🔶 YOLOdice.com 🔶 suspended on 16st Mar 2021

[Timetwister]

So, finally the investing is open again!

one-week 0% dilution fee

Yep, I've enabled investing a few minutes ago.

1. Right now you can invest in BTC, LTC and DOGE. ETH is coming soon.

2. Commission is based on wagered amounts (expected profit), not pure profit. The commission is 50% of the expected profit, so it's 0.5 BTC from every 100 BTC wagered (it's 0.5% of the wagered amount) is taken from the bankroll "live" (as bets happen). This means
  - no "commission runs" - the commission is taken in real time, which means your investments value is what you get when you close it,
  - if players lose more than "expected 1% of wagered", it's investors' gain

3. There will be new "dilution fee" of 1% or 2% (still not decided), but it will be enabled in a week (on 2020-04-16). If you invest now, you pay 0% dilution fee, but you'll receive your dilution profit from all investments opened after 2020-04-16.

4. There is no "leverage"  this time - the amount you invest translates directly to your share. It's so much simpler now.

5. During the competitions we'll pause your investments so that we can do "50% of site profit goes to prize pool".

Links:
- FAQ on investing: https://yolodice.com#faq/investing
- Investor stats: https://yolodice.com#stats/investor
- Investor panel: https://yolodice.com#invest

If you have any questions I'll be happy to answer them.

Take care and cheers!
Ethan

GREAT! I'm so happy investing is back.

[1714920379]

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[1714920379]

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[Reid]

There it goes.
Thanks Ethan for the update.

I will inform other members about this since most of them are looking for this from different gambling sites which have none or don't have the reputation like Yolodice have.

[FatFork]

This is really good news from YOLOdice. Thanks Ethan!
Hope the investment attracts new players as well.

[ethan_nx]

is this serious, especially #5?

Yes, it's serious. A word of explanation: a paused investment will just be "frozen" - it will retain it's exact value, but will not participate in the bankroll and profits. An investor could still close the investment and cash out anytime.

I think this is the only reasonable way to run competitions where we share profits with the players (like: 50% of site profits goes to the prize pool), unless anyone has any other idea?

Cheers,
Ethan

[Timetwister]

I see investing doesn't give experience points anymore. Is that a mistake or intentional?

[joksim299]

I see investing doesn't give experience points anymore. Is that a mistake or intentional?

Most likely Ethan forgot about it. I don't see why would not it give XP points.

[wontshrug]

i've been a big investor in the past, but your new terms just seem opportunistic and desperate, which doesnt make any sense since your cost basis shouldnt be that high, and you're up quite a bit since shutting down investments. reminds me a lot of what BK tried prior to their IPO and inevitable downfall. you are picking and choosing the best action, and taking 50% EV on every other bet placed and passing the risk on to us, while removing leverage and adding a dilution fee that removes the ability to make the investments liquid. there's a 0% chance this is a "better deal" for investors, so to try to market it as such sends alarm bells ringing off

GL, but I'll be out this time around

[Naida_BR]

It is good to see another casino being again on the investment environment for their users.
However, it is not preferable to see that you are opening and closing the investment window. It shows to me a lot of instability and it makes me think that the profits of the casino has been dropped and because of that you accept investments of regular users again.

[FinneysTrueVision]

I see investing doesn't give experience points anymore. Is that a mistake or intentional?

Most likely Ethan forgot about it. I don't see why would not it give XP points.

It was done intentionally. They also removed the ability to earn XP from referring users. The website specifically says that the only way to get XP is from wagering.

[darewaller]

The commission used to be 35% of the profit before, but honestly since it was tied to the profit, it was quite unstable for us - most of the costs are wager-based. I think what we have now is a better solution.

I also hope that that the real site profit will be higher than expected 1%. In such case all the extra profit goes to investors. On the other hand, you are right - when players win the commission is still taken.

Cheers,
Ethan

Yeah this one looks a lot better and sustainable, considering you guys probably thought this over during this pandemic times it shows that you really considered all the possibilities that it could go wrong and decided that you trust people losing more money than the house average so you wouldn't really go bankrupt this time when you are giving all the profits instead.

With an house edge percentage on the wagering you are both making sure that you are giving people less than the expected house edge average but also if someone loses more you are going to be profiting from it, all of which would obviously go to defending the people who will earn more than the house edge but in the long term I suspect they can't be all that much, after all there is a reason why its said that "house always wins".

[Timetwister]

5. During the competitions we'll pause your investments so that we can do "50% of site profit goes to prize pool".

About this, I'd like my bankroll to still be used during wagering competitions.

[Kiritsugu]

5. During the competitions we'll pause your investments so that we can do "50% of site profit goes to prize pool".

About this, I'd like my bankroll to still be used during wagering competitions.

If he did that though, we wouldn't be able to do the "50% of site profit goes to prize pool" thing, because he'd be taking profits from your investment (which would be silly).  I think it has to be one or the other, he can't do both.  And as a player myself, I would prefer having profits added to the prize pools.

[finity]

Yep, I've enabled investing a few minutes ago.

Great to see this, wanted to invest in a solid dice site for some time now. Took a detailed look at you platform, everything seems solid.

One question, in the provably fair, you use the very secure HMAC-SHA512 to generate the rolls - this is the industry standard. However, the hash of the seed is displayed with SHA256. Would it not be more prudent to standardize the hash in all cases to the more secure SHA512 algorithm? Better safe than sorry...

Indeed that is peculiar. Especially given the fact that all bitcoin miners can be re-purposed to try and brute-force sha256 hashes, I would expect it to be used less. Seems like a potential weak point of the provably fair algo.

[Timetwister]

5. During the competitions we'll pause your investments so that we can do "50% of site profit goes to prize pool".

About this, I'd like my bankroll to still be used during wagering competitions.

If he did that though, we wouldn't be able to do the "50% of site profit goes to prize pool" thing, because he'd be taking profits from your investment (which would be silly).  I think it has to be one or the other, he can't do both.  And as a player myself, I would prefer having profits added to the prize pools.

I don't understand. Why can't bankroll be paused only in some specific competitions?

[justdimin]

The commission used to be 35% of the profit before, but honestly since it was tied to the profit, it was quite unstable for us - most of the costs are wager-based. I think what we have now is a better solution.

I also hope that that the real site profit will be higher than expected 1%. In such case all the extra profit goes to investors. On the other hand, you are right - when players win the commission is still taken.

Cheers,
Ethan

Yeah this one looks a lot better and sustainable, considering you guys probably thought this over during this pandemic times it shows that you really considered all the possibilities that it could go wrong and decided that you trust people losing more money than the house average so you wouldn't really go bankrupt this time when you are giving all the profits instead.

With an house edge percentage on the wagering you are both making sure that you are giving people less than the expected house edge average but also if someone loses more you are going to be profiting from it, all of which would obviously go to defending the people who will earn more than the house edge but in the long term I suspect they can't be all that much, after all there is a reason why its said that "house always wins".

I guess if they did that it would basically be considered negative +ev for them, so it is not really all that possible for them to both give you money AND give you competition rewards at the same time? I mean they are not going to suddenly make more than house edge for a while and increase the house edge so they would give you more?

Mathematically speaking they are going to do nothing but just keep giving you the income for the investment, but as soon as competition starts they should do what they are doing in order to be able to afford it, otherwise they are not really going to stay afloat and going to lose money. It is actually a quite small break that really won't change too much of your income and the other option is actually not being able to invest so this is much better.

[finity]

Not sure about this, but it is reasonable to expect the hash of the seed to need to be more secure than the hash that generates the result. If anything, the HMAC-SHA512 for generating the result is overkill, compared to the SHA256 that is used to hash the server seed and is displayed to the user. The hash displayed to the user should considered to be more vulnerable and exposed to possible brute force, as you've mentioned.

@OP: Is there an actual technical reason for using the less secure SHA256 for the server seed, or would it be possible to standardize it to SHA512?

What are you not sure about? Bitcoin mining uses sha256, the asic hardware performs these hash calculations. You could just tell it to perform it on arbitrary inputs. But I agree, it is weird that the site uses sha512 for the case where comparatively less security is needed, and sha256 for the case where you really need to be sure of security (would expect the opposite, if nothing else).

[yannik.biz]

yiha i made a investement yesterday when i go to sleep and now when i weak up i have

Total profits −20.16049685 DOGE

 

[HeRetiK]

What are you not sure about? Bitcoin mining uses sha256, the asic hardware performs these hash calculations. You could just tell it to perform it on arbitrary inputs. [...]

Luckily you can't repurpose SHA-256 ASIC miners like that:

See they [ASIC Miners] don't even do that. They don't complete the double sha and don't return the hash at the end, only nonces that meet targets. So they really are useless.

(Quoted from ckolivas, developer and maintainer of cgminer so that guy knows his stuff)


Good question why YOLOdice are using SHA-256 over SHA-512 though.

yiha i made a investement yesterday when i go to sleep and now when i weak up i have

Total profits −20.16049685 DOGE

 

Welcome to the volatility of crypto casino investment!

[yoloer808]

What are you not sure about? Bitcoin mining uses sha256, the asic hardware performs these hash calculations. You could just tell it to perform it on arbitrary inputs. [...]

Luckily you can't repurpose SHA-256 ASIC miners like that:

See they [ASIC Miners] don't even do that. They don't complete the double sha and don't return the hash at the end, only nonces that meet targets. So they really are useless.

(Quoted from ckolivas, developer and maintainer of cgminer so that guy knows his stuff)

Yeah I thought something like that would be the case. Good to know, thanks.

Good question why YOLOdice are using SHA-256 over SHA-512 though.

Suppose it is just an oversight that has historically been there but no one had noticed till now.

[buwaytress]

Oh just realised you guys switched the offering back on. Didn't scroll back too much to read, but it appears that the earlier decision to remove the bankroll investments were to grow. Care to share what the experience was? Or was the sample period too small? Also noteworthy that interest and activity to tend to ebb and flow with btc price, and we know what that's been like in March!