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Author Topic: [ANN] FIMK: 2.5G POS, extra block rewards, messaging, asset colors, p2p shopping  (Read 169522 times)
gvans
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July 08, 2014, 11:16:09 AM
 #681

Block 10000 was forged by account with 18+ million FIMK i.e. one of the two gigantic stakeholders from ipo. Account has forged 120000 pos-rewards already and now gets 10000 as bonus.  http://80.240.143.139/blocks/10247

One has to look it from the point of view of average future user which is hopefully the Finnish citizen who will get 100 a month. It is obvious she/he will feel offended by the idea that someone with big stake will will get the same amount as reward what she/he will have to wait for 100 months to collect (if the distribution even ever will last that long). So the average guy would propably just abandon the whole thing feeling it is not equal chance for her/him anymore.

Any chance to reconsider this kind of idea?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=633304.msg7720567#msg7720567

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July 08, 2014, 12:33:26 PM
 #682

Hello

I wanted to ask if there is any risk associated with forging if done with a downloaded "local" client?

And aliases can still not be created right?

Is Fimk Ry devs forging with the unreleased fimk balances as well ?



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July 08, 2014, 12:44:56 PM
 #683

I have a challenge for the FIMK community. A friend of mine and his wife are going cycle from London to Paris on the 5th - 8th August to raise funds for a charity. Their goal is to raise £3000 in 28 days until the event. You can read more about their cause here http://bike4youth.tumblr.com/cause

Neither of them are cyclist so this is quite a challenge for them and I really want to help them out as much as I can therefore I have set up a donations account below and will donate 100,000 FIMK to their cause now and until the 5th of August all the FIMK I forge.

I made a few calculations and at the current BTC and FIMK rates £3000 translates to roughly 1,700,000 FIMK. That 's not too much to ask and seeing as this is a new crytpo and the forging working brilliantly, I think something great to get involved in.

I also propose that all the donations received over £3000 stay in the donations account to keep forging and then monthly we donate what's forged to the same or other charities.

Lets get donating to

FIM-8HX6-YR69-FQ6W-5MGNX

**** NB All distributions will be documented and there will always be clear visibility as to when the money is donated to the charities.***


Bullshit gtfo with your scam. I can set up a website + story in few minutes create a new address send 100k to it and let it look like its legit. After the time runs out Im gonna disappear with the donations, bye.

No need to be rude mate and before you call it a scam did you even bother to click on any one of the links to see which charity is supported. Since you claim it so easy to set up a scam maybe your the one with the people should be aware of.

I'm sure the charity is legit but noone knows if you are. If you really want to do this get a trusted escrow to hold the funds. You might have good intentions, you probably do, but money can easily corrupt people.

I too used to have trust and faith in humanity until I came onto the crypto scene and was scammed for 15btc @600usd.

good luck

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July 08, 2014, 01:18:07 PM
 #684

Block 10000 was forged by account with 18+ million FIMK i.e. one of the two gigantic stakeholders from ipo. Account has forged 120000 pos-rewards already and now gets 10000 as bonus.  http://80.240.143.139/blocks/10247

..So the average guy would propably just abandon the whole thing feeling it is not equal chance for her/him anymore.
This was sheer stroke of luck. All other accounts together probably had better probability of forging that one, but it went this way now. No reason to use that as an implication of anything sinister. Lady Fortuna's attention skips us once in a while when she has to attend for more important things!

         
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July 08, 2014, 01:25:26 PM
 #685

I am a large FIM holder (from IPO) and I even I think it would be nice to have incentives for smaller FIM holders to get involved.
We'll think this through how to arrange it, but it's very difficult to do without skewing the incentives towards unfairness.

Bonus rewards are not paid very often, so random variance will play a big role and even small time forgers have a considerable chance of hitting the bonanza on one of them.

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).

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July 08, 2014, 05:45:24 PM
 #686

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).
What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

         
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July 08, 2014, 08:17:31 PM
 #687

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).
What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?
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July 08, 2014, 08:57:25 PM
 #688

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).
What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.

Brilliant idea btw to split it in two Cool Only I would correct that either one of the two blocks in a row are as likely to be forged by a big stakeholder since that square number block is just a regular block like the rest of them. But the odds that the same account forges two in a row is way lower.

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July 08, 2014, 09:17:11 PM
 #689

Hello

I wanted to ask if there is any risk associated with forging if done with a downloaded "local" client?

And aliases can still not be created right?

Is Fimk Ry devs forging with the unreleased fimk balances as well ?


I don't see any risks in forging with a downloaded client running on your local machine. your password will stay locally, I see no risk.

I was able to create aliases? So I think creating aliases should be possible also for you?

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July 08, 2014, 09:17:19 PM
 #690

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).
What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.


Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

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July 08, 2014, 09:48:39 PM
 #691


Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

BUT, they all would have to be forging too. That's the catch, isn't it.

If even the need of active forging is not an issue, then it has to be something along these lines I suppose
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=633304.msg7720567#msg7720567

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July 08, 2014, 09:53:44 PM
 #692


Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

BUT, they all would have to be forging too. That's the catch, isn't it.

If even the need of active forging is not an issue, then it has to be something along these lines I suppose
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=633304.msg7720567#msg7720567
There is no cath, you can forge with as many account as you want on one node. There is no difference if you log in with one account or a 1000.

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July 08, 2014, 10:30:28 PM
 #693

Reward the first account whose balance is less than or equal to 1M FIM starting at block 10,000.  That's an easy way to skew the rewards toward small stakeholders.

Give 50% to account at 10,000 (likely to be large stakeholder) and 50% to first small account following block 10,000 (guaranteed to be small stakeholder).
What prevents the large stakeholders from dividing their holdings to several smaller accounts, if we start to considerably favor small accounts? The annoyance just slows them down and wastes energy.

I'm not sure how the math works, but will X amount of FIMK forge the same number of blocks split across multiple accounts as it will in a single account?

Yes, same amount. But it would require huge amounts of accounts to be generated by big account-owner, 1800 accounts for that 18 million to take it down to 10000 balance each. I would not do it if I forged millions in a year anyway.


Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

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July 08, 2014, 10:40:16 PM
 #694

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.

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July 09, 2014, 12:30:08 AM
 #695

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.


lol. 20 bucks today can easily become 10,000 USD tomorrow in the crypto world.  Everyone knows this.

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July 09, 2014, 07:26:30 AM
 #696

Skewing toward small stakeholders don't work. We ran these rounds with Nxt before.
It would take me about 5 minutes to write a scrypt that can distribute my account into 10k chunks.

I seriously doubt any big stakeholder would waste time doing this.  If you really wanted to, then you could find a way to distribute to smaller stakeholders.

I was talking about skewed distribution in general, and why won't it work.
If we are still talking about the 10k rewards, I honestly don't care, and I don't even know why we are talking about it this much. It worth 0.03 BTC currently, less than 20 bucks.


lol. 20 bucks today can easily become 10,000 USD tomorrow in the crypto world.  Everyone knows this.

The only way to successfully distribute coins evenly to people is to have those people uniquely identified. Without a central authority, or without the mass cooperation of every single person involved, people will always be able to game the system. It's not even about effort, it's about ability. This makes any attempt to reward smaller stakeholders futile. 

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July 09, 2014, 08:58:31 AM
 #697

And aliases can still not be created right?
They can, just use the correct format of the account number (update readme falsely speaks of accepting both formats - coders are like that).

Quote
Is Fimk Ry devs forging with the unreleased fimk balances as well ?

No.

This makes any attempt to reward smaller stakeholders futile. 
On this part I agree and would leave the minor issue of bonus rewards behind now. The rewards are given so rarely that random variance takes care of it. Unfortunately for the first reward randomness had a good one on us, resulting in a lot of wasted energy for the community in an attempt to solve an issue of little significance.

We have arranged the basic income to help those with less money. We cannot yet save the whole world but we can save the early adopter Finns  Cool

         
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July 09, 2014, 09:50:57 AM
 #698

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting
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July 09, 2014, 09:58:13 AM
 #699

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting

Already No. 5  Grin Hopefully we'll see more exchanges trading FIMK.
Forging blocks are quite funny and what i have understood, devs are creating new Exchange for FIMK and it will launch soon!

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BlackFor3st
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July 09, 2014, 12:45:21 PM
 #700

FIMK has been No.7 in bter voting. Maybe we can soon exchange FIMK on bter.

https://bter.com/voting

Already No. 5  Grin Hopefully we'll see more exchanges trading FIMK.
Forging blocks are quite funny and what i have understood, devs are creating new Exchange for FIMK and it will launch soon!
Will bter need a permission to list FIM or can the devs decide about that?
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