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Author Topic: [Guide] Dogie's Comprehensive Manufacturer Trustworthiness Guide [1st Feb 2016]  (Read 130993 times)
philipma1957
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March 11, 2015, 02:54:12 AM
 #1241

So at no point does ability to ROI come into play for your choice of miners?  I understand you are an enthusiast Philip, but your opinion on this board holds sway. I don't think it's very considerate to encourage purchase of this hardware for people who have any intention to make (or even not lose) money, when it would require minimum 4 months to ROI without even factoring electricity cost or difficulty increases.  That is just not realistic, and I don't know how you could "like the pricing" by any stretch.  The pricing before the increase (with or without forseeable difficulty increases on the horizon) was not incredibly lucrative, it is on a different level of crazy now.

edit: amazing how this one topic has spread across pretty much every thread in hardware.  Sorry dogie, my only intention on posting here earlier was to bring up the matter of Bitmain and pre-orders, and the fact that you should downgrade them on the next update in the context of pre-orders.

Dogie should dock bitmaintech for this preorder.

I will not buy any gear today.

I still like bitmiantech's pricing move from a business strategy .

Do I believe a 469 dollar s-5 will pay itself off in 4 month maybe maybe not. I do think it will pay itself off by nov or dec.

I think the superfarms have concluded what I did. diff can not work at endless 10%.  They will replace older gear and not expand much. they will restrict sales hoping to make coins more desirable this way.  No math works for big cloud mining and a 1000ph network it will fail. but knc bitfury a few other mining with .15 watt gear works as long as they do not over grow the diff.
   guys like us 5th 10th 20th can survive.  if diff stays at 2-3% and price moves at 5-10%.  I think diff restriction or lack of hashing gear would drive price up.   I have preached this since the late summer.

   It is why I can say bitmaintech's move may be good. I would prefer anyone today to buy and hold btc.  or mine and hold btc if they have miner.
If miners would buy coins and not buy miners we would be better off.  So my argument is this hi price  should restrict sales and drive price up. I would prefer miners to not buy a miner from bitmaintech. 

I mentioned in my previous post I blame the miners for spending on these machines not bitmaintech for selling them at a high price.

I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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March 11, 2015, 04:54:11 AM
 #1242

There is certainly a 'fiduciary' responsibility for anyone posting hardware reviews and guides etc to warn consumers of bad deals but this guide in particular is not concerned with that aspect and never has. It is primarily concerned with telling you what hardware is "good" although it lags significantly behind the consumers in what really is value for money given how long it takes to see ratings adjusted to the reality of the marketplace.

Currently there are no such ROI hardware deals available to the average small user and there will never be a time when that is possible ever again.

If you want to use that methodology, why does your guide have a thumbs up section at all? Surely all those companies (according to you) sell at a loss to the consumer and so should all be thumbs down?

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March 11, 2015, 02:37:06 PM
 #1243

There is certainly a 'fiduciary' responsibility for anyone posting hardware reviews and guides etc to warn consumers of bad deals but this guide in particular is not concerned with that aspect and never has. It is primarily concerned with telling you what hardware is "good" although it lags significantly behind the consumers in what really is value for money given how long it takes to see ratings adjusted to the reality of the marketplace.

Currently there are no such ROI hardware deals available to the average small user and there will never be a time when that is possible ever again.

If you want to use that methodology, why does your guide have a thumbs up section at all? Surely all those companies (according to you) sell at a loss to the consumer and so should all be thumbs down?

And while you and I have had our fights on line  many companies do sell at high prices.  Many items do not have hope to make a profit.

As for bick saying  no current deal will profit for a small investor.

 I actually think that at 469 shipped to the usa a s-5 will earn that back by nov, dec 2015 in a 10 cent a kwatt home with a psu on hand.


I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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March 11, 2015, 03:49:32 PM
 #1244

There is certainly a 'fiduciary' responsibility for anyone posting hardware reviews and guides etc to warn consumers of bad deals but this guide in particular is not concerned with that aspect and never has. It is primarily concerned with telling you what hardware is "good" although it lags significantly behind the consumers in what really is value for money given how long it takes to see ratings adjusted to the reality of the marketplace.

Currently there are no such ROI hardware deals available to the average small user and there will never be a time when that is possible ever again.

If you want to use that methodology, why does your guide have a thumbs up section at all? Surely all those companies (according to you) sell at a loss to the consumer and so should all be thumbs down?

And while you and I have had our fights on line  many companies do sell at high prices.  Many items do not have hope to make a profit.

As for bick saying  no current deal will profit for a small investor.

 I actually think that at 469 shipped to the usa a s-5 will earn that back by nov, dec 2015 in a 10 cent a kwatt home with a psu on hand.




That is if BTC price holds and difficulty doesn't blow up.

Too many ifs.

As you said DO NOT BUY MINERS... BUY BTC and hold. Best option.

And it is clear Dogie doesn't read my guide or he would know there are plenty of WARNINGS NOT TO BUY all the way through for months. However if you are still insisting on going ahead then I recommend what are the best companies given what consumers say about their experiences. Unlike this thread that has little or no input from consumers. If he had done that I bet tens of thousands of dollars would not have been lost to some pretty horrible companies that were touted as excellent in this thread for many months when there was ample evidence to contrary. I stand by my statements I don't have to back peddle and remake rating system to some how fit my own personal agenda. Basically I copy and paste what people post and there reports makes it clear what is a reputable business and what isn't.

Dogie trust abuse, spam, bullying, conspiracy posts & insults to forum members. Ask the mods or admins to move Dogie's spam or off topic stalking posts to the link above.
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March 11, 2015, 04:26:10 PM
Last edit: March 12, 2015, 03:23:28 AM by dogie
 #1245

And it is clear Dogie doesn't read my guide or he would know there are plenty of WARNINGS NOT TO BUY all the way through for months.

Whoa whoa whoa, lets be honest now. The only mention of income, earnings or ROI in your guide is one vague line which suggests there might be risk, along with a link to a post from May 2014 saying don't buy USB miners to make money...

Quote
And as always... read the Caveat Emptor by Gmaxwell and learn any purchase of mining equipment is a crapshoot at best. ... Oh here is a great rant about ROI. Some rants about Financial ROI by TheRealSteve. Although this Rant relates to stick or usb miners it almost seems to mirror the current situation for the home miner attempting to buy now.

That's it, the entirety of the "WARNINGS NOT TO BUY all the way through" in the ratings, yet you're still claiming some huge moral high ground.

Fatman3001
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March 21, 2015, 09:35:08 PM
 #1246

Are there any trusted manufacturers who are launching next gen miners within the next 6 months?

"I predict the Internet will soon go spectacularly supernova and in 1996 catastrophically collapse." - Robert Metcalfe, 1995
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March 21, 2015, 09:46:08 PM
 #1247

Are there any trusted manufacturers who are launching next gen miners within the next 6 months?

Nothing confirmed from anyone, and as history as shown we should wait until hardware appears before passing judgement either way.

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March 21, 2015, 11:08:43 PM
 #1248

Are there any trusted manufacturers who are launching next gen miners within the next 6 months?

Nothing confirmed from anyone, and as history as shown we should wait until hardware appears before passing judgement either way.

Ok, thanks

"I predict the Internet will soon go spectacularly supernova and in 1996 catastrophically collapse." - Robert Metcalfe, 1995
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April 14, 2015, 12:07:03 AM
 #1249

@Dogie

Great thread, but Spondoolies company site isnt valid "https://spondoolies.refersion.com/c/4381" is wrong. Consider revising it Smiley

Always Idle, Always Here, Always Mining - Bitcoin
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April 14, 2015, 05:46:42 AM
 #1250

@Dogie, Great thread, but Spondoolies company site isnt valid

Fixed thanks, that's hopefully all of them.

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April 14, 2015, 06:18:38 AM
 #1251

IMHO there's only one "r" in Black Arrow's X1 Prospero. Unless you're making a doggy joke.

Anyone who's fooled into looking for more information about these scammers shouldn't get lost due to that typo.
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April 14, 2015, 08:21:34 AM
 #1252

IMHO there's only one "r" in Black Arrow's X1 Prospero. Unless you're making a doggy joke.

Anyone who's fooled into looking for more information about these scammers shouldn't get lost due to that typo.

Will be fixed on next refresh of guides.

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April 15, 2015, 10:58:22 AM
 #1253

Disclaimers
I provide technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts has any influence over company ratings.
...
I don't believe this statement is true

New Mimblewimble implementation: https://www.beam.mw
Spondoolies is back with the SPx36: https://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/spx36
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April 15, 2015, 11:06:00 AM
 #1254

Disclaimers
I provide technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts has any influence over company ratings.
...
I don't believe this statement is true

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points when I became involved with them.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even during the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.

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April 15, 2015, 11:09:44 AM
 #1255

Disclaimers
I provide technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts has any influence over company ratings.
...
I don't believe this statement is true

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even with the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.
I don't have a proof, but I think you know some stuff about Bitmain ethics which you refrain from taking into account.
I can't reveal what it is.

New Mimblewimble implementation: https://www.beam.mw
Spondoolies is back with the SPx36: https://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/spx36
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April 15, 2015, 11:22:40 AM
 #1256

Disclaimers
I provide technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts has any influence over company ratings.
...
I don't believe this statement is true

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even with the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.
I don't have a proof, but I think you know some stuff about Bitmain ethics which you refrain from taking into account.
I can't reveal what it is.
[Moved to Skype]

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April 15, 2015, 11:24:29 AM
 #1257

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points when I became involved with them.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even during the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.

Please don't bring the minuscule dropping of points into discussion because I already showed the real reasoning for this small drop(this was just a small step out of many steps for getting Bitmain to the top). If you want I can always refresh your memory.

H/w Hosting Directory & Reputation - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=622998.0
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April 15, 2015, 11:47:37 AM
 #1258

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points when I became involved with them.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even during the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.

Please don't bring the minuscule dropping of points into discussion because I already showed the real reasoning for this small drop(this was just a small step out of many steps for getting Bitmain to the top). If you want I can always refresh your memory.

Uses own chips?
Delivered miners?
Uses preorders?
On time?
Quality Issues?
Refund Issues?
Communication
Ethics
Size

Which of these rating categories do you disagree with, on what company? What evidence can you provide to substantiate a rating change?

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April 16, 2015, 01:30:54 PM
 #1259

Disclaimers
I provide technical support for 2 companies - Bitmain and Canaan Creative. Neither of these contracts has any influence over company ratings.
...
I don't believe this statement is true

Bitmain dropped 10 points when I became involved with them.
Canaan Creative dropped 3 points.
Spondoolies' rating has risen over the same period, even with the problems of under performing SP30 preorders.
I don't have a proof, but I think you know some stuff about Bitmain ethics which you refrain from taking into account.
I can't reveal what it is.

Spondoolies-Tech,  I have nothing against you or Bitmain, but when I see stuff like this mentioned, or when I hear Bitmain say stuff like "We know things but we can't say", it reinforces my view that ASIC manufacturing has become nothing more that a classic old boy's network/oligopoly/OPEC of bitcoin and it annoys the shit out of me.  A fantastic idea and technology that Satoshi had has been reduced to ASIC manufacturers careful treading, patting each other on the back, and refusing to whistleblow on each other.  To an outsider, it seems like a careful pact has been formed which excludes the community from information they should have.  It's the bitcoin community that placed you where you are now, and it's this same community's face you spit in when you refuse to share information you have regarding other ASIC manufacturers' business practices.

I only wish information flow regarding bitcoin would be as open as the blockchain.
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April 16, 2015, 09:28:59 PM
 #1260

I don't have a proof, but I think you know some stuff about Bitmain ethics which you refrain from taking into account.
I can't reveal what it is.

Spondoolies-Tech,  I have nothing against you or Bitmain, but when I see stuff like this mentioned, or when I hear Bitmain say stuff like "We know things but we can't say", it reinforces my view that ASIC manufacturing has become nothing more that a classic old boy's network/oligopoly/OPEC of bitcoin and it annoys the shit out of me.  A fantastic idea and technology that Satoshi had has been reduced to ASIC manufacturers careful treading, patting each other on the back, and refusing to whistleblow on each other.  To an outsider, it seems like a careful pact has been formed which excludes the community from information they should have.  It's the bitcoin community that placed you where you are now, and it's this same community's face you spit in when you refuse to share information you have regarding other ASIC manufacturers' business practices.

I only wish information flow regarding bitcoin would be as open as the blockchain.

While I completely agree with the sentiment espoused here, we have no right to the private information that others possess. Nor does anyone have a duty to share consumer information that they have, no matter what we may happen to feel about it.

However, Spondoolies-Tech, you are better served not posting such things. There is no evidence either way that your statements are valid, but they certainly generate responses such as the above, and many companies fire their employees for such public commentary. It brings what may ultimately be unfounded attention, and fosters mistrust as Abracadabra noted.

Say whatever you wish, of course, but comments such as that certainly do you and your company no favours.


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