WTF Avalon? Ship the Chips!

[southerngentuk]

Yifu, please allow me to change shipping address of my batch of 10,000 chips.

That way, I can sell it to someone else without the need for escrow, as you or the website can confirm the change of shipping address.

Who wants to buy 10k chips? Ordered and paid last week of June. About 6 ~ 7 weeks ago. Fine, so they'll be late, but you still get them earlier than if you buy today.

I think TerraHash was looking to buy..

Ok guys, here's the deal. Given the current conditions (rising difficulty, Avalon uncertainty, etc.), a lot of people who ordered chips from Avalon are willing to resell their chips at cost price. This was not true a month ago or so, when we made a deal to acquire two additional orders for a premium (We never bought those orders, but only made a deal to pay a premium once they had chips in hand). We have decided to scrap those deals and instead buy chip orders from people who want to get out by selling their order for the price they paid. We have got 3 offers so far. We will re-open pre-orders after buying these.

We will keep you posted on this development.

Also, all these 3 offers are for May orders.

[deizel]

the "i'm not dead thread."

Just got off the plane, expect lots of news tomorrow.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=269950.0

[SebastianJu]

I think it is safe to assume that Yifu is not holding back the chips for the sake of the Avalon batch #3 customers, that batch is almost completed and the risk of law-suits is too great that he will gamble with it. It is highly probable that chips do not exists at this moment otherwise he would have shiped at least some quantity to stop the commotion.

Key questions is: What is the reason that Avalon doesn't have enough chips to ship? We can only try to guess, so these are few assumptions and some data to back each one:

1) Yifu doesn't have enough money to pay TMSC manfacturing the chips.
Data:
- He stated several times he doesn't control BTC address which received the payments. At the moment we assumed that he received cash in exchange for the control of it, but fact that funds are still siting on that address unspent is puzzling.

2) Yifu is not in control of Avalon design and the data needed for fabrication.
Data:
-  Members of the Avalon team had several confirmed disagreements, and even the chip designer carrying the nickname "Gridchip" was allegedly trying to find another partnership instead of Yifu's. It is also unclear how is Gridchip connected to the giant delivery of Avalon chips to Russia, it may be possible that he is in some way involved in that deal apart from the rest of the Avalon team. Could it be possible that delivery caused permanent split, and Gridchip took some data with him which is essential for chip manufacturing?

3) ... (feel free to add your own)

3) Someone bid a good amount of money to get chips fast because he didnt want to wait. Yifu gave him our chips and now waits for more chips to be created to ship them to us.

What "contract"?  Under who's jurisdiction?  What was your "valuable consideration" for this "contract" and can you prove you "paid it" and the "entity" you made this "contract" with "received it"?

Try trolling harder,
meanwhile no chips no response

Maybe someone with forum trust and reputation will start a GROUP BUY for the Chinese/USA LAWYERS and form a lawsuit?
I can do it but I live in Europe so no real point for me to do that.

I asked US-Members in my groupbuy if they know befriend lawyers that could maybe write a reminder to yifu. It looks like one ore more does have such connections but maybe its best now to wait what yifu claims in some hours first.

BitSynCom is a USA corporation, incorporated in the state of Nevada.

I don't see that entity on the website.  Possibly that was deliberate.  Is it listed once you do an account or order with them?  You can't lien or attach BTC but does the company have any assets in the US that could be frozen by lis pendens?  Since yufu is in the US the easiest route would be to serve him personally.  He might have been deliberate in publicly stating he doesn't control the BTC sent in but you might be able to depose him under oath to get some answers but the process is very long for that if he fights it.

Register yourself for the newsletter, then you will see the LLC address.

Interesting.  Presumably some % is defective. Since the chips are connected serially, one bad chip could mess up a whole board, so testing is probably pretty critical.

The chips are tested in the foundry already. Avalon isnt testing the chips. Maybe in their own miners but thats not our topic. Burnin is so sure that all chips work that he will replace broken ones out of his pocket.

[AdamKD]

I think it is safe to assume that Yifu is not holding back the chips for the sake of the Avalon batch #3 customers, that batch is almost completed and the risk of law-suits is too great that he will gamble with it. It is highly probable that chips do not exists at this moment otherwise he would have shiped at least some quantity to stop the commotion.

Key questions is: What is the reason that Avalon doesn't have enough chips to ship? We can only try to guess, so these are few assumptions and some data to back each one:

1) Yifu doesn't have enough money to pay TMSC manfacturing the chips.
Data:
- He stated several times he doesn't control BTC address which received the payments. At the moment we assumed that he received cash in exchange for the control of it, but fact that funds are still siting on that address unspent is puzzling.

2) Yifu is not in control of Avalon design and the data needed for fabrication.
Data:
-  Members of the Avalon team had several confirmed disagreements, and even the chip designer carrying the nickname "Gridchip" was allegedly trying to find another partnership instead of Yifu's. It is also unclear how is Gridchip connected to the giant delivery of Avalon chips to Russia, it may be possible that he is in some way involved in that deal apart from the rest of the Avalon team. Could it be possible that delivery caused permanent split, and Gridchip took some data with him which is essential for chip manufacturing?

3) ... (feel free to add your own)

3) Someone bid a good amount of money to get chips fast because he didnt want to wait. Yifu gave him our chips and now waits for more chips to be created to ship them to us.

Tempted to go with 3 but it's really all just speculation.  An interesting point, though, that is somewhat flimsily backed by the following piechart:

http://blockchain.info/pools

The "Unknown" is awfully big at around 19% of the network hashrate.  It comes out to be about ~70 terahash/s.

The "Unknown" can be anyone but I've only started noticing it within the last month - but that could be for other reasons.

[SebastianJu]

I think it is safe to assume that Yifu is not holding back the chips for the sake of the Avalon batch #3 customers, that batch is almost completed and the risk of law-suits is too great that he will gamble with it. It is highly probable that chips do not exists at this moment otherwise he would have shiped at least some quantity to stop the commotion.

Key questions is: What is the reason that Avalon doesn't have enough chips to ship? We can only try to guess, so these are few assumptions and some data to back each one:

1) Yifu doesn't have enough money to pay TMSC manfacturing the chips.
Data:
- He stated several times he doesn't control BTC address which received the payments. At the moment we assumed that he received cash in exchange for the control of it, but fact that funds are still siting on that address unspent is puzzling.

2) Yifu is not in control of Avalon design and the data needed for fabrication.
Data:
-  Members of the Avalon team had several confirmed disagreements, and even the chip designer carrying the nickname "Gridchip" was allegedly trying to find another partnership instead of Yifu's. It is also unclear how is Gridchip connected to the giant delivery of Avalon chips to Russia, it may be possible that he is in some way involved in that deal apart from the rest of the Avalon team. Could it be possible that delivery caused permanent split, and Gridchip took some data with him which is essential for chip manufacturing?

3) ... (feel free to add your own)

3) Someone bid a good amount of money to get chips fast because he didnt want to wait. Yifu gave him our chips and now waits for more chips to be created to ship them to us.

Tempted to go with 3 but it's really all just speculation.  An interesting point, though, that is somewhat flimsily backed by the following piechart:

http://blockchain.info/pools

The "Unknown" is awfully big at around 19% of the network hashrate.  It comes out to be about ~70 terahash/s.

Unknown are all solominers mining without a pool and cant be identified. Its not a single person.

There is, as far as i remember to read, a reseller that got many avalon chips and sells them now higher in form of miners. I wonder if he ordered his chips before us.

I hope yifu has a really good explaination. But i think he cant. There is no good reason for no communication. And he has experience how long chip production needs. I wonder what he will claim.

I did not get an answer from any of the emails i sent questions too, by the way.

[AdamKD]

Unknown are all solominers mining without a pool and cant be identified. Its not a single person.

There is, as far as i remember to read, a reseller that got many avalon chips and sells them now higher in form of miners. I wonder if he ordered his chips before us.

I hope yifu has a really good explaination. But i think he cant. There is no good reason for no communication. And he has experience how long chip production needs. I wonder what he will claim.

I did not get an answer from any of the emails i sent questions too, by the way.

Which is exactly why I wrote it's flimsy and mere speculation.  I have no idea how the piecharts are generated but there appears to be a "Unknown" and an "Other Unknown".  But yes, all speculation.

Darn .

[SebastianJu]

Unknown are all solominers mining without a pool and cant be identified. Its not a single person.

There is, as far as i remember to read, a reseller that got many avalon chips and sells them now higher in form of miners. I wonder if he ordered his chips before us.

I hope yifu has a really good explaination. But i think he cant. There is no good reason for no communication. And he has experience how long chip production needs. I wonder what he will claim.

I did not get an answer from any of the emails i sent questions too, by the way.

Which is exactly why I wrote it's flimsy and mere speculation.  I have no idea how the piecharts are generated but there appears to be a "Unknown" and an "Other Unknown".  But yes, all speculation.

Darn .

Its "other known"...

[bystander]

3) Someone bid a good amount of money to get chips fast because he didnt want to wait. Yifu gave him our chips and now waits for more chips to be created to ship them to us.

I have my suspicions that this is the case as well.  The article in TheGenesisBlock about the reseller in HK receiving many, many boxes of chips on June 25 seems to fit time-wise, though it's all speculation at this point.

[Stack]

The bullshit "announcement" was posted, btw

It's already 11:21 AM, on 8/9 in Shenzhen!

You know how it is - you've been on a long plane flight - you've been drinking free booze all flight in first class - you get back in front of your computer you've not been near for weeks due to partying, whoring and boozing in Vegas, and it's like
"Hmm PMs and emails while I've been away ... oh well, guess I better say something before I pass out so I can ignore that crap for another week ..."
Wakes up the next morning ... oh crap I said "tomorrow" in the post ... oh well no one will notice anything different if I do nothing for a few days, they're used to that from me, and I am only a PR guy, not like I know anything about hardware or software and have control over anything except delaying deliveries ... ... ...

don't you got better things to do like writing code mr. software engineer than waste time with some first-class-riding booze-drinking "pr guy" like me?

anyhow, update is live on main page. http://avalon-asics.com

[Bicknellski]

The bullshit "announcement" was posted, btw

It's already 11:21 AM, on 8/9 in Shenzhen!

You know how it is - you've been on a long plane flight - you've been drinking free booze all flight in first class - you get back in front of your computer you've not been near for weeks due to partying, whoring and boozing in Vegas, and it's like
"Hmm PMs and emails while I've been away ... oh well, guess I better say something before I pass out so I can ignore that crap for another week ..."
Wakes up the next morning ... oh crap I said "tomorrow" in the post ... oh well no one will notice anything different if I do nothing for a few days, they're used to that from me, and I am only a PR guy, not like I know anything about hardware or software and have control over anything except delaying deliveries ... ... ...

don't you got better things to do like writing code mr. software engineer than waste time with some first-class-riding booze-drinking "pr guy" like me?

anyhow, update is live on main page. http://avalon-asics.com

Sounds like Kano wants to be partying like a rock star more than he is actually concerned with the millions of dollars the community is invested here guys got no clue. As for Yifu the delays will cause Avalon to be knocked down to BFL status. Do not trust them again. Do not buy from them again. Simple solution.

[Bitcoinorama]

INTERPOL is the world’s largest international police organization, with 190 member countries including the US and China. Their role is to enable police around the world to work together to make the world a safer place. Their high-tech infrastructure of technical and operational support helps meet the growing challenges of fighting crime in the 21st century.

http://www.interpol.int/Crime-areas/Financial-crime/Fraud

http://www.interpol.int/Contact-INTERPOL

http://www.interpol.int/Member-countries/Asia-South-Pacific/China

http://www.interpol.int/Member-countries/Americas/United-States



"Advance fee fraud is when fraudsters target victims to make advance or upfront payments for goods, services and/or financial gains that do not materialise."

http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/fraud-az-advance-fee-fraud

What to do if you are a victim

If you have lost money

If you believe you are a victim of advance fee fraud, the coalition members strongly encourage you to file a complaint with your local police. If you are in the United States consider filing a complaint with the Federal Beaureau of Investigation's Internet Crime Complaint Center.

http://www.affcoalition.org/victim.html


The Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3) is a partnership between the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the National White Collar Crime Center (NW3C).

http://www.ic3.gov/default.aspx


This final link tells you how to report Internet crime that has occurred in each country including China (scroll down page for content);

http://www.consumerfraudreporting.org/reporting.php

[Bitcoinorama]

http://ia800904.us.archive.org/35/items/gov.uscourts.txed.146063/gov.uscourts.txed.146063.23.0.pdf

[Bitcoinorama]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=269950.msg2898049#msg2898049

[Ytterbium]

Interpol only looks at cases that are refered by member countries, as far as I know.

[Bitcoinorama]

Interpol only looks at cases that are refered by member countries, as far as I know.

Both the US and China are member countries.

[LaserHorse]

Strange that the majority of discourse has moved to the Incoming Avalon News thread, while our situation has not changed.  
That separate thread serves as a way to fragment the community's discussion and subsequently delay any punitive action.  The title of this thread is still 100% relevant.

The text posted @ avalon-asics.com seems intended to temporarily placate customers & 'buy more time'.
I imagine many buyers are hoping their order will be included in tentative shipments made "end of next week".  Considering BitSyncom's prior behavior, that outcome is highly unlikely.  Furthermore, there is no reason this new estimated shipping date should be trusted anymore than previous "9-10 weeks" statements.

To the best of my knowledge (please correct me if I'm mistaken):

• No new chip shipments have been made
• No orders have been refunded

BitSyncom needs our help.  They require motivation.

Thanks go to Bitcoinorama & others who have posted some legal avenues through which we can provide this motivation.  
I have begun exploring these options among others.  I encourage group buy organizers and participants to do the same.

[Vigil]

I agree Lazer Horse. We got fed some BS. It looks like he literally picked a few of the stories posted about in the thread and put those down as explanations. He has to have more precise information than what he gave.

[ampu]

Strange that the majority of discourse has moved to the Incoming Avalon News thread, while our situation has not changed.  
That separate thread serves as a way to fragment the community's discussion and subsequently delay any punitive action.  The title of this thread is still 100% relevant.

The text posted @ avalon-asics.com seems intended to temporarily placate customers & 'buy more time'.
I imagine many buyers are hoping their order will be included in tentative shipments made "end of next week".  Considering BitSyncom's prior behavior, that outcome is highly unlikely.  Furthermore, there is no reason this new estimated shipping date should be trusted anymore than previous "9-10 weeks" statements.

To the best of my knowledge (please correct me if I'm mistaken):

• No new chip shipments have been made
• No orders have been refunded

BitSyncom needs our help.  They require motivation.

Thanks go to Bitcoinorama & others who have posted some legal avenues through which we can provide this motivation.  
I have begun exploring these options among others.  I encourage group buy organizers and participants to do the same.

+1

[Vigil]

We need to know why TerraHash and others haven't united to approach Avalon regarding compensation. They agreed to have the chips within a certain time-frame from ordering, i.e., 9-10 weeks. If they did not deliver the chips by then they have not met the requirement and need to compensate for that. If their product was not time-sensitive, it would not be an issue. Avalon needs to compensate relative to the BTC loss.

[LaserHorse]

We need to know why TerraHash and others haven't united to approach Avalon regarding compensation. They agreed to have the chips within a certain time-frame from ordering, i.e., 9-10 weeks. If they did not deliver the chips by then they have not met the requirement and need to compensate for that. If their product was not time-sensitive, it would not be an issue. Avalon needs to compensate relative to the BTC loss.

I would hope group buy organizers are already communicating in private to some extent.  Unfortunately, I imagine their attempts to communicate with Bitsyncom would be just as fruitless as anyone else's.