[ANN] Firo (FIRO) - Implementing ZKP privacy without trusted setup

[AngusCanine]

how do i set up the cpu miner download. will there be wiki for linux like the first one

ok im gone to assume the dependencies are the same and i just need to delete the old cpuminer file and use the new git clone and follow the same instructions ?

bump

check out their slack, many  miners there ! https://zcoinofficial.slack.com/messages/mining/ the dependices ARE the same tho yes i believe

thank you will give it a whirl tonight

it worked!!!

[1714503545]

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[1714503545]

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[1714503545]

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[drays]

According to my calculations (and they are pretty much reliable I think) right at the moment mining with CPU gives about 4 times less than before the change (exactly the same setup gives 4x less coins).
So it is utterly unprofitable, unless the computing power is free.

I am a long term miner of this coin, so I won't shutdown the machines right now... Except obvious reasons like GPU joining, I suppose there might be an effect of slow diff retargeting and/or the fact there are too many GPU miners who got excited and jumped on this coin during the algo change.

But if this stays the same for few days, CPU mining for this coin could be officially closed for everyone except botnets, as even with 80% VPS discounts this would be unprofitable.

[AltcoinScamfinder]

Cpu mining?

An i7-6700k does 0.85 Mh/s and the difficulty is 2088. That comes down to 0.32 coins per day if I'm not mistaken.

It's awful to mine even with GPUs.

In fact, that is great news, as it means the coin is undervalued, and the price should jump up soon. If mining were cheap, miners would just dump on the market. While at the current situation, miners will not sell cheap, this is to the benefit of all us

there is something called fixed supply, it doesn't matter how many miners there are the same amount of coin will be produced, therefore unless you are talking about hype, the coin will not get any pump

Nope, I am not talking about hype. The thing is - to produce that same "fixed supply", now more electricity is being spent. So this makes the coin more expensive for all of the miners. Hence this should reflect on the coin price.
Or, alternatively, the hashrate will drop soon, and diff will go down. This is actually very likely scenario. But if it doesn't happen, price will jump.

Miners DO NOT determine market value. In no way, shape, or form. The market is generally free floating from mining with the exception of really small coins in which the emission rate effectively tanks the market.

See this all the time. It's actually pretty silly that people assume that mining has any sort of intrinsic value outside of securing the blockchain for investors. The coin will function with a gajillion miners or just one. Only people we're fighting against are eachother.

Thanks for regurgitating what you've heard while missing all the key points Amph. Can always count on you.

And private gpu farms win again.  Djm released a unoptimized gpu miner,  and optimized ones to private farms. Big guys win again.

I was actually thinking the other thing the other night while I was getting things ready... looked at GPU power usage and went 'yup, there are going to be a lot of private miners'. All else being equal, at the very least hashing power on a 1070 can be doubled without doing much of anything simply based on the power numbers I'm seeing. We've already seen this with Zcash. Probably a lot more then that.

yup it can be doubled by just looking at it... so start staring at your gpu, you never know it might work

If you think miners of a POW coin does not determine value, then crypto might not be for you.

[AltcoinScamfinder]

Horrible! Developers artificially increased the complexity of the production coin! And, like hamsters, We ate this deception! Developers somewhere running a private pool with an optimized algorithm and they get a huge portion of the coin! Compare the total hash of the network and the fact that the hash in all pools!

Welcome to the wonderful world of shitcoin development. You think developers do this for free? Of course there are private optimized miners.

[djm34]

Horrible! Developers artificially increased the complexity of the production coin! And, like hamsters, We ate this deception! Developers somewhere running a private pool with an optimized algorithm and they get a huge portion of the coin! Compare the total hash of the network and the fact that the hash in all pools!

Welcome to the wonderful world of shitcoin development. You think developers do this for free? Of course there are private optimized miners.

what so bad about making profit ? Aren't you there for that ? Isn't the reason you are trolling here, because you think you are entitled to more profit yourself (without giving back anything to anyone) ?
Please stop that hypocrisy.

and for info these were offered to you by the Zcoin team... and nothing force the dev team to do this (many coins are released without miners...)

[Tourgasm]

Now why would the devs have a private optimized miner for the coin when we know they get a portion of everycoin mined plus a portion of whatever is sold on exchanges. If you want an optimized miner real badly talk to wolf0 he's selling an AMD optimized sgminer kernel for 0.25 btc a piece 

[reb0rn21]

Don`t forget AWS could and prolly is rapping still 80% of zcoin network!

There are many way to obtain AWS, etc, botnets, etc not all are legal, but its the world we live in

one AWS instance can do +2Mhs so do your math, and not all pay for it (legal or not)!

can the ccminer be optimized more for sure, can it be 5x hell no, so there is no chance anyone has 10Mh+ GTC1070 miner
AMD is slow at lyra2_xxx always was, can it push 100% more, sure it can, but can it push 1000% more hell no
and AMD freaks you have bunch of coins with lyra_xxx and you should know AMD is bad for it!!

[bensam1231]

Miners DO NOT determine market value. In no way, shape, or form. The market is generally free floating from mining with the exception of really small coins in which the emission rate effectively tanks the market.

See this all the time. It's actually pretty silly that people assume that mining has any sort of intrinsic value outside of securing the blockchain for investors. The coin will function with a gajillion miners or just one. Only people we're fighting against are eachother.

Thanks for regurgitating what you've heard while missing all the key points Amph. Can always count on you.

Not sure whom you are opposing to, Amph or me...

Anyway, while I see your point, one cannot deny miners affect the price, while surely they do not determine that. I have been observing that many times, though you are correct I was looking mostly on smaller coins. Its better to tell - miners strongly affect the price, with the exception of the most solid coins, where the demand is big enough to make miners dump unnoticeable.

I have looked at you other posts in other threads though, and can see you are often providing really great insight.

Most miners sell off coins for peas instead of holding for speculative increase and many of them won't even bother calculating their future profit; they just mine and get surpised and angry if they don't like the results.

Yes, unfortunately this is probably the thing I was missing. If most miners are like that, then they indeed are only good at securing the blockchain, nothing more.

You're both wrong. I was 'opposing' both of you. Mining has relatively little to do with price with the exception of small coins whose emission completely dumps the exchanges every day.

You're discussing miner problems as if they're investor or exchange issues. They aren't. We can mine something into the ground and it can be extremely negative from a mining profitability standpoint and the economy of the coin can function perfectly fine. They're completely independent. Investors give shit all on whether or not things are profitable for you. Things tend to auto-balance based on users simply being able to figure out a profit calculator and moving hash off a coin, that's the only relationship there is with the market. The exchange movement has nothing to do with the miners though.

Horrible! Developers artificially increased the complexity of the production coin! And, like hamsters, We ate this deception! Developers somewhere running a private pool with an optimized algorithm and they get a huge portion of the coin! Compare the total hash of the network and the fact that the hash in all pools!

Welcome to the wonderful world of shitcoin development. You think developers do this for free? Of course there are private optimized miners.

what so bad about making profit ? Aren't you there for that ? Isn't the reason you are trolling here, because you think you are entitled to more profit yourself (without giving back anything to anyone) ?
Please stop that hypocrisy.

and for info these were offered to you by the Zcoin team... and nothing force the dev team to do this (many coins are released without miners...)

Making a grossly underperforming miner for the sake of selling a better one is a little shady. I admit, it's very stable and it uses almost no electricity... ...but that also means someone else is probably making 2-3x as much as me with the same hardware. I have no doubt you have a better miner.

Hopefully this will catch the attention of bigger devs which can make a fee miner like EWBF, Nicehash, or Claymore.


Everything aside, this coin has acquired too much 'hype' for the relaunch and people can't figure out profitability because Whattomine hasn't made a calculator so they're all mining blind and assuming it'll pan out.

[joblo]

Now why would the devs have a private optimized miner for the coin when we know they get a portion of everycoin mined plus a portion of whatever is sold on exchanges. If you want an optimized miner real badly talk to wolf0 he's selling an AMD optimized sgminer kernel for 0.25 btc a piece 

I know someone who has been unusually quiet in these forums lately who could have made a play with
private Cuda miners.  But I agree AWS users were the big winners.

I'm just speculating because I don't know how much lyra2 is left in Cuda after Nanashi doubled the
performance. I think the nature of the algo is the biggest impediment to GPU performance.

I've really enjoyed some of the new CPU algo development recently with multiple devs contributing to
optimize in the open. It seems to have motivated some others to give it a try. It's nice to see continued
interest in CPU mining.

My contribution is coming soon, maybe a little late but still significant.

Thanks for yours.

[Tourgasm]

Now why would the devs have a private optimized miner for the coin when we know they get a portion of everycoin mined plus a portion of whatever is sold on exchanges. If you want an optimized miner real badly talk to wolf0 he's selling an AMD optimized sgminer kernel for 0.25 btc a piece 

I know someone who has been unusually quiet in these forums lately who could have made a play with
private Cuda miners.  But I agree AWS users were the big winners.

I'm just speculating because I don't know how much lyra2 is left in Cuda after Nanashi doubled the
performance. I think the nature of the algo is the biggest impediment to GPU performance.

I've really enjoyed some of the new CPU algo development recently with multiple devs contributing to
optimize in the open. It seems to have motivated some others to give it a try. It's nice to see continued
interest in CPU mining.

My contribution is coming soon, maybe a little late but still significant.

Thanks for yours.

It shouldn't take you long there joblo. The code is very similar to the lyra2 code

[barrysty1e]

Everything aside, this coin has acquired too much 'hype' for the relaunch and people can't figure out profitability because Whattomine hasn't made a calculator so they're all mining blind and assuming it'll pan out.

line 2233 of main.cpp:
 static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60; // 10 minute blocks

* 1440 minutes in a day, divided by 10:
* 144 blocks a day (diff retargets every 6 blocks, so lets say 147 blocks/day just for arguments sake, perfect timing like an optical distributor).
* one block has 40 coins, times 0.00192500btc per coin making each block worth 0.077btc/block.
* 0.077btc per block times 147 blocks a day - means the chain is worth 11.319btc/day for mining alone.

we dont even need to know the proper bitcoin/scrypt derivative (2^32 vs 2^48 vs ..) difficulty algorithm. why?

* average hashrate of 2800mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* world hashrate of 7000mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* we assume approximately 40% of the blocks will be found by suprnova (more if ocminer uses candy).

so 11.319btc/day times 0.40 equals 4.52btc/day via suprnova.

* since we know that suprnova has 2800mh, we can slot out figure in there (lets say that your uncle was ec2 and you managed 20mh).
* = (20 / 2800) * 4.52btc/day = 0.03228571btc a day mined all day

yes, its not 100% accurate.
blocks are found early/late, orphaned.
certain types of pools dont let others know when theyve found blocks, in a timely fashion.

the best part? this is probably grade 5/6 arithmetic.
dont forget your lunchbox.

(regarding ragging on djm34's miner, feel free to drag your memory clock all the way down to 150mhz and take note of the results, hint on GPU: run more threads than you would normally... x2 or x3)

[bensam1231]

Everything aside, this coin has acquired too much 'hype' for the relaunch and people can't figure out profitability because Whattomine hasn't made a calculator so they're all mining blind and assuming it'll pan out.

line 2233 of main.cpp:
 static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60; // 10 minute blocks

* 1440 minutes in a day, divided by 10:
* 144 blocks a day (diff retargets every 6 blocks, so lets say 147 blocks/day just for arguments sake, perfect timing like an optical distributor).
* one block has 40 coins, times 0.00192500btc per coin making each block worth 0.077btc/block.
* 0.077btc per block times 147 blocks a day - means the chain is worth 11.319btc/day for mining alone.

we dont even need to know the proper bitcoin/scrypt derivative (2^32 vs 2^48 vs ..) difficulty algorithm. why?

* average hashrate of 2800mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* world hashrate of 7000mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* we assume approximately 40% of the blocks will be found by suprnova (more if ocminer uses candy).

so 11.319btc/day times 0.40 equals 4.52btc/day via suprnova.

* since we know that suprnova has 2800mh, we can slot out figure in there (lets say that your uncle was ec2 and you managed 20mh).
* = (20 / 2800) * 4.52btc/day = 0.03228571btc a day mined all day

yes, its not 100% accurate.
blocks are found early/late, orphaned.
certain types of pools dont let others know when theyve found blocks, in a timely fashion.

the best part? this is probably grade 5/6 arithmetic.
dont forget your lunchbox.

(regarding ragging on djm34's miner, feel free to drag your memory clock all the way down to 150mhz and take note of the results, hint on GPU: run more threads than you would normally... x2 or x3)

That's neat. You totally pwned me with your proud math skilzz... all the while forgetting that at no point did I say I'm currently mining this coin nor did I say I couldn't figure out profit estimations.

The double and triple instance trick has been kicking around the ccminer thread for the last year.

Have a nice day eth-baby.

[barrysty1e]

Everything aside, this coin has acquired too much 'hype' for the relaunch and people can't figure out profitability because Whattomine hasn't made a calculator so they're all mining blind and assuming it'll pan out.

line 2233 of main.cpp:
 static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60; // 10 minute blocks

* 1440 minutes in a day, divided by 10:
* 144 blocks a day (diff retargets every 6 blocks, so lets say 147 blocks/day just for arguments sake, perfect timing like an optical distributor).
* one block has 40 coins, times 0.00192500btc per coin making each block worth 0.077btc/block.
* 0.077btc per block times 147 blocks a day - means the chain is worth 11.319btc/day for mining alone.

we dont even need to know the proper bitcoin/scrypt derivative (2^32 vs 2^48 vs ..) difficulty algorithm. why?

* average hashrate of 2800mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* world hashrate of 7000mh on suprnova's xzc pool
* we assume approximately 40% of the blocks will be found by suprnova (more if ocminer uses candy).

so 11.319btc/day times 0.40 equals 4.52btc/day via suprnova.

* since we know that suprnova has 2800mh, we can slot out figure in there (lets say that your uncle was ec2 and you managed 20mh).
* = (20 / 2800) * 4.52btc/day = 0.03228571btc a day mined all day

yes, its not 100% accurate.
blocks are found early/late, orphaned.
certain types of pools dont let others know when theyve found blocks, in a timely fashion.

the best part? this is probably grade 5/6 arithmetic.
dont forget your lunchbox.

(regarding ragging on djm34's miner, feel free to drag your memory clock all the way down to 150mhz and take note of the results, hint on GPU: run more threads than you would normally... x2 or x3)

That's neat. You totally pwned me with your proud math skilzz... all the while forgetting that at no point did I say I'm currently mining this coin nor did I say I couldn't figure out profit estimations.

The double and triple instance trick has been kicking around the ccminer thread for the last year.

Have a nice day eth-baby.

this was a response to all 
thats fantastic, but in regards to djm34's amd miner specifically.

i find being critical works best if you bring something to the table.

[icelove]

with default setting sgminer -a lyra2z -o stratum+tcp://xzc.suprnova.cc:1569 -u username.workername -p x
RX480 only get 25k? but i5-3570 more than 200k. 

[SalimNagamato]

i minted 50 zerocoins about 100 blocks ago
and now the list in zerocoin tab in QT is empty, so i can't spend them
coins gone forever ?

[giagge]

@ocminer :

Check your pool offline more times .

[AngusCanine]

with default setting sgminer -a lyra2z -o stratum+tcp://xzc.suprnova.cc:1569 -u username.workername -p x
RX480 only get 25k? but i5-3570 more than 200k. 

i have to snicker a little (CPUs are better) good for me

[duboisi]

@ocminer :

Check your pool offline more times .

Also a lot of "Stratum authorize answer id is not correct" and "Stratum authorization failed".

[joblo]

Since I have been critical, I just brought something to the table.

cpuminer-opt-3.5.6 is relased.

Lyra2Z is 12% faster on AVX2 as well as adding AVX optimizations missing from other forks,
and other improvements.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1326803.0

[ocminer]

@ocminer :

Check your pool offline more times .

Also a lot of "Stratum authorize answer id is not correct" and "Stratum authorization failed".

Yeah sorry some folks are attacking the pool the whole day, I'm trying to keep it up