Neo & Bee talk (spam free thread)

[Luttinen]

No, they haven't [ filed for bankruptcy ]. Last word from the CEO mentioned that a 3rd party agency is looking for a buyer.

[ ... ] details will be made available to interested parties who wish to purchase 100% of my equity in LMB Subsidiaries Ltd thus taking full control of all subsidiaries. [ ... ] I am working towards having this entire process completed within a short period of time to enable the business to recover, to ensure that those invested do not lose out following this process[/b].

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=289730.msg6030319#msg6030319

Yes, that is what Mark Karpelès tried to do before finally filing for bankruptcy.  And many MtGOX clients kept hoping that some "angel whale" would buy the company and honor its debts.  But no sane person will buy a company in that situation.

Dude. That's one case out of millions of cases of businesses in trouble.

I could give you hundreds of examples of successful turnaround stories. Doesn't surprise me inexperienced Bitcoin community geeks can only give MtGox as example. This community is really a sad bunch.

[JorgeStolfi]

they don't have enough money to file for bankruptcy

Please correct me, but I understand that filing for bankruptcy is a way to suspend all lawsuits that creditors and investors may move against the company and their management.  These lawsuits can easily cost more in legal fees than a bankruptcy filing.

[JorgeStolfi]

I could give you hundreds of examples of successful turnaround stories.

Can you give me one example of such turnaround by a company which never had any revenue and never published a financial statement, and whose entire staff quit after the CEO left the country without explanation and without paying their salaries?

Doesn't surprise me inexperienced Bitcoin community geeks can only give MtGox as example. This community is really a sad bunch.

You and Brewster are part of the "Bitcoin community".  I am not, fortunately; and I do have some experience with real companies that failed.

[Luttinen]

they don't have enough money to file for bankruptcy

Please correct me, but I understand that filing for bankruptcy is a way to suspend all lawsuits that creditors and investors may move against the company and their management.  These lawsuits can easily cost more in legal fees than a bankruptcy filing.

Gox lost a LOT of customer money. You are comparing Oranges(neo) with horseshit(gox).

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

[JorgeStolfi]

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

How can one say that without a single financial statement or audit?

Is the store owned, leased, or rented? 

What other tangible assets do they have, besides the store and servers?

Since BitFunder went down, there seems to have been no progress on recovering those "frozen" coins.  AFAIK no lawsuits were brought against Jon (the owner of BitFunder). Why would a buyer believe that those coins can be recovered some day?

I read this November post by Brewster https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=348468.msg3732068#msg3732068 as:  "Jon has two options, keep saying that he is working on it, or admitting that the coins are lost. I prefer the first."  Of course.

[velacreations]

he can't say that, he doesn't know what their debt is or their assets or anything else.

[Luttinen]

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

What other tangible assets do they have, besides the store and servers?

There is the software which is valuable, POS devices, not sure about status of building, the frozen IPO funds. Not sure about other assets. We are going to need to see a report of some sort. But business is valuable sold as a whole not piece by piece.

We don't know the full story of what went down with Bitfunder. Timing was suspicious to say the least, because it came right after btc.to was forced to close by US gov. There's a chance those funds had to be frozen pending investigation.
 

[sporket]

...Doesn't surprise me inexperienced Bitcoin community geeks can only give MtGox as example. This community is really a sad bunch.

[Luttinen]

...Doesn't surprise me inexperienced Bitcoin community geeks can only give MtGox as example. This community is really a sad bunch.

https://i.imgur.com/OhdWa5N.png

I rest my case.  

I thought LambChops posts pony gay crap. Forgot to switch accounts?

[Kenta]

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

What other tangible assets do they have, besides the store and servers?

There is the software which is valuable, POS devices, not sure about status of building, the frozen IPO funds. Not sure about other assets. We are going to need to see a report of some sort. But business is valuable sold as a whole not piece by piece.

We don't know the full story of what went down with Bitfunder. Timing was suspicious to say the least, because it came right after btc.to was forced to close by US gov. There's a chance those funds had to be frozen pending investigation.
 

What other assets?
* They have done pioneer work in preparing Cypriots to adopt BitCoins. First time I read about them was about 2 months ago on the front page of Cyprus Mail, the biggest English speaking newspaper on Cyprus.
* They have agreements in place with SoEasy, which is a chain of small kiosks all over Cyprus. Every little village have one of those!
* They have made some kind of an electronic terminal that accepts a credit-size card connected directly to your bitcoin funds. Almost ready to go live as I understand.
* They have had meetings with banks and govt. officials that more or less gave them green lights to roll out this thing. Approvals that might never be given again if it fails now!

So what are we waiting for! This might become worlds first BitCoin-land and if it has success it might be used as a model for doing the same in Greece.. then perhaps Italy, France, Spain and all the other countries that already had plenty more than enough of ECB and the Eurozone.

[BCTCYPRUS]

I HAVE SEEN NEO AND BEE OFFICES IN NICOSIA-CYPRUS
Two floors of offices (550m2) on monthly rend- Fully furnished furniture fully paid
Branch-150m2-on monthly rend-Very elusive development,luxury interiors,fully function bank like space,no othr similar in cyprus.
COST,350,000 EUROS,PAID-225,000 NEO AND BEE NEEDS TO PAY ANOTHER 125,000 Euros

[sporket]

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

What other tangible assets do they have, besides the store and servers?

There is the software which is valuable, POS devices, not sure about status of building, the frozen IPO funds. Not sure about other assets. We are going to need to see a report of some sort. But business is valuable sold as a whole not piece by piece.

We don't know the full story of what went down with Bitfunder. Timing was suspicious to say the least, because it came right after btc.to was forced to close by US gov. There's a chance those funds had to be frozen pending investigation.
 

What other assets?
* They have done pioneer work in preparing Cypriots to adopt BitCoins. First time I read about them was about 2 months ago on the front page of Cyprus Mail, the biggest English speaking newspaper on Cyprus...

Somewhat more recent coverage by Cyprus Mail:



http://cyprus-mail.com/2014/04/04/police-probe-claims-of-bitcoin-fraud/

a day earlier:


Other sources:
http://www.newsit.com.cy/default.php?pname=Article&art_id=134544&catid=31
http://www.coindesk.com/neo-bee-ceo-danny-brewster-faces-fraud-allegations-cyprus/
Plenty more.

So yeah, Cypriots are now ready for bitcoin banks.  Might need sum oil, though.

[augustocroppo]

nope.
EDIT: they haven't even resume trading. According to havelock announcements, havelock itself
decided to change name on the asset and let it trade, freely.

So, there's that. Right now, people sold their actuall neobee shares for coins, and people are buying neobeeq shares
the value of which is questionable.

Tsc tsc tsc.

Deception in so many levels...

An illegal exchange acting in behalf of a fraudulent company. What next?

[Kenta]

The buyer who takes over MtGox has to cover huge amount of lost Bitcoin. Neo has very low debt and actual BTC frozen and real assets that are valuable. Neo's assets and frozen funds are much higher than the low debt it has.

What other tangible assets do they have, besides the store and servers?

There is the software which is valuable, POS devices, not sure about status of building, the frozen IPO funds. Not sure about other assets. We are going to need to see a report of some sort. But business is valuable sold as a whole not piece by piece.

We don't know the full story of what went down with Bitfunder. Timing was suspicious to say the least, because it came right after btc.to was forced to close by US gov. There's a chance those funds had to be frozen pending investigation.
 

What other assets?
* They have done pioneer work in preparing Cypriots to adopt BitCoins. First time I read about them was about 2 months ago on the front page of Cyprus Mail, the biggest English speaking newspaper on Cyprus...

Somewhat more recent coverage by Cyprus Mail:

img

http://cyprus-mail.com/2014/04/04/police-probe-claims-of-bitcoin-fraud/

a day earlier:
img

So yeah, Cypriots are now ready for bitcoin banks.  Might need sum oil.

img

Yeah, I think I saw that already in the other thread also. My point was more in the direction that the assets can not just be brought back by selling that Oracle license and some used furniture. The real value is in the political and propaganda work that has been done and that now sticks to the company.

That coverage from the Cyprus Mail web-page have not been in the paper version as far as I know, and the damage could possibly be repaired when things gets clarified...

It would probably be a good idea to keep expenses down a bit now in the beginning and work on the code at least until it's ready, but I'd still like to see all this work mature and become something valuable instead of just ripping it all apart now, just when it's so close to be rolled out... And remember; Cyprus style isn't really to make some cheap stand with a camping table and a parasol out in the street to meet people, like a farmer or something.. No one is going to make business with Neo&Bee then - They will need to put the proper suit and sunglasses on and arrive in a good car, that's the Cypriot-business style and is not going to change anytime soon. If this includes buying a proper sofa, then let them do what's needed!

[Luttinen]

Funny that most of the negativity here comes from MPEx & associates.

Articles that came out in Cypriotic papers are weak on substance to say the least. They basically say CEO is out of the country and that Neo owns some money which is to be expected due to liquidity issues.

No paper in Cyprus bothered to present Danny's plan to sell the company to a new owner, raise cash, settle the debts and move things forward, even though these were all details well worth mentioning.

[Luttinen]

Yeah, I think I saw that already in the other thread also. My point was more in the direction that the assets can not just be brought back by selling that Oracle license and some used furniture. The real value is in the political and propaganda work that has been done and that now sticks to the company.

That coverage from the Cyprus Mail web-page have not been in the paper version as far as I know, and the damage could possibly be repaired when things gets clarified...

It would probably be a good idea to keep expenses down a bit now in the beginning and work on the code at least until it's ready, but I'd still like to see this all this work mature and become something valuable instead of just ripping it all apart now, just when it's so close to be rolled out... And remember; Cyprus style isn't really to make some cheap stand with a camping table and a parasol out in the street to meet people, like a farmer or something.. No one is going to make business with Neo&Bee then - They will need to put the proper suit and sunglasses on and arrive in a good car, that's the Cypriot-business style and is not going to change anytime soon. If this includes buying a proper sofa, then let them do what's needed!

Refreshing to see a smart comment. Exactly so, in many parts of the world people won't do business with you or won't take you seriously unless you present yourself in certain fashion, which includes fancy car, which is why Danny bought that used Bentley from UK. But of course competition hellbent on destroying Neo by waging persistent defamation campaign doesn't want you to know such details, they want you to buy into their narrative.

[NotLambchop]

@Kenta re: "The real value is in the political and propaganda work that has been done and that now sticks to the company."

There is no evidence that attitudes of Cypriots towards Bitcoin are more favorable with Brewster running off to UK, leaving his employees unpaid and jobless.  Another banking fiasco associated with Cyprus also has dubious PR value.  Where do you see value?

[Luttinen]

@Kenta re: "The real value is in the political and propaganda work that has been done and that now sticks to the company."

There is no evidence that attitudes of Cypriots towards Bitcoin are more favorable with Brewster running off to UK, leaving his employees unpaid and jobless.  Another banking fiasco associated with Cyprus also has dubious PR value.  Where do you see value?

It's not like you care about the truth anyways. It's more about the fiction you're trying to sell people.

Brand awareness campaign worked and was highly successful. Cyprus made it to top of the list in global Bitcoin searches for few months in a row. I remember MPEx competition was trying hard to downplay the success of the ad campaign.

Neo didn't open its gates to regular people yet, didn't have money from customers. People didn't lose money with Neo as they did during the bail-ins. Some contractors need to be paid and that's an issue which will be solved by the new owner.

[NotLambchop]

...
No paper in Cyprus bothered to present Danny's plan to sell the company to a new owner, raise cash, settle the debts and move things forward, even though these were all details well worth mentioning.

We are discussing the fruit of Neo's PR campaign, or lack thereof.  The local press, for instance, is laughing and pointing fingers.  
Souch wow.
So value.

[okaynow]

Articles that came out in Cypriotic papers are weak on substance to say the least.

Newspaper articles seemed to be following various blogposts and articles, which in turned lately followed the narratives stemming from this forum.

not much research, to say the least..