The Cypherfunks[FUNK]: a coin for a global band! Talking v2. Join! 80+ songs

[MadCow]

@MadCow

Interesting idea. Keep the ideas flowing.

It does a bit confusing though. Basically. What would P-FUNK do better, than just FUNK? If enough people believe in the idea then FUNK itself will find its equilibrium value.

Yes, I can see my idea does sound very complicated!

I think eventually FUNK will be the currency, but at the moment I think the linkage between the Cypherfunk band and the FUNK currency is very weak. They're related but only through you guys as the dev and early adopters. People are uploading music for free, and anyone can download it for free, so FUNK is not involved at all so far. I know it's early days and I can see you plan to modify your http://min.io/ site to accept FUNK, and that would probably be the tipping point to much wider adoption.

I do think that eventually iTunes and other big online music retailers will start accepting bitcoins, and once that happens it will be harder to establish FUNK as the crypto currency for the music community. Most people like simplicity, and the network effect will probably only allow a small handful of crypto currencies to survive.

Right now FUNK has early mover advantage, but you need to distribute FUNK to as many people as possible asap. But as FUNK is 100% POW and there was no pre-mine you don't have a FUNK war chest to use for promotion etc. I know pre-mines are not popular with many people but we're now seeing a whole bunch of pure POS coins taking off, and some of them will do well because they can distribute coins using a pre-defined criteria. If the criteria is fair and attractive and transparent, pure POS coins, or POW coins with big pre-mines have some advantages.

My P-FUNK suggestion was really an option to maximise donations to some 'entity' that can distribute them for the greater good of the Cypherfunk vision. I know the country coins air-dropping coins to Iceland etc have raised a lot of eye-brows, but the idea in principal has many advantages. If you had a big holding of FUNK (say 5-20%) you could pay a nice FUNK payment for every upload of music to a modified http://min.io/ and you'd effectively have the beginnings of a FUNK based competitor to iTunes. That would be cool, but if iTunes and bitcoin get there first it'll be Apple and the Winklevii type of investor who control the crypto/music revolution.

I'm not into centralisation, or suggesting you start a 'business', but I am suggesting you need to foster markets for music related transactions in FUNK, and that's going to be difficult without a large holding at your disposal.

P-FUNK could be an alternative means of getting a community pool. You could just ask for donations, but IMO you'll get more if you offer some incentives and have a 'plan' on how to foster FUNK. I know you have plans, but you don't have a stack of FUNK to giveaway. Burning FUNk into P-FUNK might be too complicated, but it would give you a rallying cry to generate some community interest.

To some that might sound like centralisation but what I'm advocating is 'co-ordination', and without a pre-mine or a pure POS distribution it's much harder to do.

Have you heard of LTBcoin? AdamBLevine from Letstalkbitcoin is creating it as an 'asset' on top off counterparty. It's a pretty cool idea -contributors of content on their site/network will be paid in LtbCoin. Then they'll require advertisers on their site/network to pay in LtbCoin. Simple idea but quite brilliant. Cut-out the middle man by creating a link between two parties. But it requires the site owners 'controlling' the issuing of the LtbCoin asset. Not all centralisation is bad, and blockchain technology makes everything transparent and out in the open.
http://ltbcoin.com/ltbcoin-for-new-users

I think FUNK & the CypherFunk band is a great vision, but without a war chest of FUNK and some 'control' it'll be harder to make that vision a reality.  Creating P-FUNK might give you an asset like LtbCoin which you could use to promote FUNK. You can't go back in time and reboot FUNK with a different feature set, but you can 'add' useful features in other ways.

I admit it is complicated, and it might not be needed, but you need to link FUNK & the Cypherfunk content together, and with FUNK as it is I think that'll be hard, but not impossible.

edit: I came across this today, good example of what you can do with a 'war-chest'
http://bitcoin.mit.edu/announcing-the-mit-bitcoin-project/

[MadCow]

I've had an idea I'd like to share.

I said before that maybe a pure POS coin might have suited the goals of Cypherfunk better than a 100% POW coin like FUNK. I thought this mainly because in order to setup FUNK as a local/community currency you need to have a central 'authority' to 'create' the token used for the complementary currency ecosystem. Without a central authority to distribute the token it's very hard to establish any viable economic transactions using the local currency. The central authority acts like a mini FED, treasury, bank, exchange, employer, merchant, promoter and rule maker etc etc, and without a central authority I fear FUNK will fail.

This idea makes my head hurt. Marry decentralized and centralized? I really don't like centralized anything. If the end goal morphs into being adopted by the 'mainstream' you can count me out. A centralized 'parliament' could easily be absorbed or dissolved into the presently existing music industry. Anything centralized can be attacked, and brought down or taken over by outside forces.

Central authority? Mini-fed? Micro-Rothschilds? Nah...

We need to stop looking backwards to the old paradigm. Let's build something better than the current system. A new system that benefits musicians directly. A good example is Wikipedia. The Bitcoin Group (a youtube channel) had a discussion and one of the people they had on basically said Wikipedia is setup as a non-profit organization 501(c)3, which has a Board of Directors (Authority) that 'controls' the money. Meanwhile the authors that directly do the hard work and contribute to Wikipedia, scarcely see any money. To paraphrase him he said, "Why doesn't someone just fork Wikipedia on Github, and set the payment system to go directly to the authors that contribute?"

I'm all about cutting out the middle men.

Yes it is complicated. I've been a garage band drummer for 20 years and that's why I've taken an interest in FUNK (only been paid to play once), but my background is in economics, and what first drew me to the crypto scene initially was the economics and the possibility for things like complementary currencies that blockchain technologies make possible. Economics and finance can be complicated, but they're part of the crypto world now. At the start it was just the tech that was innovative, but now it's smart contracts and decentralised exchanges. That is the way ahead.

My use of the word 'Parliament' might have been a bit misleading as to my opinions here. I couldn't resist though as I'm a huge fan of the band Parliament (aka P-FUNK). I'm not in favour of centralisation, or creating a business, or anything like a mini-fed, but I am in favour of co-ordination, at least at the start. I think FUNK could become a fantastic community currency but it does need someone to co-ordinate some things to help reach critical mass.

[simondlr]

Garbage men, toilet cleaners, and ditch diggers get paid. Why shouldn't musicians get paid?
I think musicians need to improve their self respect.

Yeah, totally. I completely agree. I'm not saying musicians should NOT get paid. I'm saying we should look at new paradigms of how value flows (like FUNK). People will give a person value if they thin that person deserves it. We saw how awesome Radiohead's "In Rainbows" did, and has since been copied to great success. Pay as much as you want. That's pure & natural price discovery.

Looking forward to some of those packs!

@MadCow

All interesting ideas. And thanks for your contributions. My feeling is, is that if we continue with our rate of growth, these incentives to deploy extra services will happen naturally (as you've seen with Bitcoin, Litecoin & Dogecoin). I'm a fan of decentralized interest in the community, people working on this out of their own interest, desire and passion. We don't want something like Scharmbeck in Worldcoin's case, where a big entity in the space killed the coin, because no-one else was willing to build and foster the community.

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

@Cryptocoinrank

Thanks for adding us! Really cool.

---

btw, guys, really dig these discussions! Keep them coming. We are going to kick ass.

[MadCow]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

My heart wants to agree with you Simon!! I'll donate 100,000,000 FUNK to the Mothership collective!

[loveyou]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

My heart wants to agree with you Simon!! I'll donate 100,000,000 FUNK to the Mothership collective!

the coin is dead???

why

[lonelyman728]

what the coin means ?   

[simondlr]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

My heart wants to agree with you Simon!! I'll donate 100,000,000 FUNK to the Mothership collective!

By that I mean, buying up FUNK on exchanges. The releases financial resources.

@loveyou. No, it's not dead! Far from it.

[soundposition]

New song has been released:
Freeway Drifting
https://soundcloud.com/soundposition/the-cypherfunks-freeway-drifting

Freeway Drifting Separates Pack now available!
Share your remixes.

Download at FileSnack:
http://snk.to/f-ctmevis9

Donations welcome!
FUNK:
CGohVVCDMzCvQRcR4dbnN52rA6STYvojUw

BTC:
18CCyD2RMixKbgDQXoxLJpc3thNGUHZMLj

[simondlr]

New song has been released:
Freeway Drifting
https://soundcloud.com/soundposition/the-cypherfunks-freeway-drifting

Freeway Drifting Separates Pack now available!
Share your remixes.

Download at FileSnack:
http://snk.to/f-ctmevis9

Donations welcome!
FUNK:
CGohVVCDMzCvQRcR4dbnN52rA6STYvojUw

BTC:
18CCyD2RMixKbgDQXoxLJpc3thNGUHZMLj

Paid out the bounty. Thanks man.

Now I need to find time to do another remix.

[soundposition]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

fwiw, we've been thinking of repurposing http://min.io (old side-project developed with a friend) to work with FUNK. But I wouldn't do it to sell the music. The music should be free (as much as possible). Also, how do we divide up sales? Theoretically, anyone has permission to re-sell it for their own gain, but it's not ideal.

I agree with the part about injecting capital (as I said the FUNK needs to be worth something), although simply buying up FUNK on the exchange is going to convince people to pump and dump the FUNK. If people thought they could make easy BTC by selling FUNK on the exchange, nobody would hold onto the FUNK coins to spend. If we had some incentive for people to spend their FUNK coins, then we would have something. That's why we need something like CoinLock or min.io to allow digital content to be exchanged for FUNK.

[simondlr]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

fwiw, we've been thinking of repurposing http://min.io (old side-project developed with a friend) to work with FUNK. But I wouldn't do it to sell the music. The music should be free (as much as possible). Also, how do we divide up sales? Theoretically, anyone has permission to re-sell it for their own gain, but it's not ideal.

I agree with the part about injecting capital (as I said the FUNK needs to be worth something), although simply buying up FUNK on the exchange is going to convince people to pump and dump the FUNK. If people thought they could make easy BTC by selling FUNK on the exchange, nobody would hold onto the FUNK coins to spend. If we had some incentive for people to spend their FUNK coins, then we would have something. That's why we need something like CoinLock or min.io to allow digital content to be exchanged for FUNK.

Yep. I agree!

[soundposition]

Simon,

Maybe since you're so busy, we could do a bounty for the work needed to complete the project?

[mckmuze]

First of all, I just want to say, I love what I am seeing. This is right in line with my thinking. My name is Brady, I am a musician and crypto addict. lol I have been trying to find others interested in utilizing these technologies in a way that will rewrite the rules of music creation.
I am just now getting involved, I have some music I will submit. I also have some ideas we could all work with.

Have any of you used Kompoz? I think we could utilize it for collaboration and eventually build our own. We could create a pay per play system like nobs.is has on Cryptr, pay users Funk to listen and even develop a reddit style upvote system for songs or even snippets of audio. Allow people to use funk to vote for a riff, verse, etc. The more you listen the more you can actually shape the music as a listener by spending your generated funk.

Also if a multi pool was created for Funk we could do some REALLY interesting things. Like hardware based open source music streaming/ASIC boxes. I literally have thought about the possibilities for way too long. Someone please help me get a group hangout together to make things happen.  I am spewing with ideas. yes I said spewing... lol

I would love to get a Google hangout together and hash out some ideas. I have thought long and hard about crypto and the music industry. I would love to collaborate ideas. A few others are doing things with music and crypto, we need to round these people up and get everyone talking.

[soundposition]

Hi Brady! I'm glad to see you get on board, and I can't wait to hear your ideas. It's getting late, and I've had a long productive day, so I'll be back later after I've rested.

[simondlr]

First of all, I just want to say, I love what I am seeing. This is right in line with my thinking. My name is Brady, I am a musician and crypto addict. lol I have been trying to find others interested in utilizing these technologies in a way that will rewrite the rules of music creation.
I am just now getting involved, I have some music I will submit. I also have some ideas we could all work with.

Have any of you used Kompoz? I think we could utilize it for collaboration and eventually build our own. We could create a pay per play system like nobs.is has on Cryptr, pay users Funk to listen and even develop a reddit style upvote system for songs or even snippets of audio. Allow people to use funk to vote for a riff, verse, etc. The more you listen the more you can actually shape the music as a listener by spending your generated funk.

Also if a multi pool was created for Funk we could do some REALLY interesting things. Like hardware based open source music streaming/ASIC boxes. I literally have thought about the possibilities for way too long. Someone please help me get a group hangout together to make things happen.  I am spewing with ideas. yes I said spewing... lol

I would love to get a Google hangout together and hash out some ideas. I have thought long and hard about crypto and the music industry. I would love to collaborate ideas. A few others are doing things with music and crypto, we need to round these people up and get everyone talking.

Hey Brady! Welcome. Dig the tune you made. For those who haven't heard: https://soundcloud.com/bradymckenna/dr-j-and-mr-h. Add a FUNK address so we can tip you.

I actually dig the idea of using FUNK to "vote" for a riff/melody/drum beat they'd like to see in a song. That way we can go a bit more crazy in terms of churning out creative ideas (rather than fully fleshed out songs). Thoughts?

There's no reason why we could use Kompoz anyway. Get collaborators onto our idea. I see you can buy gift-cards... hmmm... I'm going to drop them a mail and see if they want to accept FUNK [because why not?].

Whoa, I like the idea of making custom ASICs that combine mining + streaming. That's pretty far out. Elaborate a bit more!

I like the ideas. Keep them flowing.

@soundposition:

A bounty would be great, but I wouldn't want to feel obligated to finish something by a certain time. I try to dev work in when I can. Busy working with n00bnoxious on getting that DNS seed node running so we can finish the android wallet. After that, it's more feature building [most likely trying to port over min.io to FUNK].

[soundposition]

First of all, I just want to say, I love what I am seeing. This is right in line with my thinking. My name is Brady, I am a musician and crypto addict. lol I have been trying to find others interested in utilizing these technologies in a way that will rewrite the rules of music creation.
I am just now getting involved, I have some music I will submit. I also have some ideas we could all work with.

Have any of you used Kompoz? I think we could utilize it for collaboration and eventually build our own. We could create a pay per play system like nobs.is has on Cryptr, pay users Funk to listen and even develop a reddit style upvote system for songs or even snippets of audio. Allow people to use funk to vote for a riff, verse, etc. The more you listen the more you can actually shape the music as a listener by spending your generated funk.

Also if a multi pool was created for Funk we could do some REALLY interesting things. Like hardware based open source music streaming/ASIC boxes. I literally have thought about the possibilities for way too long. Someone please help me get a group hangout together to make things happen.  I am spewing with ideas. yes I said spewing... lol

I would love to get a Google hangout together and hash out some ideas. I have thought long and hard about crypto and the music industry. I would love to collaborate ideas. A few others are doing things with music and crypto, we need to round these people up and get everyone talking.

Hey Brady! Welcome. Dig the tune you made. For those who haven't heard: https://soundcloud.com/bradymckenna/dr-j-and-mr-h. Add a FUNK address so we can tip you.

I actually dig the idea of using FUNK to "vote" for a riff/melody/drum beat they'd like to see in a song. That way we can go a bit more crazy in terms of churning out creative ideas (rather than fully fleshed out songs). Thoughts?

There's no reason why we could use Kompoz anyway. Get collaborators onto our idea. I see you can buy gift-cards... hmmm... I'm going to drop them a mail and see if they want to accept FUNK [because why not?].

Whoa, I like the idea of making custom ASICs that combine mining + streaming. That's pretty far out. Elaborate a bit more!

I like the ideas. Keep them flowing.

@soundposition:

A bounty would be great, but I wouldn't want to feel obligated to finish something by a certain time. I try to dev work in when I can. Busy working with n00bnoxious on getting that DNS seed node running so we can finish the android wallet. After that, it's more feature building [most likely trying to port over min.io to FUNK].

@mckmuze:
I really like your ideas so far, and you have some good links too. I'm definitely into having a video chat, so can you let me know when you are free? You are abouit 4 hours behind me in terms of Time Zone, and Cape Town time is about 6 hours ahead. So sometime after noon (EST) my time probably would work best for everyone.. So can you just let us know a couple days you might be free to do a video chat?

If nothing else I agree that more musicians would at the very least know about us if each of us signed up on Kompoz.

@simondlr
I'd rather see min.io ported to work with FUNK, than see a bounty. I think giving the FUNK something to back it (music related) is very important. It can't just be another pump and dump currency if it is to survive into the future. It has to be a valuable thing.

[mckmuze]

As far as the streaming/ASIC idea we could make a multipool for Funk. The multipool allows us to use old asics and it wont matter to an average music listener if its an outdated asic (they wont even really know what it is). This could also give a solid tangible item behind Funk. The guys at Blocktech would probably like to hear from us if we can get a proof of concept.

Multipools are about to dominate and really move the alt market. It also creates a consistent buy pressure on the currency allowing us to somewhat stabilize the price. Ideally staggering two different currencies multipool buys would give us a way to hedge our own position. This may be out of the question to do two, but it would create some price stability and fend off PnD'ers. Not to mention a hedge between the two would give us an interesting way to have internal price stability. This is all theory, but it might be interesting to see play out.

Now as far as a more practical project for The Cypherfunks, I was working on a way to use emunie to create a system that pays the listener and the currently streamed artist equally using the streaming hardware. Unfortunately Emunie is a network hog and you wouldn't be able to stream, not to mention new developments in traditional blockchain currencies are going to give emunie a run for its money. One of the significant developments is the multipool. This will ensure the asic device actually generates a decent return for the listener.

I have a mind map on mindomo if anyone is interested in looking it over, its a bit rough, but has many ideas we could possibly use.
The basic idea is to split the generated currency three ways, one third to a crowd sourcing pool, one third to the listener, and one third to the currently streamed song. The crowdsorcing pool could be used to pay a project after completion or possibly some other tiered upvote system. The audience could directly interact with the artists and really feel like they had a part in creating the song.

This would introduce anyone interested in music to cryptocurrency. I really feel this will be a major step forward for mass adoption and a great distribution method. We could do a Cypherfunk brand ASIC with streaming capability in a totally open source platform with 3d printable parts, NFC stickers, Raspberry Pi, and bluetooth. We could do it all from an app and slap an NFC sticker on a dock to automatically bring up the player. Even when your on the go the history could be synced when you have a connection and the multipool can send the payments out to the creators. This will also generate a transaction map of all the creators, so in the even a song is desired for a commercial, movie, game etc, the payments can be distributed to everyone involved. We could require a prospective licensee of the music to purchase using Funk through the multipool transaction map effectively giving everyone involved a cut with every consecutive payment.

The app could have the ability to stream music, buy concert tickets, shirts, hats, stickers, upvote music, advertising, and pretty much anything and everything that is involved in the music industry. The ASIC could have storage capability built in to allow a maidsafe or Bittorrent sync style storage environment for paying end users to store part of the music library as well. (this may a bit far fetched but possible)

This would greatly increase the network security, distribute the currency, create an economy, generate steady income for artists, store the music library in a decentralized fashion and possibly completely rewrite the rules of the music industry.

I have more ideas but I will spare you guys the novel, I'm a bit hard to catch at the moment but If I can get some free time I would love to really dedicate some time to brainstorming with you guys to see what is possible. We should start a weekly hangout on google and really hash out some ideas.

[MadCow]

The easiest way to do this without forming additional governance structures is to simply inject capital into the coin.

My heart wants to agree with you Simon!! I'll donate 100,000,000 FUNK to the Mothership collective!

By that I mean, buying up FUNK on exchanges. The releases financial resources.

Yes, buying up FUNK on exchanges is important, and I've been doing a bit of that this week (got some very cheap too).

I think the best immediate catalyst for FUNK would be converting your excellent min.io site for FUNK. Next might be some marketing material, like a slick looking video, and some form of sponsorship of 'live music' somewhere in the world. The reason I think FUNK needs to establish itself in the 'live' music scene is digital content can be copied, and most people under 30 expect movies & music to be free practically. Live music can't be pirated, and if we could organise a gig where the band got paid in FUNK, and the audience paid in FUNK, then that would be awesome, and if someone made a video it would create some nice marketing material too.

I'd be happy to contribute towards a bounty for a Cypherfunk gig. These gigs would be like FUNK faucets.

Another FUNK faucet  could be the modified min.io site. Have a promotion whereby every new user who signs up on the site gets X amount of FUNK to spend on the site. If there was a FUNK web wallet the whole thing could be made relatively painless for non-crypto people (i.e 99.999999% of people).

Anyway, keep the FUNK alive guys This is a very noble endeavour you guys are on.


[Bootsy Collins - BASS legend with James Brown & P-FUNK - when your ass starts moving when you hear 'Sex Machine', thank Bootsy Collins]

[MadCow]

I think the FUNK fundamental rule is this - "everyone gets paid in FUNK, everyone pays in FUNK" - even when 1 FUNK is worth 1 satoshi. Doesn't matter, as the principle is what counts.

That's why a web wallet would be great, because that would make it easy. Attach the FUNK address to a QR code and you could almost do that on the door at a gig using a laptop and a web wallet or app.

[simondlr]

@soundposition @madcow

Yeah. I'll try and spend my free time on looking into porting Min.io to FUNK. . Would be cool!

I spoke to one of the guys from citysoiree (http://www.citysoiree.co.za/ <- site to crowdfund gigs in South Africa), if they want to experiment about using FUNK for one of the gigs. He digs Cypherfunks, so he said it's definitely something consider. I think it would be an awesome milestone for us if we can crowdfund our first gig!

@mckmuze

Very, very fascinating ideas. One of the more difficult parts is to actually with cryptographic verifiability use the music to interact with the blockchain. It's no mean feat. But you give some interesting ideas.

If you could make for example, an independently verifiable queue of the Cypherfunks songs (randomised playing), you could then do things like matching block payouts to music. ie, each block, automatically pays out part of the mining reward to a song on the network. Something like that.

I like your ideas! Keep it coming! Keep it coming!