Sportsbet.io's English Premier League Football Pool Discussion Thread

[buwaytress]

I was mostly surprised by Havertz - he was never a finisher, but some of his decisions were shocking yesterday.
I still feel he's got fantastic potential, but he's stagnated since his Leverkusen days - maybe even gotten a bit worse in the process.

Moving to the Premier League was the wrong move, or perhaps it was too early in his career; he had tremendous potential but too weak to withstand the intensity of the Premier League. A player of his calibre should be playing behind the attacker to conserve energy, but his decision making is poor for that role.

I thought Chelsea was the issue, but he's proven to be his own problem.

I could be really unfair when I say this but...

...Havertz, Pulisic, Werner strike me as the same category of player -- all broke through the ranks in Bundesliga as pretty damned good talents. All wanted by Liverpool, pursued for years, but finally opting for Chelsea, and then somehow regressing.

I'm not blaming Chelsea at all, they all came under various managers, but I agree they made a wrong move, too early, but I can't help but wonder if they'd have thrived under Liverpool/Klopp instead. Klopp has a habit of turning weak players into strong stuff. Fabinho was a Monaco lightweight, Robbo even when he first came in, so was TAA actually but they got to the physical levels required of EPL after first seasons. Firmino even to an extent (also a Bundesliga import), Salah. They all really built up strength even from mid-20s. We did fail with Keita, he remained lightweight to the end but his injuries prevented him from developing really.

[1715212534]

1715212534

[cryptofrka]

I could be really unfair when I say this but...

...Havertz, Pulisic, Werner strike me as the same category of player -- all broke through the ranks in Bundesliga as pretty damned good talents. All wanted by Liverpool, pursued for years, but finally opting for Chelsea, and then somehow regressing.

I'm not blaming Chelsea at all, they all came under various managers, but I agree they made a wrong move, too early, but I can't help but wonder if they'd have thrived under Liverpool/Klopp instead. Klopp has a habit of turning weak players into strong stuff. Fabinho was a Monaco lightweight, Robbo even when he first came in, so was TAA actually but they got to the physical levels required of EPL after first seasons. Firmino even to an extent (also a Bundesliga import), Salah. They all really built up strength even from mid-20s. We did fail with Keita, he remained lightweight to the end but his injuries prevented him from developing really.

Partially, it surely comes down to the club you choose. Many great prospects chose badly and ruined their careers in the process.
However - for Havertz I thought that he'd fit anywhere. He's tall, technically gifted, has that German stamina and mentality, plays well with both feet, has great game awareness and intelligence.

Werner is a headless chicken, always was. Pulisic (and Sancho) never looked like generational talents. I have to say that Havertz did fool me though - and I'm still surprised that he didn't quite make it yet.

[Igebotz]

I could be really unfair when I say this but...

...Havertz, Pulisic, Werner strike me as the same category of player -- all broke through the ranks in Bundesliga as pretty damned good talents. All wanted by Liverpool, pursued for years, but finally opting for Chelsea, and then somehow regressing.

You're right about the other idiots, but I can make an exception for Pulisic: others were available for games and had plenty of time to improve, whereas Pulisic has fought with injuries throughout his career; he has the fire inside him, but his legs won't let him play.

Werner and Havertz were only supposed to shine in the farmers league. Werner used to score 30 goals every season for fun before joining the EPL and scoring only 10 for us.

[buwaytress]

Can't believe I missed that Newcastle was hosting City today. I thought Chelsea was the only game, so after that I just switched off and dawdled on tv.

Then I go on Superbru and saw I missed a cracker. Toons even led, but KdB is king, unfortunately.

You're right about the other idiots, but I can make an exception for Pulisic: others were available for games and had plenty of time to improve, whereas Pulisic has fought with injuries throughout his career; he has the fire inside him, but his legs won't let him play.

I always feel sorry for injured people, so yes, I retract grouping Pulisic in there.

[SATWAT]

Can't believe I missed that Newcastle was hosting City today. I thought Chelsea was the only game, so after that I just switched off and dawdled on tv.

Then I go on Superbru and saw I missed a cracker. Toons even led, but KdB is king, unfortunately.

You're right about the other idiots, but I can make an exception for Pulisic: others were available for games and had plenty of time to improve, whereas Pulisic has fought with injuries throughout his career; he has the fire inside him, but his legs won't let him play.

I always feel sorry for injured people, so yes, I retract grouping Pulisic in there.

Due to break many members were not able to check all updates about these matches, but I am happy as I have done good job in first three matches and have 4.5 points all three gone close even after end of the first half I was having though most chances Newcastle United will be winner, or we will have drawn but cracker from the Bobb as KDB is the hero for the Citizens after recovery from the injury he has done impressive job and score goal then assist for the winner in injury time my prediction was 1–3, but It's ended with the score of 2–3.

[Trofo]

I always feel sorry for injured people, so yes, I retract grouping Pulisic in there.

Again we don't know the entire story. In modern football it isn't enough to be talent anymore you have to take excellent care of your body. It isn't coincidence that players like Ronaldo, Ibrahimović and Modrić lasted that long. They are almost overdoing it with their training regimes and food they eat.

Then you have players like Grealish that I am quite sure aren't taking a superb care of their body. Not criticizing Grealish here, I would have been the same and I have nothing against him partying and drinking heavily in the clubs on the off days but I am quite sure he will not be playing with 38 years. It is just a fact. I am not sure where Pulisic falls in between those two outliers.

[un_rank]

Pullisic is an interesting case. At Dortmund, he was injured for about 120 days during a 2 season spell, at Chelsea he was out for over 400 days with injury throughout a 4 season period and at AC Milan he has been out for just 6 days for half a season.

I feel the medical team at Dortmund and Chelsea have some blame in the injuries he was having during his stay and at the prime of his career, and Milan seems to be doing something right in managing and keeping him fit.

- Jay -

[SATWAT]

I always feel sorry for injured people, so yes, I retract grouping Pulisic in there.

Again we don't know the entire story. In modern football it isn't enough to be talent anymore you have to take excellent care of your body. It isn't coincidence that players like Ronaldo, Ibrahimović and Modrić lasted that long. They are almost overdoing it with their training regimes and food they eat.

Then you have players like Grealish that I am quite sure aren't taking a superb care of their body. Not criticizing Grealish here, I would have been the same and I have nothing against him partying and drinking heavily in the clubs on the off days but I am quite sure he will not be playing with 38 years. It is just a fact. I am not sure where Pulisic falls in between those two outliers.

Here I completely agreed with @Trofo about this all as this is not only for the players it also fits for the other peoples those care ourselves they have better things in life with better health and like we have Ronaldo and Modric with those never care and have other things with partying and drinks they have completely different life and have to face many problems as well which hurt them in rest of the life.

Currently, we have Ronaldo and Djokovic as the role model players and persons which are doing amazing stuff and having no serious injuries or other things in life which create problems for them with Grealish and many other examples which are suffering and also having not ideal career which motivated others for having things like them.

[hilariousandco]

Weird that there's such a break mid round. The next games aren't till the 20th now. Not seen that before, unless these were rescheduled games or something. I'm currently tied 1st for this round though I doubt I'll keep ahold of it given my form this season. I'm pretty much bottom as most of those below me have seemingly given up.

[slaman29]

Weird that there's such a break mid round. The next games aren't till the 20th now. Not seen that before, unless these were rescheduled games or something. I'm currently tied 1st for this round though I doubt I'll keep ahold of it given my form this season. I'm pretty much bottom as most of those below me have seemingly given up.

It's just because of cups. They had to reschedule City because of Club World Cup and then now they even have some more replays for FA cup. Personally I think they need to just scrap replays OR make sure lower league team choose venue (to allow them choice of getting big teams visiting or play at big stadium). Also need to play CWC at season end after UCL.

If they follow trajectory it will be like Spain and Italy playing weird cup games in other countries.

[un_rank]

Also need to play CWC at season end after UCL.

That is how it would be played in the next tournament^[1] in 2025. It will also be expanded to include 32 teams, which for me is ridiculous, the players are complaining that the current match line ups are cray and tournaments like CWC, World Cup, and UCL are being expanded to accommodate more teams and MORE MATCHES.

At this rate it would not matter when the tournaments are played, each of the top clubs would need a squad of at least 35-40 players to deep in order to stay competitive.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2025_FIFA_Club_World_Cup

- Jay -

[buwaytress]

Again we don't know the entire story. In modern football it isn't enough to be talent anymore you have to take excellent care of your body. It isn't coincidence that players like Ronaldo, Ibrahimović and Modrić lasted that long. They are almost overdoing it with their training regimes and food they eat.

Currently, we have Ronaldo and Djokovic as the role model players and persons which are doing amazing stuff and having no serious injuries or other things in life which create problems for them with Grealish and many other examples which are suffering and also having not ideal career which motivated others for having things like them.

No, there are other examples predating these guys. Current role models for sure, and equipped with personal dietitians and more modern equipment to help them make even more use of every tiny optimisation.

I know Giggs was also a clean eater and fitness maniac. We've also got Brighton's Milner (formerly Liverpool) who's playing more minutes as his age gets riper. They may not have had the super coaches Ronaldo does but they don't drink any alcohol (famously Milner celebrates with Ribena haha)... Giggs I think doesn't even have butter. All to stay fit and healthy. Imagine Milner left Liverpool because they couldn't guarantee him minutes!

[casperBGD]

as 10 points deduction is not enough to be relegated (probably not TBH, due to three Championship teams that are really weak), Everton is facing more points deducted this season, with second charge for financial breach
this time, Forest is charged as well

Luton is having their fair share of luck, to stay in race to avoid relegation
EPL handling breaches and deductions on a low level amateur football league

[cryptofrka]

It's really disgusting what they're doing to Everton. With Chelsea, City and the like destroying the competitiveness of the league, they are punishing Everton and Forest.
I hope both teams challenge these decisions, Everton was deducted 10 points for 20 mil deficit in 3 years' time. Portsmouth had the biggest fine before that, 9 points, for fully going into administration.

What is the new deduction about? No toilet paper in the bathrooms?

[Igebotz]

It's really disgusting what they're doing to Everton. With Chelsea, City and the like destroying the competitiveness of the league, they are punishing Everton and Forest.
I hope both teams challenge these decisions, Everton was deducted 10 points for 20 mil deficit in 3 years' time. Portsmouth had the biggest fine before that, 9 points, for fully going into administration.

What is the new deduction about? No toilet paper in the bathrooms?

Chelsea has not broken any FA laws; we have brilliant business minds, and all we did was exploit FA transfer loopholes, which is not a violation of the rules. The only rule we ever violated was the UEFA FFP, which we reported on our own, submitted to UEFA, and our punishment was lowered owing to our fairness. City 115 charges hasn't been proven yet.

Everton cannot continue to break silly rules and expect to get away with it. They need a good business Lawyer and outstanding business minds to operate the club or they will go bankrupt like Postmouth.

[un_rank]

It's really disgusting what they're doing to Everton. With Chelsea, City and the like destroying the competitiveness of the league, they are punishing Everton and Forest.

I have not had the time to read all the reasons for the deductions, but one thing to note is that all the clubs agreed to the current financial rules being used, if any decision is made contrary to the agreement, other clubs would weigh in and challenge that.
We should not always weigh the smaller clubs against bigger one and make it look like they are being targeted.

If they wanted to destroy the competitiveness of the league, I do not think Forest and Everton would be the targets.

- Jay -

[slaman29]

@casperBGD That is fking shit news. What about City and United? Did they not already got fined why not points??

Also need to play CWC at season end after UCL.

That is how it would be played in the next tournament^[1] in 2025. It will also be expanded to include 32 teams, which for me is ridiculous, the players are complaining that the current match line ups are cray and tournaments like CWC, World Cup, and UCL are being expanded to accommodate more teams and MORE MATCHES.

- Jay -

Ah, finally. I had no idea this was happening. But postponing it to end of season by replacing it with a whole new tournament format is craziness. This may solve scheduling issue but it increases player tiredness. Are FIFA crazy or are clubs getting paid to agree?

Premier League bigs may not feel the pinch, especially City, Liverpool even Arsenal can all send out youth players or B squad. But that makes the cup even more worthless.

[casperBGD]

It's really disgusting what they're doing to Everton. With Chelsea, City and the like destroying the competitiveness of the league, they are punishing Everton and Forest.

I have not had the time to read all the reasons for the deductions, but one thing to note is that all the clubs agreed to the current financial rules being used, if any decision is made contrary to the agreement, other clubs would weigh in and challenge that.
~snip

financial rules are there, but there is no table for punishment on rules breaching, which is kind-a-thing, and if you don't have punishment set for breaching a rule, than it is merely a recommendation
but, EPL is deciding on case based on their own assessment, which is why some breached rules are not punished, and Everton already is, and Forest will possibly be (that is part of Everton appeal, that deduction decision is arbitrary, not as per rules)

also, Everton is now punished for time-frame that is including years that are already in first deduction (2019-2022), so basically doubled

[un_rank]

players
Ah, finally. I had no idea this was happening. But postponing it to end of season by replacing it with a whole new tournament format is craziness. This may solve scheduling issue but it increases player tiredness. Are FIFA crazy or are clubs getting paid to agree?

It is ridiculous. It seems FIFA are only bothered about the finances. More teams means more matches and bigger TV rights.
Players have been complaining about the current fixture lineup and nothing has been done yet, sure they may get more bonuses, but I think they will rather have less matches and a longer career.

...but, EPL is deciding on case based on their own assessment, which is why some breached rules are not punished, and Everton already is, and Forest will possibly be (that is part of Everton appeal, that deduction decision is arbitrary, not as per rules)

But it has not been proven that City breached any rules as yet, right?

- Jay -

[cryptofrka]

Chelsea has not broken any FA laws; we have brilliant business minds, and all we did was exploit FA transfer loopholes, which is not a violation of the rules.

True, you used loopholes. Not so brilliantly though, you have 40 mediocre players on 8-year bloated contracts so good luck with that going forward.

I have not had the time to read all the reasons for the deductions, but one thing to note is that all the clubs agreed to the current financial rules being used, if any decision is made contrary to the agreement, other clubs would weigh in and challenge that.
We should not always weigh the smaller clubs against bigger one and make it look like they are being targeted.

If they wanted to destroy the competitiveness of the league, I do not think Forest and Everton would be the targets.

- Jay -

I didn't say the smaller clubs were targeted, I said they are being used as examples - which is wrong on so many levels.
City is showing huge sponsorship incomes because that's how they pump money into the club - so of course they don't have financial deficit. It still is breaking the rules, and should be punished more severely than Everton's deficit, which happened during the Covid years where budgeting was basically impossible.