[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[toknormal]

That's because now it can be forked and....lets see how much bullsh*t I can create from nothing in 5 seconds

LoL !! You've excelled yourself there.

You've got your troll hat on today I see - must've dumped and hoping to hell it doesn't recover before your target.

Like I've always said, he is crypto cancer.

Well - if you think a wailing toddler tossing their toys out of the pram is "cancerous"   I think he's just not getting the "right" attention.

[1714993403]

1714993403

[1714993403]

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[1714993403]

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[camosoul]

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

I <3 the cock.

And one more time, for blowjay!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05hTBAOnDQE&t=1m15s

Have fun with your plate of dicks!

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

#DARKCOIN: Instant transaction technology to be named “InstantX”. See Dev Update: http://t.co/37V8BQfLQt #buildthedarkness #bitcoin

#getintothedark
#buildthedarkness
#DarkcoinChameleon

Join us on Twitter!

@TaoOfSatoshi

[thelonecrouton]

My 2 duffs for development priorities:

1. Leave the MN payment formula as it is right now. No need for tampering it...

2. Provide strong IP obfuscation - or TOR-merging, so that DRK is usable for "fund Snowden" type of stuff. If DRK doesn't do it, clones will. "We have DarkSend plus IP obf".

3. Find a way (or outsource) a solution to get back to MN payments at a protocol level, without workarounds and without forking.

4. Wallet stuff / visual improvements.

5. Instant TXs

(some could be worked in parallel)

Enforce p2pool. With Masternodes as p2pool nodes. No more bad pools, no more 51% attack, guaranteed decentralisation.

But keep the MNs behind the planned IP obfuscation? Would need to be it's own protocol/fabric.

You'd still need somewhere to point your miner in the absence of an IP address, true - but the mining software could use something like a magnet link, which is just a hash of the node ID(s). MNs will have identifying 'tokens' instead of IP's as far as the wider net is concerned, use those?

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

“Trustless, Instant transactions in a cryptocurrency? INCONCEIVABLE!” #getintothedark #darkcoin #bitcoin #innovation



#getintothedark
#buildthedarkness
#DarkcoinChameleon

Join the fun on Twitter,

@TaoOfSatoshi

[robinwilliams]

whys darkcoin dumping?

[toknormal]

whys darkcoin dumping?

Have you ever heard the phrase "buy the rumour, sell the news" ?

Well we're now at the "news" bit.

EDIT: But there's going to be a reprieve now because the 15 min MACD just punched sharply through signal line to the upside and the decline's been on barely discernible volume anyway - apart from about 10,000 DRK which got offloaded a couple of hours ago (that might've been shojayxt's 'toys' flying past actually).

Don't worry, just get used to it. If you had been a long term NxT holder like me you'd easily go 2 weeks in a dinghy in a typhoon without a hint of sea-sickness.

[robinwilliams]

whys darkcoin dumping?

Have you ever heard the phrase "buy the rumour, sell the news" ?

Well we're now at the "news" bit.

o - the open source?

[camosoul]

My 2 duffs for development priorities:

1. Leave the MN payment formula as it is right now. No need for tampering it...

2. Provide strong IP obfuscation - or TOR-merging, so that DRK is usable for "fund Snowden" type of stuff. If DRK doesn't do it, clones will. "We have DarkSend plus IP obf".

3. Find a way (or outsource) a solution to get back to MN payments at a protocol level, without workarounds and without forking.

4. Wallet stuff / visual improvements.

5. Instant TXs

(some could be worked in parallel)

Enforce p2pool. With Masternodes as p2pool nodes. No more bad pools, no more 51% attack, guaranteed decentralisation.

But keep the MNs behind the planned IP obfuscation? Would need to be it's own protocol/fabric.

You'd still need somewhere to point your miner in the absence of an IP address, true - but the mining software could use something like a magnet link, which is just a hash of the node ID(s). MNs will have identifying 'tokens' instead of IP's as far as the wider net is concerned, use those?

I was thinking, why make it specific? Just point at the whole noisy fog and let the MNs sort it out. No more mining pools at all. Just mine into the MN cloud and poof, coins come back.

Mining pools are an artificial ad-hock entity anyway. Another flaw of crypto that has never been solved. MNs can solve it.

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

whys darkcoin dumping?

Don't care. Talk to me in 2020. Got work to do.

[thelonecrouton]

My 2 duffs for development priorities:

1. Leave the MN payment formula as it is right now. No need for tampering it...

2. Provide strong IP obfuscation - or TOR-merging, so that DRK is usable for "fund Snowden" type of stuff. If DRK doesn't do it, clones will. "We have DarkSend plus IP obf".

3. Find a way (or outsource) a solution to get back to MN payments at a protocol level, without workarounds and without forking.

4. Wallet stuff / visual improvements.

5. Instant TXs

(some could be worked in parallel)

Enforce p2pool. With Masternodes as p2pool nodes. No more bad pools, no more 51% attack, guaranteed decentralisation.

But keep the MNs behind the planned IP obfuscation? Would need to be it's own protocol/fabric.

You'd still need somewhere to point your miner in the absence of an IP address, true - but the mining software could use something like a magnet link, which is just a hash of the node ID(s). MNs will have identifying 'tokens' instead of IP's as far as the wider net is concerned, use those?

I was thinking, why make it specific? Just point at the whole noisy fog and let the MNs sort it out. No more mining pools at all. Just mine into the MN cloud and poof, coins come back.

You'd need some way of automagically connecting miners to their nearest (lowest ping) MasterPoolNode (MPN), but yeah that shouldn't be too hard for the Duffinator.

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

whys darkcoin dumping?

Have you ever heard the phrase "buy the rumour, sell the news" ?

Well we're now at the "news" bit.

EDIT: But there's going to be a reprieve now because the 15 min MACD just punched sharply through signal line to the upside and the decline's been on barely discernible volume anyway - apart from about 10,000 DRK which got offloaded a couple of hours ago (that might've been shojayxt's 'toys' flying past actually).

Don't worry, just get used to it. If you had been a long term NxT holder like me you'd easily go 2 weeks in a dinghy in a typhoon without a hint of sea-sickness.

Arr, it be a big ocean, the crypto waters!

[Propulsion]

Thing is, I just decided around... two weeks ago or something, "Hey, I feel like fucking around with X11 on AMD." Seeing as I didn't know what GPU code looked like 4 months ago, there obviously are loads of people out there who could hand me my ass when it comes to GPU optimizations, on AMD or otherwise, and it stands to reason that someone has done this shit already.

What do you plan to do about it?

Game theory suggests that there is more benefit to you in releasing your improved code than simply to keep on using it yourself, as the people you claim to have even better miners are currently profiting at your expense, as well as everyone elses. Plus the steps you have taken can then also be improved upon by others, thus further lowering the disparity.

You would sacrifice your gain now for a better net gain in the future.

I don't claim anyone has even better miners - I said I believe it's quite likely. Assuming that is true, they are indeed profiting at my (very slight) expense at the moment. However, the only motive I could possibly have for releasing my current code is malice: that is, simply wanting to lower the amount they are making. Since by keeping it to myself, and VERY few others (about two to three testers and one farmer), I finally am not forced to frantically look for freelance jobs every month until I have money, as my percentage covers my expenses with a little bit extra, I would have to be EXTREMELY irrational to do so. Pretty much anything done to X11 to speed it up can be added to X13 and X15 with minimal effort - which I have, of course, completed. As there are just loads of coins that use X11/X13/X15, and more coming out, this means that for the forseeable future my optimizations will make a good enough profit to keep me above water - and very likely more. (Multipools and NiceHash are pretty much what all farmers I know use.)

Therefore, the suggestion you pose to me is, put simply, to destroy my main source of income in order to fuck over people who are profiting more than I am, for now, who I do not know and actually have no beef with. Oh, and said people may or may not exist.

So in essence you're just bitching that someone else might be doing exactly what you're doing?

Bitching? No, not at all! You've got it wrong - I'm saying that coins should take steps to avoid this type of situation, and that not doing so is extremely bad for it. Haha, I would never demonize someone for acting in a rational manner.

Ah, right, you're not bitching, you're gloating that you're doing something 'extremely bad' for DRK.

NO!  He is just saying that it would be better for the coin if the developers would release a well functioning miner from the get go so that everyone has the best available, so that people like himself wouldn't have an advantage.  Of course, he needs the money, he made a better miner, so he keeps it to himself.

I think he is sort of correct, it would be nice to have the most efficient miner available to everyone, and Evan has said he would like to devote some time in optimizing the miner, but he's been too busy.

But in the end, there will never be fair distribution for mining.  People who can code, can optimize for themselves and their hardware, people with money can buy the best equipment, etc... etc...  It's called competition and as long as the rewards are worth it, things will get more efficient and productive for those with the ability to make it so.  There is no reason why they shouldn't benefit from their work and abilities either, IMO. 

So actually, I disagree with Wolf0, I don't think the developer would ever get a coin off the ground by being so meticulous as to bring the miner up to the best it could possibly be.  That amount of time required of him is not worth it.  He was smart to spend his time on getting the coin to work.  As long as the distribution of mining power was relatively balanced, that was all we needed.  Even so, it swung over 50% a few times.  Now the network is larger and doesn't swing so badly anymore, and DRK has matured a lot.

So no, I don't believe in everything being fair.  I think, for people on the ball, they'll get their fair share of life eventually.  If they miss out once, they'll be on it next time.  For others like myself, without the talent, I am glad to have stumbled upon this coin early and learned as fast as I could how to mine.  I wish I knew I could rent an instance to mine back then!  Oh, I could have been rich!  LOL.  But I was so green, I had no clue.

Anyway, that's life.  Gotta grab it by the balls, or work 9-5 till you're 70 years old.  And just cause you can't grab as many balls as the next guy because you don't have the talent or money, doesn't mean you can't scramble up a nice chunk of 'em for yourself in accordance to your talent

Thank you for getting it. But, I'm not arguing for "fair distribution." Hell, to even start thinking about doing that, you'd have to define "fair." I'm also certainly not advocating that the coin devs perfect the mining implementation - it doesn't even need to be near perfect. Nor does everything have to be fair. Those who can optimize these miners should if they wish to, and may do with the result as they wish - my only advice is that these algorithms not be copy+pasted by someone who - at least, it seems - doesn't even know how to code, but only the syntax rules of the language. 90% of my results on X11 are from the rewriting of a single algorithm. The kicker is that my rewrite is still maybe half the speed of what it could be, because while it's not a brain-dead implementation of it anymore, it still has vague remnants of the lib SPH one. Which is actually because I created the structure much like the CPU reference one simply so I could test it without having to modify SGMiner. So the overall structure of the hash algorithm is the same, I just don't waste massive amounts of registers, causing very severe, choking, and completely unnecessary limits on how many hashes can be run in parallel per multiprocessor for that algorithm, and I use more loops - a lot more - because let's face it, AMD should release an assembler and forget about their intermediate language, because pretty much the only thing that compiler does well is loop unrolling.

I really don't see an issue with the miner. At first it was CPU only.

A couple months passed and GPU mining became possible. Another couple months and it became more optimized.

Slowly the optimizations become available to the masses. There will always be someone with a better miner than the rest of the public though.

Give it time, eventually FPGA's will be introduced and then sold. Once the first one goes out, more will follow. Eventually creating someone to create an ASIC for x11 mining.

Point is, there is no reason to fund an optimized miner when it already is being done privately, it'll be leaked eventually.

Hell, if anyone can create an FPGA for darkcoin, I'll purchase the hardware and you write the code. We'll then sell the FPGA's and become ostracized from the community when we say "They'll ship in two weeks".

[thelonecrouton]

Point is, there is no reason to fund an optimized miner when it already is being done privately, it'll be leaked eventually.

I hear that you just have to unroll the loops in the keccak module. Eh Wolf0? 

[camosoul]

Arr, it be a big ocean, the crypto waters!

MAN THE HARPOONS!

[qwizzie]

looks like Darkcoin isnt the only altcoin getting hit : http://www.cryptocoinrank.com/#

Dogecoin : -8%
Peercoin : -6%
Darkcoin : -11.6%
BitsharesPTS : -7.9%
Feathercoin : -14.4%

[camosoul]

looks like Darkcoin isnt the only altcoin getting hit : http://www.cryptocoinrank.com/#

Dogecoin : -8%
Peercoin : -6%
Darkcoin : -11.6%
BitsharesPTS : -7.9%
Feathercoin : -14.4%

When the valuation is calculated against BTC value, and BTC value is falling like a rock... There could be zero volume and static value, and it would lose points because the thing it's being calculated against is losing points.

The value really means nothing. Progress in development moves on whether the cryptotard community can understand it's value or not. DRK = Honey Badger. DRK isn't for stupid people, so I don't expect stupid people to buy it. All the cryptotards see is another abbreviation to pump and dump. They don't read.

[BlockaFett]

Thing is, I just decided around... two weeks ago or something, "Hey, I feel like fucking around with X11 on AMD." Seeing as I didn't know what GPU code looked like 4 months ago, there obviously are loads of people out there who could hand me my ass when it comes to GPU optimizations, on AMD or otherwise, and it stands to reason that someone has done this shit already.

What do you plan to do about it?

Game theory suggests that there is more benefit to you in releasing your improved code than simply to keep on using it yourself, as the people you claim to have even better miners are currently profiting at your expense, as well as everyone elses. Plus the steps you have taken can then also be improved upon by others, thus further lowering the disparity.

You would sacrifice your gain now for a better net gain in the future.

I don't claim anyone has even better miners - I said I believe it's quite likely. Assuming that is true, they are indeed profiting at my (very slight) expense at the moment. However, the only motive I could possibly have for releasing my current code is malice: that is, simply wanting to lower the amount they are making. Since by keeping it to myself, and VERY few others (about two to three testers and one farmer), I finally am not forced to frantically look for freelance jobs every month until I have money, as my percentage covers my expenses with a little bit extra, I would have to be EXTREMELY irrational to do so. Pretty much anything done to X11 to speed it up can be added to X13 and X15 with minimal effort - which I have, of course, completed. As there are just loads of coins that use X11/X13/X15, and more coming out, this means that for the forseeable future my optimizations will make a good enough profit to keep me above water - and very likely more. (Multipools and NiceHash are pretty much what all farmers I know use.)

Therefore, the suggestion you pose to me is, put simply, to destroy my main source of income in order to fuck over people who are profiting more than I am, for now, who I do not know and actually have no beef with. Oh, and said people may or may not exist.

So in essence you're just bitching that someone else might be doing exactly what you're doing?

Bitching? No, not at all! You've got it wrong - I'm saying that coins should take steps to avoid this type of situation, and that not doing so is extremely bad for it. Haha, I would never demonize someone for acting in a rational manner.

Ah, right, you're not bitching, you're gloating that you're doing something 'extremely bad' for DRK.

You really aren't listening, you just seem to be sporting a massive hate boner. No, that's not my point, either. My point is this:

DRK and other coins MUST take the time and effort, or spend the capital, to create at least a reasonably optimized implementation of miners for their coin. Not doing so is worse than a premine - it goes on usually for a long time, and no one quite knows how many coins have been gained by, and in the control of, these few entities. I'm actually trying to help you by giving you advice, and if I hadn't done any work on X11 myself, then nobody would have taken me seriously. Now, I'm being taken seriously, but instead of realizing I'm actually doing you a favor by telling you what I have, what I believe is possible, and what I project is possible later, you're just getting pissed off because I'm not going to cut off my most reliable source of income - and that income ain't disposable - by giving you the results of skilled work for free. What I will do, and have done, is tell you what will help not just DRK, but other coins you may like. So stop raging, put down the pitchfork, and instead evaluate what I've said and see if you can do something about it to better both the coin you like, and the community of cryptocurrency as a whole.

This is Wolf0 celebrating his latest photoshop 'screenshot' of his secret X11 algo running at 3.4TH on his ATI Rage Pro.



If you don't share your algos, noone cares so shut the fuck up.

[toknormal]

Loads of buys coming into the market now. All lights are "green"....

[illodin]

PIC

Who the f logs in an exchange and decides that today is a good day to place a buy order for 0.20479 DRK.