Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[crumbcake]

Ok, Americans are awake. Here's what they're thinking?

"Hmm, looks like DHS froze Gox's american arm so no Dwolla."

"Hmm, this isn't really bad news since there's still a million ways to get money in/out of a variety of exchanges, and the liquidity argument is a chicken/egg problem. If I need to get money out of Gox I'll just send the BTC to US-based CampBX and have them send me a money order or ACH transfer. Or I'll just sell the bitcoins OTC to my pal Joey; I heard he wants some."

"Hmm, looks like a bunch of idiots panic-sold last night on what was just another case of TPTB fucking with bitcoin exchanges. What are they trying to do, let the terrorists win or something? It's not like government regulation is effective at successfully reducing demand, especially with distributed systems. Man these folks are tools."

"Oh, looks like price rebounded partway so I can just pretend like nothing happened; except that something did: Bitcoin proved itself to be more resilient to classic 'TPBT Fucking with Exchange' attacks."

SCORE
Bitcoin: +1
DHS: 0

 

Ugly American here, and my thoughts go something like this:
"Hmm, the boards are divided into 2 camps:  FUDs screaming the sky finally is falling, and the Bitcoin faithful, twisting *obviously  bad news* into another win for bitcoin.  I'll just stock up on twinkies and wait."

[Coinseeker]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

You should tread softly, Coinseeker.  Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots.  If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched.  If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise.  

You know, it's funny you say that.  I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are so anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible.  And that's bad.  Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same.  The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best.  Out of sight, out of mind.  

In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist.  I think many just need a hug.  

[crumbcake]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

You should tread softly, Coinseeker.  Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots.  If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched.  If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise.  

You know, it's funny you say that.  I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible.  And that's bad.  Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same.  The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best.  Out of sight, out of mind.  

In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist.  I think many just need a hug. 

I'm sure IRL most of them are just fine.  It's a weird situation here, and the timing is bad.  Bad news -- people get sensitized & edgy.  My own dog snapped at me when he was really hurt.

[Coinseeker]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

You should tread softly, Coinseeker.  Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots.  If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched.  If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise.  

You know, it's funny you say that.  I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible.  And that's bad.  Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same.  The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best.  Out of sight, out of mind.  

In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist.  I think many just need a hug. 

I'm sure IRL most of them are just fine.  It's a weird situation here, and the timing is bad.  Bad news -- people get sensitized & edgy.  My own dog snapped at me when he was really hurt.

Not a one of us is perfect...we all fall short, especially me.  But there is no excuse for treating people outside of how you want to be treated, so please don't try to justify it.  It's only money.

[BitPirate]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

You should tread softly, Coinseeker.  Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots.  If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched.  If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise.  

You know, it's funny you say that.  I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible.  And that's bad.  Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same.  The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best.  Out of sight, out of mind.  

In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist.  I think many just need a hug. 

I'm sure IRL most of them are just fine.  It's a weird situation here, and the timing is bad.  Bad news -- people get sensitized & edgy.  My own dog snapped at me when he was really hurt.

Not a one of us is perfect...we all fall short, especially me.  But there is no excuse for treating people outside of how you want to be treated, so please don't try to justify it.  It's only money.

Finally, a point we can agree on :-)

[Coinseeker]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

You should tread softly, Coinseeker.  Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots.  If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched.  If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise.  

You know, it's funny you say that.  I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible.  And that's bad.  Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same.  The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best.  Out of sight, out of mind.  

In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist.  I think many just need a hug.  

I'm sure IRL most of them are just fine.  It's a weird situation here, and the timing is bad.  Bad news -- people get sensitized & edgy.  My own dog snapped at me when he was really hurt.

Not a one of us is perfect...we all fall short, especially me.  But there is no excuse for treating people outside of how you want to be treated, so please don't try to justify it.  It's only money.

Finally, a point we can agree on :-)

Then it was absolutely all worth it my friend.   Cheers!

[thoughtfan]

...where as [sic] Bitcoin is in violation of the laws of nearly every country.


...followed by post after post of people banging their heads against a brick wall trying to explain to Coinseeker that virtually all of the premises behind his ludicrous statement are untrue.  I think he's sort-of got most of it by now but it would help if people actually made a little effort (Google is your friend) to understand what they're talking about before just coming out with baseless rubbish.

I'll try Reddit!

Awww....does it bother you that I don't blindly follow internet rhetoric.

wtf are you talking about.  To the extent I was 'bothered' it was disappointment that a thread that has mostly for the 6 months or so I've been following and participating in it had at least something of substantive value in a few pages of posts was dominated by people trying to explain stuff to you you could have found out quite easily yourself by doing a little research.  In the first instance your claim 'Bitcoin is in violation of the laws of nearly every country' illustrates plainly you neither understand bitcoin nor law.

It is not that people don't welcome a difference of opinion.  Did you actually notice how many people who know what they are talking about generously gave explanations far beyond what the initial ignorant statement deserved?  No, you come out with some 'blindly follow internet rhetoric' bs.  wtf?!

At least I have the intelligence to be open to facts as they are presented, where most on this site are so ideologically dug in, that the only "facts" they see are the ones they have created in their own minds.

Starting with the continuing delusion that Bitcoin is immune to governmental intervention.  

Wow, you really don't get it do you?!  Nobody that I could see in the responses given to you was trying to claim 'Bitcoin is immune to governmental intervention' - if I'm mistaken please find and quote - rather patiently trying to explain things to you such as what 'legal tender' is.

And for you, who made the statement about Bitcoin being illegal to accuse others of seeing "only 'facts' they have created in their own minds" is hill-fucking-larious    Intelligence?  If you showed a tiny bit of evidence you have any you wouldn't have to protest so loudly how intelligent you are  

Edit:  looks like I was late with my rant - it appears the rest of you have kissed and made up.  I'll leave this post though because I believe it was deserved even if it does make me out to be the nasty angry one

[ChartBuddy]

[Coinseeker]

...where as [sic] Bitcoin is in violation of the laws of nearly every country.


...followed by post after post of people banging their heads against a brick wall trying to explain to Coinseeker that virtually all of the premises behind his ludicrous statement are untrue.  I think he's sort-of got most of it by now but it would help if people actually made a little effort (Google is your friend) to understand what they're talking about before just coming out with baseless rubbish.

I'll try Reddit!

Awww....does it bother you that I don't blindly follow internet rhetoric.

wtf are you talking about.  To the extent I was 'bothered' it was disappointment that a thread that has mostly for the 6 months or so I've been following and participating in it had at least something of substantive value in a few pages of posts was dominated by people trying to explain stuff to you you could have found out quite easily yourself by doing a little research.  In the first instance your claim 'Bitcoin is in violation of the laws of nearly every country' illustrates plainly you neither understand bitcoin nor law.

It is not that people don't welcome a different of opinion.  Did you actually notice how many people who know what they are talking about generously gave explanations far beyond what the initial ignorant statement deserved?  No, you come out with some 'blindly follow internet rhetoric' bs.  wtf?!

At least I have the intelligence to be open to facts as they are presented, where most on this site are so ideologically dug in, that the only "facts" they see are the ones they have created in their own minds.

Starting with the continuing delusion that Bitcoin is immune to governmental intervention.  

Wow, you really don't get it do you?!  Nobody that I could see in the responses given to you was trying to claim 'Bitcoin is immune to governmental intervention' - if I'm mistaken please find and quote - rather patiently trying to explain things to you such as what 'legal tender' is.

And for you, who made the statement about Bitcoin being illegal to accuse others of seeing "only 'facts' they have created in their own minds" is hill-fucking-larious    Intelligence?  If you showed a tiny bit of evidence you have any you wouldn't have to protest so loudly how intelligent you are  

Edit:  looks like I was late with my rant - it appears the rest of you have kissed and made up.  I'll leave this post though because I believe it was deserved even if it does make me out to be the nasty angry one

Actually it became a legal discussion that only one point was proven false.  That Bitcoin itself was illegal.  That based on the info provided, was false.  Totally fine.  I conceded that.  The rest of the pages were about the other legal ramifications of Bitcoin transactions so your generalization that pages and pages was dedicated to one point, is not entirely accurate.  And Bitcoin transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are in fact illegal.  Now, unless you have something to refute that claim, your rant is only partially relevant.

But you are right in the fact that we have been off topic for way too long so, let me go wake up DHS and get their butts in gear.  They have a Bitcoin price to crash for me.  

[HerrDoktor]

See this ? 

http://www.kirche-in-not.de/files/2009/09/berliner-mauer.jpg

[thoughtfan]

...Bitcoin transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are in fact illegal...

All transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are illegal.  What's that got to do with Bitcoin?

[Coinseeker]

...Bitcoin transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are in fact illegal...

All transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are illegal.  What's that got to do with Bitcoin?

[BitPirate]

Anyway, a bit of perspective...



Wasn't really even a blip, was it? Much less deep, although admittedly much less decisive than the blockchain fork even in March.

This plateau we've been experiencing actually reminds me a lot of that time, just on a slightly longer timescale.

The price could admittedly do anything, but as time goes on, a continuing crash does appear to be increasingly unlikely. Even if volume is weak and we hold at around $110 - $115 for another couple of weeks, any downtrend will be pretty much broken.

[Terpie]

...Bitcoin transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are in fact illegal...

All transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are illegal.  What's that got to do with Bitcoin?

To be more accurate, all transactions MAY require you to report the income/loss from that transaction, annually. Technically, if your baseball card increases in value from $1 to $1,000 and you realize that value in a sale, then that's reportable income. Bitcoin is no different. (USA)

[samson]

Anyway, a bit of perspective...



Wasn't really even a blip, was it? Much less deep, although admittedly much less decisive than the blockchain fork even in March.

This plateau we've been experiencing actually reminds me a lot of that time, just on a slightly longer timescale.

The price could admittedly do anything, but as time goes on, a continuing crash does appear to be increasingly unlikely. Even if volume is weak and we hold at around $110 - $115 for another couple of weeks, any downtrend will be pretty much broken.

It could be moving further under the long term trendline by staying still.

If it stays at this price for too long that trendline will be invalidated.

[thoughtfan]

...Bitcoin transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are in fact illegal...

All transactions that avoid paying applicable taxes are illegal.  What's that got to do with Bitcoin?

To be more accurate, all transactions MAY require you to report the income/loss from that transaction, annually. Technically, if your baseball card increases in value from $1 to $1,000 and you realize that value in a sale, then that's reportable income. Bitcoin is no different. (USA)

From what I understand, whether it gets reported as 'income' or as a 'capital gain' may depend on your jurisdiction.  My accountant's advice in the UK to me is that it becomes taxable as a capital gain only if and when the realised gain is more than £10,000 p/a.  Of course this may change because as Coinseeker correctly says it is still a gray area.

[fitty]

Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.

And here comes the name calling.  Ah...yes.  The height of supreme intelligence.    Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names.  I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions?  Segregationist?  

Wanting the price to drop? You're trying to make the price drop by spreading FUD. You're pulling shit out of your ass that has no basis in reality, you're scrambling for negative talking points, and as I said before, you're clearly autistic. Since you're in denial, here's a quick recap.

-The only reason the prices have reached +100...is because of speculative greed.  Nothing more, nothing less.

-Definitely not over.  It's just beginning.  Interesting to see how many coins the manipulators, who are trying to prop things up, are willing to lose. 

-Using Homeland Secuity, also means the U.S. could theoretically have a drone hovering over MtGox by morning.

-Momentum is too strong.  Double digits...here we come.  Buckle up!

-You'll see sub 100 in the next couple hours or so.  Maybe less.  Especially as people who don't sit and watch this forum or the markets get home and realize they are losing big $$$ and are caught in a firestorm.

-I think it's a virtual currency and I've been tell ya'll this was going to happen but you're blinded by ideology

-The biggest piece most of you fail to see and even I didn't see this coming, was they used Homeland security, NOT, the Justice Dept.  Homeland security has all kinds of freedoms to do whatever they want in the name of "fighting terror."  This is really bad...

-This is a STATEMENT from the US Government to Bitcoin.  My advice being a US citizen and knowing the reach of the USG...Sell NOW or forever hold your piece.  This is going to get worse as the news reaches mainstream media.  By then, it will be too late.

-Coinage Act of 1965, Section 102 states: “All coins and currencies of the United States (including Federal Reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal Reserve banks and national banking associations), regardless of when coined or issued, shall be legal tender for all debts, public and private, public charges, taxes, duties, and dues.” Only United States currencies (including Federal Reserve Notes) are currently legal tender in the US. Keyword being LEGAL tender. 

-If you're not paying taxes on those transactions, it's illegal.  That's cut and dry.

-that means you have to define BTC as an actual currency and using an alternate currency is against the law in the US.

-sending anonymous payments to anonymous users, tax free, and/or using an alternate currency within those borders is absolutely a violation of law. 

-All they have to do is block the flow of fiat in and out, and BTC's becomes worthless.  How some people are waking up trying to hold on to these delusions is simply amazing.  I call it denial.

-I hope DHS rains fire in the morning.  Cheap coins for all!

-a business can not accept a foriegn currency.  It can only deal in US legal tender.  It's not illegal to possess them, but to spend them in the US, on US goods and services is a clear violation of US policy.

My favorite was when you brought up the Coinage Act of 1965. We get it, you're waiting to buy back in. You don't have to spam the forum going all negative nancy. You want cheap coins, that's cool. Bitcoin is going to crash, we get it. Kindly STFU now.

[deathcode]

It is a lucrative investment, I must say.  


On a related note... how the hell did we not pass below $100?
$102.96 is a little... anticlimatic.

you seem smart... you should review the patterns... 55, 79, 103... We are crashing up dude! sorry but you won't see coins at lower prices... sad you missed the boat tho... I think you can jump in now and maybe in two years you'll see rewards

[Beta-coiner1]

The one thing I've noticed concerning this issue is that it is almost like Bitfloor even though the circumstance is different.The freezing of assets in some form in the US is not really a good thing for acceptance.It makes me wonder how Coinlabs would have survived if it had opened for business.

[thoughtfan]

Anyway, a bit of perspective...



Wasn't really even a blip, was it? Much less deep, although admittedly much less decisive than the blockchain fork even in March.

This plateau we've been experiencing actually reminds me a lot of that time, just on a slightly longer timescale.

The price could admittedly do anything, but as time goes on, a continuing crash does appear to be increasingly unlikely. Even if volume is weak and we hold at around $110 - $115 for another couple of weeks, any downtrend will be pretty much broken.

It could be moving further under the long term trendline by staying still.

If it stays at this price for too long that trendline will be invalidated.

Sorry, I'm in a picky mood today but if a trendline shows what has been how can it be 'invalidated'?  Given that no trendline goes on forever surely the trendline just shows what was going on up until the point the price went outside of it, at which point it no longer applies past that point.

If on the other hand a trendline is being used to predict future then I'm afraid my TA-sceptic stance is that it is invalid even when market prices with time happen to fall within it.  Just my thoughts on the matter