-- Miner's Official Coin LAUNCH - NUGGETS (NUGS) --

[ohiwastedmylif]

$$
____________

I think you fail to realize exactly what crypto is, and how it completely devastates the existing monetary infrastructure. The individuals who you believe are going to adopt this currency, and enact new monetary policy, would never do so. By doing so, they will directly disrupt their own highly controlled, highly profitable, and immobile ecosystem. Right now they have profitability, and control, and do not need any other source of disruption to their income.

I do not know what 'top' school you went to, names are not everything. I highly suggest you go back to school and take a class on high technological innovation. look to the past and see what has worked, learn from the past and see what has failed.

Ahahhahahaaa ha.  


A nice hard fork and the gov turns your secure and secret a bitcoin into the dollar only they have full control.

Man, people are so naive.  A digital currency would give the banks and the govt full control over you and everyone.  A hard fork would change the most secure and secret alt coin into their open playground.

So I don't think you know how things work.  You think it's a coincidence bitcoin belongs to no one?  How hard would it be for the president to sign a directive order to hijack bitcoin in name of natnal security and do a hard fork to see what terrorists and drug dealers are doing. Oops, there goes your secretive coin.

Man, people are so naive.  They're gonna let it go secretly cause foolish people like you actually buy into it.  Then when they take it over every privacy you have left will be gone.  You'll pay taxes on the $5 you gave your son to mow your lawn.  Ahahhahahaaa.  Man, its hard to imagine people actually are so blind.

You don't know what a hard fork is, do you?

I know MarkM know better than you.

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

Sure they can try to push their own fork, but you know what, it will go nowhere.

This is the basis of crypto.

The miners have the power, the miners choose which rules the coin follows. A coin could fork a million times, but only the one which has the general consensus / acceptance will survive.

A 'hard fork' just means a new fork which is incompatible with a previous version / fork of the coin. It does not literally mean man powering and forcing everyone onto a new set of rules.

[markm]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

[weav]

$$
____________

I think you fail to realize exactly what crypto is, and how it completely devastates the existing monetary infrastructure. The individuals who you believe are going to adopt this currency, and enact new monetary policy, would never do so. By doing so, they will directly disrupt their own highly controlled, highly profitable, and immobile ecosystem. Right now they have profitability, and control, and do not need any other source of disruption to their income.

I do not know what 'top' school you went to, names are not everything. I highly suggest you go back to school and take a class on high technological innovation. look to the past and see what has worked, learn from the past and see what has failed.

Ahahhahahaaa ha.  


A nice hard fork and the gov turns your secure and secret a bitcoin into the dollar only they have full control.

Man, people are so naive.  A digital currency would give the banks and the govt full control over you and everyone.  A hard fork would change the most secure and secret alt coin into their open playground.

So I don't think you know how things work.  You think it's a coincidence bitcoin belongs to no one?  How hard would it be for the president to sign a directive order to hijack bitcoin in name of natnal security and do a hard fork to see what terrorists and drug dealers are doing. Oops, there goes your secretive coin.

Man, people are so naive.  They're gonna let it go secretly cause foolish people like you actually buy into it.  Then when they take it over every privacy you have left will be gone.  You'll pay taxes on the $5 you gave your son to mow your lawn.  Ahahhahahaaa.  Man, its hard to imagine people actually are so blind.

You don't know what a hard fork is, do you?

I know MarkM know better than you.

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

Sure they can try to push their own fork, but you know what, it will go nowhere.

This is the basis of crypto.

The miners have the power, the miners choose which rules the coin follows. A coin could fork a million times, but only the one which has the general consensus / acceptance will survive.

A 'hard fork' just means a new fork which is incompatible with a previous version / fork of the coin. It does not literally mean man powering and forcing everyone onto a new set of rules.

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Whoever controls the majority of the network (hashpower) can dictate any protocol changes they like, effectively causing a hard fork. With bitcoin in particular (SHA-256) that's currently not even very infeasible if you do the math, given enough resources. Think investing an ASIC design and plant.

[ohiwastedmylif]

Whoever controls the majority of the network (hashpower) can dictate any protocol changes they like, effectively causing a hard fork. With bitcoin in particular (SHA-256) that's currently not even very infeasible if you do the math, given enough resources. Think investing an ASIC design and plant.

Assuming whoever wants to control it has invested an enormous amount in mining infrastructure, or has the ability to cease all other miners ability to mine. Essentially the 51% attack which has been seen many times. DDOS the main pools, lower global hash rate, fire up miners and break it.

[markm]

Hence altcoins that cannot be merged-mined.

The blockchain security more powerful than the world's supercomputers is totally bypassed, and as many scamcoins as desired can be taken over at will.

-MarkM-

[weav]

Whoever controls the majority of the network (hashpower) can dictate any protocol changes they like, effectively causing a hard fork. With bitcoin in particular (SHA-256) that's currently not even very infeasible if you do the math, given enough resources. Think investing an ASIC design and plant.

Assuming whoever wants to control it has invested an enormous amount in mining infrastructure, or has the ability to cease all other miners ability to mine. Essentially the 51% attack which has been seen many times. DDOS the main pools, lower global hash rate, fire up miners and break it.

That

[Vlad2Vlad]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

[weav]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

It's not about altering the program, that would be trivial, it is about spreading that altered program, or more precisely, making the majority of the network (hashrate) accept your changes. Which turns out isn't entirely infeasible given enough resources, particularly with SHA-256. Please try to familiarize yourself with the technical fundamentals more, you seem to lack a quite basic understanding of the underlying concepts of the system. The Bitcoin wiki is a good start.

[Vlad2Vlad]

Whoever controls the majority of the network (hashpower) can dictate any protocol changes they like, effectively causing a hard fork. With bitcoin in particular (SHA-256) that's currently not even very infeasible if you do the math, given enough resources. Think investing an ASIC design and plant.

Assuming whoever wants to control it has invested an enormous amount in mining infrastructure, or has the ability to cease all other miners ability to mine. Essentially the 51% attack which has been seen many times. DDOS the main pools, lower global hash rate, fire up miners and break it.

Thank you.  

It wouldn't hard for the govt to use all miners on the planet without you knowing it to use it as one massive cloud computer snd hijack and take over or crash and destroy any coin.  Afterall most miming rigs and ow since are online 24/7 unattended.  It would be easy for the govt to hack them all and use them for any purpose even hack and break any previously unbreakable  algos or urgent Chinese encryption.

 So much potential for the as sa a behind these seemingly games of Alt coins.  But the end game is much bigger than bashing power.  It's switching to a digital currency and for that the lasses have to lot digital money and there's only one way to do that:  give it away for free and make lots of people money.  

It's all digital anyway, it will get spent and put back in the economy and what isn't will be devalued and stolen back like gold in 1935.  It's win for the govt and lose for everyone else but if you know what's coming, you may win....for a short while c. Cause in the end there's no where to run.  Drones for everyone and implanted chips to know when and where you farted.

Ok.  Good night.  Thanks for the interesting Convo!

[AgentME]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

If the government released their own fork of bitcoin that was totally centralized, it would only have power if everyone switched to it. Short of going into everyone's houses and swapping the bitcoin program with govtcoin secretly, there's no way they can force everyone's bitcoin clients to switch to it. And no one is going to voluntarily switch.

[r3wt]

this coin is confirmed for a new exchange that is opening soon.

[AgentME]

Whoever controls the majority of the network (hashpower) can dictate any protocol changes they like, effectively causing a hard fork. With bitcoin in particular (SHA-256) that's currently not even very infeasible if you do the math, given enough resources. Think investing an ASIC design and plant.

Assuming whoever wants to control it has invested an enormous amount in mining infrastructure, or has the ability to cease all other miners ability to mine. Essentially the 51% attack which has been seen many times. DDOS the main pools, lower global hash rate, fire up miners and break it.

Thank you.  

It wouldn't hard for the govt to use all miners on the planet without you knowing it to use it as one massive cloud computer snd hijack and take over or crash and destroy any coin.  Afterall most miming rigs and ow since are online 24/7 unattended.  It would be easy for the govt to hack them all and use them for any purpose even hack and break any previously unbreakable  algos or urgent Chinese encryption.

hahahahahahaahahaha

Yes, the govt is going to hack every computer on the planet to disrupt bitcoin.

[weav]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

If the government released their own fork of bitcoin that was totally centralized, it would only have power if everyone switched to it. Short of going into everyone's houses and swapping the bitcoin program with govtcoin secretly, there's no way they can force everyone's bitcoin clients to switch to it. And no one is going to voluntarily switch.

Again, wrong. Any attacker who controls the majority of the network hashrate can dictate their protocol changes, effectively causing a hard fork. Without touching any existing programs at all. Please everybody at least get a basic understanding of the system before you engange in conspiracy theories from either stand

[ohiwastedmylif]

this coin is confirmed for a new exchange that is opening soon.

Seriously?

[r3wt]

this coin is confirmed for a new exchange that is opening soon.

Seriously?

yes, it will be added along with GIL and a few others shitcoins

[AgentME]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

If the government released their own fork of bitcoin that was totally centralized, it would only have power if everyone switched to it. Short of going into everyone's houses and swapping the bitcoin program with govtcoin secretly, there's no way they can force everyone's bitcoin clients to switch to it. And no one is going to voluntarily switch.

Again, wrong. Any attacker who controls the majority of the network hashrate can dictate their protocol changes, effectively causing a hard fork. Without touching any existing programs at all.

No one else will be on their hard fork if they don't receive the program themselves. And do you really think anyone is going to say "Wow, that govtcoin fork's blockchain is getting a lot of govtcoin blocks, I should switch to it!"?

Though an attacker with the majority of the network hashrate can make it unusable to us to try to force us to switch. But they would have to invest tons of money into their own ASICs to compete with the rest of the network. I know the government isn't efficient in its money spending choices, but I doubt they're going to spend millions to billions of dollars into disrupting Bitcoin.

[markm]

But again. hence altcoins that cannot be merged mined with bitcoin...

-MarkM-

[weav]

Mark, can the govt take over bitcoin and with a hard fork get rid of all the secrecy?  TIA.

That depends on how they or whoever else define "bitcoin".

They could try to take over the trademark, define the word to mean whatever, have you read Orwell's "1984"?

The CIA could activate the alien implant they implanted in Gavin's brain, and those that he and they implanted in the brains of other core developers, to have what the public thinks is 'bitcoin' do whatever, maybe.

But so what? We can record the block number beyond which the blockchain is corrupted by alien implant suggestions and continue on using sneakernet, blocks might take a long time to arrive by sneakernet but maybe that would lower difficulty enough Rainman could compute them for us with paper and pencil.

Maybe I should buy shares in various aluminium companies, since maybe most people will be investing in tin thinking tinfoil hats are made out of tin? Hmm but wait, that maybe means I should expect tin to go up just from that powerful name, tinfoil, used for aluminum foil? Hmm...

-MarkM-

EDIT: OMG that is the plot! Only tin blocks the mind control rays, aluminium lets them pass or maybe even amplifies them! They make tinfoil hats with aluminium now to make them NOT WORK!

Lol. Come on man.  In theory.  If the govt wanted to take over bitcoin.  Could they use a hard fork to make bitcoin totally transparent.   Totally centralized.  No more pipe dream secrecy Cause I've read a hard fork can do all that yet people act like its behind the power of the CIA.  Which I think it's childish - it's a program and what one programmer can do another team of 0hD programmers can alter and undo.  That's how it works.  Bitcoin is not I breakable. It's just a program.  A hard fork can change it completely if a powerful entity like the US government chose to do so. Am I right or not?  Enlighten these people please.  Because I lack the know how and vocabulary.  Thanks.

If the government released their own fork of bitcoin that was totally centralized, it would only have power if everyone switched to it. Short of going into everyone's houses and swapping the bitcoin program with govtcoin secretly, there's no way they can force everyone's bitcoin clients to switch to it. And no one is going to voluntarily switch.

Again, wrong. Any attacker who controls the majority of the network hashrate can dictate their protocol changes, effectively causing a hard fork. Without touching any existing programs at all.

No one else will be on their hard fork if they don't receive the program themselves. And do you really think anyone is going to say "Wow, that govtcoin fork's blockchain is getting a lot of govtcoin blocks, I should switch to it!"?

Though an attacker with the majority of the network hashrate can make it unusable to us to try to force us to switch. But they would have to invest tons of money into their own ASICs to compete with the rest of the network. I know the government isn't efficient in its money spending choices, but I doubt they're going to spend millions to billions of dollars into disrupting Bitcoin.

I'm not agreeing with Vlad's wild conspiracy theories, I'm just pointing out that such an attack is technically indeed not as infeasible as some seemed to imply.

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=248645.msg2640864#msg2640864

Also as was pointed out earlier there are several comparatively efficient potential strategies to gain >50%, invest a few $M in ASICs, run major mining pools then subvert them, subvert and/or DDoS existing pools..

[AgentME]

I'm not agreeing with Vlad's wild conspiracy theories, I'm just pointing out that such an attack is technically indeed not as infeasible as some seemed to imply.

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=248645.msg2640864#msg2640864

Also as was pointed out earlier there are several comparatively efficient potential strategies to gain >50%, invest a few $M in ASICs, run major mining pools then subvert them, subvert and/or DDoS existing pools..

I disagree with him calling that an attack to "manipulate the source code", but I can see how that sort of attack would be very damaging. I can't imagine anyone spending the money to do it though.

[weav]

I'm not agreeing with Vlad's wild conspiracy theories, I'm just pointing out that such an attack is technically indeed not as infeasible as some seemed to imply.

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=248645.msg2640864#msg2640864

Also as was pointed out earlier there are several comparatively efficient potential strategies to gain >50%, invest a few $M in ASICs, run major mining pools then subvert them, subvert and/or DDoS existing pools..

I disagree with him calling that an attack to "manipulate the source code", but I can see how that sort of attack would be very damaging. I can't imagine anyone spending the money to do it though.

Well effectively it would dictate code/protocol changes the minority of the network has to follow if they don't want to lose their coins, that's basically what "manipulate the source code" means, as jl2012 points out

Winklevoss uses the word "manipulate", which means "to influence or manage shrewdly or deviously".

And yeah I agree the effect would be very damaging, can't really imagine anybody doing it either though, given the still enormous resource requirements.