[ANN][XCP] Counterparty - Pioneering Peer-to-Peer Finance - Official Thread

[profitofthegods]

There's no safer way than to go through a forum member?

You can use someone listed here: https://www.bitrated.com/

[pankogulo]

They Should put up a big warning sign! Do not use Armory or Electrum wallet addresses when creating a multi signature address in your counterwallet! Not compatible! Unless you want your assets so secure not even you will be able to get them out!

Issue was reported here https://github.com/CounterpartyXCP/counterwallet/issues/733

[sdersdf3]

Could anyone explain what Counterparty's purpose/future are given Symbiont? What is it planning to do/be that Symbiont isn't planning to do/be?

Symbiont is using the Counterparty protocol to execute its model of "building the first issuance and trading platform for smart securities on blockchain technology." Symbiont will be one of what will eventually be many front ends to Counterparty's back end.

So there's no overlap between what Symbiont is/plans-to-be and what Counterparty is/plans-to-be?

No, beyond the fact that Symbiont is essentially financially backing future Counterparty open source development, by employing most of the core team and enabling them to spend some of their time working on the extant Counterparty codebase. Symbiont is a business with a commercial business model, Counterparty is an open source technology project with no commercial business model. (And yes, the foundation does take donations, but I don't consider that a business model .)

Appreciate the responses - is there anyone, any moderator, from Counterparty here that could speak to this and confirm the relationship (lack of overlap) between Counterparty and Symbiont?


So, when Symbiont is up and running as a decentralised exchange - it'll be powered by the XCP network? In other words, all Symbiont transactions will run through XCP?

I don't get how that would happen - I understand the transaction-speed/bandwidth(?) of the bitcoin network is too slow to accommodate the demands of the financial markets. Am I something here?

Yes, it will be powered by Counterparty/XCP.

Apparently the founders of Counterparty/Symbiont disagree with your assessment of transaction speed being too slow. Perhaps it's because a clearing house will be built into Symbiont that will allow faster settlement, or something (maybe the Ripple link helps answer your question?). Unfortunately, I don't have a great answer for you.

The Bitcoin network will not have to instantly have the bandwidth to accommodate the entire financial markets right away. It will be a process and its performance can be improved with time. At least that's my understanding of it.

Really appreciate the responses - is there anyone from counterparty, a moderator perhaps, that could speak to this and confirm that there's no overlap between Symbiont and Counterparty functions and that Symbiont processes will run entirely (be powered by) Counterparty's system?

[sdersdf3]

Could anyone explain what Counterparty's purpose/future are given Symbiont? What is it planning to do/be that Symbiont isn't planning to do/be?

Symbiont is using the Counterparty protocol to execute its model of "building the first issuance and trading platform for smart securities on blockchain technology." Symbiont will be one of what will eventually be many front ends to Counterparty's back end.

So there's no overlap between what Symbiont is/plans-to-be and what Counterparty is/plans-to-be?

No, beyond the fact that Symbiont is essentially financially backing future Counterparty open source development, by employing most of the core team and enabling them to spend some of their time working on the extant Counterparty codebase. Symbiont is a business with a commercial business model, Counterparty is an open source technology project with no commercial business model. (And yes, the foundation does take donations, but I don't consider that a business model .)

Appreciate the responses - is there anyone, any moderator, from Counterparty here that could speak to this and confirm the relationship (lack of overlap) between Counterparty and Symbiont?


So, when Symbiont is up and running as a decentralised exchange - it'll be powered by the XCP network? In other words, all Symbiont transactions will run through XCP?

I don't get how that would happen - I understand the transaction-speed/bandwidth(?) of the bitcoin network is too slow to accommodate the demands of the financial markets. Am I something here?

Yes, it will be powered by Counterparty/XCP.

Apparently the founders of Counterparty/Symbiont disagree with your assessment of transaction speed being too slow. Perhaps it's because a clearing house will be built into Symbiont that will allow faster settlement, or something (maybe the Ripple link helps answer your question?). Unfortunately, I don't have a great answer for you.

The Bitcoin network will not have to instantly have the bandwidth to accommodate the entire financial markets right away. It will be a process and its performance can be improved with time. At least that's my understanding of it.

Really appreciate the responses - is there anyone from counterparty, a moderator perhaps, that could speak to this and confirm that there's no overlap between Symbiont and Counterparty functions and that Symbiont processes will run entirely (be powered by) Counterparty's system?

Counterparty and Symbiont co-founder here. Unlike Counterparty, Symbiont is a private business. We cannot discuss our business plans publicly at this point, but as Robby (aka xnova) pointed out: Symbiont is personally funding Counterparty's development, having hired several of Counterparty's full-time developers.

Thanks for understanding.

Appreciate the response, but this could mean that it's entirely possible that Symbiont will overlap/displace part or all of Counterparty's functions - or not - and that any dev funding may be simply for use of Counterparty as an unffocial R&D testbed, or not. No one essentially knows or those who do know unwilling to say?

[Matt Y]

Could anyone explain what Counterparty's purpose/future are given Symbiont? What is it planning to do/be that Symbiont isn't planning to do/be?

Symbiont is using the Counterparty protocol to execute its model of "building the first issuance and trading platform for smart securities on blockchain technology." Symbiont will be one of what will eventually be many front ends to Counterparty's back end.

So there's no overlap between what Symbiont is/plans-to-be and what Counterparty is/plans-to-be?

No, beyond the fact that Symbiont is essentially financially backing future Counterparty open source development, by employing most of the core team and enabling them to spend some of their time working on the extant Counterparty codebase. Symbiont is a business with a commercial business model, Counterparty is an open source technology project with no commercial business model. (And yes, the foundation does take donations, but I don't consider that a business model .)

Appreciate the responses - is there anyone, any moderator, from Counterparty here that could speak to this and confirm the relationship (lack of overlap) between Counterparty and Symbiont?


So, when Symbiont is up and running as a decentralised exchange - it'll be powered by the XCP network? In other words, all Symbiont transactions will run through XCP?

I don't get how that would happen - I understand the transaction-speed/bandwidth(?) of the bitcoin network is too slow to accommodate the demands of the financial markets. Am I something here?

Yes, it will be powered by Counterparty/XCP.

Apparently the founders of Counterparty/Symbiont disagree with your assessment of transaction speed being too slow. Perhaps it's because a clearing house will be built into Symbiont that will allow faster settlement, or something (maybe the Ripple link helps answer your question?). Unfortunately, I don't have a great answer for you.

The Bitcoin network will not have to instantly have the bandwidth to accommodate the entire financial markets right away. It will be a process and its performance can be improved with time. At least that's my understanding of it.

Really appreciate the responses - is there anyone from counterparty, a moderator perhaps, that could speak to this and confirm that there's no overlap between Symbiont and Counterparty functions and that Symbiont processes will run entirely (be powered by) Counterparty's system?

Counterparty and Symbiont co-founder here. Unlike Counterparty, Symbiont is a private business. We cannot discuss our business plans publicly at this point, but as Robby (aka xnova) pointed out: Symbiont is personally funding Counterparty's development, having hired several of Counterparty's full-time developers.

Thanks for understanding.

Appreciate the response, but this could mean that it's entirely possible that Symbiont will overlap/displace part or all of Counterparty's functions - or not - and that any dev funding may be simply for use of Counterparty as an unffocial R&D testbed, or not. No one essentially knows or those who do know unwilling to say?

You've already gotten that answer you're looking for from two Counterparty founders. They will not overlap. One is a business, one does not have a profit model. There is no reason to assume that Symbiont will copy Counterparty and do everything themselves on that side of things when it's already free to use Counterparty. What would the point be? What would happen to Symbiont's dev team and trust in the community if Symbiont did something like that, assuming it's even possible? They would be gone, that's what. Any everyone that's part of the Symbiont team has built incredible trust either in or out of the crypto community and in some cases, both.

[sdersdf3]

Could anyone explain what Counterparty's purpose/future are given Symbiont? What is it planning to do/be that Symbiont isn't planning to do/be?

Symbiont is using the Counterparty protocol to execute its model of "building the first issuance and trading platform for smart securities on blockchain technology." Symbiont will be one of what will eventually be many front ends to Counterparty's back end.

So there's no overlap between what Symbiont is/plans-to-be and what Counterparty is/plans-to-be?

No, beyond the fact that Symbiont is essentially financially backing future Counterparty open source development, by employing most of the core team and enabling them to spend some of their time working on the extant Counterparty codebase. Symbiont is a business with a commercial business model, Counterparty is an open source technology project with no commercial business model. (And yes, the foundation does take donations, but I don't consider that a business model .)

Appreciate the responses - is there anyone, any moderator, from Counterparty here that could speak to this and confirm the relationship (lack of overlap) between Counterparty and Symbiont?


So, when Symbiont is up and running as a decentralised exchange - it'll be powered by the XCP network? In other words, all Symbiont transactions will run through XCP?

I don't get how that would happen - I understand the transaction-speed/bandwidth(?) of the bitcoin network is too slow to accommodate the demands of the financial markets. Am I something here?

Yes, it will be powered by Counterparty/XCP.

Apparently the founders of Counterparty/Symbiont disagree with your assessment of transaction speed being too slow. Perhaps it's because a clearing house will be built into Symbiont that will allow faster settlement, or something (maybe the Ripple link helps answer your question?). Unfortunately, I don't have a great answer for you.

The Bitcoin network will not have to instantly have the bandwidth to accommodate the entire financial markets right away. It will be a process and its performance can be improved with time. At least that's my understanding of it.

Really appreciate the responses - is there anyone from counterparty, a moderator perhaps, that could speak to this and confirm that there's no overlap between Symbiont and Counterparty functions and that Symbiont processes will run entirely (be powered by) Counterparty's system?

Counterparty and Symbiont co-founder here. Unlike Counterparty, Symbiont is a private business. We cannot discuss our business plans publicly at this point, but as Robby (aka xnova) pointed out: Symbiont is personally funding Counterparty's development, having hired several of Counterparty's full-time developers.

Thanks for understanding.

Appreciate the response, but this could mean that it's entirely possible that Symbiont will overlap/displace part or all of Counterparty's functions - or not - and that any dev funding may be simply for use of Counterparty as an unffocial R&D testbed, or not. No one essentially knows or those who do know unwilling to say?

You've already gotten that answer you're looking for from two Counterparty founders. They will not overlap. One is a business, one does not have a profit model. There is no reason to assume that Symbiont will copy Counterparty and do everything themselves on that side of things when it's already free to use Counterparty. What would the point be? What would happen to Symbiont's dev team and trust in the community if Symbiont did something like that, assuming it's even possible? They would be gone, that's what. Any everyone that's part of the Symbiont team has built incredible trust either in or out of the crypto community and in some cases, both.

Not to belabor the point, but I wasn't talking about the business model - I was talking about functionality. Basically, whether Counterparty's exchange functionality is going to remain relevant and be integrated into what Symbiont is doing -- will Symbiont be powered by Counterparty's exchange functionality -- or is there going to be complete or partial overlap between Counterparty's exchange funcitonality and whatever functionality Symbiont is putting together.

The obvious concern for any XCP holder is whether Counterparty is on its way to being made irrelevant by whatever Symbiont is doing. Basically, is Symbiont going to be of long-term benefit to Counterparty beyond some payments to XCP developers?

I assume that question/uncertainty is one of the factors (certainly not the only factor) that's been dragging down the XCP price and has kept it from recovering.

I don't think I've yet gotten a straight answer to a highly relevant question for XCP holders, but if I'm missing something here feel free to point it out.

[mtbitcoin]

Not to belabor the point, but I wasn't talking about the business model - I was talking about functionality. Basically, whether Counterparty's exchange functionality is going to remain relevant and be integrated into what Symbiont is doing -- will Symbiont be powered by Counterparty's exchange functionality -- or is there going to be complete or partial overlap between Counterparty's exchange funcitonality and whatever functionality Symbiont is putting together.

The obvious concern for any XCP holder is whether Counterparty is on its way to being made irrelevant by whatever Symbiont is doing. Basically, is Symbiont going to be of long-term benefit to Counterparty beyond some payments to XCP developers?

I assume that question/uncertainty is one of the factors (certainly not the only factor) that's been dragging down the XCP price and has kept it from recovering.

I don't think I've yet gotten a straight answer to a highly relevant question for XCP holders, but if I'm missing something here feel free to point it out.

From what I understand, there WILL NOT be a technology overlap because Symbiont will be powered by Counterparty. I repeat, Symbiont will running on Counterparty.

Symbiont is a business entity that will be profit driven and as such the only area where there might be overlaps are areas where services which the underlying technology is powered by counterparty are offered.  For instances its possible (this is a just a random example) if Symbiont started offering a crowdfunding service they would be in direct competition with the likes of say "Koinify", swarm, etc

On the other hand, this does not really give them a business advantage because Counterparty is a free open source platform and anyone is free to develop any services on the platform. The only limitation being your imagination, expertise and effort.

However, if the purpose of your question was to derive a reason/cause for the price decline then your guess is as good as mine :-)

Cheers

[sdersdf3]

Not to belabor the point, but I wasn't talking about the business model - I was talking about functionality. Basically, whether Counterparty's exchange functionality is going to remain relevant and be integrated into what Symbiont is doing -- will Symbiont be powered by Counterparty's exchange functionality -- or is there going to be complete or partial overlap between Counterparty's exchange funcitonality and whatever functionality Symbiont is putting together.

The obvious concern for any XCP holder is whether Counterparty is on its way to being made irrelevant by whatever Symbiont is doing. Basically, is Symbiont going to be of long-term benefit to Counterparty beyond some payments to XCP developers?

I assume that question/uncertainty is one of the factors (certainly not the only factor) that's been dragging down the XCP price and has kept it from recovering.

I don't think I've yet gotten a straight answer to a highly relevant question for XCP holders, but if I'm missing something here feel free to point it out.

From what I understand, there WILL NOT be a technology overlap because Symbiont will be powered by Counterparty. I repeat, Symbiont will running on Counterparty.

Symbiont is a business entity that will be profit driven and as such the only area where there might be overlaps are areas where services which the underlying technology is powered by counterparty are offered.  For instances its possible (this is a just a random example) if Symbiont started offering a crowdfunding service they would be in direct competition with the likes of say "Koinify", swarm, etc

On the other hand, this does not really give them a business advantage because Counterparty is a free open source platform and anyone is free to develop any services on the platform. The only limitation being your imagination, expertise and effort.

However, if the purpose of your question was to derive a reason/cause for the price decline then your guess is as good as mine :-)

Cheers

Now this was the straight answer I was looking for. Only remaining question is, are you one of the core devs?

[Matt Y]

Anything that you do on Symbiont you will need to trust Symbiont, a business, for. Counterparty is a trustless, open source protocol. It's kinda like asking if Coinbase duplicates Bitcoin's functionality and takes away the need for Bitcoin as a protocol.

He is the founder of Blockscan: http://blockscan.com/

[mtbitcoin]

Not to belabor the point, but I wasn't talking about the business model - I was talking about functionality. Basically, whether Counterparty's exchange functionality is going to remain relevant and be integrated into what Symbiont is doing -- will Symbiont be powered by Counterparty's exchange functionality -- or is there going to be complete or partial overlap between Counterparty's exchange funcitonality and whatever functionality Symbiont is putting together.

The obvious concern for any XCP holder is whether Counterparty is on its way to being made irrelevant by whatever Symbiont is doing. Basically, is Symbiont going to be of long-term benefit to Counterparty beyond some payments to XCP developers?

I assume that question/uncertainty is one of the factors (certainly not the only factor) that's been dragging down the XCP price and has kept it from recovering.

I don't think I've yet gotten a straight answer to a highly relevant question for XCP holders, but if I'm missing something here feel free to point it out.

From what I understand, there WILL NOT be a technology overlap because Symbiont will be powered by Counterparty. I repeat, Symbiont will running on Counterparty.

Symbiont is a business entity that will be profit driven and as such the only area where there might be overlaps are areas where services which the underlying technology is powered by counterparty are offered.  For instances its possible (this is a just a random example) if Symbiont started offering a crowdfunding service they would be in direct competition with the likes of say "Koinify", swarm, etc

On the other hand, this does not really give them a business advantage because Counterparty is a free open source platform and anyone is free to develop any services on the platform. The only limitation being your imagination, expertise and effort.

However, if the purpose of your question was to derive a reason/cause for the price decline then your guess is as good as mine :-)

Chee

Now this was the straight answer I was looking for. Only remaining question is, are you one of the core devs?

No, like you I am part of the CP community (albeit an early one) and at certain of points at time I shared your same concerns. This is merely an informed opinion from the publicly available information, postings, blogs and following of the overall project direction since the beginning

[bitcoinrocks]

Does Symbiont or the Counterparty Foundation hold any XCP?

[deliciousowl]

Does Symbiont or the Counterparty Foundation hold any XCP?

You for real? 

[Cornett]

Does Symbiont or the Counterparty Foundation hold any XCP?

  WTF.  Of course No  

[stereotype]

Does Symbiont or the Counterparty Foundation hold any XCP?

You for real? 

Dont be too harsh. Maybe he had experience with that questionable farce, we call MSC. 

[xyzzyx]

FYI, Bittrex is contemplating delisting XCP:

"This market is in danger of de-listing due to low trade volume and lack of user interest. It may be removed on May 15th unless the average daily trade volume for the last 7 days exceeds 0.2 BTC."

https://bittrex.com/Market/Index?MarketName=BTC-XCP

[gumcruise]

FYI, Bittrex is contemplating delisting XCP:

"This market is in danger of de-listing due to low trade volume and lack of user interest. It may be removed on May 15th unless the average daily trade volume for the last 7 days exceeds 0.2 BTC."

https://bittrex.com/Market/Index?MarketName=BTC-XCP

Good. Bittrex is a manipulative exchange and I wouldn't trust them with peanuts. At least it will reduce risk exposure.

[bitcoinrocks]

Is there any way to know if this is insider selling?

[bitcoinrocks]

How big of a concern is it that Bitcoin could build Counterparty-esque functionality directly into their protocol?

[profitofthegods]

Does anybody know whether NASDAQ adopting blockchain technology would affect Symbiont?

(https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/nasdaq-details-upcoming-use-bitcoins-block-chain-tech/)

For example, could it blaze a regulatory trail which would help? Or could it steal their thunder and make it hard for small start-ups to offer something unique enough to muscle in on the big boys' territory?

[deliciousowl]

Does anybody know whether NASDAQ adopting blockchain technology would affect Symbiont?

(https://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/nasdaq-details-upcoming-use-bitcoins-block-chain-tech/)

For example, could it blaze a regulatory trail which would help? Or could it steal their thunder and make it hard for small start-ups to offer something unique enough to muscle in on the big boys' territory?

Small start-up? Did you look at the people involved in Symbiont?