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Author Topic: Trust system abuse / DT2 member Vod is provably dishonestly rating people  (Read 5341 times)
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June 17, 2018, 09:07:33 PM
Last edit: June 17, 2018, 09:29:32 PM by suchmoon
 #221

I agree: Vod has the right to not trust me. I also have the right to not trust him. It's not OK to blackmail and lie in ratings. Vod blackmailed me and lies in his ratings. You could verify this, but naturally you won't.

I did verify this and don't agree with your conclusion. "naturally you won't" is a lie.

Vod is doing many sorts of disgusting and dishonest things here. I am defending myself from this abuse done by Vod. I've not scammed anyone. I've not lied. Vod blackmailed me. Vod lies about me. You, suchmoon, are questioning everyone here except Vod. Vod is provably dishonest with his constant lies and therefore untrustworthy.

You have lied multiple times, including TO ME ABOUT ME***, which is one of the stupidest kinds of lies you can come up with since you know that I know that you're lying. And again, I disagree with your conclusion on Vod's actions.

As you can see, you're looking at this through rose-coloured Vod-glasses. I've not scammed or lied. It is not OK for Vod to rate me negatively while presenting lies as the reason. Nobody can show where I've done anything dishonest, scammed, lied and so on. Deem Vod (or anyone) to present any evidence of me scamming or lying.  I've presented evidence and proof of my claims about Vod. It's all linked or present in this thread, and quoted to prevent Vod from editing or deleting the history.

Bidding on your own auction can be considered dishonest. Lying to my virtual forum face is definitely dishonest. That leads me to believe (the following is an opinion in case you're wondering) that you're probably not quite honest in the rest of this debate either.

Suchmoon. It's sad that you whine about others all the time while completely ignoring Vod and his dirty dishonesty. He's the provably dishonest one here. I see this clearly sided take by yours as defending Vod. Granted, it could be that you just don't understand. And yes, you're entitled to do what you're doing here, but I'm telling you it's hurting your reputation. I hope you'd be reasonable, though.

Thank you for your false concern about my reputation. Me disagreeing with you doesn't mean any of those other things that you're making up.

I don't accuse you of anything. I'm sorry if you feel offended. I simply asked you questions.

I'm fully familiar with the loaded question fallacy. Let me try:

I wonder why you're so butthurt about my comments towards you? Are you maybe in control of some other accounts, like one that starts with "cyber" and ends with "pinoy"? Or maybe one that starts with "Homero" and ends with "Garza"? When are you going to return the 128 BTC and 40000 BTC respectively to all those scammed victims?

I'm just asking questions. You don't need to answer to them. I don't ask you to agree with me, either.

Anyway, after reading what you say in that quote, I find you intellectually dishonest. I strongly think that you should know better by now. I don't know if people genuinely don't understand when they're doing shit like that. You can fool many by doing that, though. People should be better...

I find you genuinely adorable in how you think your fallacious arguments can fool anyone.



*** I consider your incessant use of fallacies intentional and I will therefore refer to it as lying. Feel free to correct me by admitting that you were simply mistaken in your reasoning.

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June 17, 2018, 09:15:49 PM
 #222

Vod blackmailed me and lies in his ratings
How did Vod blackmail you? What did he ask for? What is he lying about?

Blackmailing/threatening: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4415201.msg39457664#msg39457664 (Source in PM conv. here)

As you can see, he told me he will have to negatively me if I did not change my rating to neutral. That's threatening/blackmailing.

Vod is lying about me having scammed an auction. Vod is lying about me "admitting to lying". Vod faked a quote to be from me. Vod is lying about who faked that quote (he did it himself, as everyone can see.., but claims that someone else faked it and he just fell for it.)

Some pointers to some of his lies and other dishonesty: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4415201.msg39447493#msg39447493

You can also simply see how he has rated me. He is lying in his ratings. I've not scammed anyone, have not lied about anything, and have not "admitted to lying" etc. Read this thread please, otherwise you won't have clear picture of what's going on. You need to verify these things yourself in these kind of cases.

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June 17, 2018, 09:31:24 PM
 #223

...

Endless meta discussion incoming? Intellectual dishonesty is the thing of this time. Btw, you're inflating "lying" by claiming nearly anything said nearly anywhere is a lie.

I hope people who are reading these discussions have brains attached. ...  Wink

Let's try to stay on topic: abuse done by DT member Vod, and what to do about it and other DT / trust system problems. You don't need to participate if you're going to keep spouting nonsense & derailing meta shit.

P.S. suchmoon, I am not concerned about your reputation. I only said you're losing it. You can go and show everyone how foolish you are.

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June 17, 2018, 09:55:36 PM
Merited by Joel_Jantsen (4)
 #224

...

Endless meta discussion incoming? Intellectual dishonesty is the thing of this time. Btw, you're inflating "lying" by claiming nearly anything said nearly anywhere is a lie.

You're lying again. Not "nearly anything said nearly anywhere". Just the things that are said with intent to deceive.

P.S. suchmoon, I am not concerned about your reputation. I only said you're losing it. You can go and show everyone how foolish you are.

You're the one who brought it up though. If that was not a genuine concern then it probably was "nonsense & derailing meta shit". Don't do that.

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June 17, 2018, 10:50:09 PM
Last edit: June 17, 2018, 11:28:04 PM by Quickseller
 #225

Vod blackmailed me and lies in his ratings
How did Vod blackmail you? What did he ask for? What is he lying about?

Blackmailing/threatening: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=4415201.msg39457664#msg39457664 (Source in PM conv. here)

As you can see, he told me he will have to negatively me if I did not change my rating to neutral. That's threatening/blackmailing.
After reading the entire PM conversation, I would agree that Vod was abusing his position on DT in order to entice you to remove the rating that you had at the time against him. The question of if this rises to extortion or not, I am not sure, however unfortunately when you are in power around here, not very much will happen to you after you extort someone.

I can't support the activity that was the root cause of this dispute, and others in the past have received multiple negative ratings for similar activity. On the other hand, I don't support the public lynching of members after making a single mistake, especially after they have made the relevant parties whole (it is my understanding this has not happened in your case).

I believe Vod's claim that you are lying stems from what was likely you misspeaking a single time, and probably does not fall into the category of being dishonest. Based upon the fact that Vod was previously asking for you to remove your negative with the threat of leaving a negative rating himself, I would question the legitimacy of the claim that Vod "distrusts" you, although I disagree with this standard to leave a negative rating.

I would suggest you contact dooglus, Cryus and HostFat about your concerns, and ideally they will remove Vod from their trust lists.

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June 17, 2018, 10:53:32 PM
 #226

I believe Vod's claim that you are lying stems from what was likely you misspeaking a single time

What misspeaking?

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June 17, 2018, 11:29:22 PM
 #227

I believe Vod's claim that you are lying stems from what was likely you misspeaking a single time

What misspeaking?
After rereading your previous thread, I will retract that statement. My statement stems from an issue that you cleared up here.

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June 18, 2018, 01:13:22 AM
 #228

Let me make a new point here.
According to Vod, Anduck is a scammer, correct? OK.
Actmyname counters Vod's feedback to give a free pass to a scammer, actmyname literally said: here scammer Anduck, receive this positive trust and go on scamming people with ease, don't worry about Vod's negative feedback because I just countered it so that you could keep scamming people.

Now what is the reaction of Vod? yes he goes and leaves a positive trust for actmyname, Vod literally said: here actmyname have this positive trust because you just gave a free pass to somebody I consider as scammer. then DarkStar_ comes here and is not even countering any body's feedback, he just hands out a positive feedback for somebody Vod considers as scammer. what is Vod's reaction here? yes he goes and counters DarkStar_'s feedback just to say that Anduck is still a scammer.

They are misusing the trust system left and right and they will continue to do so unless they are kicked out from DT2.

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June 18, 2018, 01:31:34 AM
 #229

Vod literally said

Wrong.  I don't speak when I type.  :/

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June 18, 2018, 08:20:30 AM
 #230

Vod literally said

Wrong.  I don't speak when I type.  :/

Savage vod level 9999. Checkmate. 
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June 18, 2018, 05:36:19 PM
 #231

DarkStar_ comes here and is not even countering any body's feedback, he just hands out a positive feedback for somebody Vod considers as scammer.

Try reading.

Quote
This feedback also serves as a counter to Vod's. While Anduck has made a questionable decision, the rating from Vod does seem retaliatory (Anduck is not exempt from this either).

Therefore, I would recommend that you ignore both this trust rating, and Vod's trust rating.

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June 19, 2018, 10:18:31 AM
 #232

Currently people can place any feedback they like - some of it is blatantly untrue.  It would be good if we were able to put a comment under any feedback.


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June 19, 2018, 03:05:54 PM
 #233

DarkStar_ comes here and is not even countering any body's feedback, he just hands out a positive feedback for somebody Vod considers as scammer.

Try reading.

Quote
This feedback also serves as a counter to Vod's. While Anduck has made a questionable decision, the rating from Vod does seem retaliatory (Anduck is not exempt from this either).

Therefore, I would recommend that you ignore both this trust rating, and Vod's trust rating.

No you didn't counter Vod's feedback because actmyname already did countered his rating on Anduck. is this the kind of accurate feedback people are supposed to leave on others in order to get on DT2?

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June 19, 2018, 10:17:16 PM
 #234

DarkStar_ comes here and is not even countering any body's feedback, he just hands out a positive feedback for somebody Vod considers as scammer.

Try reading.

Quote
This feedback also serves as a counter to Vod's. While Anduck has made a questionable decision, the rating from Vod does seem retaliatory (Anduck is not exempt from this either).

Therefore, I would recommend that you ignore both this trust rating, and Vod's trust rating.

No you didn't counter Vod's feedback because actmyname already did countered his rating on Anduck. is this the kind of accurate feedback people are supposed to leave on others in order to get on DT2?

And where is it stated/implied that you are limited to one counter feedback per account? (I'll remove it if this is the case, however I do not know of any limitation)

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June 19, 2018, 10:49:51 PM
 #235

And where is it stated/implied that you are limited to one counter feedback per account? (I'll remove it if this is the case, however I do not know of any limitation)

Do that remove it and I will remove my tag on you because I only tagged you for misusing the trust system, it's not about limitation, you are not supposed to do this kind of thing. you didn't counter Vod's feedback man you tagged Anduck with green and for what? what did Anduck do to deserve the green tag from you?


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June 19, 2018, 11:14:38 PM
 #236

Do that remove it and I will remove my tag on you because I only tagged you for misusing the trust system, it's not about limitation, you are not supposed to do this kind of thing.

Image loading...

Mind providing a source that states that I am not supposed to leave counter feedbacks if one is already left? I'd be happy to remove it as soon as you provide a reputable citation. (from theymos or another admin)

you didn't counter Vod's feedback man you tagged Anduck with green and for what? what did Anduck do to deserve the green tag from you?

Anduck got negative trust from Vod to deserve the green rating from me. They did not appear to intend to deceive, and Vod seemed to have wanted to trade rating removal with Anduck.

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June 19, 2018, 11:27:37 PM
 #237

Anduck got negative trust from Vod to deserve the green rating from me. They did not appear to intend to deceive, and Vod seemed to have wanted to trade rating removal with Anduck.

What happens to Vod here? he gets a free pass then? Vod also countered your green tag, how long are you going to play this game of tagging and countering the tag? this will only increase or decrease the trust scores artificially.

According to Vod, Anduck is a scammer, he should've tagged you for giving a free pass to a scammer but he is too much of a pussy to tag DT members, he is just a bully who would only bully non DT members.
Theymos is busy doing what admins do, moderating the trust system is on you DT members and when you are misusing your power, people are usually busy with their garbage posting businesses and don't have the time to get involved so you'd keep misusing the trust system, don't wait for theymos to tell you what is right and wrong, be a man and have your saying on the matters, though be fair and earn our trust and respect doing so.

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June 19, 2018, 11:38:49 PM
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 #238

Anduck got negative trust from Vod to deserve the green rating from me. They did not appear to intend to deceive, and Vod seemed to have wanted to trade rating removal with Anduck.

What happens to Vod here? he gets a free pass then? Vod also countered your green tag, how long are you going to play this game of tagging and countering the tag? this will only increase or decrease the trust scores artificially.

Vod's counter to mine does nothing; it's a red colored neutral as he already left a negative trust in the past. I would only recounter if he deleted his old rating, as that would be trying to game the system and I might leave them a negative trust. As per theymos:

It's entirely legitimate to give someone a new positive rating just to negate a negative rating. (In this case you should explicitly respond to the negative rating you're negating.) It is not legitimate to keep deleting and reposting negative ratings to put the system back into "this guy just turned scammer!" mode. People who do that shouldn't be trusted.



According to Vod, Anduck is a scammer, he should've tagged you for giving a free pass to a scammer but he is too much of a pussy to tag DT members, he is just a bully who would only bully non DT members.

So because I do not find Anduck untrustworthy, that results in me becoming untrustworthy in Vod's eyes? He could argue that, but it wouldn't be a great argument. Not everyone has the same opinions, which helps keep the DT system (somewhat) decentralized.



Theymos is busy doing what admins do, moderating the trust system is on you DT members and when you are misusing your power, people are usually busy with their garbage posting businesses and don't have the time to get involved so you'd keep misusing the trust system, don't wait for theymos to tell you what is right and wrong, be a man and have your saying on the matters, though be fair and earn our trust and respect doing so.

My say is that there is zero issue leaving multiple counters. Again, please provide a citation, even if it's grasping at straws that multiple counters are not allowed. I don't have to wait for theymos to tell me what to do, just like how I don't have to listen to you tell me what to do. What gives you the power to create new rules for DT members?

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June 20, 2018, 12:28:18 AM
 #239

Snip.

Did Anduck pay you to counter Vod's feedback? maybe this is just a way for you guys to tag people just to get their money? if you are not going to provide a convincing reason as to why you are countering Vod's feedback, we could say that you are favoring Anduck, if your reason is just that Vod's feedback wasn't fair and Anduck didn't deserve it, then what happens to other people? for example:
Do I need to pay a DT member in order to have some counter feedbacks?
You seem to be the one making up your own rules and just expect us to trust you. Vod also tagged Anduck after 2 years, isn't that what theymos said to avoid doing? so we should consider Vod untrustworthy because he deleted his feedback and reposted it again to say "this guy turned to a scammer".

This whole case is because of Vod abusing Anduck, there are multiple red and green trust involved just because Vod felt he had the right to do whatever he wants and because nobody is stopping him, this will continue just like he countered your rating.

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June 20, 2018, 02:04:35 AM
 #240

Did Anduck pay you to counter Vod's feedback? maybe this is just a way for you guys to tag people just to get their money? if you are not going to provide a convincing reason as to why you are countering Vod's feedback, we could say that you are favoring Anduck, if your reason is just that Vod's feedback wasn't fair and Anduck didn't deserve it, then what happens to other people? for example:
Do I need to pay a DT member in order to have some counter feedbacks?

No. My only communication with Anduck was back in September 12, 2016, when I let him know that his Electrum server was lagging behind. Let me guess, new Reputation thread now and you're going to somehow link an Electrum server from almost two years ago with bribery? Also, funny that this is coming from you because you were the one who suggested that someone contact Lauda and offer to pay to get their negative trust feedback removed.

You seem to be the one making up your own rules and just expect us to trust you. Vod also tagged Anduck after 2 years, isn't that what theymos said to avoid doing? so we should consider Vod untrustworthy because he deleted his feedback and reposted it again to say "this guy turned to a scammer".

This whole case is because of Vod abusing Anduck, there are multiple red and green trust involved just because Vod felt he had the right to do whatever he wants and because nobody is stopping him, this will continue just like he countered your rating.

Vod did not delete his rating; the old one is still there, so the new one has no effect (essentially a red colored neutral).

What rules have I made up exactly? I left direct quotes on how counter feedbacks can work, from theymos. You have provided "restrictions" without any sources.

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