[NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread

[patmast3r]

Has anyone talked to Graviton yet regarding selling NEM on dgex ?

[utopianfuture]

Has anyone talked to Graviton yet regarding selling NEM on dgex ?

he will do it when the time comes.

[Bullprick]

You're going to be running taint analysis on the stake buys and booting out multi-stakers? I bought more than a few shares myself but as instructed I used new accounts and sent from different addresses. Prior from what I just read, I understood this was acceptable. Or will it be retro-d in?

Will my money as well as others doing the same be honored or thrown put and will there be refunds issued? I just need to clear this up.

[utopianfuture]

You're going to be running taint analysis on the stake buys and booting out multi-stakers? I bought more than a few shares myself but as instructed I used new accounts and sent from different addresses. Prior from what I just read, I understood this was acceptable. Or will it be retro-d in?

Will my money as well as others doing the same be honored or thrown put and will there be refunds issued? I just need to clear this up.

There will be refunds for big-multi-accounters. The goal is to distribute the stakes widely and evenly (but not perfectly even)

[erkki12]

By the way Utopianfuture would you look at the forums we've made (http://nemcoin.userboard.net/) and the nemcoin.com (http://stylebox.wix.com/nemcoin) page model I PM'd you yesterday and let me know If we should develop them more or if you don't want us for some reason to do these pages. Please note that both the websites are under construction, and not complete, but that only the site outlook has been created. We'd gladly add more content but it seems to be a waste of time unless we get approval that these websites will become used!

It's taken already hours of work creating both sites and it's only reasonable that you give us an answer. And btw if you're not aware the website developers are shantell and me. We already have experience in creating online retailing websites and also websites for real-life businesses so we're confident that we'll manage this.

Thanks for making these two sites. It is looking good to me. I especially like the latter which could easily be the front page for nemcoin.org, nemcoin.info or nemcoin.com. I think that we will have our own forum when the community is big enough, probably when we officially launch the blockchain. I have no interest of running a forum and I assume core developers would prefer not doing it themselves so I think we would naturally migrate to a forum built by a NEM founder/ stakeholder as the time comes. But it is also an important decision because it could be the face of NEM and if the development team can't find a place they can trust to deliver NEM's messages, then we will make our own forum.

It is the same to nemcoin.com, nemcoi.org, nemcoin.info; I have bought all these three but I prefer not to run them or run only one so I will transfer them to a coupe of NEM founders/ stakeholders who are capable of running them and doing them justice. But these decisions would be decided later when the community already have sometimes together and we can make a better informed decisions on whom doing the best for NEM.

NEM community is still very young but I am overwhelmed by the supports from many people so far. The big day we are targeting is the launch of our blockchain, probably a few months in the future. NEM's model is different from other cryptos. All cryptos so far  launches the blockchain first and then develop community and build supporting sites and services and then continue growing. For POW coin, it works well since mining activities help distributing the coins gradually to many people as the coins grows. But the POW coins have some unsolvable problems such as the domination of mining industry, inefficient energy usage which makes the real cost of Bitcoin transaction is actually much higher than many people realizes. Bitcoin's model can still work only because the transaction fee is still funded by yearly coin inflation but it will not be the case in the future.

So I think we need to move to Proof of Stake coin which is a self-sufficient network which has a long-term sustainability. But the conventional launch does not work so well with a pure proof-of-stake coin as all the coin distribution has to be made at the launch. Hybird POW/ POS such as Peercoin could be a solution but they are  not escaping the influence of the existing mining industry so I have a more radical idea of "parallel development".  The core development progresses along side with community and user base building. Supporting sites, forum and brand awareness are also developed simultaneously. The goal is that we will start the blockchain with a huge user base and a relatively equal distribution. The blockchain could then take-off very fast after launch and go to a sustainable trajectory. I am lucky to have the helps of a very talented team of core developers so at this point I am confident that NEM would materialize and successfully create its own space in crypto industry. Jaguar will deliver a detail development plan this weekend and you will see why I can be that confident.

So that's my plan. Join in and contribute to NEM' success if you are a founder/ stakeholder. Naturally there would be some kind of imbalance between the technical development and promotional development at times, but my goal is to have both sides well developed when we launch NEM's blockchain.    
  

Thank you for your great response! I think most NEMsters should read utopians post above, for it clarifies many things that are been talked about here.

So I take it there will be a discussion about nemcoin.com and the forums when the time comes and you'll be in touch if our help is needed.

Looking forward to the development plan !

[TauMuon]

I think it's pretty vital we decide on a logo and slogan now and stick to it.

Once this has been done, the NEM brand can be fully established and implemented on the forums/websites/advertisements which will pop up quite soon into the future. It will help enormously to promote NEM and to spread word about it.

The thing is; how do we, as a community, decide on a logo? A poll? Or will it just be chosen by the devs? Whatever it is, it should happen fairly soon.

[patmast3r]

I think it's pretty vital we decide on a logo and slogan now and stick to it.

Once this has been done, the NEM brand can be fully established and implemented on the forums/websites/advertisements which will pop up quite soon into the future. It will help enormously to promote NEM and to spread word about it.

The thing is; how do we, as a community, decide on a logo? A poll? Or will it just be chosen by the devs? Whatever it is, it should happen fairly soon.

I somewhat agree. I mean we got the slogan. "New Economy Movement". There's always "No envy Movement" in the room but I think we shout shoot that horse in the face since it'll remind people of the whole stake thing and how unfair it was and bla bla bla.

Logo...hmmm...did we collect em all yet ? Has everyone uploaded his Logo to that gallery utopian postet a couple days ago ?
Let's wait until wednesday to give the fellas reading this a little time to upload everything and then we can commence a vote. (plenty of possibilites online)

It'd be cool to get something done. Progress always motivates

@Utopian: Could you post that gallery again ? It's lost in the realm of 50 previous pages

[utopianfuture]

You're going to be running taint analysis on the stake buys and booting out multi-stakers? I bought more than a few shares myself but as instructed I used new accounts and sent from different addresses. Prior from what I just read, I understood this was acceptable. Or will it be retro-d in?

Will my money as well as others doing the same be honored or thrown put and will there be refunds issued? I just need to clear this up.

There will be refunds for big-multi-accounters. The goal is to distribute the stakes widely and evenly (but not perfectly even)

Taint analysis is taking it way too far.

NEM will be reduced to people arguing over each other's taint.


This is unfair to the earlier people who spent many hours creating new accounts (waiting 4 hours before they could post on each one).

The newer people now know that they have to mix their coins between wallets to hide the taint.

The earlier people were told it was fine to use new accounts with unique wallets, nobody said anything about taint analysis or having to send their coins through a mixer.

Applying taint analysis is very unfair to people who did not know mixing their coins was ANOTHER hassle they had to go through.


With taint analysis:
The guy who put in the effort and money to get 10 stakes, but did not send his coins through a mixer, gets a refund.
While the guy who put in the effort and money to get 10 stakes AND mixed his coins, gets to keep his 10 stakes.
How is that fair?


Utopianfuture said over and over he would not be applying new rules retroactively.
Please stick to your word and don't apply new rules like taint analysis retroactively.

There are no new rules.

4. How could you prevent multiple buy-ins ?

In short - We can't. Multiple buy-in will be possible with multiple accounts. We also want you to have the ability to buy a NEM stake for your loved ones so they could all join the movement. However accumulating many NEM stakes goes against NEM's principles of fairness and equality, therefore the development team reserves the right to refund you the money if an effort to unfairly accumulate NEM stakes is discovered.

NEM Flickr page http://www.flickr.com/photos/115246188@N06/ Take a closer look at the series of mvag NEM logo as they are smaller in size but they are pretty good with many variations.

[Kooream]

This is unfair to the earlier people who spent many hours creating new accounts (waiting 4 hours before they could post on each one).

The earlier people should know what means fair distribution and they shouldn't try to make sockpuppet accounts.

[utopianfuture]

mvag nem by futureutopian, on Flickr


mvag nem 3 by futureutopian, on Flickr


mvag nem 2 by futureutopian, on Flickr

[patmast3r]

You're going to be running taint analysis on the stake buys and booting out multi-stakers? I bought more than a few shares myself but as instructed I used new accounts and sent from different addresses. Prior from what I just read, I understood this was acceptable. Or will it be retro-d in?

Will my money as well as others doing the same be honored or thrown put and will there be refunds issued? I just need to clear this up.

There will be refunds for big-multi-accounters. The goal is to distribute the stakes widely and evenly (but not perfectly even)

Taint analysis is taking it way too far.

NEM will be reduced to people arguing over each other's taint.


This is unfair to the earlier people who spent many hours creating new accounts (waiting 4 hours before they could post on each one).

The newer people now know that they have to mix their coins between wallets to hide the taint.

The earlier people were told it was fine to use new accounts with unique wallets, nobody said anything about taint analysis or having to send their coins through a mixer.

Applying taint analysis is very unfair to people who did not know mixing their coins was ANOTHER hassle they had to go through.


With taint analysis:
The guy who put in the effort and money to get 10 stakes, but did not send his coins through a mixer, gets a refund.
While the guy who put in the effort and money to get 10 stakes AND mixed his coins, gets to keep his 10 stakes.
How is that fair?


Utopianfuture said over and over he would not be applying new rules retroactively.
Please stick to your word and don't apply new rules like taint analysis retroactively.

There are no new rules

4. How could you prevent multiple buy-ins ?

In short - We can't. Multiple buy-in will be possible with multiple accounts. We also want you to have the ability to buy a NEM stake for your loved ones so they could all join the movement. However accumulating many NEM stakes goes against NEM's principles of fairness and equality, therefore the development team reserves the right to refund you the money if an effort to unfairly accumulate NEM stakes is discovered.

NEM Flickr page http://www.flickr.com/photos/115246188@N06/

So the guy who puts his coins through a mixer gets to keep his 10 stakes, but the guy who didn't put his coins through a mixer gets a refund then?

We were told new address, new account was enough.  Nobody mentioned the requirement to use a coin mixer until the last few pages of this thread.

I've been helping family and friends buy stakes in NEM.  I did not know I had to mix the coins though.  Are all my friends and family going to lose their NEM stakes because their bitcoin wallets connect back to mine?

Read what uptopian posted:  "therefore the development team reserves the right to refund you the money if an effort to unfairly accumulate NEM stakes is discovered"

It's not about you helping your friends - You'll be fine. It's about people buying > 10 stakes.
Also it was never okay to to buy more than 2 stakes. 1 for you and 1 for your loved ones. Sending them through a mixer would not have it made okay it would just have prevented taint analysis.

[Anotheranonlol]

vote for v4/v5

[patmast3r]

@utopian: Are you saying you only want us to vote among the ones you just posted ? Shouldn't the community get a say in that ? I mean yes those are among the best but still...

On a side note some are partially or completely stolen from other logos so we'll have to dismiss those.

[BitZCoin]

I like the idea of version 3

And also i wanted to ask, if it would be ok, to invest another 0.06 btc for parents, too?
So I would have 2 invests counting on my name.

[TauMuon]

Edit: Poll will be here shortly.

[utopianfuture]

@utopian: Are you saying you only want us to vote among the ones you just posted ? Shouldn't the community get a say in that ? I mean yes those are among the best but still...

On a side note some are partially or completely stolen from other logos so we'll have to dismiss those.

I just think they are nice but probably neglected because of their small sizes in the Flickz.

[jkoil]

...

version 8 has the Movement (waves of the sea, or a 'ball of change' bouncing forward: Let him who hath understanding reckon the number of NEMS and throw the ball of change...).

ver 4 is the second best

[patmast3r]

@utopian: Are you saying you only want us to vote among the ones you just posted ? Shouldn't the community get a say in that ? I mean yes those are among the best but still...

On a side note some are partially or completely stolen from other logos so we'll have to dismiss those.

I just think they are nice but probably neglected because of their small sizes in the Flickz.

I also think their nice but I still think the community should be allowed to decide.
Can you see how many times a picture has been favorised by a person ? That would be an easy way to vote since you don't even need to be registered to favorise a pic
Everyone could just favorise the pictures they'd like to see elected as logo and the logo with the most "points" wins.

[utopianfuture]

@utopian: Are you saying you only want us to vote among the ones you just posted ? Shouldn't the community get a say in that ? I mean yes those are among the best but still...

On a side note some are partially or completely stolen from other logos so we'll have to dismiss those.

I just think they are nice but probably neglected because of their small sizes in the Flickz.

I also think their nice but I still think the community should be allowed to decide.
Can you see how many times a picture has been favorised by a person ? That would be an easy way to vote since you don't even need to be registered to favorise a pic
Everyone could just favorise the pictures they'd like to see elected as logo and the logo with the most "points" wins.

Sure. Community decides the logo. But generally website owners and app owners can choose the materials they want to use too .

[Jenska]

Cmoon, the guys who buyed more than two stakes should be refunded their money, if thats possible or atleast try refund stakes when its clear that Same person has done lot of accounts.

Let the community choose!