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[Rating Place]

Winner

Your Selection : Kei Nishikori @ -131.6 or better

Bet Received :
Amount Received : 0.9998 BTC.

Bitcoin Transaction ID : ec2eddc09e2bbc4f9acff68d8d5e9a8046c8692b61e0b64cc025967e3d80899b

Confirmed Odds : -131.6

[Josepht]

this bet is winner w/o djokovic.not winner champion.
he won to djokovic.this bet should be won???

Your bet was 'to win the tournament when Djockovic doesn't participate.'
You chose Nishikori. Unfortunately for you he didn't win. Cilic did.

[tins]

this bet is winner w/o djokovic.not winner champion.
he won to djokovic.this bet should be won???

That bet was placed after he beat djokovic. It was a bet to win the U.S. Open.
He came in second, not winning. So, the bet lost.

[Rating Place]

Those odds are really screwed up and his money should be returned. The bet was placed 8/25. This meant that Nishikori has to finish 1st. Or he can finish 2nd if Djokovic wins the tourney. Because Nishikori and Djokovic were on the same side of the draw, it was impossible for them to be 1 and 2. Those odds, as well as the bet, make absolutely no sense. -131 to win the tourney and he had to beat Djokovic along the way to the finals.

[tins]

Those odds are really screwed up and his money should be returned. The bet was placed 8/25. This meant that Nishikori has to finish 1st. Or he can finish 2nd if Djokovic wins the tourney. Because Nishikori and Djokovic were on the same side of the draw, it was impossible for them to be 1 and 2. Those odds, as well as the bet, make absolutely no sense. -131 to win the tourney and he had to beat Djokovic along the way to the finals.

No, look up the transaction...from blockchain transaction of the bet: Received Time 2014-09-08 20:57:56 

He actually sent in the bet within seconds of the finals starting (couple days after Djokovic was already knocked out).





Whew. Glad we're all on the same page now.

[Rating Place]

Those odds are really screwed up and his money should be returned. The bet was placed 8/25. This meant that Nishikori has to finish 1st. Or he can finish 2nd if Djokovic wins the tourney. Because Nishikori and Djokovic were on the same side of the draw, it was impossible for them to be 1 and 2. Those odds, as well as the bet, make absolutely no sense. -131 to win the tourney and he had to beat Djokovic along the way to the finals.

No, look up the transaction...from blockchain transaction of the bet: Received Time 2014-09-08 20:57:56  

He actually sent in the bet within seconds of the finals starting (couple days after Djokovic was already knocked out).





Whew. Glad we're all on the same page now.

Then the ticket is written incorrectly and the money should be refunded. The ticket doesn't list the name of the second player.

It's written up as future with a start date of 8/25  to win the open w/o Djokovic. It's cut and dry unless DirectBet is going to make up another rule.

Event : Mens Tournament

Start Time : 08/25/2014 10:00

Competition : US Open 2014

Bet Type : Winner W/O Djokovic

Your Selection : Kei Nishikori @ -131.6 or better

[tins]

Those odds are really screwed up and his money should be returned. The bet was placed 8/25. This meant that Nishikori has to finish 1st. Or he can finish 2nd if Djokovic wins the tourney. Because Nishikori and Djokovic were on the same side of the draw, it was impossible for them to be 1 and 2. Those odds, as well as the bet, make absolutely no sense. -131 to win the tourney and he had to beat Djokovic along the way to the finals.

No, look up the transaction...from blockchain transaction of the bet: Received Time 2014-09-08 20:57:56  

He actually sent in the bet within seconds of the finals starting (couple days after Djokovic was already knocked out).





Whew. Glad we're all on the same page now.

Then the ticket is written incorrectly and the money should be refunded. The ticket doesn't list the name of the second player.

It's written up as future with a start date of 8/25  to win the open w/o Djokovic. It's cut and dry unless DirectBet is going to make up another rule.

Event : Mens Tournament

Start Time : 08/25/2014 10:00

Competition : US Open 2014

Bet Type : Winner W/O Djokovic

Your Selection : Kei Nishikori @ -131.6 or better

You are way off base tonight. It's written as the U.S. Open began on 8-25.
Every ticket for these types of events (if you remember the Wolrd Cup), every single one lists the opening day of the event.

You were caught being wrong. I posted the blockchain timestamp. You're better off leaving while you're way behind.

[Rating Place]

Those odds are really screwed up and his money should be returned. The bet was placed 8/25. This meant that Nishikori has to finish 1st. Or he can finish 2nd if Djokovic wins the tourney. Because Nishikori and Djokovic were on the same side of the draw, it was impossible for them to be 1 and 2. Those odds, as well as the bet, make absolutely no sense. -131 to win the tourney and he had to beat Djokovic along the way to the finals.

No, look up the transaction...from blockchain transaction of the bet: Received Time 2014-09-08 20:57:56  

He actually sent in the bet within seconds of the finals starting (couple days after Djokovic was already knocked out).





Whew. Glad we're all on the same page now.

Then the ticket is written incorrectly and the money should be refunded. The ticket doesn't list the name of the second player.

It's written up as future with a start date of 8/25  to win the open w/o Djokovic. It's cut and dry unless DirectBet is going to make up another rule.

Event : Mens Tournament

Start Time : 08/25/2014 10:00

Competition : US Open 2014

Bet Type : Winner W/O Djokovic

Your Selection : Kei Nishikori @ -131.6 or better

You are way off base tonight. It's written as the U.S. Open began on 8-25.
Every ticket for these types of events (if you remember the Wolrd Cup), every single one lists the opening day of the event.

You were caught being wrong. I posted the blockchain timestamp. You're better off leaving while you're way behind.

 Obviously the ticket was meant for the last match, even though -131 was terrible (closed -110 at other books), but intent has nothing to do with an improper ticket. Every other book would refund the bet. Djokovic should not have been listed. The ticket was written as a futures bet.

[Josepht]

Of course it won't be refunded. The bet was lost fairly.
You're saying that the odds were low? It was his own choice to make this bet.

[Rating Place]

Of course it won't be refunded. The bet was lost fairly.
You're saying that the odds were low? It was his own choice to make this bet.

I agree that the intent would make the player a loser. The odds were bad but I also agree that's irrelevant. It's just that all other sportsbooks refund money on improper tickets. DirectBet doesn't abide by universal rules. It's similar to players losing some money on ties. This only happens at DirectBet. It will be interesting to hear their new rule on this one. At least it will clear it up for the future.

[Rating Place]

A poster that goes by cornchip posted this

With those odds the bet makes no sense.

A pre-tourney No Djokovic would mean player has to win or finish 2nd if Djok wins. But, that's pretty fked up for a tennis tourney with Nishikori on the same side of the draw. He can't finish 2nd to Djok, so any cut odds for eliminating Djok from the field is just a theft for guys on his side.

The odds were a bad price for the final today (closed -110 at pinny). I'm guessing something got fked up and it was a price for todays match just entered into the wrong event?

[damakhun]

The odds closed -137 at ToteSport and BetFred (the online division of the 4th and 5th largest UK brick and mortars). It closed at -133 at Tipico (largest servicing turkey). At William Hill (largest in UK, Largest in USA) it was -137 hours before the match but closed -125. There was for sure better out there, a lot better. But Pinnacle had a 6 cent line on this match (-103 base) other bookies operate with vig. The odds were valid and similar to what many other sources had, and even better than those closers at major books I mentioned. The bet is valid. The terms are valid, the odds are correct. Not sure the issue here?

[Rating Place]

The odds closed -137 at ToteSport and BetFred (the online division of the 4th and 5th largest UK brick and mortars). It closed at -133 at Tipico (largest servicing turkey). At William Hill (largest in UK, Largest in USA) it was -137 hours before the match but closed -125. There was for sure better out there, a lot better. But Pinnacle had a 6 cent line on this match (-103 base) other bookies operate with vig. The odds were valid and similar to what many other sources had, and even better than those closers at major books I mentioned. The bet is valid. The terms are valid, the odds are correct. Not sure the issue here?

The odds were fine from what you posted. DirectBet is cloning lines from an exchange and adding lots of juice. That's why his hold is all over the place and they list lots of bets as "negotiate". When there are no offers at the exchange, it's "negotiate" at DirectBet.

Then he's mixing up the rules of an exchange with that of a sportsbook. Betfair had Nishikori as a future that was never taken down. As an individual game with a sportsbook where the betting is pregame and not "live betting", they have to list both players along with a date.

I think we all know the intent of the bet so that's not a big deal if the player agrees. DirectBet has a lot of cleaning up to do with their rules and tickets if they are working as a sportsbook.

No sportsbook takes a cut on pushes in the UFC and NBA quarters and halves. No sportsbook should have a 3 day rule in baseball during the regular season. Games are always settled same day even if suspended.

[damakhun]

I'm not sure their rule but some books keep changing the suspended game rule on the fly. About a year ago there was a dispute with Bookmaker.eu because the first time this happened in a while they changed their rules specific to that game. In this case the bets carried over to the next day but wasn't what the rules said would happen. Then later they changed the rule again. It was a very valid complaint but SBR banned the poster and deleted the thread.  At the time was "don't worry it will work out for you next time". Well Bookmaker has altered their rules several times since and neither here nor there. Well this past week there was a game that restarted the next day. When the bet was made, till after it settled, till the player requested to talk to managers multiple times, Bookmakers rules clearly said that if the game is scheduled to resume within 7 days the bets stand (so they keep the bet pending up to 7 days if known will be replayed). This was shown both on their live wager rules and on their main baseball rules. A player has a dispute over a large sum. Guess what happens? Bookmaker alters the rule page and adds word playoffs to imply this only applies to playoff games. That is NOT how the rule read. By what was published on their website they owe a large payout.

Anyways Pinnacle has also had different rules at different times but were fair. Didn't change them after the fact. So point is, yes some sites do or had held bets up to 7 days (let alone 3) so that is far from universal. Secondly, bonus points to a site that is consistent with their rules on how that is handled as it is not standard. (it is a big world out there and bitcoin is global - nothing wrong with that baseball rule, and thus is not an issue.

The dead heat rule however is so unorthodox and something I never heard of before. It is also not fair. It doesn't just net out. The reason is because the push probabilities held are not equal on each side. It adds a new dynamic to handicapping where people always just cap push+win together. It's not one of those oh wow I didn't know okay next time I know and it was fair. Unless this is bold in red and a way players completely understand, I would call that one bordering on being a dishonest attempt to profit by including unorthodox rules. It is their business and they are free to do as they like, but would certainly view them negatively for doing that.

[Rating Place]

I'm not sure their rule but some books keep changing the suspended game rule on the fly. About a year ago there was a dispute with Bookmaker.eu because the first time this happened in a while they changed their rules specific to that game. In this case the bets carried over to the next day but wasn't what the rules said would happen. Then later they changed the rule again. It was a very valid complaint but SBR banned the poster and deleted the thread.  At the time was "don't worry it will work out for you next time". Well Bookmaker has altered their rules several times since and neither here nor there. Well this past week there was a game that restarted the next day. When the bet was made, till after it settled, till the player requested to talk to managers multiple times, Bookmakers rules clearly said that if the game is scheduled to resume within 7 days the bets stand (so they keep the bet pending up to 7 days if known will be replayed). This was shown both on their live wager rules and on their main baseball rules. A player has a dispute over a large sum. Guess what happens? Bookmaker alters the rule page and adds word playoffs to imply this only applies to playoff games. That is NOT how the rule read. By what was published on their website they owe a large payout.

Anyways Pinnacle has also had different rules at different times but were fair. Didn't change them after the fact. So point is, yes some sites do or had held bets up to 7 days (let alone 3) so that is far from universal. Secondly, bonus points to a site that is consistent with their rules on how that is handled as it is not standard. (it is a big world out there and bitcoin is global - nothing wrong with that baseball rule, and thus is not an issue.

The dead heat rule however is so unorthodox and something I never heard of before. It is also not fair. It doesn't just net out. The reason is because the push probabilities held are not equal on each side. It adds a new dynamic to handicapping where people always just cap push+win together. It's not one of those oh wow I didn't know okay next time I know and it was fair. Unless this is bold in red and a way players completely understand, I would call that one bordering on being a dishonest attempt to profit by including unorthodox rules. It is their business and they are free to do as they like, but would certainly view them negatively for doing that.

I found the dead heat rule interesting too since it adds value to the dog. The push percentage is approximately 6% on NBA quarters.

I agree with most of what you have said except for the suspended rule in baseball. That rule is now universal with Vegas books and books in Costa Rica.

[damakhun]

Up until yesterday. Bookmaker's rules this season stated they held the bets for 7 days. They are in Costa Rica, no?

And

the online world is much bigger than Costa Rica and Vegas who are actually relatively small players in the grand scheme.

And

as long as the rule is consistent that one is fair.

[Rating Place]

Up until yesterday. Bookmaker's rules this season stated they held the bets for 7 days. They are in Costa Rica, no?

And

the online world is much bigger than Costa Rica and Vegas who are actually relatively small players in the grand scheme.

And

as long as the rule is consistent that one is fair.

Bookmaker is in CR. I didn't realize that the change was recent.

I defer to Europe and Asia for soccer but MLB is an American market and it would be nice if the bitcoin books conformed to the same rules. Scalpers would like it too.

[damakhun]

Allow me to point to a peepsplace thread on the subject:

http://www.peepsplace.com/showthread.php?t=429713

Besides the actual details of the complaint what you can see is that in July 2013 so we're talking mid baseball season (last season) the rules were:

Pinnacle:

For grading purposes, all games must go 8.5 innings and be played to completion within 7 days of their start time for wagers to have action.

Wagers on games that are suspended or otherwise not finished on the day of game, but are finished within 7 days of their start time, have action and will be graded based on the completed game score.

BetCris:

Game must go 8.5 or more innings and be concluded with a winner determined.

Any game or event must be played to its conclusion within 7 days in order to have action on full game props. Wagers on games that are suspended on the day of the game but played to conclusion within 7 days of the start time have action and will be graded based on the completed game score.

So both Pinnacle and Bookmaker were using a rule other than the one you consider universal. Fwiw Tipico (largest in turkey) also has the same rule. Pinnacle and Bookmaker have changed their rules multiple times. It appears no one can decide how they want to handle those. Pinnacle has done it (changes) and stuck to what the rules were at the time bets were placed. Bookmaker seems to have changed them twice both in the middle dispute (second accusation of that). Now to be clear perhaps they settled the dispute and changed it. I don't know (this here isn't to accuse them - though was at bare minimum some low level support issues were had).

The point I'm trying to make is perhaps directbet has some to learn about bookmaking and rules, perhaps you as well in looking at rules and judging books off them. The baseball rule is a) fair, b) has been used at other sites - I mean was even the case at Pinnacle and Bookmaker - two large limit outs. This one is a pass. Yes DirectBet's version is the less common rule, but they are not alone. There are dozens of places action continues till when the game resumes. On that one I think you two should kiss and make up

[liwayway]

this bet is winner w/o djokovic.not winner champion.
he won to djokovic.this bet should be won???

That bet was placed after he beat djokovic. It was a bet to win the U.S. Open.
He came in second, not winning. So, the bet lost.

when i bet.there are 2 bets.
first is winner odd 1.96 (there is no live at this bet)
and second is Winner W/O Djokovic 1.76 (there is live at this bet)
if my bet need  Kei Nishikori  win first place to win so this bet have odd not fair.
and there is not thing different between 2 bets WINNER AND  WINNER W/O DJOKOVIC.
my bet is WINNER W/O DJOKOVIC.Kei Nishikori  is second place till have higher place than Djokovic

[21pilot]

graded!

Thanks guys!