Bitcoin Forum
December 07, 2016, 04:35:42 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.13.1  [Torrent].
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 »
  Print  
Author Topic: BitMarket.Eu has closed down  (Read 182495 times)
PowerChaos
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 50


PowerChaos Company


View Profile WWW
August 09, 2011, 08:18:20 PM
 #301

it depends how paypal looks at it and how your history is

as you say that you got 3X the same case ( getting hacked ) and you thell them that it goes about a virtual currency ... those things has nothing to do with each other

what has bitcoin to do with hacking ?? it are 2 totaly differend things

so yes , it is normal that you won this case as there is just no proof of hacking on there account

but if you reply and you start talking about stuff that doesnt mather or that doesnt fit the claim then you lose it , as you got away from the subject and shows to paypal that you are "scamming" the other party (they complain about hacking .. not about a non claimed item and you reply that they got the item .. got nothing to do with hacking)

it is just a example , i do not know what you exactly reply and what the exact case was that they opened but depending on case you need to reply or ignore

and if you reply , it depends what you reply and what kind of proof you got to win the case

in your case you are just lucky or the case that was openend was just 1 of the XXX noob cases like they get 1000 from every hour


i started up the escrow service to prevent those fraude from happening , so the seller would always get his money
but i am wondering if it would be intrested in the first place or if users can trust a third party after what all is happening with paypal and bitcoin

anyway
there is a solution , and that is all i can say

Greets From PowerChaos

1481128542
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481128542

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481128542
Reply with quote  #2

1481128542
Report to moderator
1481128542
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481128542

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481128542
Reply with quote  #2

1481128542
Report to moderator
1481128542
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1481128542

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1481128542
Reply with quote  #2

1481128542
Report to moderator
There are several different types of Bitcoin clients. Header-only clients like MultiBit trust that the majority of mining power is honest for the purposes of enforcing network rules such as the 21 million BTC limit. Full clients do not trust miners in this way.
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
byte-storm
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 9


View Profile
August 12, 2011, 08:38:21 PM
 #302

Are your helping hands still on holiday? I'm now waiting for 3 weeks for an email reply.
Keninishna
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 551



View Profile WWW
August 13, 2011, 01:42:50 AM
 #303

yup me too, I'm waiting for a transaction cancel. I keep getting buyers who put in offers then don't buy or respond.
Mahkul
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 420


Be silent, or be silenced.


View Profile WWW
August 13, 2011, 06:15:12 PM
 #304

Keninishna & byte-storm

Apologies for the very long delay, we have been under severe pressure. I have finally responded to your emails.

Bitalo.com coming soon!

1MAHKULzqZb4evFFg9157LvnJhJQQbeYo7
byte-storm
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 9


View Profile
August 14, 2011, 03:54:18 PM
 #305

Thank you for your kind and unexpected gesture in your mail. However, you replied to the wrong email. This one has already been answered weeks ago. The newer one(s) are relevant. You should be able to find my shortest resend sent on 09.08.2011 14:56 (CEST) if you want to save time reading. Wink
Peripeteia
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 34


View Profile
August 15, 2011, 05:54:58 AM
 #306

For everyone's information:

I had a total of 2 transactions today on Bitmarket.eu from from the same person. Once I received payment through Paypal I released the BTCs he bought. A couple of hours later he hit me with Paypal chargebacks.

His info is:

Michael Evans: michael180sx@gmail.com

If anyone else here has been scammed by him, please PM me so we can exchange information/evidence. While it may be futile, I will try to fight the Paypal chargebacks - I don't want him to get away with his fraud.

I strongly urge everyone to be way of the individual described above. To Evans, if I've wrongly branded you as scammer I will publicly apologize and retract what I've said without hesitation. However, as you initiated the chargebacks without cause and without contacting me and have not replied to my emails; I'm not holding my breath that you care about your name and reputation.

I've contacted the site admin as well regarding this matter. I don't blame Bitmarket.eu, I knew the risks involved in using Paypal. However I do hope the admins reply to my request for info/help soon. I've been vocal on this forum about Bitmarket.eu being safe and reliable. Sadly now I'm going to discover how helpful they are in assisting their users who have been defrauded.

Lastly, does anyone have any advice on how to respond to Paypal? I noticed that PowerChaos recommends being upfront about everything (that it was a transaction for BTC, etc.), has this approach worked for people? The problem is I still have a Paypal balance from other transactions involving bitcoin. If I inform Paypal that the Evans chargebacks are from the sale of bitcoin, will they reverse my other transfers as well?
Ten98
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 201



View Profile
August 15, 2011, 06:39:27 PM
 #307

I'll never be accepting Paypal again that's for sure.

I got scammed today from someone using a gmx.de email address.

Pure greed and stupidity on my part really, never trade to anyone who does not respond to your emails to them, and never trade with anyone with a gmx.de email address (common address used by international scammers).

I think they should simply remove Paypal as a payment option from Bitmarket to be honest. So many people just get taken for a ride.

This is the whole reason we even have bitcoin in the first place, because of Paypal's ridiculous policy of "steal from the seller at all costs" and "always side with the buyer".

Even if you can prove that you sent the Bitcoins via the internet, and even though their "seller protection policy" is supposed to cover "digital goods", the moronic drones they have working for them in "Customer service" (pah, some service) won't accept *anything* other than a postal tracking number to prove that you posted the item... Slightly difficuly if you never posted anything.

Maybe if you are going to accept Paypal, accompany every sale you make with a recorded delivery envelope saying "thanks for buying my bitcoins", then at least you have a tracking number to give them....
nmat
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602


View Profile
August 15, 2011, 07:21:12 PM
 #308

Pure greed and stupidity on my part really, never trade to anyone who does not respond to your emails to them, and never trade with anyone with a gmx.de email address (common address used by international scammers).

I have traded with people using gmx.de addresses and I have no complaints. But I am using bank transfer, not Paypal...
sonba
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 395


View Profile
August 16, 2011, 07:41:23 AM
 #309

Pure greed and stupidity on my part really, never trade to anyone who does not respond to your emails to them, and never trade with anyone with a gmx.de email address (common address used by international scammers).

I have traded with people using gmx.de addresses and I have no complaints. But I am using bank transfer, not Paypal...

Same here - no problems with gmx. For teh record: Bitmarekt eu advises "( Re: BitMarket.Eu - We advise users not to use Paypal! )" for some reason. They also post it in the payment options. So, I think they should keep offering it. If somebody wants to take the risk, so be it. And bear in mind, usually you can get some extra 20-50 cents if you accept PayPal. (Not worth the risk in my opinion but I can just speak for myself Smiley)
Ten98
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 201



View Profile
August 16, 2011, 12:25:42 PM
 #310

Personally I have been burned too many times from people using gmx.de email addresses for me to ever trust them...
Mahkul
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 420


Be silent, or be silenced.


View Profile WWW
August 16, 2011, 06:32:26 PM
 #311

We are very sorry to announce that as of this moment Paypal is no longer available as a payment method on BitMarket. The reason being, as some of you already know, that over the last couple of weeks there have been a significant increase in the Paypal scams on our exchange.

We realize that this decision will probably make some of you even quit using our service, but we would rather have fewer people around that can feel safe than a lot of people that will constantly be worrying about being scammed.

No matter what we do, Paypal will never be a safe option for selling Bitcoins. The small percentage of the scammers is really using stolen Paypal accounts. But the nicest people in the world and with 100% positive E-Bay feedback proved to be scammers as well and even more often! And there is nothing we can do to stop them, because they use their own Paypal account and tell Paypal the transactions were not authorized by them. What can you do then - how can we prove that they are not right? And of course Paypal doesn't give a damn about sellers, otherwise they would have introduced some OTP mechanism and there would be no stolen passwords then and no excuses for dumb users who cannot guard their passwords properly or simply are thieves. Why don't they do it even though they are one of the biggest money processing companies in the world? I don't know, but that's pathetic and laughable.

Some of our users even started (sic IMHO) suspecting that we ourselves have something to do with these chargebacks; believe me that this is not very encouraging to keep on running this service altogether. So, we are just fed up with Paypal and that's over. Due to all the recent scams we haven't even had time to take a look at any other emails other than those related to Paypal reversals. One thing I can promise everyone is that from now on processing emails will be much faster.

Within two months BitMarket is going to be transformed into an exchange operating in a similar exchange as Mt. Gox, where users are able to transfer their money directly to us and then trade safely. There will also be a much more advanced login procedure in place (2-step authentication). BitMarket will also become an Irish limited company accepting: EUR, GBP, PLN, USD and CHF. There will also be small fees for using it; however, for our most loyal users that have been supporting us constantly trading will remain free of charge.

EDIT: When I get around to it I will post all email addresses that were used to scam people.

Bitalo.com coming soon!

1MAHKULzqZb4evFFg9157LvnJhJQQbeYo7
Ten98
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 201



View Profile
August 16, 2011, 06:41:43 PM
 #312

Great decision, Paypal will not be missed!

One of the reasons Bitcoin even exists in the first place is because Paypal is so bad.
nmat
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 602


View Profile
August 16, 2011, 07:06:55 PM
 #313

Within two months BitMarket is going to be transformed into an exchange operating in a similar exchange as Mt. Gox, where users are able to transfer their money directly to us and then trade safely. There will also be a much more advanced login procedure in place (2-step authentication). BitMarket will also become an Irish limited company accepting: EUR, GBP, PLN, USD and CHF. There will also be small fees for using it; however, for our most loyal users that have been supporting us constantly trading will remain free of charge.

Will you still allow peer-to-peer exchanges? The big exchanges (Mt Gox and Tradehill) are having lots of trouble setting up SEPA transfers. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. So I have been buying bitcoins at Bitmarket. It is really simple and it is always available.
Mahkul
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 420


Be silent, or be silenced.


View Profile WWW
August 16, 2011, 07:54:14 PM
 #314

Within two months BitMarket is going to be transformed into an exchange operating in a similar exchange as Mt. Gox, where users are able to transfer their money directly to us and then trade safely. There will also be a much more advanced login procedure in place (2-step authentication). BitMarket will also become an Irish limited company accepting: EUR, GBP, PLN, USD and CHF. There will also be small fees for using it; however, for our most loyal users that have been supporting us constantly trading will remain free of charge.

Will you still allow peer-to-peer exchanges? The big exchanges (Mt Gox and Tradehill) are having lots of trouble setting up SEPA transfers. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. So I have been buying bitcoins at Bitmarket. It is really simple and it is always available.


Yes, I think what will happen is the BitMarket website will get split in two - I am not sure how exactly, but we realize that there still are people who prefer this way of trading. We will, however, add the rating system and limits for new users and Paypal is out of the question. I know this was announced a long time ago, but M4v3R is away until the end of August and since primarily I am not a coder but a network security expert I can't proceed with this on my own. Thanks for everyone's patience.

Bitalo.com coming soon!

1MAHKULzqZb4evFFg9157LvnJhJQQbeYo7
EuSouBitcoin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 463


View Profile
August 17, 2011, 01:13:42 AM
 #315

I am definitely in favor of removing PayPal as an allowed payment method on BitMarket.eu. Dwolla is the way to go. Lose PayPal and all the scams associated with it.
PowerChaos
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 50


PowerChaos Company


View Profile WWW
August 17, 2011, 06:14:46 AM
 #316

I am definitely in favor of removing PayPal as an allowed payment method on BitMarket.eu. Dwolla is the way to go. Lose PayPal and all the scams associated with it.

i am not so happy that paypal get removed from the trade list

the reason why is because i use paypal as trading exange

most of my payments are taken care of by paypal , so i was specialy looking for a place to trade bitcoins to paypal ( it goes fast in my case)

i know about the scammings that are happening and thats why i started up a escrow service so i can make sure that the user get paid even if it got charged back (as they charge back from me , so the end user always get his money )

for me it would be sadly if paypal get removed , as it is already hard to find a good place to trade with paypal

on the other side , there will always be scammers , specialy because bitcoin is a 1 way currency
how you want to look at it , there are always ways to scam some1 , and sadly enouf they are abusing the systems to make a quick amount of money
but that does not mean that you need to eliminate the use of it

you need to see it like a shop
you got a shop in mainstreet , it get robbed 3X per week , does that means that that shop need to close because it is in a high risk street ??
if they are heavy secured , does that eliminate the risk to get robbed ?? (maybe a bit )
they just change the payment way , instead only acceping cash they accept creditcards so they can not be robbed from there cash ... (external source to complete the payment)

point i mean
if some1 can abuse something then mostly they will abuse it

i want to fight to against the abusing of paypal , that  is why i offer that escrow service
i got a bit more skills with the chargebacks so i know how i can protect myself from it
unlike ohter *new* users who barely use paypal , they do not know the tricks to protect from chargeback and they mostly fail to keep the chargeback

like i told before to , try to accept only verified paypal accounts
if they do fraude then there account wont be verified (as it need a valid visa card .. not a stolen creditcard in the first place)
applying that rule will eliminate already 65% of the current clients you have , but it does not destroy the nice payment system you are offering
and it let users feel safer because it is a verified account and not just a account that exist from 2 days ago

hopely you can understand what i try to explain

Greets From PowerChaos

Mahkul
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 420


Be silent, or be silenced.


View Profile WWW
August 17, 2011, 07:15:02 PM
 #317

I am definitely in favor of removing PayPal as an allowed payment method on BitMarket.eu. Dwolla is the way to go. Lose PayPal and all the scams associated with it.

i am not so happy that paypal get removed from the trade list

the reason why is because i use paypal as trading exange

most of my payments are taken care of by paypal , so i was specialy looking for a place to trade bitcoins to paypal ( it goes fast in my case)

i know about the scammings that are happening and thats why i started up a escrow service so i can make sure that the user get paid even if it got charged back (as they charge back from me , so the end user always get his money )

for me it would be sadly if paypal get removed , as it is already hard to find a good place to trade with paypal

on the other side , there will always be scammers , specialy because bitcoin is a 1 way currency
how you want to look at it , there are always ways to scam some1 , and sadly enouf they are abusing the systems to make a quick amount of money
but that does not mean that you need to eliminate the use of it

you need to see it like a shop
you got a shop in mainstreet , it get robbed 3X per week , does that means that that shop need to close because it is in a high risk street ??
if they are heavy secured , does that eliminate the risk to get robbed ?? (maybe a bit )
they just change the payment way , instead only acceping cash they accept creditcards so they can not be robbed from there cash ... (external source to complete the payment)

point i mean
if some1 can abuse something then mostly they will abuse it

i want to fight to against the abusing of paypal , that  is why i offer that escrow service
i got a bit more skills with the chargebacks so i know how i can protect myself from it
unlike ohter *new* users who barely use paypal , they do not know the tricks to protect from chargeback and they mostly fail to keep the chargeback

like i told before to , try to accept only verified paypal accounts
if they do fraude then there account wont be verified (as it need a valid visa card .. not a stolen creditcard in the first place)
applying that rule will eliminate already 65% of the current clients you have , but it does not destroy the nice payment system you are offering
and it let users feel safer because it is a verified account and not just a account that exist from 2 days ago

hopely you can understand what i try to explain

Greets From PowerChaos

I think you are missing the point. Scammers use verified Paypal accounts, it doesn't make any difference whatsoever.

Another thing is - the rightful owners do chargebacks as well - claiming their account was taken over. How do you deal with that? Paypal doesn't give a shit about our logs, IPs, screenshots and whatnot. Don't use it - that's it. I am so looking forward to the day when Bitcoin will finally take over from Paypal.


Bitalo.com coming soon!

1MAHKULzqZb4evFFg9157LvnJhJQQbeYo7
Ssoele
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 135


There's no place like 127.0.0.1


View Profile
August 17, 2011, 07:56:36 PM
 #318

I'm glad we still have MoneyBookers Tongue

Did my words move you? Or did they bring you to enlightenment? Feel free to give some ฿ to me: 1DKMAfeDswYf9MFjWxjPCfjEVkgmXvnizo
Want to play some Minefield?
PowerChaos
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 50


PowerChaos Company


View Profile WWW
August 17, 2011, 08:52:10 PM
 #319

I think you are missing the point. Scammers use verified Paypal accounts, it doesn't make any difference whatsoever.
Another thing is - the rightful owners do chargebacks as well - claiming their account was taken over. How do you deal with that? Paypal doesn't give a shit about our logs, IPs, screenshots and whatnot. Don't use it - that's it. I am so looking forward to the day when Bitcoin will finally take over from Paypal.

i got other ways to deal with paypal
as you probaly know to , i sell virtual goods ( vps servers and webhosting )  and there is no difference with bitcoin
bitcoin is a virtual currency , so same rules apply to them

in first place it depends how mutch you use paypal ( it build up the trust with paypal itself) and how many problems you dealed with before (and definaly what you are selling as business account)

i do not know how the usa paypal take care of things , but the dutch paypal is kinda harder to get charged back from

i got on regulair time claims from users that says the same as you do , that claims that there paypal is hacked or that they dit not authorise the sending
and they do accept my logs i provide to them ( if i provide them , mostly i do not even provide them anything as that is not needed for me )

on 2 years time only 2 chargebacks where sucesfull
and 1 chargeback from it was because the user used a stolen visa card ( he dit not even use a paypal account ) , tooks about 14 days to solve that problem and i lost that claim because they got a lot of proof that it was realy a stolen creditcard

then a other claim was because of my mistake , i provided them the wrong information about the claim so the user could get that claim valid (to long ago to provide more detais about it )

for the rest i got on regulair times claims about the vps servers , about donations ( from games ) and about other stuff and i never lost them
so i see no reason why i woulnd be able to defend me from bitcoin fraude ?

then to answer the other question
bitcoin as final trading currency is a realy bad idea
reason is that it is realy hard to track where it is sended to , that you can easy lose the files ( as it are files) and that it is a 1 way sending only (so you get the coins or not .. )

then we dit not talk yet about the market and the rates it got all the time and how you can get them

as soon bitcoin got a api system and a verification system so you know that it get sended to the persone , a safe system to get things recovered in case you lose them and a safe tracking system to validate the sending then it can be something
but then it still need a kinda fixed rate like the other currency's , or do you see that 1€ will become 10$ in 1 day ?? and next day just 2$ like bitcoin does ?

anyway , it is not for me to deside what bitcoin wil be or what it should become
i dit not know about that scammers used verified paypal accounts , as it sound strange to me to link a visa card to a account if you use it to scam .. (it get locked by paypal if they figure out that it get used for scamming )

but my thing stays the same
i want to help the community with offering my services as a escrow ( third party ) service , so the buyer get his bitcoins and the seller get his money for sure
so if the buyer want to scam that he need to deal with me and not to the seller that does not have the knowledge about paypal that i have and never dealed with the problems i dealed with

if they are realy that hard to fight then paypal will be able to stop them soon enouf , as paypal get a lot of info from me with every case i need to deal with so they can prevent it from happening
and as side note , every payment get past my billing system , and a billing system is a official document that does count as proof (specialy when it send a conformation email)
so if the user refuse to react on that in a given time then 95% of the claims are already invalid for paypal (in my case) as the owner can not say that it was a unwanted/stolen card after XX time (or does users never read emails ??)

anyway
dealing with paypal is part of my problem
if i can not handle the problem anymore then i will close my escrow service , but at this moment i make sure that the sellers realy got his money even if i lose money because of it

it is my way to fight against abusing , i want to show the scammers that it is not easy to get money back if they try to do it from some1 who know how to fight back and got differend ways for proof against chargebacks that get accepted

as special i will even make a list of the users with there email + paypal + bitcoin adress + username + maybe his password if i am allowed to release it ( need to do some research about that )  of the users who are trying to make a claim ( sucesfull or not .. a claim is a claim) so others are warned to

as my escrow works only betwean buyer/seller directly does the seller know to that the buyer is a scammer or not , as the seller already talked to the buyer and is just using me to finish the trade

anyway
enouf about me
if i need to be honnest , i would leave paypal avaible , it is the user there responsibility to trade the stuff , they press confirm and they take the risk to use paypal
it is like sending money to a other bank or by getting a check ... if i put the check on a other name then it is invalid to and i still got my items ?? or not ??

you can suggest not to use it , but you can not take the responsibility on you if they use it , its the user there responsibility if they want to use it as long they know the risks ofcourse

hopely i explained myself good enouf as it is kinda hard to explain this kind of things to show what i mean

Greets From PowerChaos

ancow
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 373


View Profile WWW
August 18, 2011, 12:19:41 AM
 #320

i got other ways to deal with paypal
as you probaly know to , i sell virtual goods ( vps servers and webhosting )  and there is no difference with bitcoin
bitcoin is a virtual currency , so same rules apply to them
[...]
Just to point this out, but as I see it, it also is a staffing problem for BM. They just don't have the manpower to deal with all those PayPal frauds. Whether they would be willing to accept your escrow service as a payment method is another matter entirely...

BTC: 1GAHTMdBN4Yw3PU66sAmUBKSXy2qaq2SF4
Pages: « 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 [16] 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 »
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!