Official Thread: AMT

[FrictionlessCoin]

The photo provided by the newbie forum participant is not just in a different address advertised by AMT, but it also shows the company name as "Advanced Mining Technology, INC". The register of the domain advancedminers.com is "Advanced Mining Technologies INC". The company name used in the invoice is "Advanced Mining Technologies INC".

Photo shows "Advanced Mining Technology"
My invoice says "Advanced Mining Technology"

Domain name entry says "Advanced Mining Technologies inc" - created 2013-09-10
The Delaware registration is "ADVANCED MINING TECHNOLOGIES INC" formed 05/29/2013

So I would think it would be conceivable that they changed their name from incorporation and domain registration to the creation of the office sign and their invoice.

Also,  I did a google for the name of the doctor on the sign "Ruth Garfield"

Here's the result:  http://www.healthgrades.com/physician/dr-ruth-garfield-2s7pl  

349 Lancaster Ave Suite D
Haverford, PA 19041

The address on AdvancedMiners.com page is:

355 Lancaster, Bldg. E1,
Haverford PA 19041

So the photo of the place is legit.   


Folks!!!! You guys are PARANOID!

I have no idea why people here are taking great pains to discredit the company.  It is bordering on ridiculous.

Sure maybe they don't answer emails or phone calls,  but they certainly are a real company with a real product.

[fryarminer]

No, that business and the others listed is at
355 West Lancaster Avenue
Haverford, PA 19041

http://goo.gl/maps/Cg3lx

You can see the styling design in the street view images, it would likely be the back right corner building.

I said that the address provided by AMT (1254 W. Chester Pike, Havertown, PA, 19083) is not the address of the entrance show in the photo provided by the new forum participant.

Correct. They moved mid December. The address is currently 355 Lancaster Ave, Havertown PA. Building E1

[RickJamesBTC]

Folks!!!! You guys are PARANOID!

I have no idea why people here are taking great pains to discredit the company.  It is bordering on ridiculous.

Sure maybe they don't answer emails or phone calls,  but they certainly are a real company with a real product.

Real companies respond to inquiries. You don't think a little paranoia is warranted with the number of scams associated with this industry so far? If you aren't paranoid, you're an idiot.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Folks!!!! You guys are PARANOID!

I have no idea why people here are taking great pains to discredit the company.  It is bordering on ridiculous.

Sure maybe they don't answer emails or phone calls,  but they certainly are a real company with a real product.

Real companies respond to inquiries. You don't think a little paranoia is warranted with the number of scams associated with this industry so far? If you aren't paranoid, you're an idiot.

I have to ask,  what percentage of hardware bitcoin manufacturers were pure scams?

TerraHash - Fail
BFL - Late.  
KNC - Good
Avalon - Delivered
AsicMiner - Delivered
Bitmain - Delivered
Bitmine - Chips tested
HashFast - Late.  Sending units out.
Cointerra - Late.  Chips in package.

who else... what hardware vendors are running a total scam?

[Puppet]

who else... what hardware vendors are running a total scam?

All the ones you didnt list. For obvious reasons, Id rather not link them, but to name just one of countless, remove spaces:
www.a s i c-t e c h n o l o g i e s.com

[FrictionlessCoin]

who else... what hardware vendors are running a total scam?

All the ones you didnt list. For obvious reasons, Id rather not link them, but to name just one of countless, remove spaces:
www.a s i c-t e c h n o l o g i e s.com

Maybe you should come up with a list? 

[YourPalToots]

It is bordering on ridiculous.

It passed over that line long ago. #tinfoilhatbrigade

[amer]

I am sorry to say but everyone who has anything positive to say here is discredited by the "5% discount to anyone who combats trolls post".

Also, paranoia comes from lack of communication, not because people are bored and want to play e-Private Investigator with Google Street Maps. If AMT would have a consistent message and delivered product, there would be customers here posting about their miners and support/performance/build quality (see other threads where companies delivered)

I get that people who "believe in AMT" want to blame the cruel, horrible troll world, but it's solved by delivering product. Taking money, not delivering and not communicating breeds all kinds of speculation. Reap what you sow.

[ISAWHIM]

Why TEK and not ____ coin..?

That was just what I would mine. As per the below thinking. (Made me what I have today.)

The pages show you profit "now"... which is only relevant if you "have coins to sell now". Also, some of those numbers are "incorrect"... showing old DIFF, to a new pumped-value, not counting block-collisions/rejects of rewards. Never mine the "top" coin... stay 2-3 coins below top... That's another solo-miner tip. Top coins return to the bottom in a few minutes. Once diff corrects and you make next to nothing for hours later.

To mine... You have to take more in to consideration. However, by the easiest terms, for SOLO, you simply want any coin that is lowest difficulty, and "greatest potential future-gain". (Lowest value now, which will rise. As opposed to a high-value coin that will just fall, or level-out, or is being pumped.)

Why lowest diff... (Exaggerated example)
BTC DIFF 1.5 billion. Time to earn 1 BTC ~ 30 days. (One block is 25x longer than 30 days = 750 days... that is if diff never changes.)

TEK DIFF 23 thousand. Time to earn 1 BTC ~ 30 days. However, in those 30 days, you will find over 843 TEK blocks, which can be instantly converted to BTC, or held until the coin value rises. It will rise, since you are now taking coins from someone, and not cashing-in yet. You are not taking shit from BTC mining BTC.)

Thus...

0 BTC, 0 BTC, 0BTC, 0BTC.... 750 days later... 25BTC (In a pool, you would only end-up with about 15BTC.)
30 TEK, 60 TEK, 90 TEK... 750 days later... 283723 TEK Worth only 20 BTC, but BTC-value now $6000/BTC = $120,000 USD... so it is as if you made that same value, for all the coins, even back when they were less.

As opposed to having cashed out at BTC values as you mine them, of $900, $1000, $580, $690, $2100, $1400, $2800, $3650, $1600, $3950, $6000... as you mined, cashing out along the way. (You get a lot less that way.)

Pools are not super difficult to setup... but difficult to maintain and operate. Needs good servers, good linux skills, and some ability to compile and code PHP, MySQL, HTML, etc... And deal with all the exploits involved with the operation of free-code. (New pools usually run into a lot of the same issues that the big ones already had to deal with, but they don't tell you how to fix it. You either just get raped yourself, or figure out how to stop being raped by the miners/exploiters. Fake shares, double withdraws, wallet breaches, user-breaches, server raiding, DDOSing, pool-hoppers.)

If you mine in pools... it is best to have a single miner in every possible pool. That is for better average luck. If you had a miner in every pool, and there were no solo-miners... you would have 100% luck, getting reward without "dry-spells", like pools normally have, that are small. However, luck doesn't matter much over time... you get the same after a year mining in one pool, or many... (Well, again, actually less, because they don't give you all the actual rewards.)

[Biomech]

I am sorry to say but everyone who has anything positive to say here is discredited by the "5% discount to anyone who combats trolls post".

Also, paranoia comes from lack of communication, not because people are bored and want to play e-Private Investigator with Google Street Maps. If AMT would have a consistent message and delivered product, there would be customers here posting about their miners and support/performance/build quality (see other threads where companies delivered)

I get that people who "believe in AMT" want to blame the cruel, horrible troll world, but it's solved by delivering product. Taking money, not delivering and not communicating breeds all kinds of speculation. Reap what you sow.

I agree with your first paragraph. Said so to the AMT boys, too. It was a reactionary post, like a lot of their responses on here. They said to me, privately, that the thread gets them all fired up (in a bad way). Customer service is not their strong point, which they have acknowledged. They told me they are trying to hire CS professionals to handle things much better going forward.

I've known a lot of engineers and tech weenies over the course of my life, and while I despise stereotypes, they don't come out of nowhere. Guys like that tend to take things personally, when they should just shrug their shoulders and ignore it, while soldiering on. The AMT guys know this, but aren't real good at restraining their tempers.

My feeling, having dealt with them at arm's length, is that they will get their shit together. They know where their problems lie, and are trying to fix them. One of those problems is dealing with an often hostile audience. They aren't unique in this, but they got jumped on the first few posts here. I think it blindsided them.

[swiftshoot]

But yes, AMT are VAR's, not base level manufacturers.

They are not VARs yet until hundreds of equipment has been delivered to paying clients.

[Biomech]

But yes, AMT are VAR's, not base level manufacturers.

They are not VARs yet until hundreds of equipment has been delivered to paying clients.

Point taken. I suppose I should have said they are attempting to be VAR's

I'm trying to be neutral here. They've been nice to me, and I have personal reasons why I'd like them to succeed, but they also have some serious problems to overcome. I think they are trying, and I think they will likely succeed. Give 'em some space to breathe.

If I'm to be totally objective, they were a week late shipping to me. But they gave me the damn thing, so I can't bitch about that. If I had paid for it, I'd be a bit upset, but still, a week is not so bad. I don't think they are trying to do any harm, and I think they are trying very hard to be a good company. I also think they lack experience in customer service that they thought technical skill would overcome. It rarely works that way, which they are quickly discovering. But all new businessmen run into walls. It's the nature of the beast. This is off of memory, so it could be off a bit, but I seem to recall that 80 percent of all new businesses fail in their first year. I can just about guarantee that 100 percent of those failures didn't intend to fail.

These guys have reacted in a less than stellar fashion to a lot of people on these fora pulling out the pitchforks before they had any reason to. I've been a forum rat/ BBSer since (computerwise) the dawn of time. This is one of the most contentious and often downright vicious places I've ever been. It's also home to some incredibly smart people, which makes the noise worth it. I know for certain that the AMT boys did not expect the level of hostility that they got.

This does not excuse them reacting in kind, but it does make it more understandable. They have said, both publicly and to me in private, that they are trying to hire people who are more professional on the CS side of things. I think they will do so. I think they need to do so actually ahead of just about everything else, because a lot of the hostility would be put to rest by somebody regularly communicating, and being straight up about any delays or issues that come down the pipe.

One thing that has been noted ad nauseam that they should have addressed has been ASIC availability, both Bitfury and Coincraft. They should have talked about it. I think they'll handle it, but if you don't SEE it, you get antsy. I understand this. I'm not sure they did. I'm sure they do now, they just ain't sure how to handle it. PR is often maligned, but it's vital to a business.

[swiftshoot]

I just hope I can reach someone this week to find out my tracking number...
I hope they can deliver.  The 80 GH unit got released now how about my 128GH unit

Seeing those picks helped relieve my stress headaches... I guess I just need to be more patient. 

FYI: if you plan on delaying deliveries from a specific date, please reply/notify the users that it would be delayed... Communication is great to have and if you need to do it on a mass scale, please place that in the News Section. 

Good work AMT... When I get my 128GH, I will most probably order my 1.2 or higher unit from you as well.

[FrictionlessCoin]

Here's why I ordered from AMT.

I looked at all the 28nm manufacturers at the time.

There was:

KNC
Bitmine
HashFast
Cointerra
BFL

KNC was not selling 28nm and moved to 20nm.  Their product was scheduled 2nd half of 2014 at $12,000 for 3GHs
Bitmine has demos and had a tapeout earlier than both HashFast and Cointerra
HashFast looked legit but I could not find an order date that would ship in Feb.
Cointerra has the best prices and hardware but, they were delayed, and I couldn't order anything that would ship by April.
BFL -  I didn't bother.

So clearly Bitmine was neck and neck with HashFast in their schedule.
Only problem with Bitmine was that they were European and I couldn't figure out how I could buy their stuff from the USA.
Out comes announcement from Bitmine about AMT
The AMT promise ship date was for Feb on 1.2 THs machines that were on par price wise with HashFast.

Right now, it is a race to get those THs systems.  The situation however in Mining is becoming similar to GPU mining.  With GPU mining nobody is releasing new hardware that an order magnitude higher.  They have hit the limit of speed and power consumption.  The same will happen to ASIC in the next 3 months.  None of the ASIC manufacturers will be able to sell 28nm cheaper than what they already sell it for.  At best $3 per GHs is the limit.   

The benefits of 20nm is miniscule.  The KNC neptune system at 3THs requires industrial power requirements.

There are a ton of 200GHs 55nm products sold today, but these will plummet in price in the next couple of weeks.  So, if you want hardware that depreciates at a slower rate, then it is like 28nm because you can't get anything better.

BFL miners for example, who got their system really late were still able to profit because their units did not depreciate.   Many mined and even sold their units at the price they bought it at.  The same situation will likely play with 28nm miners.   

[Puppet]

.  None of the ASIC manufacturers will be able to sell 28nm cheaper than what they already sell it for.  At best $3 per GHs is the limit.  

At the risk of derailing this thread, but since no AMT news is being posted anyway, I could not possibly disagree more with the above statement. These asics carry a very high NRE, but cost peanuts to produce, the only reason you are paying $3/GH is because the market can bear that price and there is a huge shortage.

This wont last. As demand dries up (due to exploding difficulty), and manufacturers get their act together, prices will tumble until at some point they approach marginal production cost. And that is around one order of magnitude lower than what you see today.

FYI, a 300mm 28nm wafer costs ~$2500 in volume, possibly as "much" as $4000 with smaller volumes currently. One wafer holds somewhere between 50 and 100TH worth of chip candidates.  Thats $0.04 per GH in silicon production cost. Add a few dollar per chip for packaging, yield etc and a 400GH HF chip will cost on the order of $30. If that.  PCBs are fairly cheap too (probably around $20-$30 for a HF or BFL Monarch board), KnC style cases cost just a few bucks, what remains is cooling and PSU's.

The benefits of 20nm is miniscule.  

remains to be seen. Like most others, I suspect KnC is heavily sandbagging on their specs.  20nm finfet ought to provide a very substantial efficiency boost. However, I will only believe they can deliver before June when I see it.

BFL miners for example, who got their system really late were still able to profit because their units did not depreciate.   Many mined and even sold their units at the price they bought it at.  The same situation will likely play with 28nm miners.  

Only as long as there is a production shortage. My guess is that wont last very long.

[grumpybearsgirl]

Hi, I'm one of those people who have been reading and watching this thread since the day I ordered my miner from AMT. I've been silent the entire time because, frankly, this thread became rather heated and I didn't want to get involved. Besides, I thought the whole "noob" thing was more involved than it actually is, so I didn't want to sign up. I've been doing bitcoin for a long time now and so I didn't feature being considered a "noob".

At one stage people were asking how we found out about AMT - in my case, I found out about them from their ad on CoinEx. After seeing it multiple times I decided to give them a shot. They do have quite a professional-looking website, so I bought one 80gh miner to try them out.
On the one hand I understand the several of you who have reservations or doubts about AMT. I have to admit that I was quite afraid that I had lost my investment over the past few weeks. Also coupled with the fact that there is (or was) no trace of anyone having one of their miners, not on Google, not on eBay, not anywhere, was truly scary.
At any rate, I ordered a 80gh miner on December 5th. My order number was #888. I paid with BTC. A few days before Christmas I sent an email and Jim replied that I would hear shortly from them that the miner was finished. Sure enough, this week I got an email in my inbox saying that the miner was ready for me to pick it up. I live just outside of NYC, so I took the drive down to Havertown.
Josh was at their small office, he had my miner, and he sat me down and showed me how to connect it and get hashing.
I have to admit that I was pretty happy to see that indeed the location is real, the company is real, it is indeed US based, and I have a real miner for them.
I know that Biomech will give a report on the product within the next few days, but for anyone out there thinking less of what his report will be based on the fact that he was given a miner to review, I want to add this post as a paying customer who has received his product.
Furthermore, they didn't pay me to post this, I paid full price for my miner - I'm getting nothing out of giving this report. Still there are many of you who could appreciate someone going to the physical office to reassure you (more than a google earth pic), so I'm writing this to give you that reassurance.
I still haven't gotten the miner hashing. It was working fine at the office when Josh was showing me, however I needed to change settings to get it working on my network and managed to mess things up. So now Josh is back and forth with me on email trying to help me fix up what I messed up!

Here are some pics:

http://ppl.ug/e9xgrqCkWTA/

http://ppl.ug/FxUihk9hGmA/

http://ppl.ug/eoz0__3CIq4/

http://ppl.ug/6JonrknehbQ/

Thank you for posting! this definitely helps. The pictures however are no longer available. Would you be willing to post them again somewhere else?

At any rate, this is a good sign. Frankly I've been hoping that we invested in a company that is probably just a bit on the amateur side right now......instead of investing in a 'scammer'. With a few products delivered, it seems like the former may be the case after all.

Thanks

[FrictionlessCoin]

.  None of the ASIC manufacturers will be able to sell 28nm cheaper than what they already sell it for.  At best $3 per GHs is the limit.  

At the risk of derailing this thread, but since no AMT news is being posted anyway, I could not possibly disagree more with the above statement. These asics carry a very high NRE, but cost peanuts to produce, the only reason you are paying $3/GH is because the market can bear that price and there is a huge shortage.

This wont last. As demand dries up (due to exploding difficulty), and manufacturers get their act together, prices will tumble until at some point they approach marginal production cost. And that is around one order of magnitude lower than what you see today.

FYI, a 300mm 28nm wafer costs ~$2500 in volume, possibly as "much" as $4000 with smaller volumes currently. One wafer holds somewhere between 50 and 100TH worth of chip candidates.  Thats $0.04 per GH in silicon production cost. Add a few dollar per chip for packaging, yield etc and a 400GH HF chip will cost on the order of $30. If that.  PCBs are fairly cheap too (probably around $20-$30 for a HF or BFL Monarch board), KnC style cases cost just a few bucks, what remains is cooling and PSU's.

The benefits of 20nm is miniscule.  

remains to be seen. Like most others, I suspect KnC is heavily sandbagging on their specs.  20nm finfet ought to provide a very substantial efficiency boost. However, I will only believe they can deliver before June when I see it.

BFL miners for example, who got their system really late were still able to profit because their units did not depreciate.   Many mined and even sold their units at the price they bought it at.  The same situation will likely play with 28nm miners.  

Only as long as there is a production shortage. My guess is that wont last very long.

My thesis is that the price is going to plateau.

28nm is already near the limit.  Moving to 28nm to 20nm might get you like a 25% increase, but not an order of magnitude like going from 55nm to 28nm.   AMD GPU for example, the latest generation is like 25% better than the previous.

We are also reaching the limit in power for these machines.  If I heard right, the Neptune requires power beyond what residential circuits can handle.

Then you have the cost os the power supplies (which you neglect),  these aren't getting cheaper.  As you go higher and demand greater efficiencies, they just get more expensive.

So I doubt you'll see folks lowering their prices a lot.  In fact you are seeing this now,  nobody wants to lower their price to match Cointerra.   

It is $3 per GHs now for Cointerra,  possibly worse case we are seeing $2 per GHs long term.   

Look at GPU from AMD,  they've remained relatively constant with barely any improvement in technology in the past 3 years.   A 5990 board performs just as well as a R9 290x (2 generations later).

[Puppet]

My thesis is that the price is going to plateau.

28nm is already near the limit.  Moving to 28nm to 20nm might get you like a 25% increase, but not an order of magnitude like going from 55nm to 28nm.   AMD GPU for example, the latest generation is like 25% better than the previous.

We are also reaching the limit in power for these machines.  If I heard right, the Neptune requires power beyond what residential circuits can handle.

Then you have the cost os the power supplies (which you neglect),  these aren't getting cheaper.  As you go higher and demand greater efficiencies, they just get more expensive.

So I doubt you'll see folks lowering their prices a lot.  In fact you are seeing this now,  nobody wants to lower their price to match Cointerra.   

It is $3 per GHs now for Cointerra,  possibly worse case we are seeing $2 per GHs long term.   

Look at GPU from AMD,  they've remained relatively constant with barely any improvement in technology in the past 3 years.   A 5990 board performs just as well as a R9 290x (2 generations later).

You are wrong

Comparisons with GPU's are invalid. People dont buy $500 GPU's because they are profitable (miners aside, but they are a tiny minority). Nor do they stop buying GPU's because they no longer "profitable", so prices and margins are mostly determined by the competition. This is 100% different with bitcoin asics. The first asics could be sold their weight in pure gold, literally (the chips), because they were operationally immensely profitable. Even today bitcoin asics generate FAR more in mining revenue than they cost to operate (ie, electricity/hosting costs). WHich is why you see insane high marginal profits. Thats not going to last.

Price per GH will roughly follow price per bitcon / difficulty until you approach marginal cost. Assuming the price of bitcoin doesnt explode next year like it did in the past year, the cost of these asics will collapse just as fast as difficulty goes up. No one will want to pay $3 per GH if difficulty is 50B and estimated break even on the purchase is measured in decades rather than months. So vendors wil have a choice: reduce prices or hardly sell anything at all. Considering right now, these asics command a gross margin thats in the region of 10000%, which do you think is most likely? That they will stop selling, or sell for "only" 5000% margin, until one day, "only" 100% margin? Keep in mind even intel doesnt get 100% gross margins on average. Older bitcoin asics like avalon can already be bought for $5 per chip. These chips are not that much cheaper to produce than 28nm ones.  You will be able to buy coincraft A1"s for that price this year.

[FrictionlessCoin]

My thesis is that the price is going to plateau.

28nm is already near the limit.  Moving to 28nm to 20nm might get you like a 25% increase, but not an order of magnitude like going from 55nm to 28nm.   AMD GPU for example, the latest generation is like 25% better than the previous.

We are also reaching the limit in power for these machines.  If I heard right, the Neptune requires power beyond what residential circuits can handle.

Then you have the cost os the power supplies (which you neglect),  these aren't getting cheaper.  As you go higher and demand greater efficiencies, they just get more expensive.

So I doubt you'll see folks lowering their prices a lot.  In fact you are seeing this now,  nobody wants to lower their price to match Cointerra.   

It is $3 per GHs now for Cointerra,  possibly worse case we are seeing $2 per GHs long term.   

Look at GPU from AMD,  they've remained relatively constant with barely any improvement in technology in the past 3 years.   A 5990 board performs just as well as a R9 290x (2 generations later).

You are wrong

Comparisons with GPU's are invalid. People dont buy $500 GPU's because they are profitable (miners aside, but they are a tiny minority). Nor do they stop buying GPU's because they no longer "profitable", so prices and margins are mostly determined by the competition. This is 100% different with bitcoin asics. The first asics could be sold their weight in pure gold, literally (the chips), because they were operationally immensely profitable. Even today bitcoin asics generate FAR more in mining revenue than they cost to operate (ie, electricity/hosting costs). WHich is why you see insane high marginal profits. Thats not going to last.

Price per GH will roughly follow price per bitcon / difficulty until you approach marginal cost. Assuming the price of bitcoin doesnt explode next year like it did in the past year, the cost of these asics will collapse just as fast as difficulty goes up. No one will want to pay $3 per GH if difficulty is 50B and estimated break even on the purchase is measured in decades rather than months. So vendors wil have a choice: reduce prices or hardly sell anything at all. Considering right now, these asics command a gross margin thats in the region of 10000%, which do you think is most likely? That they will stop selling, or sell for "only" 5000% margin, until one day, "only" 100% margin? Keep in mind even intel doesnt get 100% gross margins on average. Older bitcoin asics like avalon can already be bought for $5 per chip. These chips are not that much cheaper to produce than 28nm ones.  You will be able to buy coincraft A1"s for that price this year.

Ok, let's go with the $5 per chip as the floor price.  If coincraft chips dive to that, then let's calculate the cost of this kind of system.

A single coincraft is 25 GHs, so a 1.25 THs will consume 50 chips.   At $5 per chip, that would be $250.  Add the power supply at $750.  The case, logic board, the embedded processor etc.  add $200.   Total, $1,200.  So we are roughly talking about $1 per GHs.

So I going to make this claim,  the floor may like be $1 per GHs.

It won't be $0.1 per GHs or $0.001 per GHs.

[Puppet]

Ok, let's go with the $5 per chip as the floor price.  If coincraft chips dive to that, then let's calculate the cost of this kind of system.

I never said that was the floor. I said I expect that this year. Avalon is selling their chips at this price today, and I guarantee you that is not at a loss. I also expect coincraft chips to become economically obsolete way before the bigger chips that provide 100s of GH per chip and cost ~$30 to produce.

Add the power supply at $750.  

Are you kidding? You can buy 1000W PSU's in retail for $100.

Sure it may be a bit inefficient or even total crap, but its also the price end users pay when ordering one unit through amazon and it cant possibly be worse than the PSU's BFL bundles with its miners (let alone worse than KnC or Monarch PSU's, since they dont come with any). Now just how much do you think a half decent unit costs if an OEM orders a few 1000 directly from china?

The case, logic board, the embedded processor etc.  add $200.  

Again you are way off. A rasberry Pi costs $35 (retail) and is overkill, its not like you need HDMI, audio, video decoding etc. You can buy complete ATX cases with fans, drive bays, USB sockets and everything for $10 on amazon, which is probably 5x more than KnC "cases" would cost in volume. And Ive linked prices of way more complicated PCBs for highend videocards earlier and they never exceed $10.

Here is a shocker for you: the most expensive part of the miner may well be the heatsink, even if its an off the shelve aircooled unit similar to what KnC uses.