Problems with bitcoin-24.com WARNING! UPDATE!

[2weiX]

lemme get this straight, you filed your own claim against btc24?
on grounds of fraud?
and its still open?

no, I didn't.
I filed a claim for release of my funds, for documentational reasons only (to stake my claim, so to speak).

If I wanted to get a title, I would've had to file against Simon, which I refused to do since I did not want to be instrumentalized by the powers that be to make an unwarranted case against him. I do not believe that Simone is a fraud, I believe he's an enthusiast in way over his head. Thus, accusing him of fraud would have been extremely foul play.

Filing a claim against the Ltd would've been of no use (since, LOL, it's "Limited" status).

It is interesting, though, that the DA forces you to file against Simon when I would have *wanted* to file against the Berlin and Polish DA for unlawful seizure of my funds or something.

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[bernard75]

Filing a claim against the Ltd would've been of no use (since, LOL, it's "Limited" status).

My bad, BTC24 and Simon became synonymous for me.

It is interesting, though, that the DA forces you to file against Simon when I would have *wanted* to file against the Berlin and Polish DA for unlawful seizure of my funds or something.

Thats one of the downsides of Europe, you cant sue the DA for whatever they have dreamed up.

And even though i still dont understand the claim, we are pretty much on the same page.

[2weiX]

Filing a claim against the Ltd would've been of no use (since, LOL, it's "Limited" status).

My bad, BTC24 and Simon became synonymous for me.

It is interesting, though, that the DA forces you to file against Simon when I would have *wanted* to file against the Berlin and Polish DA for unlawful seizure of my funds or something.

Thats one of the downsides of Europe, you cant sue the DA for whatever they have dreamed up.

And even though i still dont understand the claim, we are pretty much on the same page.

the claim was, simply put:

"i have X€ on bitcoin-24s account #xyz. I have used these usernames and the accounts had these bank accounts as withdrawal targets. please free up the money."

just to make sure that I said it's mine first.

[bernard75]

So it is a claim based on fraud. You are in the eye of the law "claiming" he doesnt want to pay you out.
And in laymans terms Simons lawyer is saying "We would like to, but we cant".
Case closed.
 

[2weiX]

So it is a claim based on fraud. You are in the eye of the law "claiming" he doesnt want to pay you out.
And in laymans terms Simons lawyer is saying "We would like to, but we cant".
Case closed.
 

no.

I only made a claim.


to actually make that claim effective (and receive a title), I would have to go after Simon, and the only way to do that is accusing him of fraud, which he clearly didnt commit. so there.

[legitnick]

From what I heard in this thread stay away from Bitcoin-24.com

[bernard75]

How can anybody not stay away from it?
Its closed.

[positivelybitcoin]

Thanks for the warning. It sounds like something PayPal would do.

[Kj1]

New Statement: http://buff.ly/19VZE47
Neues Statement: http://buff.ly/19VZCct

[michalko]

For those having Gmail and money frozen with Bitcoin-24 check your SPAM folder.

Their lawyers sent me email on 10th June but it went to spam folder, I realized only yesterday.

[fydel]

Any news by now?

I have read on kuttlers blog that some ppl received their fiat money. But only if the fiat wasn't used for trading.
I still have around 3k € there.

Any recommandations what I can do instead of just waiting?

Will filing a claim cost me money?

[bernard75]

I have read on kuttlers blog that some ppl received their fiat money. But only if the fiat wasn't used for trading.

And more importantly paid to the Commerzbank account, which was ope for 3 days only.

[fydel]

I have read on kuttlers blog that some ppl received their fiat money. But only if the fiat wasn't used for trading.

And more importantly paid to the Commerzbank account, which was ope for 3 days only.

Oh. Yes of course. I did forgot that. Thank you for adding.

[threedrules]

the site says next update is on 11th of july

[bernard75]

So the new update sux!
I have been a vivid supporter of Simon until now, actually i still am, but his lawyers latest statement just makes me mad.
It basically says "There are few a few black sheep and because of them nobody will receive their money back in the foreseeable future. Oh and btw dont wait for any updates."
Also this was known to them for a long time and they didnt inform their customers.

I am considering hiring a real lawyer(cause theirs apparently isnt), who will get us some clarification.
And just to be clear, i am not looking to go after Simon, but rather the authorities.
Please PM me if you are ready to do so, too.

[apetersson]

this is not looking too good.
apparently some of the polish funds will remain seized.
after they have been identified the "black sheep" will not recieve euros. fine. so what will happen if a so-called back sheep has sold his ill-gotten money for bitcoins and already withdrew them? bitcoins have already been paid out.

who is going to take the loss?

[bernard75]

who do you think?
and if i would be washing cash thru btc24, i would get it out asap

[Beutelschneider]

...
after they have been identified the "black sheep" will not recieve euros. fine. so what will happen if a so-called back sheep has sold his ill-gotten money for bitcoins and already withdrew them? bitcoins have already been paid out.

who is going to take the loss?

That's why the BTC should NEVER have been paid out 'til the black sheep were separated from the white sheep and ALL banking accounts were unfrozen!

It's like sue the owner of an apartment 'cause:

-a bad guy bought stuff online with bad money (at least there must be no money involved, just order it on invoice might be enough sometimes!)
-ordered it to an apartment complex to someones apartment in the 15th floor
-waits for the deliverer and intercepts him "Oh, you got my $very_expensive_thing...i'll carry it up myself to the 15th floor, where do i have to sign?"

The owner of the apartment doesn't know anything about this, the shop got the bad money(or nothing if its paid on invoice), the deliverer did his job, the bad guy gets away with the expensive stuff if he isn't real dumb. 

[fydel]

So, the there months are over now. As Simon's attorney told us there should have been a solution by now.

@2weiX: You said you filed a claim against btc-24. How can I do that? Do I need to hire a attorney?
Any info would be greatly appreciated.

[2weiX]

So, the there months are over now. As Simon's attorney told us there should have been a solution by now.

@2weiX: You said you filed a claim against btc-24. How can I do that? Do I need to hire a attorney?
Any info would be greatly appreciated.

I didn't in the end.
Since a claim can only go against the OWNER of the company, and I didn't agree to charging him with fraud when in my eyes he didn't defraud me.

I am thinking of setting up a fund of sorts to get a class-act against the polish authorities.
I need to talk this through with my lawyers first, though.