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Author Topic: BitMarket.Eu has closed down  (Read 182631 times)
sonba
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June 13, 2011, 05:11:09 PM
 #181

Taking into account what Jurian wrote (I saw that guy popping up - was lucky that I didn't have any offers on at the time) - it might be a good idea to have some methodology to enforce good behaviour? That might also stop people from canceling their binding bids/offers when you hit them. I'm not sure myself how this should look like. The most obvious punishment is banning from your side - but that won't stop people from trying to scam - they can re-register.

Taken into account that most people use eBay or Bitcoin-OTC history to register at your side - maybe it might make sense to give them a bad rating at OTC (or tell their counterparties their OTC-nick *g*) if they do not comply. Alternatively one could make it a prerequisite that they do a sell trade (sales for 1EUR are pretty much free) of whatever on eBay (like selling an e-mail) so that it is possible to rate them there. On a second thought that looks like quite some work for you guys - so, not really a useful idea Sad

Maybe somebody else has a better idea?
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M4v3R
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June 13, 2011, 08:00:38 PM
 #182

Just finished reverting all the transactions that this user done. For your reference (if you don't want trouble, don't engage in anything with this person), here's his email address: eadwig@gmail.com.

@sonba: We are looking into methods that will minimalise this kind of behaviour. Thanks for the suggestions. We'll keep you posted.
sonba
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June 13, 2011, 11:26:54 PM
 #183

probably best to avoid mail@matthiasmarx.org as well. seems to be the same person.
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June 14, 2011, 07:35:51 AM
 #184

Maybe it is possible to implement a rating system that is based on the amounts and volume of trades that have succesfully taken place. As a new member, you'll only be allowed to trade BTC worth XXX EUR and each succesful trade (be it selling or buying) increases your trading volume by another XXX €. After a certain number of succesful trades, the limitation is removed because you have proven to be a trustworthy trader.

This way, the behaviour mentioned above does less harm to the marketplace and makes it less attractive for scammers to enter the marketplace.

Another possibility that comes to my mind is some sort of collateral that you have to pay before trading. If you're doing any trade, XXX BTC are frozen until ALL transactions are completed, then it is repaid. Obviously, it would be harder for new bitcoin-users to enter the market, but the collateral payment could be implemented for users that don't have the initial trading limitation anymore.

Keep up the great work!

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sonba
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June 14, 2011, 09:52:41 AM
 #185

The limitation for new members sounds like a good idea. It should be high enough so that they can trade a bit. hence, I would rather make a BTC then a EUR limit. Plus: it's easier to implement for the developers as you don't have to convert currencies (otherwise you need limit for PLN, GBP, USD...). IMHO it shouldn't be below 10BTC. Otherwise new people cannot really buy anything.

I'm not sure I like the idea about collaterals too much, though. I don't appreciate of having BTC lying around which I cannot access. Especially not in the current volatile market.
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June 15, 2011, 07:27:06 PM
 #186

im still waiting on confirmation ... i sent what you requested can u take a look at it please ... account the same as here.
i have been waiting for more than 2 weeks.
thanks ...

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June 16, 2011, 02:32:42 PM
 #187

The account was verified ... thanks alot...  Wink

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June 16, 2011, 05:12:47 PM
 #188

Just signed up, used ebay as verification.  Will report back as to how long verification took.

Site looks very clean/professional.

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M4v3R
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June 18, 2011, 06:58:22 AM
 #189

New features and some new guidelines available on BitMarket.eu!

Phew, it was quite a week. The price went crazy, there was a big theft on the Bitcoin network. But we at BitMarket were working to bring you two new features, and one small something for us.

Paypal guidelines changed!
PLEASE READ THIS if you use Paypal, if you don't, you can get yourself trouble. Because of some confusion about who should pay the Paypal fees, we are changing our FAQ to reflect the most common situation: now the seller pays the Paypal fees. This is because, when you send money Paypal via Paypal you often don't have a choice besides choosing that seller will pay the fee. It happened to us many times and we have to make it an official rule to avoid more confusion.
Additionally, when buying with Paypal, please don't mention "Bitcoin", "coin", or any other currency-revelant words in your payment description. Please just put the your username/email and transaction ID there.

Site notifications
Now, when something's changed or added on our site, every member will get a notification to let him know of this fact. This notification will dissapear once you click on it and get you to a bigger story (probably most of you that are reading this already used this mechanism). So no more telling that "I didn't know that you changed something!" Smiley

Italian language
Our fellow trader ZEB-DEMON provided us an italian transation of our site, free of charge. We'd like you thank him for this and welcome all our italian friends to join us on the market!

You can now define which payment type to use on each offer
Because many people told us, that, for eg. they want to buy with Paypal but they don't want to sell in it, we're added a form to select your desired payment types on the Offers page. Your default payment types are always selected there, but you can change them at every offer.

And last, but not least...
BitMarket.eu was always free to use, for buyers and for sellers. As far as I know we are the only relatively big exchange that takes no commitions at all. This will change today though. We will... still remain free! Wink But, we are adding an optional donation, that you can give to us on every trade you make.
You can choose whether you want to donate nothing, 0.1%, 0.5% or 1%. It's totally up to you. For now there won't be any premium features for using donations (beside of making the smiley in the Account page more happy Smiley), but it may change in the future. The donation is one side only (seller pays the donation) and it's totally unobtrusive - it's doesn't get you in your way. It doesn't change your offer nor it doesn't block you from selling everything you have. In the latter example, you will just end up with small negative balance, but that's all.

We believe that most of you know that running a site like this costs money (right now we use a top-shelf VPS server, and hire two people to handle account verifications), but because Bitcoin is such a terrific idea, we want it to remain as free to use as possible. So optional donations/fees seem like a good idea - we will be grateful if you donate, but we'll not get mad if you don't Smiley.

Trade well!
sonba
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June 18, 2011, 08:43:18 AM
 #190

Hi all,

great changes!
In regard to the PayPal guidelines I'm not entirely sure that this is the right approach. If I would sell via PayPal (which I never do, so I don't care *g*), you don't know who buys from you, i.e. what the costs are. They can be either 1.9% (inside EU and EUR country) or 3.9%. Hence, you don't know what to charge. This will probably lead to even less people offering BTC via PayPal. The way I always handled it in OTC transactions was that buyer pays PayPal. PayPal shows the fees on its side, so if you know the geographic details of buyer and seller you can calculate the fees yourself. But I can also see your point on this story.

Site notifications is great!

As mentioned beforehand - if you want a German translation of the side give me a shout.

The automatic donation is nice. Safes me the work of doing manual donations. However, I would appreciate if you could choose your amount freely and not only have 4 options. If that's too much work leave as is though and I'll continue doing it manually Smiley

Looking forward to the rating system Smiley

Thanks for your great work and effort,

sonba
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June 18, 2011, 09:53:27 AM
 #191

I'm a bit confused about how to use the site -
I was accepted as a registered member yesterday. When I click one of the offers, it leads me to a page where I am to set up my own offer rather than allowing me to trade against the offer on the market. I feel quite stupid for having to ask this, but what am I doing wrong? I read the FAQ but surely I'm missing something!


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ancow
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June 18, 2011, 10:37:00 AM
 #192

If you want to trade against an offer on the market, you just need to click on that offer and the offers page is opened automatically with the proper values filled in.
I'm not sure whether this will result in you always getting matched against the offer you clicked or whether the normal "select a better offer first, if any exist" algorithm applies (I'd assume the latter).

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M4v3R
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June 18, 2011, 11:12:29 AM
 #193

Ancow got it right. You can click an offer from the Market section to place a matching offer. But if there will be a better offer (better price for you) matching your other criteria, it will be picked instead.
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June 18, 2011, 12:17:19 PM
 #194

And then what happens?

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M4v3R
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June 18, 2011, 12:23:03 PM
 #195

Everything is described in the FAQ. When your offer match other offers, the transaction is made. The Bitcoins on sellers account get frozen, and emails are dispatched to both parties instructing them to complete the trade. Once seller receives money from buyer, he uses a button called "Send BTC" which releases his coin to the buyer. And everyone is happy and peace is restored to this land Smiley.
Elokane
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June 18, 2011, 12:26:10 PM
 #196

Everything is described in the FAQ. When your offer match other offers, the transaction is made. The Bitcoins on sellers account get frozen, and emails are dispatched to both parties instructing them to complete the trade. Once seller receives money from buyer, he uses a button called "Send BTC" which releases his coin to the buyer. And everyone is happy and peace is restored to this land Smiley.

Yeah, I read that, but it didn't happen. Perhaps my order wasn't compatible with the one I clicked. Welp, I'll look into it further. Thanks.

Synereo: a completely decentralized and distributed application ecosystem.

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yossarian
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June 18, 2011, 01:41:22 PM
 #197

Paypal guidelines changed!
PLEASE READ THIS if you use Paypal, if you don't, you can get yourself trouble. Because of some confusion about who should pay the Paypal fees, we are changing our FAQ to reflect the most common situation: now the seller pays the Paypal fees. This is because, when you send money Paypal via Paypal you often don't have a choice besides choosing that seller will pay the fee. It happened to us many times and we have to make it an official rule to avoid more confusion.
Additionally, when buying with Paypal, please don't mention "Bitcoin", "coin", or any other currency-revelant words in your payment description. Please just put the your username/email and transaction ID there.

This pretty much kills paypal as an option for the seller, at least for me. I had about 10 transactions using paypal as a seller so far, and not once did I have a problem with someone who didn't pay the fees. I just included that information in the payment details. If anyone forgot, I would just send the money back and tell the buyer to include the fee, which everyone did so far.

Especially for traders who want to get their money fast, this is a disappointment. bitmarket.eu is still a relatively slow option to get your hands on some coins, and I guess now it's even getting harder because less sellers will accept paypal. Sad Waiting three days or more for your coins or your money to arrive is just a pain.

Besides that: Good work, bitmarket! Cheesy


I'm always buying and selling BTC, PM me for details. Rating and GPG-key: http://is.gd/yossarian

Buy and sell BTC via SEPA: https://www.bitcoin.de/r/nrnxg6

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June 18, 2011, 01:45:37 PM
 #198

Paypal guidelines changed!
PLEASE READ THIS if you use Paypal, if you don't, you can get yourself trouble. Because of some confusion about who should pay the Paypal fees, we are changing our FAQ to reflect the most common situation: now the seller pays the Paypal fees. This is because, when you send money Paypal via Paypal you often don't have a choice besides choosing that seller will pay the fee. It happened to us many times and we have to make it an official rule to avoid more confusion.
Additionally, when buying with Paypal, please don't mention "Bitcoin", "coin", or any other currency-revelant words in your payment description. Please just put the your username/email and transaction ID there.

This pretty much kills paypal as an option for the seller, at least for me. I had about 10 transactions using paypal as a seller so far, and not once did I have a problem with someone who didn't pay the fees. I just included that information in the payment details. If anyone forgot, I would just send the money back and tell the buyer to include the fee, which everyone did so far.

Especially for traders who want to get their money fast, this is a disappointment. bitmarket.eu is still a relatively slow option to get your hands on some coins, and I guess now it's even getting harder because less sellers will accept paypal. Sad Waiting three days or more for your coins or your money to arrive is just a pain.

Besides that: Good work, bitmarket! Cheesy



This chance is a result of a LOT of emails that we received from sellers complaining that the buyers either don't agree to pay the fees or that they are wasting too much time to explain this to them.

Any suggestions how we can keep everyone happy then?  Huh

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jackaroo
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June 18, 2011, 02:43:33 PM
 #199

Well, as seller who uses PP only I always paid the fees myself and never bothered to complain to the buyers. Only a few paid the fees themselves.
yossarian
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June 18, 2011, 02:56:42 PM
 #200

Well, as seller who uses PP only I always paid the fees myself and never bothered to complain to the buyers. Only a few paid the fees themselves.

If I would have accepted paypal only, I would have paid the equivalent of at least 7 BTC just for paypal fees (on international sales) so far. In the current goldrush, this might not seem to much. Still, some people work a long time for that kind of money. So why waste it?


@Makhul: Wouldn't it have been easier to just strongly emphasize that the buyer has to pay all paypal fees? Before the buyer accepts paypal as a payment method, you could open up a pop-up window that states his obligation to pay the fees again, so he has to actively agree on this point. You could also link to a paypal-fee calculation site. Again, I've made the experience that the majority of buyers are willing to pay the fees once this is pointed out to them. It's just a matter of how this rule is communicated via bitmarket and the sellers. And how it is enforced if the buyers is unwilling to comply. As discussed before, a rating system would help here, too. Cheesy

I'm always buying and selling BTC, PM me for details. Rating and GPG-key: http://is.gd/yossarian

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