...

I received and activated my Bitpay Debit Card (MasterCard) on Thursday.  I could not do the activation via the Bitpay app on my phone, so I had to call the 1-855-xxxxxxx number.  Next was loading the card with BTC (looks like the only way, easily anyway, to load the card is from the Bitpay app), it converts to US$ and then does not vary (US$).

I then used the card to buy a book and afterwards pull $20 from an ATM, all went smoothly.  

I did not have the time nor inclination to calculate fees, but they were apparently not exorbitant, but I will pay more attention the next time I use the card.  I believe the limit on CA$H withdrawal from an ATM is a pretty decent $1000 per ATM visit.  I also believe I read that you can have up to $25,000 loaded on it.  That high limit on the card might come in handy if you are traveling and bump-up against your limits on any other cards you may have (assuming you can send BTC to it).

So far, so good.


Edit: KYC documents uploads are mandatory.

...

I got my Bitpay debit card working today.  

The circle is now unbroken.  I can buy and sell BTC/CA$H without exchanges (though had to do KYC).  If I can do it, millions of other Americans can too.  These services make it that much more likely that Bitcoin will see even greater numbers of users as they now can have confidence that they can "Exit" if they want.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5285365.new#new


Edited for clarity

...

And OROBTC has completed the circle.  I now have a cheap way to buy BTC (see: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5257626.0) and just today have used a good way to sell Bitcoin (I am a HODLer, but long wanted an exit ramp) for CA$H or "stuff".

Bitpay offers a debit card that pairs up with an account (app) that allows you to fund a MasterCard with Bitcoin, at least in the USA.  I am not the first to have found this, but I wanted to post my experience to encourage any interested to go for it.

First step is downloading the Bitpay app.  Then ordering a physical card (you will have to submit the usual KYC), which arrived about 11 days after applying.  Activate the card (I had to do it via the 1 855 398 1373 tel number, doing iy via the app did not work for me).  Next is to fund the card via the Bitpay app/wallet (apparently no other way or no easy way) to fund the card -- you send BTC and it is automatically converted to dollars.  After confirmation, you're good to go.

I used it to buy a book (Albert Camus' The Plague, the bookseller applauded my choice and with a contactless card to boot) at B & N, the transaction went through just fine.  Then visited an ATM to pull $20 to see of that worked, yes.

*   *   *

So, non-tekkie Americans now have a good way to get some of the best features in the Bitcoin Ecosystem, an end-to-end way to conveniently use BTC and cash:

1)  LibertyX offers a great & cheap (1.7% or so premium over "spot") way to BUY BTC, see link in second sentence above

2)  And Bitpay offers the other end, a way to buy stuff or get cash when needed.

Imagine now being able to travel and use another way to pay, this might reduce anxieties about robberies or losing cash/cards.

[Previously I could only "cash-in" BTC by buying gold via providentmetals.com or APMEX]


The circle is now unbroken.  If I can do it, almost anyone else can.  The future of Bitcoin looks brighter every day!

There are already some lessons to be learned from your post about LUMI:

1) There are too many players (wallets) that are not well-designed for newbies and non-tekkies (moi)

2) It's annoying that there are so many forks & updates that demand near constant attention, NOT GOOD

3) Read reviews here and consider avoiding cryptos that fork, and wallets that update too much

4) Consider providers that have been serving people well for a long time

5) Take some profits along the way, sell some BTC when it spikes, that way you cannot lose it all

The above thoughts just off the top of my head.

...

20 years is a long time in our Brave New World.  So much happens so quickly that looking at an event that MIGHT happen in ~100 years is not worth serious amounts of time, it's really just idle intellectual speculation (not there's anything wrong with that).

There will almost surely be unanticipated changes of huge magnitude in the next 100 years that no one has any idea of what will happen to us in 100 years, much less what the world will look like after the last Bitcoin is mined.

I am more focused on the next 10 years.  That will be exciting enough.  Thought that 2020 has been interesting?  Wait until 2021...

...

I just received my bitpay debit card, today I will activate it (can't on the iPhone app for some reason).  THIS will mean that I now have an easy off-ramp to sell BTC if/when I want to, it will even work for getting FIAT$ at regular bank ATMs.  I'll report back, perhaps at a new thread as well, once I have test-fired it.

This also means that for us non-tekkies that we have relatively easy on and off ramps for Bitcoin to/from cash.  This is important.  With bitpay and LibertyX, I have been able to make it much easier for me to get in and out EASILY (and CHEAPLY) whenever that might become an issue.  Without having to use exchanges...

As more such services come out, more new users will enter the Bitcoin Ecosystem!  They will have confidence that it is somewhat easy to use.  We will see more and more users enter, big and small.  

And more and more will BUY & HODL.  Confidence that "normal" people can get in and out is vital.

[NONE of my few rich relatives are into (AFAIK) Bitcoin, they are missing out, but some will see the light soon]


^--- TL/DR?  Expect BTC to keep moving up (over time).  The numbers tossed around here may actually happen...  

1% of our net for us wimpy conservative thinkers (also older), a higher percentage for the bold.


Edited

...

Well, the only way I know how to respond to you, philipma1957 since I don't mine or anything, is to lord it over you (probably) some other way:

OROBTC1956  

     


Edit: been waiting for the right opportunity...

...

Re "A Breakthrough", it just occurred to me that BTC price spikes (like we apparently have now: $13,790 as I write) will get attention and FOMO.  Each incremental advance in BTC adoption and/or price spikes will get attention and more users.

My interest in a debit card is to allow me to incrementally CA$H-OUT of Bitcoin during price spikes.  In 2017 I was able to do this by buying gold, but there is still not a convenient way to cash-out for, well, cash.

Also, we travel (did until COVID anyway), having a MasterCard funded with BTC might come in very handy.  I could get $500 out of the ATM whether in Peru or in Europe...

Over the years I have typically bought BTC more-or-less every month or so.  The only exceptions were when I sold (just some) in late 2017 and a small amount in early 2018.

Bitcoin is still a "risk asset" as far as I am concerned.  Risky, but with a likely (?) great future.  

I have never been able to predict the future, so when I am handed a gift (like a big-time BTC price spike), I take the it...

Yes, agreed on all points!  I had bought BTC since about 2014 - 2015 (will have to check and remember this once and for all, LOL), and HEDL until I started trimming as BTC spiked in 2017.  Sold some here, some there.  As low as $9000, highest sales were at $15,000 (all numbers approximate).  One sale around $15,000 was after the tippy-top (which I missed), but that's OK.  Nice profit, properly declared to the IRS and CapGains tax paid.  I still have "enough" BTC to be over 1% of my net.

And I too have heard about how "lucky" I have been.  And part of that is likely true!  But your main point is that we who believed that BTC had a great future.  The 2018 - 2020 bear market was brutal, and tested our patience and resolve.

Also, I will likely trim a bit of my HODLings if we go up more, say, to $15,000 again.  Probably some more at +/-$25k.  More at $40k.  What would I do with the proceeds?  Au & Pt

But I will NEVER sell all my Bitcoin, even if over a $150,000 price...

Finally, fuck yeah!

...

That US investor I mentioned above is Paul Tudor Jones making those comments from back in May 2020.  (BTC was almost to $10,000 then)

Various references (Bloomberg, CNBC, others), Google those articles/videos for more info, but Jones is a seriously rich and smart guy (a big-time hedge fund manager), he has money on "the fastest horse".

Yes, Bitcoin volatility is a good thing.  It is a reasonable assumption (no guarantees!) that BTC will go up in price over time, so those with any extra money ought to have a stake.

As a large US investor (I don't remember who) is doing, he puts some of his own money into BTC because "it's the fastest horse in the race".

If you speculate or invest, consider betting on the fastest horse...  And I mean BTC, a legitimate solid horse.

*   *   *

Here in the US there are three interesting developments I have been following that are making Bitcoin more user-friendly and available:

1)  a company called LibertyX (libertyx.com) now has a service where you can buy BTC for cash it CVS and 7-Eleven stores for as low as 1.7% or so over BTC "Spot" price.  I myself have used this service a few times, works great, have to do KYC though.

2)  I am waiting on a BitPay Debit Card.  This would allow you to fund it with BTC, they credit you with cash, then you can use it like any other MasterCard, even to take out cash from ATMs.  This is a big step.  This allows an easy way to "cash-out" of Bitcoin should you choose.

3)  PayPal has now offered an imperfect means of getting into BTC.  Imperfect, but getting a lot of attention here.

"Momentum is building."

Ask yimfinity!  (See above)  He seems to be affiliated with LibertyX and could probably find out which (if any) 7-Elevens would offer that service there in The Philippines.

The service appears (my uneducated observation only) to work somewhat like the "Green Dot" service (putting cash onto special cards/cellphones, essentially), Green Dot is a way for the unbanked here in America to carry something other than actual cash around.

That's about where I am at.  I am glad PayPal has allowed a way to participate, imperfectly, with Bitcoin, but I have other methods I prefer.

Recently I signed on with LibertyX, they have a way to buy BTC for CA$H at almost all CVS stores and 7-Elevens.  You have to go through KYC, that's really the only drawback, but if you don't mind...  LibertyX currently offers BTC as below:

-- $20 - $500 limits IIRC
-- a $4.95 flat fee
-- They sell BTC at the "offer price", so a bit higher than, say, preev.com's BTC price.
-- Customer chooses "fast" or "slow" confirmation/miner's fee
-- LibertyX may end this October 31, check!  

libertyx.com

The above works out to about 1.8% TOTAL premium -- with "fast" confirmation for a $500 purchase, which is pretty good!  Note the $4.95 flat fee, obviously premium would be a higher percent for smaller BTC purchases.  I have done this a few times now, it's a cheap way to buy BTC without messing with exchanges.


edited for clarity

...

I think we're good on defense vs. Brute Force attacks, even with the 12 seed word wallets.  That works out to some 2048^12 word combinations (a comfortably large number).  

https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/blob/master/bip-0039/english.txt

Yes, the word order is very important!

I would just add here, FYI everyone, that the words can be "re-used" within that seed, that is, I once generated a 12 word seed, and one of the words was used TWICE.



EDIT: I will leave most of your questions for those more advanced than I am in the technical aspects of wallets & seeds.

...

Three recent developments (PayPal's acceptance of BTC into their system, LibertyX and BitPay's debit card -- en route, will review when I get it) will, in time, help a LOT in getting more people into BTC and help lift the price even further...:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5283604.0

We're all winners!

...

Recent events look to be very positive for BItcoin acceptance as well as price gains.  Very...

-- My own experiences with LibertyX (purchase BTC for less than 2% premium at 7_Eleven and CVS ($500 worth), see https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5257626.0)
-- I am waiting on BitPay's debit card, which gives a nice off-ramp way to "cash-in" BTC, an important step
-- And, of course, PayPal's recent decision to allow exchange of BTC (which I presume makes AMZN purchases using BTC)

Each of the above means relatively little in the short-term on their own, but WILL mean more as time goes on and more people enter the Bitcoin Ecosystem using one or more of the above services.

Based on the above pretty recent developments, I have to presume that more useful services are on their way.

Which will be BIG in time.  


(Edited for clarity)

Nor do Taleb's holdings match my own.  I too am diversified, but he makes a very interesting case based on misperceptions of RISK.

The 90% ($-value) of his Barbell would be ultra-safe.  So, you would never lose more than 10% of your holdings.

The 10% are the riskiest assets you can buy with low & limited downside but HUGE upside.  I am surmising that you would buy such things (options, options on Bitcoin, etc.) in small quantities each such that you could endure many of them going to zero (like options would).  But, sometimes you would win.  And win BIG.  That's the point, low-priced out of the money options (for example) appear to be underpriced, hence, in the long run would yield the occasional "White Swan" (an unexpected low probability event with enormous positive impact).

An example of a 10% investment that a acquaintance of mine had was he bought S&P 500 puts right just before one of the drops in October 2008.  There were several days when the market dropped various percentage points, he made a schnittload of money (perhaps some 20 times as much as he bet) over those few days.

Taleb apparently does just this.  He is a MUCH better speculator/trader/investor than I am.  He is also much richer, and self-made.

My own holdings likely are closer to your own.  But, I have cash & gold for "my 90%" even though those are not 90% of my net.  And no debt.  Taleb recommends holding Treasuries, but he wrote the book before rates went down so much that the REAL INTEREST rates are near zero.
 
He also recommends holding no debt, debt holdings are fragile (you might have to pay it back at a bad moment, like a margin call, or bank calling in your mortgage).  

He does not like real estate either, it's taxable, illiquid (what if you have to sell in a hurry?), possibly bought with borrowed money, perhaps a hassle to hold, possible landlord/tenant problems (look at commercial real estate now), etc.  Illiquid investments tend to be fragile by their very nature (unpredictable BIG losses can happen).

*   *   *

Diversification is my game.  I hold lots of different kinds of assets, discussed elsewhere here at bitcointalk.  Good diversification is what he terms "Robust".  Like a rock, hard to break.  But, "Antifragile" is better in his opinion, in that whatever you have that is antifragile gets stronger (more valuable) when stressed.

And, properly applying his principals, is how you get rich at lower risk as a speculator.

Those who don't have time nor interest in following his fairly involved insistence of research and understanding would do better to stick to robust and/or diversified investments.

Taleb, Nassim Nicholas
Antifragile -- Things That Gain from Disorder
2012


Edited for typos and corrections

THAT is interesting information, thanks.  IIUC that means if one transfers, say, 0.1BTC (call it $1800 now), you would automatically received some $1800 in cash (on the card).

But, if you just left your money idle there on the card, for a month say, some (small?) amount gets drained away?  Sort of like those old "Green Dot" cards?

I suppose a way to get around that would be to transfer BTC to the card for debit card use would be just before you make an ATM dollar withdrawal or just before making a credit card style purchase.


Edited for errors...

...

hatshepsut93 and teosanru

Taleb's Barbell Strategy does not concern itself with correlation, at least not much.

One side of the barbell is for ultra-safe investments (that ideally keep up with inflation, which Treasuries do not currently do not as their interest rates are so low) are on one end, and on the other end are the riskiest possible investments that offer a LARGE UPSIDE but with limited risk (losing all of any investments on the risky "10%" end).

Examples of investments at the risky end:

-- buying options (calls or puts), especially cheap ones.  Yep, you could lose 100%, but that would be less than or equal of the 10%
-- cheap futures (eg, a gold January 2021 option, strike price of $3000)

Note that you only put small parts of your 10% in any one investment, just putting your 10% in ONE investment makes you fragile!

Also note that he does not distinguish between a bullish or bearish investment.

Examples of something NOT to invest in your 10% (risky) end:

-- writing options or selling short.  You could lose MORE THAN 100% of these investments!
-- anything you would buy using borrowed money (as you could lose more than 100%)

Borrowing money is FRAGILE!  You may have trouble paying it back if things go wrong.


One of Taleb's main points is that most investment risks are grossly misunderstood.  He considers that the risk of a major "blow-up" (massive losses) is much higher than people, even investment professionals, think.

Another major point of his is NOT to "predict the future", but to identify what is fragile (for example bonds in Italian banks, or commercial real estate REITS), and then act.  Keep your best small, they may very well end up at $0.  But, enough of these risks, risky enough to go WAY UP when they blow-up, that you will make a lot.  Risk is typically mis-priced!  Especially risks of low probability, but a properly placed bet on a weak investment may make a lot of dough.

N. N. Taleb has "f**k you money" from doing just this.  90% ultra-safe, 10% properly placed bets on fragility.

It DOES seem that positive things are speeding up for BTC adoption and ease of use:

-- MSTR and @Jack buying in
-- Lots of talk about others entering BTC space
-- LibertyX making it cheap and easy to buy BTC (after KYC), not necessary to work with exchanges
-- BitPay apparently offers a debit card that would allow for use as a MasterCard and even to withdraw FIAT$ at ATMs.

The two immediately above are important advances.

Hmm, perhaps I should try and get one of Bitpay's cards?  Another project, but that allows spending BTC easily.  GREAT for liquidity.


EDIT: Has anyone gotten one of Bitpay's debit cards yet?