[XMR] Monero Speculation

[kurious]

It's been remarkably quiet in here lately, given the price action.  Everyone glued to BTC drama?

I'm very glad I diversified into alts in 2014, otherwise I'd be very uncomfortable right now.

BTC purists are slagging off the alts and spouting various implausible conspiracy theories, so there is real pain for them - it's not just discomfort...

However, it is just common sense to have a balanced portfolio in crypto. At times like this, it is quite obvious why.

That said, the rise of alts has been huge these past few months with BTC down to 66.3% of the overall crypto market.   Yep, down to under two thirds.  It is true that we are in an alt bubble, so if someone waves a magic wand and ends the civil war, I would expect a sea of red, but the crypto space does have serious contenders now and BTC is never going to be over 90% of the market again.

The only thing to watch out for is that a total collapse in the price of BTC to (say) under $500 will depress the entire market.  Some capital will leave and some exchanges and miners may even be in trouble.   If we are heading for 2014 all over again, it will not be easy no matter what you are holding.  

I have been of the opinion for many years that sooner or later some other crypto would replace BTC.  The reason is simple, there are literally hundreds of cryptocurrencies that are technically superior to BTC.  In the past when I pointed out that BTC block time is not realistic if the intent is to replace cash, I was told that BTC could just change the block time, so these upstart alts with shorter block times don't even matter.  But the truth is that BTC will never, and can never, change the block time; and the reason I feel confident in saying so is that it has now literally been years without a consensus on a scaling solution.  If they can't find consensus on a block size issue in years, they will never, ever, be able to agree on a block time change (although that too would help address the scaling issue).  No, the block time, and reward for BTC are set in stone and no consensus on change would ever arise, which means BTC will never be a viable replacement for cash.  Even if the block size dispute is settled such that I can get a small transaction in the very next block every single time with a tiny fee, waiting 10 minutes on average is too long for a substitute for cash.

BTC has been benefiting from the network effect of having been first.  I have always considered it a matter of time until some replacement asserts itself.  I will admit I did not even suspect monero though until the past 6 months or so.  I have been moving the majority of my BTC into a handful of promising alts for more than a year and this past six months or so (but especially the past two months) has been insanely profitable for me.  Of the top 5 cryptos by market cap I have been accumulating all of them except for ripple (because who needs a centralized cryptocurrency anyway?) so the transfer away from BTC to alts has been very welcome to me.  

But I agree, a full on floundering for BTC would be bad for everything.  I would rather see a slow and steady decline for BTC while it was replaced by alts.

Agreed, I have always thought ten minutes was ludicrous for BTC to expect to be used for a coffee purchase as it stands.  Maybe SW and LN would sort this, but BTCs lack of consensus is the thing that is losing it its unassailable status.

Other alts? Of course, eventually will make their mark and takeover, even - but BTC is still the backbone of the market for now.   If another alt surpasses it soon and becomes No. 1, it will have been BTC's fault.   My hunch is BTC will sort something out and we have a way to go yet (before this happens).  

Unless Bitcoin really shoots itself in the foot...

BTC is going through some growing pains right now and perhaps there is something a bit sinister afoot. Not sure what to think with BU.
Regarding XMR, the lack of JAXX support or a light wallet imo, really hurt. I think the price would be much higher right now. Maybe that is a good thing. I am a holder however.
And there are questions regarding the fee's for XMR as it relates our growing and quite large blockchain. Sorry, no expert and I just said that poorly, but maybe someone can jump in here.
Speaking of coffee, how does one buy it without a light wallet? Any word on Jaxx integration?

Jaxx integration was abandoned AFAIK.

[Febo]

It's been remarkably quiet in here lately, given the price action.  Everyone glued to BTC drama?

I'm very glad I diversified into alts in 2014, otherwise I'd be very uncomfortable right now.

BTC purists are slagging off the alts and spouting various implausible conspiracy theories, so there is real pain for them - it's not just discomfort...

However, it is just common sense to have a balanced portfolio in crypto. At times like this, it is quite obvious why.

That said, the rise of alts has been huge these past few months with BTC down to 66.3% of the overall crypto market.   Yep, down to under two thirds.  It is true that we are in an alt bubble, so if someone waves a magic wand and ends the civil war, I would expect a sea of red, but the crypto space does have serious contenders now and BTC is never going to be over 90% of the market again.

The only thing to watch out for is that a total collapse in the price of BTC to (say) under $500 will depress the entire market.  Some capital will leave and some exchanges and miners may even be in trouble.   If we are heading for 2014 all over again, it will not be easy no matter what you are holding.  

I have been of the opinion for many years that sooner or later some other crypto would replace BTC.  The reason is simple, there are literally hundreds of cryptocurrencies that are technically superior to BTC.  In the past when I pointed out that BTC block time is not realistic if the intent is to replace cash, I was told that BTC could just change the block time, so these upstart alts with shorter block times don't even matter.  But the truth is that BTC will never, and can never, change the block time; and the reason I feel confident in saying so is that it has now literally been years without a consensus on a scaling solution.  If they can't find consensus on a block size issue in years, they will never, ever, be able to agree on a block time change (although that too would help address the scaling issue).  No, the block time, and reward for BTC are set in stone and no consensus on change would ever arise, which means BTC will never be a viable replacement for cash.  Even if the block size dispute is settled such that I can get a small transaction in the very next block every single time with a tiny fee, waiting 10 minutes on average is too long for a substitute for cash.

BTC has been benefiting from the network effect of having been first.  I have always considered it a matter of time until some replacement asserts itself.  I will admit I did not even suspect monero though until the past 6 months or so.  I have been moving the majority of my BTC into a handful of promising alts for more than a year and this past six months or so (but especially the past two months) has been insanely profitable for me.  Of the top 5 cryptos by market cap I have been accumulating all of them except for ripple (because who needs a centralized cryptocurrency anyway?) so the transfer away from BTC to alts has been very welcome to me.  

But I agree, a full on floundering for BTC would be bad for everything.  I would rather see a slow and steady decline for BTC while it was replaced by alts.

Agreed, I have always thought ten minutes was ludicrous for BTC to expect to be used for a coffee purchase as it stands.  Maybe SW and LN would sort this, but BTCs lack of consensus is the thing that is losing it its unassailable status.

Other alts? Of course, eventually will make their mark and takeover, even - but BTC is still the backbone of the market for now.   If another alt surpasses it soon and becomes No. 1, it will have been BTC's fault.   My hunch is BTC will sort something out and we have a way to go yet (before this happens).  

Unless Bitcoin really shoots itself in the foot...

BTC is going through some growing pains right now and perhaps there is something a bit sinister afoot. Not sure what to think with BU.
Regarding XMR, the lack of JAXX support or a light wallet imo, really hurt. I think the price would be much higher right now. Maybe that is a good thing. I am a holder however.
And there are questions regarding the fee's for XMR as it relates our growing and quite large blockchain. Sorry, no expert and I just said that poorly, but maybe someone can jump in here.
Speaking of coffee, how does one buy it without a light wallet? Any word on Jaxx integration?

How to determinate fees will be revamped in a fork 3 weeks from now.   You will be able to use GUI on your phone. Work on that should start  when GUI beta2  start gets used.

[Its About Sharing]

It's been remarkably quiet in here lately, given the price action.  Everyone glued to BTC drama?

I'm very glad I diversified into alts in 2014, otherwise I'd be very uncomfortable right now.

BTC purists are slagging off the alts and spouting various implausible conspiracy theories, so there is real pain for them - it's not just discomfort...

However, it is just common sense to have a balanced portfolio in crypto. At times like this, it is quite obvious why.

That said, the rise of alts has been huge these past few months with BTC down to 66.3% of the overall crypto market.   Yep, down to under two thirds.  It is true that we are in an alt bubble, so if someone waves a magic wand and ends the civil war, I would expect a sea of red, but the crypto space does have serious contenders now and BTC is never going to be over 90% of the market again.

The only thing to watch out for is that a total collapse in the price of BTC to (say) under $500 will depress the entire market.  Some capital will leave and some exchanges and miners may even be in trouble.   If we are heading for 2014 all over again, it will not be easy no matter what you are holding.  

I have been of the opinion for many years that sooner or later some other crypto would replace BTC.  The reason is simple, there are literally hundreds of cryptocurrencies that are technically superior to BTC.  In the past when I pointed out that BTC block time is not realistic if the intent is to replace cash, I was told that BTC could just change the block time, so these upstart alts with shorter block times don't even matter.  But the truth is that BTC will never, and can never, change the block time; and the reason I feel confident in saying so is that it has now literally been years without a consensus on a scaling solution.  If they can't find consensus on a block size issue in years, they will never, ever, be able to agree on a block time change (although that too would help address the scaling issue).  No, the block time, and reward for BTC are set in stone and no consensus on change would ever arise, which means BTC will never be a viable replacement for cash.  Even if the block size dispute is settled such that I can get a small transaction in the very next block every single time with a tiny fee, waiting 10 minutes on average is too long for a substitute for cash.

BTC has been benefiting from the network effect of having been first.  I have always considered it a matter of time until some replacement asserts itself.  I will admit I did not even suspect monero though until the past 6 months or so.  I have been moving the majority of my BTC into a handful of promising alts for more than a year and this past six months or so (but especially the past two months) has been insanely profitable for me.  Of the top 5 cryptos by market cap I have been accumulating all of them except for ripple (because who needs a centralized cryptocurrency anyway?) so the transfer away from BTC to alts has been very welcome to me.  

But I agree, a full on floundering for BTC would be bad for everything.  I would rather see a slow and steady decline for BTC while it was replaced by alts.

Agreed, I have always thought ten minutes was ludicrous for BTC to expect to be used for a coffee purchase as it stands.  Maybe SW and LN would sort this, but BTCs lack of consensus is the thing that is losing it its unassailable status.

Other alts? Of course, eventually will make their mark and takeover, even - but BTC is still the backbone of the market for now.   If another alt surpasses it soon and becomes No. 1, it will have been BTC's fault.   My hunch is BTC will sort something out and we have a way to go yet (before this happens).  

Unless Bitcoin really shoots itself in the foot...

BTC is going through some growing pains right now and perhaps there is something a bit sinister afoot. Not sure what to think with BU.
Regarding XMR, the lack of JAXX support or a light wallet imo, really hurt. I think the price would be much higher right now. Maybe that is a good thing. I am a holder however.
And there are questions regarding the fee's for XMR as it relates our growing and quite large blockchain. Sorry, no expert and I just said that poorly, but maybe someone can jump in here.
Speaking of coffee, how does one buy it without a light wallet? Any word on Jaxx integration?

How to determinate fees will be revamped in a fork 3 weeks from now.   You will be able to use GUI on your phone. Work on that should start  when GUI beta2  start gets used.

Thanks for that! Great news. I was pretty disappointed with the Jaxx thing. And the other poster said it was abandoned. That is hard to imagine - 100% dropped?

[TrueCryptonaire]

Dumped some more coins...  

Sorry.  

The price is now closer to the Moon than it was when I initially bought coins.
I am not saying it will not go to the moon but the coin represents 2 % of bitcoin right now which is quite good achievement. When you take into account how hard it is to develop and how slowly everything progresses.
The market situation has also changed dramatically recently when Dash passed XMR in market cap. I am having the opinion that only one anon coin can survive and now it looks like it is Dash.
They have far better marketing which generates more users and wider adoption.... But we will see - not bought any Dash though.



And those of you who bought my coins (not sold everything though) I hope you can resell them higher.

I hope I have the opportunity to sell even higher the rest of my coins.

[binaryFate]

Sorry.  

Don't be.

I am having the opinion that only one anon coin can survive and now it looks like it is Dash.

Dash anon... That says it all, you have zero grasp of the fundamentals of what you are investing in.

[Its About Sharing]

Dumped some more coins...  

Sorry.  

The price is now closer to the Moon than it was when I initially bought coins.
I am not saying it will not go to the moon but the coin represents 2 % of bitcoin right now which is quite good achievement. When you take into account how hard it is to develop and how slowly everything progresses.
The market situation has also changed dramatically recently when Dash passed XMR in market cap. I am having the opinion that only one anon coin can survive and now it looks like it is Dash.
They have far better marketing which generates more users and wider adoption.... But we will see - not bought any Dash though.



And those of you who bought my coins (not sold everything though) I hope you can resell them higher.

I hope I have the opportunity to sell even higher the rest of my coins.

There are things about DASH that they certainly got right. They are organized and well funded.
But, their tech is not as good as XMR's and to the average user, $100 is a lot more than $20.
The marketing aspect can't be overlooked, I agree with you there, in part. But are those looking to anonymous currencies the type who need marketing to attract them? Or do they want the best tech?
Having a lite client imo is important, and that is what I want XMR to have yesterday. (I'm talking for more personal transactions, for real anonymity, you need the full client.)

[OrangeP]

Monero is currently undervalued in terms of  $.
It has a better solution for scaling and should be the one getting a lot of market cap. from BTC.

Good time to buy for a patient investor.

[obit33]

They have far better marketing which generates more users and wider adoption.... But we will see - not bought any Dash though.

pfff, you're being TrollCryptonaire again...

why don't you back these things up with facts.. show me where is all the dash user adoption? Show me where are all the dash-transactions?

You're only looking at the pumped up price and drawing your conclusions from there, sorry, but that is very narrowminded...

But speaking about price, why is everybody so damn impatient? Look at what xmr has given you already, if you bought in 2015 and 2016 you're very very much in the green fiatwise. I doubt there have been (for now) much better investments... Let it consolidate, let it develop at its steady pace, let it be the coin with 'no marketing', it's doing excellent...

Praise to all the devs and core-team who keep the steady pace, without hiring pretty faces to sell promises based on air, without price-talking and pumping the coin, without hiring some guy that will take market cap to 1 billion... They're doing a fantastic job and I can only admire the way they're keeping their feet on the ground while this project has (up until now) been incredibly succesful without throwing heaps of money at it...

best regards

[Fragbait]

Anyone can already use Monero for what it's meant for, anonymous transactions. It has high enough market cap for that. You could say that Monero has already achieved its purpose. Monero has succeeded.

Buy Monero, send anon tx, receiver sells Monero. It works. It does what it is supposed to do. What else could you wish for?

There are better coins for store of value.

[fiscorcle]

Good to be on-board. I enjoy these leisurely space rides through the cosmos.

[TrueCryptonaire]

They have far better marketing which generates more users and wider adoption.... But we will see - not bought any Dash though.

pfff, you're being TrollCryptonaire again...

why don't you back these things up with facts.. show me where is all the dash user adoption? Show me where are all the dash-transactions?

You're only looking at the pumped up price and drawing your conclusions from there, sorry, but that is very narrowminded...

But speaking about price, why is everybody so damn impatient? Look at what xmr has given you already, if you bought in 2015 and 2016 you're very very much in the green fiatwise. I doubt there have been (for now) much better investments... Let it consolidate, let it develop at its steady pace, let it be the coin with 'no marketing', it's doing excellent...

Praise to all the devs and core-team who keep the steady pace, without hiring pretty faces to sell promises based on air, without price-talking and pumping the coin, without hiring some guy that will take market cap to 1 billion... They're doing a fantastic job and I can only admire the way they're keeping their feet on the ground while this project has (up until now) been incredibly succesful without throwing heaps of money at it...

best regards

You call me troll because I do not agree with you.  
Dash is present on social media (Youtube). If someone who knows a little about crypto but not too deeply the best way to send anonymous transactions, (s)he probably says: using dash. That's because Dash is flooding their propaganda everywhere.
Still crypto's main purpose is a store of value, not transacting. Even many bitcoin merchants are removing bitcoins from their list of accepted payment methods (locally) because there are barely people using it so it is not worth it to accept bitcoins.

Dash is anonymous enough for average people, those of you who want more hard core privacy Monero is an excellent choice, but that is a niche and probably that's the reason why Monero will not need that much marketing. Those of you who need that sort of privacy will figure it out themselves. You see, many alts are far ahead bitcoin technologically but when it comes to network effect they fall short badly. And it is the network effect alone that creates the value for the coin (look at coinmarketcap).


I am not speaking down Monero and I think the current price is fine selling point (that's why I sold quite a lot around here).
I might buy some coins if the price gets severely undervalued (it might be slightly undervalued even now but I need better deal).
Maximum growth potential with XMR is to 0.04-0.05 btc so it is about 100 % ROI if you buy now and that potential will become reality.

In my investment philosophy, 100 % ROI is not that good. I prefer investing into places that can relatively easily increase in value by 20-100 times and Monero did met that.
Therefore, I owe a multitude of gratitude to the Monerians and developers, and of course - to Risto who got me into this. Thank you.

[TrueCryptonaire]

Anyone can already use Monero for what it's meant for, anonymous transactions. It has high enough market cap for that. You could say that Monero has already achieved its purpose. Monero has succeeded.

Buy Monero, send anon tx, receiver sells Monero. It works. It does what it is supposed to do. What else could you wish for?

There are better coins for store of value.

I completely agree with you.
Monero is a success already in many ways and I hope it will reach 1 billion market cap at some point.
I might be even willing to buy some Moneros for higher price if my other investments will make me more money. 

[Genesis1337]

Anyone can already use Monero for what it's meant for, anonymous transactions. It has high enough market cap for that. You could say that Monero has already achieved its purpose. Monero has succeeded.

Buy Monero, send anon tx, receiver sells Monero. It works. It does what it is supposed to do. What else could you wish for?

There are better coins for store of value.

Monero is actually the best coin for store of value right now. What else do you wish for? This crypto with mandatory privacy has worked flawlessly for past few months, and obviously has not been around as long as btc. When i think of best coins for store of value against USD, i think monero.

[obit33]

You call me troll because I do not agree with you.  
Dash is present on social media (Youtube). If someone who knows a little about crypto but not too deeply the best way to send anonymous transactions, (s)he probably says: using dash. That's because Dash is flooding their propaganda everywhere.
Still crypto's main purpose is a store of value, not transacting. Even many bitcoin merchants are removing bitcoins from their list of accepted payment methods (locally) because there are barely people using it so it is not worth it to accept bitcoins.

Dash is anonymous enough for average people, those of you who want more hard core privacy Monero is an excellent choice, but that is a niche and probably that's the reason why Monero will not need that much marketing. Those of you who need that sort of privacy will figure it out themselves. You see, many alts are far ahead bitcoin technologically but when it comes to network effect they fall short badly. And it is the network effect alone that creates the value for the coin (look at coinmarketcap).


I am not speaking down Monero and I think the current price is fine selling point (that's why I sold quite a lot around here).
I might buy some coins if the price gets severely undervalued (it might be slightly undervalued even now but I need better deal).
Maximum growth potential with XMR is to 0.04-0.05 btc so it is about 100 % ROI if you buy now and that potential will become reality.

In my investment philosophy, 100 % ROI is not that good. I prefer investing into places that can relatively easily increase in value by 20-100 times and Monero did met that.
Therefore, I owe a multitude of gratitude to the Monerians and developers, and of course - to Risto who got me into this. Thank you.

No,not because I don't agree with you, but because you're saying things without backing them up with facts...
- transaction-volume went nowhere in dash since inception
- they're having less than half the number of reddit-subscribers than the monero-sub (you know, without marketing...)


Secondly, it is important to try to look in the future here. If privacy/anonimity is not sublime, it means you don't have a fungible currency... A currency that is not fungible is not a good currency and will fail in the long term imho...

anywayz, good luck on your further endeavours
best regards

[cAPSLOCK]

Dumped some more coins...  

Sorry.  

The price is now closer to the Moon than it was when I initially bought coins.
I am not saying it will not go to the moon but the coin represents 2 % of bitcoin right now which is quite good achievement. When you take into account how hard it is to develop and how slowly everything progresses.
The market situation has also changed dramatically recently when Dash passed XMR in market cap. I am having the opinion that only one anon coin can survive and now it looks like it is Dash.
They have far better marketing which generates more users and wider adoption.... But we will see - not bought any Dash though.



And those of you who bought my coins (not sold everything though) I hope you can resell them higher.

I hope I have the opportunity to sell even higher the rest of my coins.

Depending when you did it... I might have a TC coin or two.   I liquidated my btc position post etf news.  Some of that is now monero.  Wonder when to buy back btc.

But i told you a long while back...

I would propose Dash better meets your desires for a cryptocurrency.

[rdnkjdi]

So guys, I've been out of the crypto space for about a year. 

Came back to Monero's huge rise (congrats!), Ethereum's parabolic rise (not really a surprise) but Dash???

Figured it'd be dead or well below XMR by now.  Can someone give me the basic rundown on what's happened to it in the last year?  I'm aware of the premine, marketing as anon when it wasn't, masternodes, etc.  Has anything really changed?  I hear Roger Ver was pushing it?

Kinda contemplating opening a short against it against Monero or just fiat

[explorer]

So guys, I've been out of the crypto space for about a year. 

Came back to Monero's huge rise (congrats!), Ethereum's parabolic rise (not really a surprise) but Dash???

Figured it'd be dead or well below XMR by now.  Can someone give me the basic rundown on what's happened to it in the last year?  I'm aware of the premine, marketing as anon when it wasn't, masternodes, etc.  Has anything really changed?  I hear Roger Ver was pushing it?

Kinda contemplating opening a short against it against Monero or just fiat

Liquidity is low, coins are mostly controlled by a very small group.  They've burned a lot of shorters thus far, but I don't see how it could be pumped much higher from here.  Another thing that hasn't changed with it is transaction volume. Uh, ever.  Zero adoption.  So yes, it looks like a prime short to everyone that investigates at all.  Sooner or later, shorters will kill it, but the club is holding all of the loan coins as well, keeping the rates very high.  They did time this well, quite possibly with the help of Roger Ver and friends to help put the squeeze on BTC.  Theories abound, this is one of them.

[rdnkjdi]

So guys, I've been out of the crypto space for about a year. 

Came back to Monero's huge rise (congrats!), Ethereum's parabolic rise (not really a surprise) but Dash???

Figured it'd be dead or well below XMR by now.  Can someone give me the basic rundown on what's happened to it in the last year?  I'm aware of the premine, marketing as anon when it wasn't, masternodes, etc.  Has anything really changed?  I hear Roger Ver was pushing it?

Kinda contemplating opening a short against it against Monero or just fiat

Liquidity is low, coins are mostly controlled by a very small group.  They've burned a lot of shorters thus far, but I don't see how it could be pumped much higher from here.  Another thing that hasn't changed with it is transaction volume. Uh, ever.  Zero adoption.  So yes, it looks like a prime short to everyone that investigates at all.  Sooner or later, shorters will kill it, but the club is holding all of the loan coins as well, keeping the rates very high.  They did time this well, quite possibly with the help of Roger Ver and friends to help put the squeeze on BTC.  Theories abound, this is one of them.

Ah yeah I hadn't thought about the majority hiking short rates into oblivion.  Makes sense.

Saw that reddit post from some poor bastard who lost it all - with "it all" being a helluva lot shorting it all the way to like $90

Edit:  Is there a way for me to see current interest rates on Polo?  Looks like Bitmex is just 2% annually. 

[smooth]

@rdnkjdi you can see the loan rates on the Lending tab. Each coin has different rates.

[rdnkjdi]

@rdnkjdi you can see the loan rates on the Lending tab. Each coin has different rates.

Thanks Smooth ... & thanks for letting the OT slide.