Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[TwitchySeal]

Is this a country where people can be themselves and have the right to freedom of speech?

...see Trump's latest podcast with Joe Rogan... if you can find it, since it and its reuploads getting removed in a few hours after they get uploaded.
Luckily commy youtube isn't the only game in town:
https://www.bitchute.com/video/WdzbBWQbKhzd/

Freedom of speech like this?

The west banned their own president from every social media there is.

Freedom of Speech doesn't mean a private company can't ban someone from using their platform.  The whole point is to protect the people from being silenced by the government.  Think about how silly you look crying about the head of the government getting banned by private American businesses.  Dry your tears, Trump started his own platform and it's going as expected.

Seized the Russian properties regardless of whom the owner is supporting (seriously why haven't the UK questioned the source of Abramovitz's wealth before?), kicking people out of colleges, not letting Russian people into the restaurants (wtf?)

I haven't been to Russia so I can't say anything about the country but the west's mask has slipped, they are also not what they claim to be.

Jesus, right wing media really going heavy on the "Russia is the victim, lets go Brandon" kool aid. 

If they didn't support Putin, they wouldn't be Oligarchs today.  That's literally the deal they made.

[mindrust]

IMO, in this case, seizing Russian properites isn't something wrong,

If you agree with this then you shouldn't say a word when some other country seizes the western properties. Shit like this cuts both ways. I hate this hypocrisy. The west is free do kill and steal but when some other country does it, it is the worst thing ever happened.

[TwitchySeal]

IMO, in this case, seizing Russian properites isn't something wrong,

If you agree with this then you shouldn't say a word when some other country seizes the western properties. Shit like this cuts both ways. I hate this hypocrisy. The west is free do kill and steal but when some other country does it, it is the worst thing ever happened.

Unless "some other country" is invading an Ally that the US agreed to defend it wouldn't really be the same thing, would it?

[Etranger]

If you agree with this then you shouldn't say a word when some other country seizes the western properties. Shit like this cuts both ways. I hate this hypocrisy. The west is free do kill and steal but when some other country does it, it is the worst thing ever happened.

Why is rhetoric of defending russia for accusing the West of similar actions so popular? Do you understand that your argument is based on substitution of concepts and distraction from the main subject of discussion? Do you also justify one murderer by being convicted by the same murderer? Will this first be less killer after that? And why entangle crimes of the West here now? You can create a separate thread for them. Your accusations against the West in no way diminish or smooth out what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

[Tash]

................what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

What is so bad about liberating Donetsk and Luhansk, de-nazify and deal with out of control corruption?

https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php/en/news-page/news-nation/in-2015-new-york-times-calls-ukraine-s-azov-regiment-openly-nazi-today-nyt-calls-same-regiment-far-right

[Etranger]

................what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

What is so bad about liberating Donetsk and Luhansk, de-nazify and deal with out of control corruption?

https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php/en/news-page/news-nation/in-2015-new-york-times-calls-ukraine-s-azov-regiment-openly-nazi-today-nyt-calls-same-regiment-far-right

The thing that all this is a lie, created for 25 years by your sick government. And the thing that it not you damn business, even if it was at least slightly true, which is not

[Tash]

................what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

What is so bad about liberating Donetsk and Luhansk, de-nazify and deal with out of control corruption?

https://halturnerradioshow.com/index.php/en/news-page/news-nation/in-2015-new-york-times-calls-ukraine-s-azov-regiment-openly-nazi-today-nyt-calls-same-regiment-far-right

The thing that all this is a lie, created for 25 years by your sick government. And the thing that it not you damn business, even if it was at least slightly true, which is not

Which one is a lie, the liberation, the denazification the corruption or all of them?
My sick govenment, no certainly not, i don't have a govenment, currrently i govern myself, been so for some time but may change.
It is Donetsk peoples business and no-one elses.

The Ukrainian State, which declared its independence from Russia in November 1917: https://64.media.tumblr.com/579933e6b9cd0b4576b44f40b86b7704/tumblr_pd06hms45x1xnrvdzo1_640.png   https://tinyurl.com/vvamxhtm


What large scale corruption will do

[suchmoon]

17th century LOL

RT doesn't want you to know this, but...

Ancient Kievan lands... 1000 years ago, since before Moscow even existed.

[Tash]

17th century LOL

RT doesn't want you to know this, but...

Ancient Kievan lands... 1000 years ago, since before Moscow even existed.

Thank you for confirming that the two countries at the center of the dispute Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic never ever have been part of Ukraine other than in Soviet times when Vladimir Lenin  gave it to them.

[paxmao]

There is plenty of history on the formation of any estate, and Ukraine is no different. In modern times, it is the people that live in a region or country that have the right to decide their future and their organisation. It is just silly pretending that you have to go back decades or even centuries and then wage a war on those grounds and certainly Putin does not give a ****k about that.

This war is only about Putin loosing their geostrategic grip and exclusive access on a large part of the former USSR republics, including some of the most strategic and financially critical regions such as the Black Sea and Azov Sea. All the rest is the trolls trying to make noise and trying to blame the war on things that are absolutely irrelevant to Putin and his entourage.

The sad truth is that Putin has failed to seduce, use diplomacy or economically influence those territories and he is using the last resource of the incompetent: war.



And as for how to stop the guy

[paxmao]

...

War is a team sport.

From what we have seen so far, it looks like Putin is making all military decisions by himself.

Not quite. This is more or less publicly known but there is a select "club" of people in Russia called the "Lake Club" ("Ozero"), named after a fancy area in which an entourage of Putin built their "dachas". An entourage built on friends from St Petesburg and from his years in the KGB. A notable one is Yury Kovalchuk, possibly the second most powerful man in Putin's Russia. He along with Putin and his closed circle planned the aggression to Ukraine.

I guess what I want to say is that this war is "a team effort", the problem is that is a dysfunctional team that lacks a counterbalance in opinions and generates only the same old cold-war mafia-style ideas.

[DaRude]

If you agree with this then you shouldn't say a word when some other country seizes the western properties. Shit like this cuts both ways. I hate this hypocrisy. The west is free do kill and steal but when some other country does it, it is the worst thing ever happened.

Why is rhetoric of defending russia for accusing the West of similar actions so popular? Do you understand that your argument is based on substitution of concepts and distraction from the main subject of discussion? Do you also justify one murderer by being convicted by the same murderer? Will this first be less killer after that? And why entangle crimes of the West here now? You can create a separate thread for them. Your accusations against the West in no way diminish or smooth out what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

Well, because context matters, history matters, and double standards and hypocrisy are a thing. Have you ever considered why Lady Justice is blindfolded? Selective justice is not justice but just another term for preferential treatment. How could you take a kangaroo court that doesn't investigate laser guided bombing killing 408 civilians hiding in the bomb shelter seriously? It's like me cheating and getting advantage in the beginning of the game and then saying, from this point on lets play by the rules. Even kids wouldn't fall for that. Precedents have consequences.

...
This war is only about Putin loosing their geostrategic grip and exclusive access on a large part of the former USSR republics, including some of the most strategic and financially critical regions such as the Black Sea and Azov Sea. All the rest is the trolls trying to make noise and trying to blame the war on things that are absolutely irrelevant to Putin and his entourage.

The sad truth is that Putin has failed to seduce, use diplomacy or economically influence those territories and he is using the last resource of the incompetent: war.

BINGO! I concur, I covered this in my soft/hard power post. Glad to finally see someone step back and look at it in terms of geostrategical grips. But keep going, don't stop there. There's a clear Hegemony in the world, there's like 100x difference in weight categories in terms of economic influence, preferential treatments seductions etc... We all know theres no way Russia can compete on that playing field. So Russia's sphere of influence was gradually being chipped away by this 1000kg guerilla. Putin drew a line on last remaining 4 countries he had left in his sphere. So what were his options when that 1000kg guerilla came after the last pieces of his sphere of influence? Either roll over and let his country be absorbed between east and west (in current global economy single country is not competitive to survive on its own), or take the last stand. I believe here we're watching him taking the last stand.

Now we come to the fun part, what happens next. The way i see it is either west manages to collapse Russia with soft power for the second time (but now has to deal with China next), or diplomats totally miscalculated and fucked up big time, giving cookies to Ukraine just went too far too fast, it cornered Russia, so west looses all leverage over Russia, Europe looses a trade partner and once again gets a totalitarian regime next door with it's gloves off. On top of that it'll have no option but to align itself with another totalitarian regime, China. That has potential for a change in a world order, that's why now everyone is watching China

[Tash]

There is plenty of history on the formation of any estate, and Ukraine is no different. In modern times, it is the people that live in a region or country that have the right to decide their future and their organisation.
......................

Exactly and the people of Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic have decided they want have anything to do with Ukraine.
You nailed it.

Looks like the end is near for mariupol.
https://www.veteranstoday.com/2022/03/20/russias-mod-outlines-efforts-to-free-mariupol-hostages-from-nazi-fanatics/

[Etranger]

If you agree with this then you shouldn't say a word when some other country seizes the western properties. Shit like this cuts both ways. I hate this hypocrisy. The west is free do kill and steal but when some other country does it, it is the worst thing ever happened.

Why is rhetoric of defending russia for accusing the West of similar actions so popular? Do you understand that your argument is based on substitution of concepts and distraction from the main subject of discussion? Do you also justify one murderer by being convicted by the same murderer? Will this first be less killer after that? And why entangle crimes of the West here now? You can create a separate thread for them. Your accusations against the West in no way diminish or smooth out what the russians are doing to Ukraine now.

Well, because context matters, history matters, and double standards and hypocrisy are a thing. Have you ever considered why Lady Justice is blindfolded? Selective justice is not justice but just another term for preferential treatment. How could you take a kangaroo court that doesn't investigate laser guided bombing killing 408 civilians hiding in the bomb shelter seriously? It's like me cheating and getting advantage in the beginning of the game and then saying, from this point on lets play by the rules. Even kids wouldn't fall for that. Precedents have consequences.

The context is important when it comes to comparing two situations. The context is important when we retrospectively describe these events as part of history. But how can you say that context matters when you use it to say, "well, you know, they've died before, and generally, for example, in Syria, much more destructive weapons were used. It's not just these guys who are bad."

Just an amazing take on the situation! It only says that you do not have your own position on what is happening right now. The context can be used stupidly for everything, just to do nothing. Napoleon, you know, burned the half of the Europe, so that you can ignore the demolished Mariupol, the scale is still not the same, and in general, let's stop considering Napoleon a hero, because this is a blatantly topical issue, given the context.

[paxmao]

There is plenty of history on the formation of any estate, and Ukraine is no different. In modern times, it is the people that live in a region or country that have the right to decide their future and their organisation.
......................

Exactly and the people of Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic have decided they want have anything to do with Ukraine.
You nailed it.

...

That is quite far from the truth I am afraid. Putin has been supporting a certain group but the local support is nil. Who would like to live under Putin's despotic and inhuman rule?

On Mariupol... it seems that Putin could enter the city. The obvious problem is that there is no longer a city in there, he has conquered a flat plain full of rubble, dead and hungry people. He has simply flattened it and that only leaves ill will and hate. I guess that is not an immediate problem for Putin, yet controlling a territory that is hostile is a costly effort, so this "victory" may become his new Afghanistan, but hey, feel free to consider it a victory if it happens.

Again, your trolling and citing of propaganda simply sucks. Your reputation in the forum is being permanently damaged, but hey, call it a victory for you if you want.

...

Now we come to the fun part, what happens next. The way i see it is either west manages to collapse Russia with soft power for the second time (but now has to deal with China next), or diplomats totally miscalculated and fucked up big time, giving cookies to Ukraine just went too far too fast, it cornered Russia, so west looses all leverage over Russia, Europe looses a trade partner and once again gets a totalitarian regime next door with it's gloves off. On top of that it'll have no option but to align itself with another totalitarian regime, China. That has potential for a change in a world order, that's why now everyone is watching China

There is no fun part in all this. Europe will not "align" with China much more that already was. This war has shown how totalitarian regimes need to always be considered a risk.

What is clear is that Europe may actually create a real army of its own. The problem with armies, particularly if large, is that they tend to justify their cost creating wars.

[Tash]

There is plenty of history on the formation of any estate, and Ukraine is no different. In modern times, it is the people that live in a region or country that have the right to decide their future and their organisation.
......................

Exactly and the people of Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic have decided they want have anything to do with Ukraine.
You nailed it.

...

That is quite far from the truth I am afraid. Putin has been supporting a certain group but the local support is nil. Who would like to live under Putin's despotic and inhuman rule?

On Mariupol... it seems that Putin could enter the city. The obvious problem is that there is no longer a city in there, he has conquered a flat plain full of rubble, dead and hungry people. He has simply flattened it and that only leaves ill will and hate. I guess that is not an immediate problem for Putin, yet controlling a territory that is hostile is a costly effort, so this "victory" may become his new Afghanistan, but hey, feel free to consider it a victory if it happens.

Again, your trolling and citing of propaganda simply sucks. Your reputation in the forum is being permanently damaged, but hey, call it a victory for you if you want.

...

Now we come to the fun part, what happens next. The way i see it is either west manages to collapse Russia with soft power for the second time (but now has to deal with China next), or diplomats totally miscalculated and fucked up big time, giving cookies to Ukraine just went too far too fast, it cornered Russia, so west looses all leverage over Russia, Europe looses a trade partner and once again gets a totalitarian regime next door with it's gloves off. On top of that it'll have no option but to align itself with another totalitarian regime, China. That has potential for a change in a world order, that's why now everyone is watching China

There is no fun part in all this. Europe will not "align" with China much more that already was. This war has shown how totalitarian regimes need to always be considered a risk.

What is clear is that Europe may actually create a real army of its own. The problem with armies, particularly if large, is that they tend to justify their cost creating wars.

That is why they have the own countries, they don't want Putin, they want away from Ukraine govenment terror.
Fast majority of Ukraine history Donesk region has not been part of Ukraine anyway.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donetsk_People's_Republic
https://web.archive.org/web/20220224051432/http://gorod-donetsk.com/
and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luhansk_People's_Republic
https://glava-lnr.su/

[be.open]

On Mariupol... it seems that Putin could enter the city. The obvious problem is that there is no longer a city in there, he has conquered a flat plain full of rubble, dead and hungry people. He has simply flattened it and that only leaves ill will and hate. I guess that is not an immediate problem for Putin, yet controlling a territory that is hostile is a costly effort, so this "victory" may become his new Afghanistan, but hey, feel free to consider it a victory if it happens.

The occupation of Ukraine is not the purpose of the special operation. Ukraine will lose its army and ultra-right nationalists, just as it has already lost Crimea, Donbass and Lugansk. And then she will begin to build a new peaceful life, while maintaining neutrality and loyalty to Russia. Because the blood ties between our peoples are stronger than the current ideological differences.

[be.open]

The only way there will be peace in this world is when all pro-Soviet imperialist enthusiasts are killed, in Russia and abroad (Belarus, Crimea, Donbas, Chechnya, Ossetia, Transnistria, etc).

Peace in Ukraine will come much sooner than you think, because according to your version, it will never come.

[Etranger]

The occupation of Ukraine is not the purpose of the special operation.

Yeah, the purpose of this ''special operation'' (my God, just two words, but they really tell everything about your inability to think) is to finally convince the whole world that your society needs nothing more than propaganda and assassinations on which you build a sick sense of self-sufficiency.

And then she will begin to build a new peaceful life, while maintaining neutrality and loyalty to Russia. Because the blood ties between our peoples are stronger than the current ideological differences.

How can you be so brainwashed and not even notice it? Do you really think that Russia is worth dealing with? You live by ear in shit and consider it a normal peaceful life? When the FSB can come to you at any time because of "inapropriate" Instagram post? I strongly advise you to raise money (better not in rubles, because nothing will work) and go at least once in your life to really normal, developed countries - in Austria, Switzerland, Germany. Try to use the rest of your brain to compare how people live there and how your people live, for example, in Orlovshchina.

[be.open]

The occupation of Ukraine is not the purpose of the special operation.

Yeah, the purpose of this ''special operation'' (my God, just two words, but they really tell everything about your inability to think) is to finally convince the whole world that your society needs nothing more than propaganda and assassinations on which you build a sick sense of self-sufficiency.

And then she will begin to build a new peaceful life, while maintaining neutrality and loyalty to Russia. Because the blood ties between our peoples are stronger than the current ideological differences.

How can you be so brainwashed and not even notice it? Do you really think that Russia is worth dealing with? You live by ear in shit and consider it a normal peaceful life? When the FSB can come to you at any time because of "inapropriate" Instagram post? I strongly advise you to raise money (better not in rubles, because nothing will work) and go at least once in your life to really normal, developed countries - in Austria, Switzerland, Germany. Try to use the rest of your brain to compare how people live there and how your people live, for example, in Orlovshchina.

Russophobia, problems with refugees, expensive gasoline, expensive food, expensive electricity, high unemployment are now thriving in Europe, and there is no certainty that the situation will change for the better. I can move to Europe, but I can't stop being Russian. Thank you but no. I'd rather live in my homeland brainwashed than in a foreign land with burnt porridge in my head.