so created coins has something backing it - holds it's value.

I disagree with you on this one for sure because your analysis completely ignores the changes that occur with the supply and demand of the coin.  Also there is no difference in what is "backing" the coin. In either scenario you have an amount of capital, whether physical or digital, that is being utilized to hash on the chain.

You have a right to disagree but i'm afraid you are totally wrong. Supply and demand is a market force phenomena to establish a price of a particular good and/or services. The creation of money supply has nothing to do with supply and demand. You need to understand classical economics, especially the work of Ludwig Mises. When a money supply is expanded, it creates inflation. Fiat money creates high inflation as it cost nearly nothing to produce. Money backed by gold has very low inflation because it cost money to get gold out of the ground. The difference between the cost and the selling price of gold is the expansion of money supply.

Don't assume anything.  I have an undergraduate degree in economics from a "heterodox economics" university.  During which period I read the road to serfdom by Hayek and was exposed to many economic theories and studied history of economic doctrines as well as macroeconomics. And besides that, Mises isn't a classical economist, he is Austrian. Smith, Ricardo, et al are classical.

Anyways the point here isn't to debate who knows what about economic doctrines, because I am sure that we would agree on very little.  Instead I would like to take issue with this statement because it is totally wrong:

The creation of money supply has nothing to do with supply and demand.

First of all the creation of money in the case of crypto is the supply. So it is directly relevant. But instead of thinking of the money supply (the total number of coins), I think in terms of the coin supplied in the form of sell orders on the exchange. When a coin is proof of stake, and especially high rate PoS, coin sell orders are not plentiful because everyone takes their coins and stakes them rather then keeping them on the exchange. This will happen to NOBL and it will cause the price to be bid up.  I have seen it happen CAP when it went from 1% annual stake to 200%.  Look at the sell orders on TEK (500%).  There are plenty of examples of this.  And it really doesn't require any understanding of classical economics or austrian economics, it only requires knowledge of very very basic supply and demand charts.