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Author Topic: ★★★ MEMs LIST of GAMBLING SITES ★★★  (Read 121125 times)
LuckyBitSupport
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May 11, 2014, 01:34:49 PM
 #1021

maybe I'm wrong, but what I got is even if the yabtcl site owner(s) decide to play some tickets, it won't alter anyone chance. this is because when the tickets are listed in the file, the lottery result will depend on a event that will happen one and a half hour later.

Yes, you are right, I stand corrected. In case of a lottery, additional players do not alter your chances of winning.
Of course, additional players influence your expected return, but they do so while paying into the jackpot, so it's all in order.

3rd edit: still not sure if they are provable fair.
(Have to agree with mem though: their explanation of their system is rather hard to follow.)

As they don't put the txids of the bets in the results, you can't prove that payment occurred, thereby giving the operators the possibility to play for free, which goes back to my previous point.

The original falling coin game
Dice is boring.



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mem
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May 11, 2014, 02:17:06 PM
 #1022

hi all,

mem, you said: "What I have realized from reviewing yabtcl is that its not enough for sites to simply describe their provably fair system they need to walk through an example."

So, I'm not clear if you're talking about my site.

In every draw, we have an explanation about the provably fair system using the values used in that draw. Do you think we need to improve it? What do you missed in the explanation?


Now, let me explain the technical details how we timestamp the SHA256 hash with a bitcoin transaction.

The SHA256 hash has a total of 64 characters, so we split the hash in 10 parts of 6 characters.

We also defined a specific address to each hashpart.

So, after getting the SHA256 hash of the file, we divide the 64 characters into 11 parts and transform each part into a decimal number. The decimal number got in each part will be the amount of satoshis needed to be sent to the address representing that part. As nowadays a bitcoin transaction output need to have at least 5430 satoshis, we add this amount to each part and then create a bitcoin transaction to timestamp the SHA256 of the file.

Hope it is clear.

Any question, just ask.

And tks again for reviewing our lottery.

https://yabtcl.com/drawsSecretsHashes.txt

Ahhh there it is.

that wraps it up nicely then.

Also the timestamp is quite nifty, thanks for the explanation.
Regarding extra details, I'll sit down tomorrow and send you an example of where I personally would like a bit more a helping hand when working my way through the results.

Just one quick example is the JS that fetches the txid hash, I noted in the code you embedded the addresses.
Thats fine, not an issue at all - but Id suggest perhaps updating the js so it fetches the file and explodes it.

Its a minor minor detail, but I had to look at the code to figure out where the file was being pulled from, only to see that for each draw you post updated JS with the file contents embedded.

also I had the opportunity to try your password reset feature, extremely impressed with your innovation there.

Also I quite like the lottery itself as far as lotteries go, I used to work for an award winning lotteries agent for 3.5 years when I was much younger and you have done a nice job of implementing the payouts, the extra numbers and your tables showing payouts. Its a very traditional lotto, I hate to play them personally as after 3.5 years you get used to people pouring their money away, buut it doesnt mean I cant appreciate a good implementation when I see it, well done.

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May 11, 2014, 02:28:08 PM
 #1023

yabtcl approved, credit to the site operator for stepping me through his provably fair system.

Site Updates

userlist disabled for non admins / moderators (whoopsie).

users emails only displayed for admins / moderators (whoopsie again).

internal restrictions on what userlist can display (prevent naughty templates).

ssl cert validating disabled for admins and moderators when fetching memslist.txt (some sites force SSL when they have an invalid cert, annoying but still better than no ssl).

existing sites can be updated with a new memslist.txt, for example say I added your site manually myself but now you would like to have a user that is set as the site_owner so you can update descriptions, min & max bets and add new games, well now you can.

Id like to thank royal-casino.pl & yabtcl for the feedback, it all goes to helping make the site better to use.

Sort of related news:

Ive built a rather cool app (imho), but the problem is I was very "un sober" one night and had a rather simple idea on how to expand this app to answer an old gripe of mine.
Even better is, once I add these new extensions to my cool app is it will heavily compliment memslist.txt (I hope).
In keeping with my tradition, its a rather hacked together concept thats better demonstrated than talked about (I ramble), so long story short:
Ive got something cool coming everyone, hope you like it, it may take away a bit of my time here but not for long and when complete it will be a big benefit to the bitcoin community and especially gamblers imho.

Also Ive decide to throw up my other apps on memslist.com under a /memscrap section. For other shit Ive written and currently maintain (namefix.pl) and retired apps WiiCR and anything else I write thats actually worth releasing. Will likely throw up arby.pl as well for the traders Smiley

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May 11, 2014, 03:33:33 PM
 #1024

As they don't put the txids of the bets in the results, you can't prove that payment occurred, thereby giving the operators the possibility to play for free, which goes back to my previous point.

Disagree with you here, at their help page there's an explanation of the revenue distribution of their lottery:

    We take 4% to the house;
    From the remainder, we reserve 6% to the next 6 hits jackpot, this means, after someone hit the jackpot for 6 hits, the acumulated amount in this reserve will be used to next 6 hits jackpot;
    And the remainder we split it into the following:
        17% to the jackpot for 6 hits;
        17% to the jackpot for 5 hits;
        16% to the jackpot for 4 hits;
        25% to the jackpot for 3 hits;
        25% to the jackpot for 2 hits.

so, as the tickets are listed before the draw, you can calculate how much a jackpot worth in a draw. So, they won't be able to put a free ticket without risking to be caught cheating.




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Also I quite like the lottery itself as far as lotteries go, I used to work for an award winning lotteries agent for 3.5 years when I was much younger and you have done a nice job of implementing the payouts, the extra numbers and your tables showing payouts. Its a very traditional lotto, I hate to play them personally as after 3.5 years you get used to people pouring their money away, buut it doesnt mean I cant appreciate a good implementation when I see it, well done.

In my opinion, when any person use their money to gamble. they are "pouring their money away", but when I decide to risk gambling, I would like to have the bigger reward possible, regards the odds.

When you play in a casino game with the odds of 50% winning, if you win you will receive less than 2x your bet. It really doesn't make me happy. But when playing a lottery having a chance of winning hundreds of thousands times your bet, if I won, it will really makes me happy. That's why I prefer playing lotteries instead gambling on casinos.

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May 12, 2014, 03:41:07 AM
 #1025

As they don't put the txids of the bets in the results, you can't prove that payment occurred, thereby giving the operators the possibility to play for free, which goes back to my previous point.

Disagree with you here, at their help page there's an explanation of the revenue distribution of their lottery:

    We take 4% to the house;
    From the remainder, we reserve 6% to the next 6 hits jackpot, this means, after someone hit the jackpot for 6 hits, the acumulated amount in this reserve will be used to next 6 hits jackpot;
    And the remainder we split it into the following:
        17% to the jackpot for 6 hits;
        17% to the jackpot for 5 hits;
        16% to the jackpot for 4 hits;
        25% to the jackpot for 3 hits;
        25% to the jackpot for 2 hits.

so, as the tickets are listed before the draw, you can calculate how much a jackpot worth in a draw. So, they won't be able to put a free ticket without risking to be caught cheating.


You're right BRules.

When we had the idea to make a bitcoin lottery, we decided that the lottery should be as most transparent as possible, only this way we can have confidence from our players.

but this discussion made me realize that we should put the jackpot value in the draw details, this way will be easier to the users to follow the jackpots.


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May 12, 2014, 04:02:13 AM
 #1026

Just one quick example is the JS that fetches the txid hash, I noted in the code you embedded the addresses.
Thats fine, not an issue at all - but Id suggest perhaps updating the js so it fetches the file and explodes it.

Its a minor minor detail, but I had to look at the code to figure out where the file was being pulled from, only to see that for each draw you post updated JS with the file contents embedded.

I think you didn't get how exactly this script works. I didn't use different JS for different draws and I also didn't use the tickets file on it. What this script do is:

- verify if the txid was passed as a request parameter.
- if yes, get the content from the URL: https://blockchain.info/rawtx/<txid>
- get the address and value from each transaction output and also the time the transaction reached the BlockChain.info servers
- do the calculations to transform the outputs in the SHA256 hash of the tickest file.

as you can see on the draws details, the URL to this script is always the same, the only thing that changes is the request patameter (txid).


And the reason that I embedded the addresses in the JS is because I won't change the address that represent the parts of the SHA256 hash, this means that:

1P7XU93VPfF3UWiA1BTPqeq3fCay98nHLj will always contain the representation of the first 6 characters set of the tickets file hash. 12BDqs7PbiME8o8prgrq44F5G6t2XWWNDu will always contain the representation of the second 6 characters set of the tickets file hash, and so on...

hope this is clear.

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May 14, 2014, 07:18:35 AM
 #1027

And the reason that I embedded the addresses in the JS is because I won't change the address that represent the parts of the SHA256 hash, this means that:

1P7XU93VPfF3UWiA1BTPqeq3fCay98nHLj will always contain the representation of the first 6 characters set of the tickets file hash. 12BDqs7PbiME8o8prgrq44F5G6t2XWWNDu will always contain the representation of the second 6 characters set of the tickets file hash, and so on...

hope this is clear.

I see I see Smiley

Yes Im not sure why I had difficulty grasping your system, perhaps it was because I needed to reference several pages to compile the result.
At the end I was satisfied that there was no obvious loopholes for a site operator to exploit and more just a bit puzzled about the entire process.

I just added your lottery game listing (not sure why I was not there already), please feel free to update the description to something nicer Smiley
Added the badge for progressive jackpots as well.

Hopefully I'll be back on tonight to start on the next round of reviews.

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May 14, 2014, 07:40:10 AM
 #1028

Found and fixed a bug that would revert a sites status to pre-pending when updating a site via memslist.txt and the site already exists.
Reported by royal casino (thanks).

Added a menu tab for moderators and admins that takes us straight to pre-pending sites.
All new sites are set as pre-pending, a status which regular users cannot see and is not shown in the forum listings.
This is done purely as a simple spam control, imho user interaction is required so Ive just made it easier for myself and other moderators (coming) to review new sites.

And I fixed the status page, clicking on the site name now takes to you their games list (missing a form name).

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May 15, 2014, 03:39:28 PM
 #1029

hey mem, tks for adding our lottery in the games list.


I'm sorry if our provably fair system isn't that easy to understand but it couldn't be simpler as we want transparency to our players and also investors.


And once again, you have a great site. Impartial reviews and also badges, loved it.

Keep up the good work.

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May 15, 2014, 08:58:05 PM
 #1030

a lot of sites are missing Tongue

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May 15, 2014, 09:10:38 PM
 #1031

a lot of sites are missing Tongue
He checks every site from top to bottom before he rates them, so that takes a lot of time. He doesn't have a lot of time which means not all website will be on there. Plus, not every website owner has submitted the site to the website, which causes more websites to be left out. It also doesn't help that a new website comes out like every week or so. So yeah Tongue

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June 03, 2014, 03:56:00 AM
 #1032

Please consider www.satoshislot.com !

A New Provably Fair Video Slot Game with min bet 0.5 mBTC and max bet 125 mBTC.

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June 04, 2014, 12:01:26 AM
 #1033

No problems, please fill in my new template (ahh laziness) and I'll get it added shortly Smiley

Here is our new site:

Code:
Site: StockBet.com
Key:  Not sure what should go here
Min Cash In: BTC 0.001
Min Cash Out: BTC 0.01 or balance, whichever is lower
Games: BullBear
Min Bet: BTC 0.001
Max Bet: None
Comments: In regards to being provably fair, players can verify stock prices from stock market.

You can get more information at announcement of StockBet.com - Bet on stocks with Bitcoin
mem
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June 06, 2014, 02:25:58 AM
 #1034

a lot of sites are missing Tongue
He checks every site from top to bottom before he rates them, so that takes a lot of time. He doesn't have a lot of time which means not all website will be on there. Plus, not every website owner has submitted the site to the website, which causes more websites to be left out. It also doesn't help that a new website comes out like every week or so. So yeah Tongue

That is quite correct, I do a very thorough review (when time permits).
Its not unusual for some twerp like Joca97 to assume its all done in 1 minute of work - I could do it that way but then what would be the value of this list ?
I'll keep plodding along doing my reviews Smiley, I was supposed to have an extra helping hand by this stage but alas, nothing but talk with no follow through.

I'll be doing a few reviews today and posting the updates.
Got about 15 pm's to answer as well.......

edit: so after seeing the rather cheesy "coinhulk" Ive felt it is necessary to penalize sites that offer misleading "cash in "bonuses"".

What makes it unfair ? When the cost of playing the minimum rounds to withdraw your deposit exceeds that of the house edge.
Why is it unfair ? because Ive yet to see a user not get confused by the nature of the cashin bonus, coinhulk does all players a big misservice buy burying that factoid while at the same time going "OMG OMG OMG 800% EXTRA FOR FREE OOOMMMMMGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG".

and on the other hand, we also need a merit badge for any sites where the deposit bonus IS actually a bonus and not simply a slimey advertising technique.

Im thinking +1 for real bonuses and -1 for the deceptive ones.

edit2: whoops, went for a ride on my new ebike and lost track of time Tongue

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June 16, 2014, 07:28:42 AM
 #1035

Hey mem,

Got something special for you - we launched this last week (after a 2mo alpha test):

https://www.betmoose.com

First distributed P2P betting exchange - users create and resolve the outcome (and get a commission for doing so) - we just run the platform to be as secure and reliable, and feature-rich as possible, as well as act as a 2-tier resolution fail-safe in case of cheating by the hosts.

We would fall under your 'Wagering' category.

Please let me know if you have any questions!

Adam

BetMoose.com - Wager on real world events. Profit from predicting the future. Create and share your own contracts.
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June 17, 2014, 03:19:31 AM
 #1036

Hello all.

Well no riding for me this morning, perth is dark and rainy today.
Im going to start on my next batch of reviews and also get to answering some PM's in a few hours (best left until Im fully awake and not grumpy).

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June 17, 2014, 10:15:42 AM
 #1037

code update (testing atm):

reset password added (only for users with registered emails).
fixed bug with profile update that would nuke a users email address (whoops).

todo:

allow users to update email address (after confirmation).

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June 17, 2014, 10:18:05 AM
 #1038

can you please add luckynumber.me to the list?!

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June 17, 2014, 10:36:02 AM
 #1039

can you please add luckynumber.me to the list?!

you can add yourself using: http://memslist.com/?action=submit_site_by_url_form .

Updates completed, was able to reset my password (forgot my old 1 Tongue ).

Getting a bit late now, but I'll try and knock through and pre-pending sites now then tomorrow finish replying to PM's (~15 to go) and do a few reviews.

edit:

I think Im up to date on PM's.

Really sorry to those who got buried in my inbox. I'll be giving this some extra focus over the next several days so expect some completed reviews shortly.

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June 17, 2014, 12:34:56 PM
 #1040

can you please add luckynumber.me to the list?!

you can add yourself using: http://memslist.com/?action=submit_site_by_url_form .

Updates completed, was able to reset my password (forgot my old 1 Tongue ).

Getting a bit late now, but I'll try and knock through and pre-pending sites now then tomorrow finish replying to PM's (~15 to go) and do a few reviews.

edit:

I think Im up to date on PM's.

Really sorry to those who got buried in my inbox. I'll be giving this some extra focus over the next several days so expect some completed reviews shortly.

Hi Mem,

We have a legitimate 100% first deposit bonus and are the first licensed Bitcoin sportsbook - we've even been featured by the likes of the Wall Street Journal, Coindesk and Daily Mail.

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