ANTMINER S7 is available at bitmaintech.com with 4.86TH/s, 0.25J/GH

[Questor]

I'm wondering if batch 7 will handle OC over 650 MHZ ?

Unlikely,  as even the "gems" of the S7 world start to lose hash and see increased HW errors above 625.

The best way to think about this would be that the batch sevens are "factory overclocked"

[notlist3d]

I'm wondering if batch 7 will handle OC over 650 MHZ ?

Unlikely,  as even the "gems" of the S7 world start to lose hash and see increased HW errors above 625.

The best way to think about this would be that the batch sevens are "factory overclocked"

They have a decent amount of time to perfect as shipping is a way's off.  I'm really surprised at speed change, seems they can not be happy with a single design.  This will make market on 2nd hand S7's so much harder to shop for and sell with so many variations and no + or other thing to differentiate it.

I wish they would have kept old price though.  With difficulty turning nasty... it could be a hard ROI to do.

[Biodom]

almost impossible to ROI (before halving) @ current btc price with such high % diff jump.

PLEASE add in : miner + psu + shipping costs + tax + elec cost (if any) + ISP + Setup costs (if any) + DIFFICULTY ! many forget to add in DIFFICULTY ! next jump is over 10%

even with avg +5% diff jump @ current prices - (pool luck + variance . . . one will almost NEVER get 100% all the time) + FREE power = VERY long time to ROI & NOT to mention halving.

with the math above i am seeing above 200 days range MINIMUM.

btc price @ 334 USD , free internet, 0 breakdowns, USD 150 for shipping & psu, 0 tax, FREE power, pool fee of 2.5% (PPS), 0 setup + maint. costs.

I'm NOT trying to discourage but please do your math.

best part is that you WILL NOT get your miner until shipped & the delivery man knocks on your door so add in a -15% lost due to diff jump till the time you plug it in & start mining.

Mining is just as much of a speculative market as the exchanges are when speculating on price.  I imagine some, if not most here, are "speculating" the price of bitcoin [Over time] will increase at a higher percentage rate than the percentage rate in which bitcoin price increases.  That's what I'm speculating.  I have my reasons for investing more in rigs than buying BTC alone.  We will see over time if my speculation is right.  Although, I must say, I have plans on getting to cheaper power costs soon as well.

i don't think that you can predict anymore. i run the numbers based on 10% rise during next 1-3 cycles, then 4%. As a result, there are $$ deficits by July IF bitcoin price is the same. If bitcoin goes to $700 by July, this will all be in +. I decided not to buy either bitcoin or miners anymore. I had my fill for 2015 already.

[RichBC]

I'm wondering if batch 7 will handle OC over 650 MHZ ?

Unlikely,  as even the "gems" of the S7 world start to lose hash and see increased HW errors above 625.

The best way to think about this would be that the batch sevens are "factory overclocked"

I think it's the other way round and Batches 1 to 6 are actually "factory underclocked"  

Even batch 7 is underclocked relative to the Bm1385 Data Sheet. If we look at the numbers.

With a 12V supply and an 18 Node String that gives a 0.667V Core Voltage / Chip.
Data Sheet Hash / Chip at 0.66V is 32.5GH/s * 162 Chips = 5265GH/s / 8.1 = 650MHz clock

Whereas we have with Batch 7 5063GH/s /8.1 = 625MHz clock

So we are getting close but still underclocked relative to the Data Sheet.


Rich

[Questor]

I wager the data sheet published for these 1385 chips was not based on nominal chips but exceptional chips and perhaps some exaggeration.

IIRC I don't think we've seen a unit come in at spec, but I can't say I've ready EVERY post on the S7's.

My units are exceptional 4.86 rock solid B1's and I'm excited to see what they can do once warranty is up, and closer to ROI.

An associate has several he's been clocking at 625mhz since day one and they still have .00xx HW rates, when he clocked them higher, HW rates suffered and the hash did not increase.
All the empirical evidence so far points to the released performance data being slightly in-accurate.

Has anyone (novak / sidehack) gotten any raw 1385's to play with?

P.S.  I just noticed that... IF the 1385's were producing 30 gh/s instead of 32.5 gh/s...

162 Chips @ 30gh/s = 4860

[not.you]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

[suchmoon]

I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.

If you ignore the spike to $8 it increased just enough to compensate for halving. It was trading around ~$1.5 then spiked then settled at $3+. And there is no new Scrypt hardware being made so mining LTC has been surprisingly good during 2015.

That's not to say that Bitcoin would repeat the pattern. For one, hardware situation is completely different.

[Biodom]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

[RichBC]

P.S.  I just noticed that... IF the 1385's were producing 30 gh/s instead of 32.5 gh/s...

162 Chips @ 30gh/s = 4860

Yes that is correct and how they have been running the 600MHz, 4.86TH Miners.


Rich

[-droid-]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

[hawkfish007]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

[adaseb]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

Yes you have to accept the return AND pay for shipping both ways.

[Marvell1]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

Yes you have to accept the return AND pay for shipping both ways.

on my paypa i say no returns on Bitcoin mining equipment clear as day in my terms.  I have sold a ton of hardware , from sp30s , sp20s and now selling scrypt gear and only ever had one return.

the key is to never sell to new users , or people with less that 30+ positive feedbacks otherwises youre just shooting yourself in the foot

[not.you]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

I don't think that is true.  You are not providing a warranty on used gear to work for 45 days.  This is from paypal ebay:

http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/return-policy.html
Important: Even if you specify "no returns accepted," under the eBay Money Back Guarantee the buyer can still return an item if it doesn't match the listing description. Learn more about what the eBay Money Back Guarantee means to sellers.
http://pages.ebay.com/resolutioncenter/BuyerProtectionForSellers.html

This is what it says on a listing when the seller does not offer return:
Seller does not offer returns. You are covered by the eBay Money Back Guarantee if you received an item that is not as described in the listing.

[fr4nkthetank]

Any clues why bitmain is now charging based off btc ?  so btc/usd doesnt matter anymore ?  I'm guessing no one will buy until btc drops to 300ish and then boom everyone buys at the same time ?  I understand the utopian world of only having btc as a barter currency  but seriously btc has to be compared to something to assess its value quickly and reliably.  thoughts?

[Biodom]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

I don't think that is true.  You are not providing a warranty on used gear to work for 45 days.  This is from paypal ebay:

http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/return-policy.html
Important: Even if you specify "no returns accepted," under the eBay Money Back Guarantee the buyer can still return an item if it doesn't match the listing description. Learn more about what the eBay Money Back Guarantee means to sellers.
http://pages.ebay.com/resolutioncenter/BuyerProtectionForSellers.html

This is what it says on a listing when the seller does not offer return:
Seller does not offer returns. You are covered by the eBay Money Back Guarantee if you received an item that is not as described in the listing.

you are just being naive about it. the buyer does not need to elaborate on anything. "the item is not as described", no questions asked. what you described is a miner that hashes as specified. imagine the buyer having shitty PSU, then doing something inane in addition. case closed and you lose.
You can try to fight it, but will lose review in most cases-just ask around.
It is better to simply refund and hope that the item will be returned undamaged.
However, I don't think that the majority of buyers on ebay are unfair, but the higher is the price, the higher a probability of a deal going south, I believe, although I don't have hard numbers.

[dmwardjr]

i don't think that you can predict anymore. i run the numbers based on 10% rise during next 1-3 cycles, then 4%. As a result, there are $$ deficits by July IF bitcoin price is the same. If bitcoin goes to $700 by July, this will all be in +. I decided not to buy either bitcoin or miners anymore. I had my fill for 2015 already.

Really?  You're not even buying bitcoin anymore?  It's easily going to $700 [Minimum] in my opinion just before the halving.  Even if one thought it was going to $500 or $550 minimum just before the halving, it's worth buying on the next dip and hold until it gets to $500 to $550 [If one has the funds to spare in buying it].

[Biodom]

i don't think that you can predict anymore. i run the numbers based on 10% rise during next 1-3 cycles, then 4%. As a result, there are $$ deficits by July IF bitcoin price is the same. If bitcoin goes to $700 by July, this will all be in +. I decided not to buy either bitcoin or miners anymore. I had my fill for 2015 already.

Really?  You're not even buying bitcoin anymore?  It's easily going to $700 [Minimum] in my opinion just before the halving.  Even if one thought it was going to $500 or $550 minimum just before the halving, it's worth buying on the next dip and hold until it gets to $500 to $550 [If one has the funds to spare in buying it].

To be very honest, wifie complains that i overspent "our" money recently, and I somewhat agree as I spent quite a bit on B1-B6 (been greedy  ).
They will provide a bitcoin flow, hopefully, so i don't have to purchase more for cash and instead buy or lease her a Mini that she wants.
happy wife, happy life rule.

[RichBC]

Really?  You're not even buying bitcoin anymore?  It's easily going to $700 [Minimum] in my opinion just before the halving.  Even if one thought it was going to $500 or $550 minimum just before the halving, it's worth buying on the next dip and hold until it gets to $500 to $550 [If one has the funds to spare in buying it].

Really hope you are right.   Would be interested in your theory as to why will see a rise, and why just before the halving?

We know that 1/2 the number of coins a Day will then be mined, but why does that mean the value increases? Also surely if there is a rise "Due" it will happen way ahead of the actual event?


Rich

[hawkfish007]

One interesting thing to note about ROI is that for some reason bitcoin miners have an unreasonably high resell value on ebay.  So an S7 in hand today (or soon) doesn't have to mine the full value back if you can resell it and:
 
resell amount + mining returns > cost + expenses

Of course with the halving coming up there may actually be a glut of miners hitting the resell market next year some time so timing a sale might be part of the equation if you go that route.  But it's hard to predict what the halving will actually do.  I would have thought the LTC halving would increase the value of LCT but it didn't really.  If BTC follows the same pattern then mining will get much less profitable.

what is ebay return rate, i wonder? also, once you remove 13% fees, there is not much profit there either.
It seems that $400 level does not induce much fraud on ebay, but i don't know if $2000 does, especially since a buyer can make a mistake, then return for any reason at all.

theres options on your listing to select no returns.. also if you mention no returns in the listing as well thats twice being mentioned returns not offered.

can a buyer still return them after that?

Yes they can by claiming that the miner doesn't work within 45 days or PayPal refund window. You have no choice but to accept the return.

I don't think that is true.  You are not providing a warranty on used gear to work for 45 days.  This is from paypal ebay:

http://pages.ebay.com/help/sell/return-policy.html
Important: Even if you specify "no returns accepted," under the eBay Money Back Guarantee the buyer can still return an item if it doesn't match the listing description. Learn more about what the eBay Money Back Guarantee means to sellers.
http://pages.ebay.com/resolutioncenter/BuyerProtectionForSellers.html

This is what it says on a listing when the seller does not offer return:
Seller does not offer returns. You are covered by the eBay Money Back Guarantee if you received an item that is not as described in the listing.

You probably didn't had to go through eBay return process yet. This is from my experience, I sold B1 S7 on eBay after 40 days buyer started a return process on my no return eBay sale. I was given three choices :

1. Issue a return label at my own expense
2. Issue refund now or
3. Issue refund after receiving the item.

Not much choice.