17 (US) cents probably is true, the situation there in Venezuela is getting desperate.  Venezuela probably is the most vilnerable country in South America: poorest and with the poorest prospects ahead.  They have more OIL than any other country in the world, go figure (ah, THAT counts as a failure of Socialism).

Yes, I would have thought that US$ would work!  Ecuador's official paper currency is the US$ (Panama too I believe).

* * *

I like theymos's idea re Opendimes loaded up with varying amounts of BTC (still need a real BTC wallet though).  Opendime seems to be the cheapest solution.

But, how do you convince Venezuelans to accept a digital currency that would surely be the target of Maduro y Cia...?

That's not true (my experience only) in the USA.  It's been a pain in the butt for me to buy BTC.  I have used "BTMs" that charged from 6% (long time ago) to 15%.  Currently the best (lowest) premium over spot in my city is 9%.

I have used localbitcoins, but it's HARD to coordinate meetings, at least for me.  I've done it, but not easy.

I used Circle for a short while, but they're now OUT of the BTC biz.

...

I believe I read something the other day about Barclays of the UK starting up some kind of operations w/ Bitcoin.

But, my casual Google search did not turn up anything exciting.  Barclays HAS been doing projects involving BTC since August, 2015, various articles on that are easy to find.

I bet that banks will slowly get into Bitcoin, one article I saw linked had "Chainanalysis" (a BTC wallet tracer, and other services I believe) looking at doing business with banks, perhaps Chainalaysis would keep them from getting "Dirty BTC" (from drug sites, porn, gambling, etc.).

I doubt he is Satoshi as well.

But, his web-bot project has been going for many years now, and some people swear by him (like him, sort-of how many like Martin Armstrong).

The idea behind is to collect memes, words, ideas from all kinds of places; and then I suppose he has some heavy-duty computers crunching away.  But I have not heard much about him lately, nor would it seem likely that any BIG predictions of hid would have come true, else we would all have heard about it...

That's interesting, I would not have guessed that property in Oz would be expensive, so much land and all.  Maybe GOOD property (without the snakes, etc.) or along the beach I could see being pricey.

Land itself has gone up a lot over the past few years (esp. like farmland in places like Iowa), but I have not looked at it nor read anything in about a year.  Right now we are concentrating on selling our ocean-view condo, then we will move into a smaller one (& cheaper, inland some).

trollerc, either here or elsewhere, drop us a line about TYPE of real estate you might like, wow, that could be a LOOOOONG thread...

DEFINITELY check with me if you're interested in Washington DC!  [Our daughter is a realtor there]

Very well stated, deisik.  I should copy that, memorize that, and tell that to everyone I know involved in money & investments.

Bitcoin may, or may not, become accepted as an international currency (one of finviz.com 's links (Forex) shows BTC price along with the Euro, etc.):

http://finviz.com/forex.ashx

Everywhere I have been, the US$ and the Euro can be converted pretty hassle free (except somewhat the Euro here in the USA), your experience matches mine.  The Euro is easy to convert to local currency in Peru for example.

The term "money" is indeed a slippery concept.

...

I do wish I had held on to some of my Bitcoin (when it was around $400 - $500 or so) when I bought some gold.  Once it was close to $500, I "celebrated" by selling some BTC to buy gold.

Ah well, bad timing.  I am glad that I still have "enough", but my investment timing (at least short-term) typically is not good.

I did learn years ago that I do NOT do well in casinos (poker, craps, blackjack), so at least I don't lose anything there.

...

Thank you above repliers re posting that Russian and E. European gangs are infesting your countries.  I had not heard that per se, but it makes a lot of sense.

* * *

I had an interesting conversation yesterday with a realtor here in town (warm SE USA!).

He (he and his wife are from Spain and maintain connections to their friends & families there) told me that European countries will definitely raise taxes (esp. on the "rich"), as they WILL NOT cut spending (no votes in cutting spending).

And they will do things like introduce NEW taxes, apparently real estate is not heavily taxed (it is kind of heavily taxed here, it varies by state, but 1% - 2% of real estate value goes to "Property Tax").

Europe already has high Income Tax as well as a VAT that is typically 17% - 21%.


He was NOT optimistic re Europe and their future, at least among the wealthy that he has recently dealt with.

...

I had an interesting conversation yesterday with a realtor here in town.

He (he and his wife are from Spain and maintain connections to their friends & families there) told me that European countries will definitely raise taxes (esp. on the "rich"), as they WILL NOT cut spending (no votes in cutting spending).

And they will do things like introduce NEW taxes, apparently real estate is not heavily taxed (it is kind of heavily taxed here, it varies by state, but 1% - 2% of real estate value goes to "Property Tax").

Europe already has high Income Tax as well as a VAT that is typically 17% - 21%.

He was NOT optimistic re Europe and "Economic Totalitarianism", he is getting inquiries from Norwegians, etc. who are looking to US property as a "Plan B" (smile).

No, the yuan is getting weaker.  It closed (last I looked) at almost exactly Y7:US$1.

EDIT: Here's an article from TODAY at Zero Hedge, noting the very weak Yuan:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-15/china-devalues-yuan-weakest-fix-may-2008


No, Apple's HQ is still in California.  Most of their production (of iPhones anyway) is in China.


The US$ lately has been very strong, the "US Dollar Index" closed today over 103, higher than it's been in over two years:

...

What about matters that affect tourists like street crime?

Yes, I know that street crime is not necessarily an important issue in Europe (it is a pretty important issue here), but I have heard stories about immigrant gangs attacking people in the streets.  If that is a BIG DEAL that would affect tourism, which I imagine (?) would affect ALL the rest of a country's economy.

* * *

Also re immigrants, we read here that they are NOT "fitting in", America used to be famous in that all immigrants "became Americans".  This is changing somewhat due to OUR own illegal immigrants NOT wanting to fit in.

...

bittaitaliana

I have bought gold several times from https://www.providentmetals.com/ with great success.  Quick service, and they do take Bitcoin.

I do not know if they would ship to Italy.  You could ask them...  

There *may* be European companies that would accept your BTC for gold.

Good luck!


EDIT: I am American, but never had to pay any tax on buying gold from Provident.  European laws might be different...

...

Europe is the world's largest economic zone with a little larger GNP than the USA.  Yet we have all heard of the severe economic (and cultural because of migrants) problems.

I am an American but very much a "Friend of Europe".  In the parts that our family has visited, we feel pretty comfortable, as European values are pretty similar to American ones.  The food is good, the infrastructure probably better than the USA's.

Here in this thread, I invite discussion and comments on where Europe is heading.

Martin Armstrong (an economic forecaster who has a fan base and a huge supercomputer grinding out economic analysis) just wrote the below short piece on the prospects for Europe breaking up:

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/europes-current-economy/europe-starting-to-break-apart/

* * *

I particularly invite Europeans to comment!  We (I) need perspectives from bitcointalk members as to what you think is happening there!  Here is a list of various subjects all pertaining to Europe now, but I encourage comments on anything that forum members have.

--  Migrants from Muslim countries (appears to us Americans as a huge problem)
--  Continuing problems in the banking system (both "Club Med", but also even mighty Deutsche Bank)
--  Do Europeans living close to Russia view that country as a threat?
--  How likely would you see a break-up of the Eurozone or the Euro currency?

...

Armstrong came out with an interesting (yet short!) piece on the real risk of Europe breaking up.  It seems that Juncker again is pusing a centralized solution to keep Europe together.

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/europes-current-economy/europe-starting-to-break-apart/

Armstrong goes on to comment that that is evidence of Europe starting to break up.

We just came back from a visit to Europe (as tourists).  Part of our trip was in Germany.  And the river cruise patrons were mostly Americans.  But I heard ZERO about Euro-problems the whole time we  were there.

...

I have no ideas at the moment, but some of the above seem good (I like the one about multi-currency BTC ATMs at airports).

I too am interested in ideas as expressed by the O/P.  And so I will keep an eye on this thread. 

...

Thank you for advising us of Yet Another Country that wants to screw its citizens by taking away CA$H.

Do the authorities there not recognize what is happening in India and Venezuela where they have started such lunacy?

I wonder if we Americans would react in our typically harsher way...

Molon Labe!  You can have my money after I give you all my lead!

...

It's good to read that BTC is catching on there in India.

Perhaps the time is right (the technology and Indian people are congruent now), and perhaps Modi's mishandling of the R500 and R1000 banknotes bans have both contributed to a more rapid use of Bitcoin there than I had anticipated based on my trip (as a tourist on a guided tour).

I see no real downside to India getting large into BTC, au contraire...

Rock on, friend Risto.  It's OK to want it all (Torque's list), LOL.

Actually that was a wonderful post, I had not considered that (my red emphasis).  Yep, you are the only one who can post your unique experiences, and we can choose to read this thread if so (I do).

People you want to meet will eventually show up.  

...

Wow, nice post iamnotback.

I will only address a few of your points.

1)  Yeah, the pace of change certainly has been picking up.  Especially technological change, but cultural, political and financial as well.  This is not a new idea of course (Toffler: Future Shock, from the 1970s).  I would expect (again, not new) change to accelerate.

2)  A Knowledge Age would likely make such change even faster.  Drawing that much closer to a Singularity.

3)  I have not been idle in my BTC buying over the last several weeks...  While I do not have active counterparts with whom I can buy BTC from, I did buy some from Circle (before their demise) as well as the "cheapest BTC ATM in town" (9%).  So I am now ahead, in the black.  At least on paper, er, at least in electrons...

4)  I agree that the SHTF scenarios have receded somewhat, as well as in intensity in part at least due to TRUMP.  The US$ being so strong is also lessening my worries about the immediate economy.  When our "friends" on the Socialist D-Team look like they may come back into power, then at least I will have had already made a start in preparing for them.

5)  As per my diversity in investments, yes, I hold some stocks, and some real estate.

6)  We will see what happens re precious metals.  My bias is towards GOLD, as silver has never in recent times counted as "money", NO ONE cared in 1965 when they changed our dimes & quarters to "clad".  NO ONE is clamoring for silver coins to be minted.

* * *

freshman777

The Bible is written in its fashion (esp. the KJV) because its language is symbolic.  Times were different back then, so the actual words meant for contemporaries THEN.  But, the Bible was written so that every person in every era could read & understand it by looking carefully at what the authors meant to be communicated through the millennia.

Agree with you re the Human Soul being more important than any form of money.  But, the Bible does not condemn wealth, just bad thought and bad behavior.

It is not worth getting us involved in interpretations of the Bible, there are plenty of other places for that.  I'll drop this subject here, as I think most really don't care, and there are plenty of other places for people to discuss this who DO care.

...

New articles from Armstrong might be of interest.


https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/markets-by-sector/precious-metals/gold/indias-gold-confiscation-turkeys-war-on-currency/

India and Turkey are discussed, their mismanagement of their economies.  I have read (Zero Hedge) that the whole cash elimination (R500 and R1000 -- their largest bank notes, worth very little in US$) is causing HUGE suffering in India.

Yet, Venezuela is trying the same thing (banning their 100 bolivares)!

Turkey is pushing their people to NOT buy US$.  Erdogan looks like he is going very dictatorial...


https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/north_america/2016-u-s-presidential-election/jill-steins-the-great-con/

Jill Stein (discussed in the link) is pushing more of the political warfare that the whole Democrat Party is, this may end poorly if any of this BS (vote recounts, Electoral College challenges, etc.) gets bad.

[And they asked TRUMP, like he was the Bad Guy, if he would accept the election results...]